Line up I would like to see...

[DSouthr]

Be it a starting line up or a rotation but I think this would be an interesting line up to take a look at.

Manley at THE 5, Luke 4, Cam 3, Theo 2, with Joel. It would make us about as long as we can get with guys that produce, it allows Theo to create from the 2 and yet have Cam as a shooting threat at the 3. It allows us to switch off a lot with a 2 that can check both 3s and 4s as well and I think help us rebounding. What you lose is kenny's defense but Cam in to me means we don't lose jump shooting, Cam is IMO a more reliable jump shooter. Theo seems more willing to put pressure on defenses than Kenny and would be able to see/play over most 2s.

Manley IMO is a better match up at he 5 with his length and would allow luke to step outside more when we have another big man anchored inside the paint. While I prefer Theo at the 3, he and Cam have both played the 2 in college while kenny has really only been a 2. Not down on Kenny just looking at what we have and how pieces may fit together a little better. IMO Theo defending at the 2 is not a huge drop off from kenny but brings more versatility and a bit more of an attacking mindset on the offensive end.

What think you?

 

[Spacegrass]

I think come tourney time against say a team like Arizona or Kansas or even the Dookies in conference play that lineup will work best. But against teams that play smaller which is a majority of college teams I feel like the smaller starting 5 from the last 2 games is the better group. That bigger lineup I don't think you could expect more than 15-18 MPG out of that 5 because of Manley's strength and conditioning deficiencies. So you would almost have to get the bigger teams going one way against the traditional 2 big guys only to be able to swing it to the spread the floor shooting small ball group to keep them off balance defensively.

 

[BillyL]

Mine as well, DS . . I actually hoped that would be our starting line-up from Day 1.

IMHO, it's our very best.

 

[pln2013]

There's an excellent article on TOS from Adrian Atkinson that discusses the early results from "big ball". Sample sizes are tiny, though.

Overall, I'm not really a fan of the concept. There's very little shot creation (playing at the 2 takes away most of Theo's off-the-dribble oomph), and there isn't a reliable wing defender (Theo is a gambler, Cam isn't really an anything).

 

[DSouthr]

I think come tourney time against say a team like Arizona or Kansas or even the Dookies in conference play that lineup will work best. But against teams that play smaller which is a majority of college teams I feel like the smaller starting 5 from the last 2 games is the better group. That bigger lineup I don't think you could expect more than 15-18 MPG out of that 5 because of Manley's strength and conditioning deficiencies. So you would almost have to get the bigger teams going one way against the traditional 2 big guys only to be able to swing it to the spread the floor shooting small ball group to keep them off balance defensively.

As the season Manley should be able to play more minutes from a stamina standpoint, just as Tony's stamina seemed to increase last season. I agree, don't see him able to give us 30mins a game but maybe close to 20 may not be out of the question ( I would take 15-18).

 

[al would]

That line up might be something to try occasionally but Manley simply doesn't have the strength to hold a solid post position yet .. which means he's not really a good option for starting the offense with an interior entry pass and probably not a very good screener for holding a lane open for driving .. but he is making some really good improvements. As far as Cam being a superior outside threat than Kenny, I might have to reserve judgement till I see him play another game. He went 1-5 from 3 against ND and his shot was flatter than my feet .. not sure what happened to that pretty form of old but it looked like it didn't get it out of the locker room against ND. Hope he gets that sorted out fairly quickly. jmho

 

[tarheel0910]

I'm not really sure why you would take out KW in the starting line up. Taking him out and putting in Cam would be a net negative. Anything you would gain in offense (which I think would be minimal at best) would be offset by a huge drop off in defense.

 

[Heelswin]

Could be a powerful lineup ... but can Manley hack it?

OTH, l think we need Kennys defense!

 

[nctransplant]

I'm not really sure why you would take out KW in the starting line up. Taking him out and putting in Cam would be a net negative. Anything you would gain in offense (which I think would be minimal at best) would be offset by a huge drop off in defense.

Try Manley but leave Kenny. Cam has yet to prove he is the shooter everyone says he is.

 

[TPFKAPFS]

Put KW back in for CJ and I think you have it!

CJ is a better % shooter, but hasn't yet shown it in games and he also hasn't shown the desire to mix it up on the boards. I trust KW a little more to block his man out and fight harder on the boards so far. Both are good shooters when they get them out of the flow of the O and neither has proven to be elite when creating their own shot. Right now I think KW has the edge in determining what a good shot is as well. I love them both, but I don't see the change as yet!

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Be it a starting line up or a rotation but I think this would be an interesting line up to take a look at.

Manley at THE 5, Luke 4, Cam 3, Theo 2, with Joel. It would make us about as long as we can get with guys that produce, it allows Theo to create from the 2 and yet have Cam as a shooting threat at the 3. It allows us to switch off a lot with a 2 that can check both 3s and 4s as well and I think help us rebounding. What you lose is kenny's defense but Cam in to me means we don't lose jump shooting, Cam is IMO a more reliable jump shooter. Theo seems more willing to put pressure on defenses than Kenny and would be able to see/play over most 2s.

Manley IMO is a better match up at he 5 with his length and would allow luke to step outside more when we have another big man anchored inside the paint. While I prefer Theo at the 3, he and Cam have both played the 2 in college while kenny has really only been a 2. Not down on Kenny just looking at what we have and how pieces may fit together a little better. IMO Theo defending at the 2 is not a huge drop off from kenny but brings more versatility and a bit more of an attacking mindset on the offensive end.

What think you?

If Manley could handle it, I think we'd already be seeing a lot of it.

Since we haven't been seeing a lot of it, I suspect that means Roy has decided Manley isn't up to the demands of playing enough in that lineup to use it very much.

That said, if Manley improves, we might start seeing it more.

BTW, I don't think we have to worry about who sits. Could be Kenny, as you suggest. Could be Cam. Could even be Theo. They should all be getting starter minutes and rotating in and out freely.

The question that we will see answered in the next few weeks is whether Manley can improve at a sufficient pace to get that chance. Or whether he will be this year's Brice - who, despite is obvious talents, just couldn't keep up and lost minutes toward the end of his freshman season.

Unfortunately, by shifting to the smaller lineup we have seen for the last couple of games, Roy may already be signalling that he doesn't think Manley can keep up. If so, he is making that decision much sooner than he did when he went small in 2013. A number of people were critical of Roy then for waiting so long. But is he being too quick to pull the trigger this year?

The more we win with the current lineup, the more likely Roy sticks with it, I think.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

One game where I could definitely see this lineup is against NC State. While their front line has been less impressive than I expected, they still have good size and skills with Yurtseven, Abu and L. Freeman.

 

[gunslingerdick]

Our best line up is any line up that includes Kenny. He’s the best defender we have. I can’t believe taking him out of the line up is even a thought. That’s crazy talk to me.

 

[Archer2]

I agree with gun. Kenny is firmly entrenched in any starting lineup I devise. I specifically watched Kenny last night and he was playing with so much energy. I really love his game.

Sterling is only good for spot minutes right now, due to lack of stamina. Once he builds up his lower body strength and can hold his position, he will become a viable option. Thomas just manhandled him in the low block last night.

As much as it pains me to say it, we're going to see a ton of small ball this year, which means heavy reliance on the long ball. It's nerve wracking but it's our best chance to win right now. That's not to say Roy won't continue to develop an inside game, but it's going to take time.

 

[gauchoheel]

It makes intuitive sense, but Kenny is just a better player than Sterling right now. Overall, I think it'd be a net negative to cut down Kenny's minutes for any of our bench players.

I love Sterling's potential, but he is still too weak to be a reliable post defender. He just got beat handily by Elijah Thomas, so I don't think he's strong enough to contain Bagley or Carter. I think our best bet against Duke is to contain penetration, not give up easy threes, and make them shoot a really high percentage inside. Giving up scoring and our best wing defender to get Manley may be the wrong move.

 

[Archer2]

In all fairness, Thomas was ranked 31st nationally coming out of high school. He could very well be playing in the NBA some day.

 

[dadika13]

Agree with the above...Thomas is a baller and any lineup without Kenny makes us worse, not better.

 

[mikeirbyusa]

Mine as well, DS . . I actually hoped that would be our starting line-up from Day 1.

IMHO, it's our very best.

Manley won't start til next season at best.

 

[thaUNCshow]

i question anyones bball knowledge that doesnt think Cam, JB, Theo, Kenny, Luke is our best lineup

 

[mikeirbyusa]

i question anyones bball knowledge that doesnt think Cam, JB, Theo, Kenny, Luke is our best lineup

For scoring YES. For rebounding NO.

 

[gauchoheel]

For scoring YES. For rebounding NO.

But overall, I think it is. We give up a bit on defense with Cam in, but the offense compared to Manley outweighs the defensive dropoff.

 

[mikeirbyusa]

But overall, I think it is. We give up a bit on defense with Cam in, but the offense compared to Manley outweighs the defensive dropoff.

Agree 100%

 

[Archer2]

Our conference stats and conference ranking after the Clensum game:

FG% 42.4% 4th
2P% 46.2% 9th
3PM 56 2nd
3PA 153 2nd
3P% 36.6% 6th
FTM 68 10th
FTA 88 10th
FT% 77.3% 4th
ORB 91 3rd
DRB 165 2nd
TRB 256 2nd
AST 99 1st
TOV 67 6th
BLK 22 8th
PF 97 6th
PPG 75.7 4th

So we're rebounding the ball well, even with the small lineup being used more often. What we miss with the small lineup is shot blockers and high percentage inside scoring. We are ranked 9th in 2P% and that is simply too low for a UNC team that is leading the league in assists.

We are 2nd in 3PM and 3PA, highly unusual for a UNC team. As a reference, we were 8th in both categories last year and 15th(3PM) and 11th(3PA) the year before that. This demonstrates just how much we are dependent upon scoring behind the arc, too much for all of our liking(including Roy I'm sure). But with the lack of production inside the paint due to the inexperience of our green bigs, it's our best chance of winning right now.

We're also 10th in FTM and FTA, another consequence of a lack of big men who can score down low and draw fouls. Ergo, why I think Theo, Joel, and Kenny must look to drive more often and attempt to draw fouls/get the other team in foul trouble.

 

[FranktheHeel]

Thanks for posting Archer. The stat that really jumped out to me was the assist number and it is great to see that we are at the tops, and you know what I see this number skyrocketing as the season progresses. This year we are very capable of moving the ball due to the versatility and unselfishness of our guys and their ability to not only be very good passers, but also to get into the right spots to receive that pass, which is another reason that going small has helped a ton offensively as it has led us to have that spacing and off ball movement that is so important for us. If we are going to continue to shoot as many threes as we have, we need to continue to make that extra pass in order to get the best look that we can. Luke is also a very good passer too, he once again had 5 assist last night. He is starting to realize this and as he senses double teams he has done a better job of being able to stay under control and find the open man which has usually led to a higher percentage looked compared to when when he tried to force shots up. Our ball movement definitely benefited Cam last night and as he continues to get more comfortable with our guys we will keep finding him as he gets to his spots and is ready to knock them down. Having a good chemistry goes a long way with being able to move the ball and find the open man and the more our guys gain confidence in one another the better it will continue to get.

 

[Archer2]

I agree Frank, this team has a lot of willing passers. We're still a bit careless with the ball, our A/TO ratio is slightly lower this year(1.48/1) as compared to last year(1.53/1) and the year before(1.51/1), but actually not as bad as I would have thought. It seems to me like we've turned the ball over an awful lot this year. Again, all these are conference stats only.

There is a fine line between being very aggressive(the full length TD pass Luke made to Kenny), and "valuing" the ball.

 

[Spaceytoyz]

Heels have 5 ready to go players and I am sure we all know the 5, everyone else needs time.. This is the difference between a good team and a great team , if they were getting 20 points off the bench a night that would be a great team..

 

[Steat]

Manley won't start til next season at best.

Mikey, I agree. Manley's off-season will be so closely watched they could make a hit miniseries. Would love to see him put on about 15-20 lbs of muscle and get much stronger. Then he will be in a position to get 20-25 minutes a game next season with 2nd team ACC honors.

 

[Ozheelfan]

Manley won't start til next season at best.

I’m comfortable with a Jnr year start for Sterling. Not saying he won’t be much improved as a sophmore, but the growth, weight, and added strength he’d get over the next 20-or so months should see him really develop into a very solid ACC centre by November 2019.

 

[Archer2]

Heels have 5 ready to go players and I am sure we all know the 5, everyone else needs time.. This is the difference between a good team and a great team , if they were getting 20 points off the bench a night that would be a great team..

Have to agree. Last year, we got 23.4 PPG from our bench during ACC play, this year so far, 10.8 PPG. That needs to improve.

The four players I think we need to be steady off the bench are Sterling, Garrsion, Jalek, and Brandon. They don't have to be exceptional but if they can contribute 20/10, we'd go to another level. We got 11/8 last night. We are averaging 12.1 RPG off the bench this year but we need more scoring from them.

 

[al would]

For scoring YES. For rebounding NO.

Might have to respectfully disagree with you on that one boss. As much as I love Theo and respect what he does for the team I don't think he would be on the floor if I was looking for the best "pure offensive" team. Think I might put JB,Cam,Kenny,Luke and BRob on the floor as my best offensive team. Brandons shot looked purty sweet against clemmy last night and he brought some good energy on both ends of the floor... Also think you might start seeing that combination on the floor a bit more often, especially if we have to play from behind. jmho

 

[pln2013]

Might have to respectfully disagree with you on that one boss. As much as I love Theo and respect what he does for the team I don't think he would be on the floor if I was looking for the best "pure offensive" team. Think I might put JB,Cam,Kenny,Luke and BRob on the floor as my best offensive team. Brandons shot looked purty sweet against clemmy last night and he brought some good energy on both ends of the floor... Also think you might start seeing that combination on the floor a bit more often, especially if we have to play from behind. jmho

Theo is one of two players who has shown the ability to create a shot for someone else, the other being Jalek. Our best lineups include him.