ADVERTISEMENT

How bad has this year been in comparison to other "bad" years?

a_bartlett

Gold Member
Jan 5, 2023
9
9
3
So, I know we can pretty much all agree that this year, at least by Carolina Basketball standards, has been bad and difficult to watch at times. My question though, if you were to compare this to an average Carolina basketball season, how poor would you say this year has been?

I ask because even though I've grown up a North Carolina fan, this was the first year I really started caring about the team and watching all of their games. I think it was partially because of how amazing their improbable run was last year, but it's safe to say that at this point, the team hasn't lived up to its expectations. I don't have much knowledge of previous years' teams except for some memories of the 2016 and 2017 championship games, partially because I'm so young (I'll be a freshman at UNC next year if that is any reference to my age).

I know there have been bad teams in recent years such as the 2019-2020 team, and I also think we were spoiled last year with the miracle run in March despite the team's underwhelming regular season, but those, along with this year, seem to be relatively standout bad seasons when compared to UNC's program history.

I wonder if this season is really that bad or if it just seems like it is because of recency bias and the expectations we all had for this team coming into the year. What do you all think?
 
Unless you are a good student of the game and the ACC, you really can't know anything because your age severely limits you in what you can compare.

This is as weak an ACC as I've ever seen. My fan days go back to the late 1960s. And even when young I knew about Frank McGuire and 1957, as well as Everett Case.
 
The 8-20 season is as bad as it gets.

We had 4 players who were ranked in the top 25 of their classes (what is usually considered a 5-star recruit.) We had 3 other players ranked in the top 40 of their classes. So that's 7 highly ranked recruits: 2 seniors, 2 sophomores, 3 freshmen. We only won 8 dang games.
 
8-20 was the worst, Bacot's freshman season was bad due to all the injuries, Roy's last season was to me very disappointing but he played a LOT of freshmen. I think the hype of that run to the natty game last season set us all up with expectations that were flawed, we were more the team that played most of the regular season last season than the one that caught fire late and ran it to the natty game. 8-20 was worse, maybe Matt's last season as coach would maybe rival this season but yeah, this one was terrible with a capital "T". NOT because of the win loss record but how so much of it did not have to end as it did. Hubert had a really really bad second season and in my view to much of it was by his decisions.
 
The 8-20 season was the worst. Unless this current UNC team can pull off a miracle, this season will be a close second. Why? Because the Tar Heels are on pace to become the most disappointing preseason No. 1 team in men's college basketball’s modern era.
 
  • Like
Reactions: UNCPJH81
The 8-20 season is as bad as it gets.

We had 4 players who were ranked in the top 25 of their classes (what is usually considered a 5-star recruit.) We had 3 other players ranked in the top 40 of their classes. So that's 7 highly ranked recruits: 2 seniors, 2 sophomores, 3 freshmen. We only won 8 dang games.
Which of the players on that team were ranked that high as recruits? What was obvious the year before was that the team had no depth, and then easily the best player expected to return, Forte, went NBA.

You think there are 25 5* recruits per year?

The ACC that year was a much deeper, tougher conference than what it is this season. I didn't expect only 8 wins back then, but I did expect a losing season, because Guthridge left a team sorely in need of discipline that had showed for 2 seasons in a row that it lacked depth and by then also would lack experience. Making all that much harder was that players knew that Dean Smith had said publicly, to Doherty with a number of witnesses, that Doherty was not his choice for the job. That was all a few of them needed to become like the kids dealing a teacher they know the Principal does not like - they intend to get away with as much as possible.
 
Which of the players on that team were ranked that high as recruits?
You can use the RSCI site to look up the players on that team. It is a composite recruiting ranking site. Here are those rankings in their various recruiting classes. (And I was wrong, it was 5 top 25 recruits.)

Jason Capel #10
Jawad Williams #11
Kris Lang #22
Brian Morrison #24
Jackie Manuel #25
Adam Boone #33
Melvin Scott #37
 
It’s all about perspective. You could argue that 1983/1984 was bad. Same with 1997/1998. The time Phil Ford was injured and Butter. The 8-20 season was just another level. This current season minus a miracle will also be in the discussion.
 
A couple random seasons I hated. 2009-10. Roy played like a 13 player rotation. Zeller and Davis were hurt but every game was a rough watch. We just strolled out average player after average player. The combination of over subbing and just a bunch of “just a guys.”

Roy’s last year. Seeing Garrison Brooks play any minutes when we had 2 absolute studs in Sharpe and Kessler. Miserable watching that because you knew the best players werent out there. Garrison Brooks… another example where experience can be absolutely useless.

That one year where Roy started Desmond Hubert and Joel James over PJ Hairston for like 2/3 of the season. Then he finally went away from 2 bigs and we turned into a half competent team. For the life of me, I’ll never understand Desmond Hubert ever starting games. Remember when people thought Joel James would be good because he was on NBA mock drafts for like the first 2 months of his freshman year? Good times.
 
A couple random seasons I hated. 2009-10. Roy played like a 13 player rotation. Zeller and Davis were hurt but every game was a rough watch. We just strolled out average player after average player. The combination of over subbing and just a bunch of “just a guys.”

Roy’s last year. Seeing Garrison Brooks play any minutes when we had 2 absolute studs in Sharpe and Kessler. Miserable watching that because you knew the best players werent out there. Garrison Brooks… another example where experience can be absolutely useless.

That one year where Roy started Desmond Hubert and Joel James over PJ Hairston for like 2/3 of the season. Then he finally went away from 2 bigs and we turned into a half competent team. For the life of me, I’ll never understand Desmond Hubert ever starting games. Remember when people thought Joel James would be good because he was on NBA mock drafts for like the first 2 months of his freshman year? Good times.
You have an amazing memory. I’m astonished at how much I either forgot or my brains defense mechanism kicked in and protected me from these players/seasons.
 
You have an amazing memory. I’m astonished at how much I either forgot or my brains defense mechanism kicked in and protected me from these players/seasons.
Basically every team I hated consisted of big guys missing mid range jumpers.

Deon Thompson loved missing those awkward turnaround 13 footers. The Wear twins loved missing 17 footers. Garrison Brooks loved missing 13 footers.

James Michael McAdoo loved missing turnaround 17 footers (I didn’t hate those teams but I cringed when he would elevate for that shot).

But no one loved missing mid range jumpers more than Joel James missing those turn around lefty jumpers.
 
2010 had legit talent but unfortunately Zeller and Ed Davis were hurt most of the year, Roy spent most of the year trying to put John Henson at the 3, and Larry Drew was cancer. Roy took a lot of criticism that year but when you look back and see all that was working against him it really shouldnt be surprising that it was a rough year
 
  • Like
Reactions: Heelicious
Basically every team I hated consisted of big guys missing mid range jumpers.

Deon Thompson loved missing those awkward turnaround 13 footers. The Wear twins loved missing 17 footers. Garrison Brooks loved missing 13 footers.

James Michael McAdoo loved missing turnaround 17 footers (I didn’t hate those teams but I cringed when he would elevate for that shot).

But no one loved missing mid range jumpers more than Joel James missing those turn around lefty jumpers.
In his defense, Deon Thompson came around regarding what he should / shouldn't do in the 2009 title season, and he was a big part of that team's utter domination of most everyone they played, including being a big part of both Final Four games IIRC. DT scored well, passed, etc in the paint and at the rim, where he should have been all along.
 
A couple random seasons I hated. 2009-10. Roy played like a 13 player rotation. Zeller and Davis were hurt but every game was a rough watch. We just strolled out average player after average player. The combination of over subbing and just a bunch of “just a guys.”
Yep, a bad year for UNC, but it ended with a nice uptick on a run to the NIT championship game.

Last year was sort of like 2010. Not as bad, and with an even better uptick at the end, but similar.

If this team keeps winning it could get in that group.

OTOH, if Hubert's teams only get good at the end of the season, I may save some money and only pay for the basketball package starting in March.
 
  • Haha
Reactions: Heelicious
It’s all about perspective. You could argue that 1983/1984 was bad. Same with 1997/1998. The time Phil Ford was injured and Butter. The 8-20 season was just another level. This current season minus a miracle will also be in the discussion.
Lmao..no way 97-98 were bad teams.

Back to Back Final Fours and ACC tournament champions.
 
8-20 is the winner for bad.

Lots of tournament disappointments that you can classify however.

This is most disappointing regular season team I’ve seen (45 years old for perspective). Besides Mondo’s double doubles, the good RJ games, and the people Leaky would lock down there was nothing enjoyable about this team and it was the same frustration game after game.

I don’t want us to be bad next year, but we need to clear the decks.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Heelicious
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT