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Is it time for SC to take down the conf flag?

Had it not been slavery, it would have been some other form of states rights eventually. The regions were just so different.
That may be true, but the fact remains that the abolition of slavery was overwhelmingly the threat that was cited as the justification for secession.

Banning the Confederate battle flag is inconsistent with the First Amendment right to free speech.
Nobody's talking about banning the flag (at least not here). I specifically said people can fly whatever flags they want. People can also sell whatever symbols they want. The debate is whether popular governments within the United States should display it.

I think the overwhelming concern was the profit being made from them.
I agree with this. I'm not saying that Southerners were defending slavery because they were inherently evil or morally inferior to Northerners. The South's economy and way of life depended on it, which is why they were willing to fight to preserve it. But that doesn't excuse it or make the cause any less reprehensible.

This issue is not an easy one for me. I grew up with the rebel flag on my wall. I waved it at Ole Miss football games. I read books about the Civil War and looked up to men like Robert E. Lee and Stonewall Jackson. But I can't continue to deny that the Confederate cause was unequivocally wrong. Though the flag is just a symbol, it stood for something not worth fighting for then, and has been co-opted by white supremacists now. Despite my history with the battle flag, I think its time has passed. There is so much to celebrate about Southern culture, but the Confederacy isn't part of that for me.
 
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If you look at it all Southern state flags closely resemble some form of a Confederate flag.
 
I'm not racist. Never have been and never will be. I live in this state and have the majority of my life. Are there lunatics out there? Sure they are, just like every other state. The majority of the folks in SC are good people, both black and white. This whole flag deal is nothing but PC and politics. That flag did not cause that punk to do what he did and there will be others more than likely. What are they going to take down then?
 
If you look at it all Southern state flags closely resemble some form of a Confederate flag.
Not all are, but many of them do. FL, AL, GA, MS, AR and TN were designed to reflect the CSA flag(s) in some way. NC & Texas flags are reminiscent to the state regimental flags and state flags during the war. VA & SC flags have pretty much been the same since the Revolution. I know the Blue and Crescent Moon were always SC's flag. Sic Semper Tyrannis Seal was always with VA, too.
 
I'm not racist. Never have been and never will be. I live in this state and have the majority of my life. Are there lunatics out there? Sure they are, just like every other state. The majority of the folks in SC are good people, both black and white. This whole flag deal is nothing but PC and politics. That flag did not cause that punk to do what he did and there will be others more than likely. What are they going to take down then?

Hey Tazki! How are you doing? You just did the "Ole I'm not racist comment". Lol.
 
I'm hanging in there Slick, hope you are good. I did because I'm not. ;)


I am good Taz. I took a job in Orlando last year. We know you aren't racist, but us black folk we laugh when white people say "I'm not racist". It's like trying ensure to everyone that they aren't racist. In the future don't start with that message. :)
 
I am good Taz. I took a job in Orlando last year. We know you aren't racist, but us black folk we laugh when white people say "I'm not racist". It's like trying ensure to everyone that they aren't racist. In the future don't start with that message. :)


Slick, taking that flag down will not change humanity. And please don't tell me how to start a message buddy. Hope things are good in FL.
 
Ann Coulter has things correct. She called flag issue "moronic" and it is. People were shot and killed by a kook and Dems/MSM siezed upon event opportunistically to bulldoze through an agit-prop campaign over something marginal. Not for one second do I think Dems and MSM care about "black people" ( the ones they are burying under illegals). They live to hate and the pretend "to care" about things as a way to stoke hate. When a kook goes off they secretly yell "Yes!" inside themselves because they see an opportunity.

Do Dems go after Koran when Muslims kill? No - they make sure terrorists have a Koran and prayer cloths in prisons. Walmart banned the flag - but they put in Muslim shopping sections in their Michigan stores.

Dem party was the party of slavery, Jim Crow and KKK. Will we be eradicating that? The donkey symbol goes back to Andrew Jackson - he of the "trail of tears".

Che Guevara was Castro's executioner. Will the libs be throwing out their Che t-shirts, posters, tattoos etc now that they are in a frenzy kissing Cuban rear?

These people are phony - no crazy. All the BIG problems we have get ignored, and little stupid stuff gets blown up to be a crisis so the opportunists can break through.

If a Muslim shooter had gone off on blacks they would be quiet as mice. Congress had to sue Obama to get info on Ft Hood shooter ( his act was called "workplace violence)

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/jun/23/ann-coulter-confederate-flag-debate-completely-mor/


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Slick, taking that flag down will not change humanity. And please don't tell me how to start a message buddy. Hope things are good in FL.

You and I know it won't change anything. That change starts in the household with the parents. Some parents today are still teaching their kids to be racist and hate anyone that doesn't look like them. When you are 21 years old, there is no reason for you to be racist. Nobody has ever done anything for them to be racist.
 
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Should military bases named after famous Confederate generals renamed for the sake of political correctness?
 
Should military bases named after famous Confederate generals renamed for the sake of political correctness?

Only if Dems are going to offer up all their racists pols. Wonder how many Woodrow Wilson high schools their are?

"“[Reconstruction government was detested] not because the Republican Party was dreaded but because the dominance of an ignorant and inferior race was justly dreaded.”

“The white men were roused by a mere instinct of self-preservation—until at last there had sprung into existence a great Ku Klux Klan, a veritable empire of the South, to protect the Southern country.”

WW
 
I started a thread on the Iowa board asking how far it goes in general. Washington and Jefferson were slave owners. Blast away half of Mount Rushmore. James Madison, John Tyler, Patrick Henry, etc. all had slave plantations. Andrew Jackson killed-off a lot of Indians. Most American Presidents through the 19th Century had great disdain for native tribes. Abraham Lincoln was as much a white supremacist, by today's standard, as any Grand Dragon!

Humans are not infallible. Stop naming things after them if it's so difficult for people to focus on their contributions in a positive sense and preferring to focus on things they struggled with or couldn't meet with a present-day measure of etiquette. Jefferson might have struggled with a smartphone, too!

Tillman hall over here at Clemson is going to have to change it's name. Everyone holding people in the past to today's social standards. I don't get it. I wouldn't want anything named after me. In 100 years (or a few weeks) after I'm gone, all my transgressions and faults will make me a villain.
 
wow the hyperbole. Where do i start. This isnt about pc. This is about racist mass murder and a community trying to come together as opposed to others that riot and tear each other apart. One thing that unites them in a common goal is the desire to finally end the idiotic backwards redneck toothless hick display of a racist symbol on the state grounds. Bravo to them if it helps. No it wont end racism and only a flaming dumbass would claim anyones saying that. And no it doesnt mean we need to blow up mt rushmore and rename military bases for chrissake's. What it does mean that a community can find common ground in the midst of a horrible tragedy and take a step that the mass majority of scians agree is time to take anyway!. If anyone cant begrudge them that small bit of solace for the sake of some idiotic false bullshit narrative about southern heritage then the hell with u.

And btw every single state that seceded claimed in their secession statements that it was over slavery. So spare me the pathetic spin control that the war was about anything else.
 
wow the hyperbole. Where do i start. This isnt about pc. This is about racist mass murder and a community trying to come together as opposed to others that riot and tear each other apart. One thing that unites them in a common goal is the desire to finally end the idiotic backwards redneck toothless hick display of a racist symbol on the state grounds. Bravo to them if it helps. No it wont end racism and only a flaming dumbass would claim anyones saying that. And no it doesnt mean we need to blow up mt rushmore and rename military bases for chrissake's. What it does mean that a community can find common ground in the midst of a horrible tragedy and take a step that the mass majority of scians agree is time to take anyway!. If anyone cant begrudge them that small bit of solace for the sake of some idiotic false bullshit narrative about southern heritage then the hell with u.

And btw every single state that seceded claimed in their secession statements that it was over slavery. So spare me the pathetic spin control that the war was about anything else.

It should be about a nut going off his rocker. But, it wouldn't stay there. That should be the focus, but that's not good enough for the rest of the country. They chose to dredge-up the Civil War AGAIN!

And, it is not accurate to say that every state, or every southern citizen, seceded (or wanted secession) because of ONLY Slavery. Slavery was a wedge and it was ultimately why the Civil War was fought. But, the North was benefiting from Slavery just about as much as the South. That's why they didn't wanna lose it! Would you want your wife to divorce you after she won the lottery?

But, we are a country that has difficulty living harmoniously. I think we needed at least 2 countries! We need them now! I'd be happy with 50 small countries. More diversity! Find what fits and stop playing "State/Federal" ping pong.
 
I bring up the question about how far this goes (banning Confederate flags being merchandized just blocks away from this masscre, renaming bases, etc.) only because that is exactly what is being considered right now at UNC with respect to Saunders Hall...Hillary Clinton, for example, said Wednesday that she would like to see stores across the country stop selling Confederate flags.
 
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If Strum is winning this thread, heelmanwilm just went on a 18-2 run, and now leads by three. Lol
 
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I imagine if Germany decided to fly a Nazi Swastika flag beside the Herrenhaus where the Bundesrat is located in Berlin as a memorial to the German soldiers who lost their lives in WWII there would be world wide pressure for it to be removed.
 
I'm actually thinking that now is a good time to start a Confederate Flag company.
Exactly! Ka-Ching!

I just heard where a cookie store in a Columbia mall is selling the rebel flag cookies like crazy.

See, if they'd never made any reference to that flag, this never would have happened. Now the scab is pulled right back off the wound!
 
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There ya go, 71-00 . . . you can sell flags, cookies and confederate flag jewelry and make a fortune.
 
If, you hurry, you might be able to get in on the last of one of these really cool Virginia license plates before that option ends. You know, to promote that new flag and cookie company you're gonna start . .

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Good for her . . !

Maybe Amazon, EBay, Sears and Walmart will follow suit. Oh wait . . ;)

Alabama took their flags down from the state Capitol, seems like the movement is starting to snowball . .
A little over the top, I believe... Would her first act as CIC be to rename all US military bases currently named after Confederate generals?
 
I imagine if Germany decided to fly a Nazi Swastika flag beside the Herrenhaus where the Bundesrat is located in Berlin as a memorial to the German soldiers who lost their lives in WWII there would be world wide pressure for it to be removed.
Hasn't Germany used the Iron Cross since WWII as emblems on their aircraft and tanks?
 
If, you hurry, you might be able to get in on the last of one of these really cool Virginia license plates before that option ends. You know, to promote that new flag and cookie company you're gonna start . .

images
I've lived in southeastern VA for 11 years and have never seen such a license plate on the road... maybe the least used license plate options in VA. Interesting that such a big deal is being made about eliminating it...
 
You and I know it won't change anything. That change starts in the household with the parents. Some parents today are still teaching their kids to be racist and hate anyone that doesn't look like them. When you are 21 years old, there is no reason for you to be racist. Nobody has ever done anything for them to be racist.


Slick I'm sorry but I don't believe there are many parents out there teaching their kids to be racist. I'm sure there are some but a small minority. Would you agree that racism exist in black families as well?
 
If, you hurry, you might be able to get in on the last of one of these really cool Virginia license plates before that option ends. You know, to promote that new flag and cookie company you're gonna start . .

images

See, that is way off, Billy. That is just malicious presumptuousness. NO ONE on this board has any personal contempt for black people because they are black. NO ONE here wants anything resembling the antebellum south. No one even condones the notion of the institution of slavery as ever having been an acceptable idea, let alone a policy and profitable industry. NO ONE is doing that. That was in really poor taste there. I'm surprised at you.
 
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See, that is way off, Billy. That is just malicious presumptuousness. NO ONE on this board has any personal contempt for black people because they are black. NO ONE here wants anything resembling the antebellum south. No one even condones the notion of the institution of slavery as ever having been an acceptable idea, let alone a policy and profitable industry. NO ONE is doing that. That was in really poor taste there. I'm surprised at you.


Nothing I do is in poor taste.

The pic of the Va state license plate with the confederate logo was what I was presenting. Which has been, btw, eliminated as an option for Virginia residents.
 
Good for her . . !

Maybe Amazon, EBay, Sears and Walmart will follow suit. Oh wait . . ;)

Alabama took their flags down from the state Capitol, seems like the movement is starting to snowball . .


And what the hell will it accomplish??? Absolutely NOTHING. There actually may be a war if they keep going. Robert E Lee was one of the best General's our country has ever known. He also freed is slaves before Grant did. BTW, the Democrats actually put the flag up in SC and the wonderful (lmao) Robert Byrd was a KKK head but that's just fine cause he was a liberal dem.
 
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See, that is way off, Billy. That is just malicious presumptuousness. NO ONE on this board has any personal contempt for black people because they are black. NO ONE here wants anything resembling the antebellum south. No one even condones the notion of the institution of slavery as ever having been an acceptable idea, let alone a policy and profitable industry. NO ONE is doing that. That was in really poor taste there. I'm surprised at you.

I may be wrong, but I didn't think Billy was implying that anyone ITT was racist.

Am I wrong Billy?
 
Nothing I do is in poor taste.

The pic of the Va state license plate with the confederate logo was what I was presenting. Which has been, btw, eliminated as an option for Virginia residents.
The SCV is not a racial hate group. "SLAVES" was in pretty bad taste. It implied, to me anyway, that any display of that flag = you hate blacks and want to go back to antebellum South.

If that wasn't what you were implying, then I apologize.
 
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