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Post-Maui stuff...

gary-7

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...and this is about self-scouting.

Didn't post last night because my language may have been bannable, and this is about more than any one game. So, only gonna spend a few lines on that last one:
...like tired legs being obvious from the tip with the myriad short-armed finish misses --- or that a team that was literally ranked in the 300s in the NCAA D1 in 3-pt shooting lights it up on us --- or that we got that incompetent buffoon zebra (Curry) for the damn 3rd time in 4 games who thwarted our initial comeback by T-ing up Hubert (who wasn't even talking to him) after his partner-in-crime made a hideously bad call (or I should say, let Izzo make the call), and make no mistake, that changed the game --- or after leading another comeback and abusing their PG, EC misses a damn 99% layup to for the lead, then leads us back to force OT on Seth's splash --- or that we ran outta gas in said OT. Yeah, enough of that...

This is about deeper issues., and they are NOT the ones many fans fall back on. Our issues are NOT about who we got or did NOT get in the portal --- or which player might be struggling at whatever --- it is how the players we have are (or are NOT) being used.

Thus, as I said, it is time for this staff to do some serious SELF-scouting. The texts and calls I've gotten from my coach mafia during and after the game can be summed up by one in particular from my (Carolina-guy) AAU coach bud:
"WTF are we even doing???"

Y'all know I love this staff, but it is their collective pedigree that makes what I'm seeing so much of a "WTF?"
So, I actually hope one of them reads this, because here are 4 self-scouting points (that are BTW unanimous amongst my circle) that need to be corrected pronto (and I'll save the most important for last:
1. DEFENSE - Guys, we can NOT afford to just give opponents one look, and I don't care how good we are at it. We have the arsenal and the personnel made to be multiple. We used three series of 43 Tuesday and one of 42 last night, but there were myriad situations that screamed for scrambles.

2. PERSONNEL USAGE - We have a roster that has strengths and weaknesses (like most teams), but we SHOULD be legitimately deeper than we are showing. Tyson is being forgotten and that is helping neither him nor us. I know casual fans will jump to conclusions that he is a bust --- BS --- For those who watched practices, he proved himself worthy of starter consideration. He can play but is never gonna find his fit and mojo rotting on the bench. Powell, in particular is showing his value, and that's good. But we're not gonna win with 34 minutes of Withers (nothing against his value).

3. HALF-COURT OFFENSE - Hubert has a nice array of set plays and actions, BUT we are limiting ourselves by forgetting an inside-out game. Never forget that the highest % 3-pt shots come from rhythm kick-outs. We should be using mid-post entries with JWash as a shot-threat and passer, as opposed to just a screener and roller.

4. (and most important) RESTORE THE DAMN SECONDARY - for Christ sake, this is Dean's greatest invention and Roy's calling-card! There's a reason we aren't getting sh** off the Secondary these days --- we're doing it WRONG. There is nothing easier to defend than a team that just comes down and surrounds the defense. All you hafta do is get your guys to mirror and it stalls. The Secondary run properly is designed to stress a retreating defense, but there are TWO fundamental f***-ups going on right now:
A) NEVER use a cross-court pitch-ahead (unless it makes for a layup) --- all that does is balance the defense FOR them --- and I can tell this is not a player decision, it is being taught. Hell, Dean would've stopped practice if he saw that nonsense. You push middle or sideline which draws the defense and affords a reversal.
B) The magic key to the Secondary is the first 4/5 man sprinting to the block (rim-run, dive). It forces a reaction as it is option #1, making it difficult to account for everyone. We're are eschewing this critical component, which has killed the TRIGGER of the Carolina system, and puts us in an (ugh) 5-out set, which is just unsound pussery.

As I said prevciously, running a Secondary without the post option is like putting tits on a boar-hog.
Come on guys! I mean, three of you on our bench played for Roy Williams, and 3 played for Dean Smith!... well, somewhere up there Dean is face-palming right about now, and Roy won't say anything unless he is asked. He probably should, but he won't. So ASK! Please...

Anyway, good Thanksgving wishes for all, and well... I guess we shall see what happens next...
 
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I have seen one entry pass to the post in the 4 games they played in the tournament.

IMO is not a matter of if the guy you throw it to can score the ball or not but it's the action of making them sag just a bit to give the pass out a little bit of a cleaner look.
 
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I think this team has pretty major personnel issues.

The backcourt is good but it’s like water and oil. RJ and Cadeau are ball dominant guards. And Seth is quickly becoming a player you want having plays designed for too. There’s only one ball and all three need it in some capacity.

I’m not really disappointed by Withers. He’s shown this year to be the same inconsistent player he’s been for his entire college career. Was one more year in UNC’s system going to change that?

Through 3 seasons Washington hasn’t shown to be a starting caliber player at this level. That’s what the film says.

And the film to this point says Cade Tyson isn’t a rotational player at this level. I care somewhat what they do at practice. I really care what the game film shows. And apparently he’s great at practice but Hubert doesn’t trust him? That goes against every coach I’ve ever heard of. Coaches by in large value practice reps a ton. So that doesn’t make sense to me.

The freshman Jackson and Powell are certainly talented but I don’t think they’re consistent difference makers like the Rutgers freshmen for instance. So how much can you depend on them?

The reality right now is this team is more at Michigan State’s level. Probably a fringe top 25 team and one you hope develops and gets better as the season progresses.

I don’t buy fatigue as a relevant excuse. MSU played 3x in 3 days. Make the f’ing layup.
 
I think this team has pretty major personnel issues.

The backcourt is good but it’s like water and oil. RJ and Cadeau are ball dominant guards. And Seth is quickly becoming a player you want having plays designed for too. There’s only one ball and all three need it in some capacity.

I’m not really disappointed by Withers. He’s shown this year to be the same inconsistent player he’s been for his entire college career. Was one more year in UNC’s system going to change that?

Through 3 seasons Washington hasn’t shown to be a starting caliber player at this level. That’s what the film says.

And the film to this point says Cade Tyson isn’t a rotational player at this level. I care somewhat what they do at practice. I really care what the game film shows. And apparently he’s great at practice but Hubert doesn’t trust him? That goes against every coach I’ve ever heard of. Coaches by in large value practice reps a ton. So that doesn’t make sense to me.

The freshman Jackson and Powell are certainly talented but I don’t think they’re consistent difference makers like the Rutgers freshmen for instance. So how much can you depend on them?

The reality right now is this team is more at Michigan State’s level. Probably a fringe top 25 team and one you hope develops and gets better as the season progresses.

I don’t buy fatigue as a relevant excuse. MSU played 3x in 3 days. Make the f’ing layup.
It's not about personnel. Other than maybe Auburn, literally everyone has personnel issues. This is college basketball. The task is to maximize what you have and we can play with anybody if we would just do that.
 
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And after suffering through as much of a re-watch of some of the Maui games as I could stand, and after many servings of stuffed turkey, Wild Turkey and some Ole Smokey Butter Pecan moonshine deserts I would like to summarize what a pure layman, but long time UNC fan, has to say about the Maui tournament and this team thus far. As well as a condensed version of @gary-7 's eloquent coaching perspective.

Gary's summary:

1) Hubert sucks as a head coach
2) our offensive spacing, movement and use of available personnel sucks.
3) our defense sucks and once again we go through a group that has yet to grasp the concept of defensive rotations or closing out on, and getting a hand in the faces of, the jump shooters.
4) Hubert sucks as a head coach.

Now my additions:

1) This small ball crap with EC/RJ/Seth ain't gonna fly.
2) Drake and Jack need more time on the floor together (with EC and Seth).
3) If RJ was putting up his current numbers as a frosh or sophomore would you RJ fan clubbers still be giving him such latitude and love? Sports is a "what have you done for me lately" thing. But I really hope he get's "it"
back but for now he's putting to much pressure on himself. He needs to remember UNC is team first and records and accolades are secondary.
4) This coming out flat and being down double digits, in multiple games in a tournament, is a BRF (big red flag) and a direct reflection on game prep, attitude and the coaching staff.
5) Rebounding (effort and lack of rebound positioning) sucks
5) Hubert is once again quickly becoming hubcap.
 
Thanks for your observations Gary. I, sadly or luckily, didn't get to watch any of the Maui games and so can't comment directly..... but it seems to me that Hubert is insisting on playing a "system" of his own choosing, not traditional Carolina basketball, and possibly not in tune with the players he has.

I have not enjoyed Hubert's time so far, besides that golden run fuelled by Brady Manek and closed out by Caleb Love's hot hand.

There have been too many question marks for a program with the pedigree of UNC over the last 3-4 years, and now that he's not getting it done recruiting-wise, it's hard to see what Hubert is actually good at.... this is not work experience, this is a very highly regarded and hugely compensated position in the sport.

I wonder how long it will be before people who have a say decide it's not fair on players, fans and the program to allow a 55yr old to learn on the job.
 
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And after suffering through as much of a re-watch of some of the Maui games as I could stand, and after many servings of stuffed turkey, Wild Turkey and some Ole Smokey Butter Pecan moonshine deserts I would like to summarize what a pure layman, but long time UNC fan, has to say about the Maui tournament and this team thus far. As well as a condensed version of @gary-7 's eloquent coaching perspective.

Gary's summary:

1) Hubert sucks as a head coach
2) our offensive spacing, movement and use of available personnel sucks.
3) our defense sucks and once again we go through a group that has yet to grasp the concept of defensive rotations or closing out on, and getting a hand in the faces of, the jump shooters.
4) Hubert sucks as a head coach.

Now my additions:

1) This small ball crap with EC/RJ/Seth ain't gonna fly.
2) Drake and Jack need more time on the floor together (with EC and Seth).
3) If RJ was putting up his current numbers as a frosh or sophomore would you RJ fan clubbers still be giving him such latitude and love? Sports is a "what have you done for me lately" thing. But I really hope he get's "it"
back but for now he's putting to much pressure on himself. He needs to remember UNC is team first and records and accolades are secondary.
4) This coming out flat and being down double digits, in multiple games in a tournament, is a BRF (big red flag) and a direct reflection on game prep, attitude and the coaching staff.
5) Rebounding (effort and lack of rebound positioning) sucks
5) Hubert is once again quickly becoming hubcap.
lol that’s a big IF question. If my aunt had balls, I could call her my uncle. But I’ll bite, he’s not a sophomore and he didn’t put up those numbers as a sophomore. Those are facts. I think that’s why he does get some leeway. IMO it’s almost ran out, but you want to give the ball up to two freshmen who supposedly won’t be here next year. Interesting. I don’t think it’s a selfish or a nonteam first attitude. You don’t want to give him credit for anything and that’s fine, but you dang sure didn’t gripe when he’s gotten it done for unc. If you can’t see him getting the majority of the pressure due to our lack of bigs and others not needing pressure to be guarded, then by all means keep going.
I know one thing we can agree on, our coaches need to bow up. There’s a lot more that can be fixed with this team than rjs struggles. If they can’t see it with J Wit then they may not even see anything wrong with rjs shooting lol
 
...and this is about self-scouting.

Didn't post last night because my language may have been bannable, and this is about more than any one game. So, only gonna spend a few lines on that last one:
...like tired legs being obvious from the tip with the myriad short-armed finish misses --- or that a team that was literally ranked in the 300s in the NCAA D1 in 3-pt shooting lights it up on us --- or that we got that incompetent buffoon zebra (Curry) for the damn 3rd time in 4 games who thwarted our initial comeback by T-ing up Hubert (who wasn't even talking to him) after his partner-in-crime made a hideously bad call (or I should say, let Izzo make the call), and make no mistake, that changed the game --- or after leading another comeback and abusing their PG, EC misses a damn 99% layup to for the lead, then leads us back to force OT on Seth's splash --- or that we ran outta gas in said OT. Yeah, enough of that...

This is about deeper issues., and they are NOT the ones many fans fall back on. Our issues are NOT about who we got or did NOT get in the portal --- or which player might be struggling at whatever --- it is how the players we have are (or are NOT) being used.

Thus, as I said, it is time for this staff to do some serious SELF-scouting. The texts and calls I've gotten from my coach mafia during and after the game can be summed up by one in particular from my (Carolina-guy) AAU coach bud:
"WTF are we even doing???"

Y'all know I love this staff, but it is their collective pedigree that makes what I'm seeing so much of a "WTF?"
So, I actually hope one of them reads this, because here are 4 self-scouting points (that are BTW unanimous amongst my circle) that need to be corrected pronto (and I'll save the most important for last:
1. DEFENSE - Guys, we can NOT afford to just give opponents one look, and I don't care how good we are at it. We have the arsenal and the personnel made to be multiple. We used three series of 43 Tuesday and one of 42 last night, but there were myriad situations that screamed for scrambles.

2. PERSONNEL USAGE - We have a roster that has strengths and weaknesses (like most teams), but we SHOULD be legitimately deeper than we are showing. Tyson is being forgotten and that is helping neither him nor us. I know casual fans will jump to conclusions that he is a bust --- BS --- For those who watched practices, he proved himself worthy of starter consideration. He can play but is never gonna find his fit and mojo rotting on the bench. Powell, in particular is showing his value, and that's good. But we're not gonna win with 34 minutes of Withers (nothing against his value).

3. HALF-COURT OFFENSE - Hubert has a nice array of set plays and actions, BUT we are limiting ourselves by forgetting an inside-out game. Never forget that the highest % 3-pt shots come from rhythm kick-outs. We should be using mid-post entries with JWash as a shot-threat and passer, as opposed to just a screener and roller.

4. (and most important) RESTORE THE DAMN SECONDARY - for Christ sake, this is Dean's greatest invention and Roy's calling-card! There's a reason we aren't getting sh** off the Secondary these days --- we're doing it WRONG. There is nothing easier to defend than a team that just comes down and surrounds the defense. All you hafta do is get your guys to mirror and it stalls. The Secondary run properly is designed to stress a retreating defense, but there are TWO fundamental f***-ups going on right now:
A) NEVER use a cross-court pitch-ahead (unless it makes for a layup) --- all that does is balance the defense FOR them --- and I can tell this is not a player decision, it is being taught. Hell, Dean would've stopped practice if he saw that nonsense. You push middle or sideline which draws the defense and affords a reversal.
B) The magic key to the Secondary is the first 4/5 man sprinting to the block (rim-run, dive). It forces a reaction as it is option #1, making it difficult to account for everyone. We're are eschewing this critical component, which has killed the TRIGGER of the Carolina system, and puts us in an (ugh) 5-out set, which is just unsound pussery.

As I said prevciously, running a Secondary without the post option is like putting tits on a boar-hog.
Come on guys! I mean, three of you on our bench played for Roy Williams, and 3 played for Dean Smith!... well, somewhere up there Dean is face-palming right about now, and Roy won't say anything unless he is asked. He probably should, but he won't. So ASK! Please...

Anyway, good Thanksgving wishes for all, and well... I guess we shall see what happens next...
Good breakdown as usual gary-7. I like our team. I want to see balance on offense, bringing back the secondary break. We’re deep enough to wear teams down with an in to out offense and a defensive that brings pressure. Got to get some confidence in JWash and Tyson- they are better than they are playing. RJ may need to pull back a little and not force things and look to involve his teammates a little more. I think this will get him in the flow too. Our kids are playing hard and I hope our staff can put them in position to maximize their abilities.
 
I would add that our guards assist to turnover ratio is horrendous. Seems like we don't value the ball or play hard nosed defense until we are down 15. Just improve those 2 things and we are in every game we have played.

Really seems like having consistent effort is an issue. Remedy that and I think we are a top 10 team.

There are other things that I would like to see but don't have the knowledge of seeing practice like the coaches. Do hope we can lower minutes of our starting guards for more time to the freshman. I would love to see that so we could apply nonstop pressure and get into the other teams legs late in the game. That might lower opponents 3 point shooting. Excited to see more from Drake and Ian and maybe even a sprinkle of James.
 
I would add that our guards assist to turnover ratio is horrendous. Seems like we don't value the ball or play hard nosed defense until we are down 15. Just improve those 2 things and we are in every game we have played.

Really seems like having consistent effort is an issue. Remedy that and I think we are a top 10 team.

There are other things that I would like to see but don't have the knowledge of seeing practice like the coaches. Do hope we can lower minutes of our starting guards for more time to the freshman. I would love to see that so we could apply nonstop pressure and get into the other teams legs late in the game. That might lower opponents 3 point shooting. Excited to see more from Drake and Ian and maybe even a sprinkle of James.
I agree and knowing the depth of guard play we have why don’t we pressure a lot more? My only guess is fouling problems. EC can barely play the last few games for foul trouble. Doesn’t matter if it’s warranted or not, they’ve called them. Need to have more awareness of time and place. All that said, the top of my head wanted to come off when they called the foul before the timeout by ms. Total garbage. Even the announcers and ms bench was surprised.
 
While I do agree with the majority of what gary is saying, I do jump ship in feeling, as I shared so many times during the portal, not adding a legit big man was a strong miss. Simply put WE are simply a small team. We lack length and girth and it costs us against physical teams with size over us and yes there are ways you can mitigate that to an extent but it becomes a version of whack a mole, stop one problem only to create another. You can double the post but who do you leave open for example. Length is one thing but girth is a thing few seem to talk about.

Last season with Bacot, he was that huge big man that had the girth and physical strength to both hold his position as well as push opposing players away from theirs. JWash, JWit, Lubin, and for darn sure Tyson nor Drake have that. JWash has the length but he does not have the arse as we say, Brown is not ready and High is MIA so we spend a lot of minutes with 6'6" to 6'8"centers. JWash, out longest regular player got less than 14mins vs MSU. It is hard enough to deal with a really small point and 2 guard, add to that a 6'3" wing, a 6'8" power forward, and a lot of time with a badly under sized 5? See, that is the problem with small ball, that is why small ball is extremely high risk if it is your primary look, don't look now but we are about to start a 6'6" power forward, yea, cool, so we get even shorter? But, it is as well beginning to look like we could very well start a 6'8" CENTER that is NOT built like Sean Maye or Meeks.

Yes, all the concerns gary expresses are legit but I doubt I can be convinced that our lack of size and strength in our front court is not a concern. It is in my view exactly what will limit this team and high school recruiting has surely not addressed this problem.
 
I would add that our guards assist to turnover ratio is horrendous. Seems like we don't value the ball or play hard nosed defense until we are down 15. Just improve those 2 things and we are in every game we have played.

Really seems like having consistent effort is an issue. Remedy that and I think we are a top 10 team.

There are other things that I would like to see but don't have the knowledge of seeing practice like the coaches. Do hope we can lower minutes of our starting guards for more time to the freshman. I would love to see that so we could apply nonstop pressure and get into the other teams legs late in the game. That might lower opponents 3 point shooting. Excited to see more from Drake and Ian and maybe even a sprinkle of James.
Assist to turnover is going to be bad every time when they don't have anyone to throw the ball to but themselves.
 
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Good breakdown as usual gary-7. I like our team. I want to see balance on offense, bringing back the secondary break. We’re deep enough to wear teams down with an in to out offense and a defensive that brings pressure. Got to get some confidence in JWash and Tyson- they are better than they are playing. RJ may need to pull back a little and not force things and look to involve his teammates a little more. I think this will get him in the flow too. Our kids are playing hard and I hope our staff can put them in position to maximize their abilities.
Thank you. This^ is the reasonable synopsis.
 
And after suffering through as much of a re-watch of some of the Maui games as I could stand, and after many servings of stuffed turkey, Wild Turkey and some Ole Smokey Butter Pecan moonshine deserts I would like to summarize what a pure layman, but long time UNC fan, has to say about the Maui tournament and this team thus far. As well as a condensed version of @gary-7 's eloquent coaching perspective.

Gary's summary:

1) Hubert sucks as a head coach
2) our offensive spacing, movement and use of available personnel sucks.
3) our defense sucks and once again we go through a group that has yet to grasp the concept of defensive rotations or closing out on, and getting a hand in the faces of, the jump shooters.
4) Hubert sucks as a head coach.

Now my additions:

1) This small ball crap with EC/RJ/Seth ain't gonna fly.
2) Drake and Jack need more time on the floor together (with EC and Seth).
3) If RJ was putting up his current numbers as a frosh or sophomore would you RJ fan clubbers still be giving him such latitude and love? Sports is a "what have you done for me lately" thing. But I really hope he get's "it"
back but for now he's putting to much pressure on himself. He needs to remember UNC is team first and records and accolades are secondary.
4) This coming out flat and being down double digits, in multiple games in a tournament, is a BRF (big red flag) and a direct reflection on game prep, attitude and the coaching staff.
5) Rebounding (effort and lack of rebound positioning) sucks
5) Hubert is once again quickly becoming hubcap.
I neither said, nor implied that Hubert sucks. He needs to self-scout and stop trying to reinvent the wheel.
 
Yes, all the concerns gary expresses are legit but I doubt I can be convinced that our lack of size and strength in our front court is not a concern. It is in my view exactly what will limit this team and high school recruiting has surely not addressed this problem.
Didn't say it wasn't a concern, it's an issue that needs to be adjusted to, and the best way to do that is to not be predictable on defense, and utilize mid-post action on offense.
 
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Didn't say it wasn't a concern, it's an issue that needs to be adjusted to, and the best way to do that is to not be predictable on defense, and utilize mid-post action on offense.
All that can be done at this point is to adjust as best we can, as I said, mitigate the problem as best we can( I do not disagree with your suggested adjustments). If being honest, I am not convinced workable adjustments will be made, I mean you are talking about "adjustments" that frankly should have been no brainier standard operating procedure that must now be adjusted to?

Our defensive approach, other than Roy didn't really switch in to multiple looks defensively either? I never understood why Roy did it either, stay with the same defensive approach but get down and have to dig out of a hole then all the sudden we are pressing and trapping, going in to scramble? Geez, if it is good enough to dig us out of a hole then why are we not doing those things as a regular course of the game?

This defense we seem intent on playing is odd, it appears to be a man defense with zone principles due to all the switching for no reason? I believe you never switch unless you have to, that isn't what we are doing. We are switching when a guy simply enters an area rather than because the primary defender is trailing? Roy lived by the scramble, fine but it does lead to mismatches and teams game plan it. That is why multiple defenses work, they can't be as ready for every look as they can be with just 1. Never will understand why Roy didn't not copy paste that from Dean nor why Hubert has seemed to scrap it?
 
All that can be done at this point is to adjust as best we can, as I said, mitigate the problem as best we can( I do not disagree with your suggested adjustments). If being honest, I am not convinced workable adjustments will be made, I mean you are talking about "adjustments" that frankly should have been no brainier standard operating procedure that must now be adjusted to?

Our defensive approach, other than Roy didn't really switch in to multiple looks defensively either? I never understood why Roy did it either, stay with the same defensive approach but get down and have to dig out of a hole then all the sudden we are pressing and trapping, going in to scramble? Geez, if it is good enough to dig us out of a hole then why are we not doing those things as a regular course of the game?

This defense we seem intent on playing is odd, it appears to be a man defense with zone principles due to all the switching for no reason? I believe you never switch unless you have to, that isn't what we are doing. We are switching when a guy simply enters an area rather than because the primary defender is trailing? Roy lived by the scramble, fine but it does lead to mismatches and teams game plan it. That is why multiple defenses work, they can't be as ready for every look as they can be with just 1. Never will understand why Roy didn't not copy paste that from Dean nor why Hubert has seemed to scrap it?
I would be willing to bet Dean and Roy could explain and justify why they did what they did and I wouldn't think Hubert could do that.
 
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All that can be done at this point is to adjust as best we can, as I said, mitigate the problem as best we can( I do not disagree with your suggested adjustments). If being honest, I am not convinced workable adjustments will be made, I mean you are talking about "adjustments" that frankly should have been no brainier standard operating procedure that must now be adjusted to?

Our defensive approach, other than Roy didn't really switch in to multiple looks defensively either? I never understood why Roy did it either, stay with the same defensive approach but get down and have to dig out of a hole then all the sudden we are pressing and trapping, going in to scramble? Geez, if it is good enough to dig us out of a hole then why are we not doing those things as a regular course of the game?

This defense we seem intent on playing is odd, it appears to be a man defense with zone principles due to all the switching for no reason? I believe you never switch unless you have to, that isn't what we are doing. We are switching when a guy simply enters an area rather than because the primary defender is trailing? Roy lived by the scramble, fine but it does lead to mismatches and teams game plan it. That is why multiple defenses work, they can't be as ready for every look as they can be with just 1. Never will understand why Roy didn't not copy paste that from Dean nor why Hubert has seemed to scrap it?
We complained about Roy not neing as multiple as Dean, but hell, even he was way more so than Hubert. Tellingly, Roy got less multiple over time, and I truly believe that contibuted to some of the disappointing results of his later years.

As far as our base D now, it is a sound scheme that has generally worked well, but Weds we started getting caught in up/down switches (that Izzo was trying to induce) which is a no-no. But what that shows is, in staying in one defense, we become sitting ducks for that sort of manipulation.

As for what you said about the offense, yeah, I think "no-brainer" is an apt description of what should have ben there from the outset...
 
I neither said, nor implied that Hubert sucks.
You might not have said it Gary but you surely implied it as I read it. (Almost) Everything in your original post outside of the first paragraph is pointing out coaching deficiencies and everything you said was accurate.

This set the tone, and was an accurate thesis, and you merely supported it with examples as you saw it for the better part of the post ...

"This is about deeper issues., and they are NOT the ones many fans fall back on. Our issues are NOT about who we got or did NOT get in the portal --- or which player might be struggling at whatever --- it is how the players we have are (or are NOT) being used."

Whether you actually said the coaching sucked or not is irrelevant but the poast surely highlighted coaching issues and I totally agree. jmo
 
You might not have said it Gary but you surely implied it as I read it. (Almost) Everything in your original post outside of the first paragraph is pointing out coaching deficiencies and everything you said was accurate.

This set the tone, and was an accurate thesis, and you merely supported it with examples as you saw it for the better part of the post ...

"This is about deeper issues., and they are NOT the ones many fans fall back on. Our issues are NOT about who we got or did NOT get in the portal --- or which player might be struggling at whatever --- it is how the players we have are (or are NOT) being used."

Whether you actually said the coaching sucked or not is irrelevant but the poast surely highlighted coaching issues and I totally agree. jmo
There's a big difference between a coaching critique --- that's why it's called self-scouting --- and calling someone a lousy coach. Please don't insinate that I did the latter, because I did not.
 
There's a big difference between a coaching critique --- that's why it's called self-scouting --- and calling someone a lousy coach. Please don't insinate that I did the latter, because I did not.
It's a matter of semantics then. Kind of like not being a lousy coach but doing a lousy job of coaching (self-scouting) . I simply broke it down to my drinking (not a coach) fan terminology. But there is no doubt that at this point in the season there are some glaring issues that need to be addressed and personnel use and game planning or lack of is at the top of my, and likely your, list. Good write-up either way. Thanks.
 
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It wouild help if the 4 and 5 position catch the pass they are given. Passes aren't always good ones, but too many are not caught securely. It would help if players don't hesitate for a moment before shooting. It would help if RJ and Cadeau don't use the "chicken wing" separation when they know it will be called for a foul. It would help if the opposing team doesn't beat RJ and Cadeau to a pulp before the half. Someone has to set a solid pick consistently. It would help if UNC doesn't have to catch up 10 pts in the first half.

UNC has been trying to play 8 or more players. Powell is blossoming, Tyson is still working it out, Jackson is beginning to get there, Brown is a mystery still, Rj is adjusting. Claude is an unkown. None are 7 feet tall. Defense takes time to work out on a team. With the portal it is harder to have a whole team know the defenses and communicate within them. Given the height and weight differences with certain matchups knowing the sets and communication becomes more important.

It feels like Hubert is trying to see which players perform under pressure. Which 5 players work best with each other given the matchups of the game. The team is competitive but has to work with their limitations. And it is clear that they cannot count on the refs. It is not going to be an easy season. But there will be some very good moments.
 
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It's a matter of semantics then. Kind of like not being a lousy coach but doing a lousy job of coaching (self-scouting) . I simply broke it down to my drinking (not a coach) fan terminology. But there is no doubt that at this point in the season there are some glaring issues that need to be addressed and personnel use and game planning or lack of is at the top of my, and likely your, list. Good write-up either way. Thanks.
It is NOT semantics. Please stop with that.
 
With Bama on deck, the search for a front court contributor is still the #1, 2, and 3 priority for me, someone has to at least keep dee's honest. Bama is a team with a solid athletic backcourt and wings, with bigs who produce.

They will stay at home and hawk RJ once again, even more this year without Cormac as a legit 3 threat, and live with the others trying to score on contested 2's.
 
You might not have said it Gary but you surely implied it as I read it. (Almost) Everything in your original post outside of the first paragraph is pointing out coaching deficiencies and everything you said was accurate.

This set the tone, and was an accurate thesis, and you merely supported it with examples as you saw it for the better part of the post ...

"This is about deeper issues., and they are NOT the ones many fans fall back on. Our issues are NOT about who we got or did NOT get in the portal --- or which player might be struggling at whatever --- it is how the players we have are (or are NOT) being used."

Whether you actually said the coaching sucked or not is irrelevant but the poast surely highlighted coaching issues and I totally agree. jmo
This post, summarizing the obvious issues with this team and current coaching challenges along with the responses have been very interesting to read. I think Gary has offered a lot of insight, exposing serious issues that even someone like me with limited bball IQ can understand, seeing such with my own eyes. Al, in my opinion, you and Gary are seeing eye to eye on this one. I don't think his point is to imply or point out that Hubs and the coaching sucks, just that there are some coaching decisions being made that may be hindering the potential of this team, the difference in the quality/consistency on the court.
Ultimately, from my simplistic, low IQ perspective, the overall issue is quality and size in certain positions(yes stating the obvious here). Are things going to trend such that player quality diminishes more over time with recruiting and the portal? That seems to be the case right now and getting worse as we look to the near future. My question is this: is the issue simply NIL like I've been reading from others in the off season? Is the UNC bball brand losing luster with prospects these days? Is it both of those combined? If this is the case now and going into the future, then we are back to Gary's accessment(along with yours and many others on this board) that coaching needs to be top quality. Right now we are all witnessing some questionable coaching that's being exposed given the personnel on the court. It's no knock on these players as I respect each and everyone one of them and the commitment they've made. Honestly I'll continue to support the players and will enjoy watching them play and develope. Sorry for the long reply...
 
It's a matter of semantics then. Kind of like not being a lousy coach but doing a lousy job of coaching (self-scouting) . I simply broke it down to my drinking (not a coach) fan terminology. But there is no doubt that at this point in the season there are some glaring issues that need to be addressed and personnel use and game planning or lack of is at the top of my, and likely your, list. Good write-up either way. Thanks.
No, it is not semantics. Good coaches make mistakes.
 
...and this is about self-scouting.

Didn't post last night because my language may have been bannable, and this is about more than any one game. So, only gonna spend a few lines on that last one:
...like tired legs being obvious from the tip with the myriad short-armed finish misses --- or that a team that was literally ranked in the 300s in the NCAA D1 in 3-pt shooting lights it up on us --- or that we got that incompetent buffoon zebra (Curry) for the damn 3rd time in 4 games who thwarted our initial comeback by T-ing up Hubert (who wasn't even talking to him) after his partner-in-crime made a hideously bad call (or I should say, let Izzo make the call), and make no mistake, that changed the game --- or after leading another comeback and abusing their PG, EC misses a damn 99% layup to for the lead, then leads us back to force OT on Seth's splash --- or that we ran outta gas in said OT. Yeah, enough of that...

This is about deeper issues., and they are NOT the ones many fans fall back on. Our issues are NOT about who we got or did NOT get in the portal --- or which player might be struggling at whatever --- it is how the players we have are (or are NOT) being used.

Thus, as I said, it is time for this staff to do some serious SELF-scouting. The texts and calls I've gotten from my coach mafia during and after the game can be summed up by one in particular from my (Carolina-guy) AAU coach bud:
"WTF are we even doing???"

Y'all know I love this staff, but it is their collective pedigree that makes what I'm seeing so much of a "WTF?"
So, I actually hope one of them reads this, because here are 4 self-scouting points (that are BTW unanimous amongst my circle) that need to be corrected pronto (and I'll save the most important for last:
1. DEFENSE - Guys, we can NOT afford to just give opponents one look, and I don't care how good we are at it. We have the arsenal and the personnel made to be multiple. We used three series of 43 Tuesday and one of 42 last night, but there were myriad situations that screamed for scrambles.

2. PERSONNEL USAGE - We have a roster that has strengths and weaknesses (like most teams), but we SHOULD be legitimately deeper than we are showing. Tyson is being forgotten and that is helping neither him nor us. I know casual fans will jump to conclusions that he is a bust --- BS --- For those who watched practices, he proved himself worthy of starter consideration. He can play but is never gonna find his fit and mojo rotting on the bench. Powell, in particular is showing his value, and that's good. But we're not gonna win with 34 minutes of Withers (nothing against his value).

3. HALF-COURT OFFENSE - Hubert has a nice array of set plays and actions, BUT we are limiting ourselves by forgetting an inside-out game. Never forget that the highest % 3-pt shots come from rhythm kick-outs. We should be using mid-post entries with JWash as a shot-threat and passer, as opposed to just a screener and roller.

4. (and most important) RESTORE THE DAMN SECONDARY - for Christ sake, this is Dean's greatest invention and Roy's calling-card! There's a reason we aren't getting sh** off the Secondary these days --- we're doing it WRONG. There is nothing easier to defend than a team that just comes down and surrounds the defense. All you hafta do is get your guys to mirror and it stalls. The Secondary run properly is designed to stress a retreating defense, but there are TWO fundamental f***-ups going on right now:
A) NEVER use a cross-court pitch-ahead (unless it makes for a layup) --- all that does is balance the defense FOR them --- and I can tell this is not a player decision, it is being taught. Hell, Dean would've stopped practice if he saw that nonsense. You push middle or sideline which draws the defense and affords a reversal.
B) The magic key to the Secondary is the first 4/5 man sprinting to the block (rim-run, dive). It forces a reaction as it is option #1, making it difficult to account for everyone. We're are eschewing this critical component, which has killed the TRIGGER of the Carolina system, and puts us in an (ugh) 5-out set, which is just unsound pussery.

As I said prevciously, running a Secondary without the post option is like putting tits on a boar-hog.
Come on guys! I mean, three of you on our bench played for Roy Williams, and 3 played for Dean Smith!... well, somewhere up there Dean is face-palming right about now, and Roy won't say anything unless he is asked. He probably should, but he won't. So ASK! Please...

Anyway, good Thanksgving wishes for all, and well... I guess we shall see what happens next...
Reading this today Gary, is like looking at my unwritten notes in my head.
Each of these 4 high lighted areas are things I think about each game with equal frustration.
#1 Defense: I have been told since grade school that a team that cannot defend the paint conventionally, must use measures to be counter productive. Why we aren't using our defense in a disruptive manner rather than a reactionary manner is beyond me.
#2 Personnel usage: I said very early in the game vs Michigan State that Tyson needed to play because besides Carr, State is not athletic. Cade Tyson is not going to be ready to help in January- March, if he doesn't play in November and December.
#3Halfcourt offense.
How easy we must be to scout and play against. We don't use Washington or Withers as a pick n pop weapon. How can Coach Davis call JWASH the best shooting big man he has seen and then not utilize that part of his game.......EVER!?!?
That is akin to using Michael Jordan as a spot up shooter.
#4 Secondary break.
This one really hurts, because for me as a 54 year old longtime fan, this is the definition of " Carolina basketball "
How is it even possible that Carolina is not using the Secondary break that Dean made famous and most grade and HS coaches teach to this day?
There are fixable issues with this team, and talented parts to make that fix happen. Changes need to take place starting on Wednesday night.
 
Reading this today Gary, is like looking at my unwritten notes in my head.
Each of these 4 high lighted areas are things I think about each game with equal frustration.
#1 Defense: I have been told since grade school that a team that cannot defend the paint conventionally, must use measures to be counter productive. Why we aren't using our defense in a disruptive manner rather than a reactionary manner is beyond me.
#2 Personnel usage: I said very early in the game vs Michigan State that Tyson needed to play because besides Carr, State is not athletic. Cade Tyson is not going to be ready to help in January- March, if he doesn't play in November and December.
#3Halfcourt offense.
How easy we must be to scout and play against. We don't use Washington or Withers as a pick n pop weapon. How can Coach Davis call JWASH the best shooting big man he has seen and then not utilize that part of his game.......EVER!?!?
That is akin to using Michael Jordan as a spot up shooter.
#4 Secondary break.
This one really hurts, because for me as a 54 year old longtime fan, this is the definition of " Carolina basketball "
How is it even possible that Carolina is not using the Secondary break that Dean made famous and most grade and HS coaches teach to this day?
There are fixable issues with this team, and talented parts to make that fix happen. Changes need to take place starting on Wednesday night.
Can't argue with any of that...
 
Reading this today Gary, is like looking at my unwritten notes in my head.
Each of these 4 high lighted areas are things I think about each game with equal frustration.
#1 Defense: I have been told since grade school that a team that cannot defend the paint conventionally, must use measures to be counter productive. Why we aren't using our defense in a disruptive manner rather than a reactionary manner is beyond me.
#2 Personnel usage: I said very early in the game vs Michigan State that Tyson needed to play because besides Carr, State is not athletic. Cade Tyson is not going to be ready to help in January- March, if he doesn't play in November and December.
#3Halfcourt offense.
How easy we must be to scout and play against. We don't use Washington or Withers as a pick n pop weapon. How can Coach Davis call JWASH the best shooting big man he has seen and then not utilize that part of his game.......EVER!?!?
That is akin to using Michael Jordan as a spot up shooter.
#4 Secondary break.
This one really hurts, because for me as a 54 year old longtime fan, this is the definition of " Carolina basketball "
How is it even possible that Carolina is not using the Secondary break that Dean made famous and most grade and HS coaches teach to this day?
There are fixable issues with this team, and talented parts to make that fix happen. Changes need to take place starting on Wednesday night.
By george, I think he's got it ! LOL (ever try to type a British accent)...
 
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Hubert needs his own version of Dean's secret weapon. WE all revere the memory of Dean, how could we not? But Dean had a secret weapon, Dean had Gut! Coach Gut was that guy that Dean trusted above everyone else. But even more so Gut may have been the best TEACHER of big man skills we have ever seen. It was never all on Dean, it was always on Dean and Gut and together they found their way. Who does Hubert have, he sure does not have a Gut but does he at least have a Steve Robinson like Roy did?
 
Hubert needs his own version of Dean's secret weapon. WE all revere the memory of Dean, how could we not? But Dean had a secret weapon, Dean had Gut! Coach Gut was that guy that Dean trusted above everyone else. But even more so Gut may have been the best TEACHER of big man skills we have ever seen. It was never all on Dean, it was always on Dean and Gut and together they found their way. Who does Hubert have, he sure does not have a Gut but does he at least have a Steve Robinson like Roy did?
He has extremely limited himself with the ridiculous notion that you had to play here to coach here. None of his mentors held that mindset and neither should he. Steve Robinson should still be on staff imo.
 
The issue is there's too damn much "NBA" junk influencing the approach, and (ironically) not enough Carolina stuff.
Gary, you know, I may agree with you much of the time but you know I don't agree with you ALL of the time. This reply I have quoted may well be the most accurate thing I have EVER seen from you. I 100% totally agree!
 
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Hubert pigeonholes himself because he will only put "Carolina Guys" on his staff. There's a lot of dang good coaches out there, at all levels (even high school), that will never get a shot at Carolina (at least while Hubert is there) because they look down from their ivory tower at all these Coaches. Loved Lebo as a player, but he was not a good coach at Auburn nor ECU. Sean and Marcus had no coaching experience when they were put on staff. Frederick has been on staff for a good while, but not sure exactly what he brings. Sullivan is the only one with Coaching experience (in the NBA), and I'm not sure what he even does at practice. Surround yourself with the best guys possible.
Sorry, but that's just completely off-base.
 
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My $0.02, Hubert may be a good coach but he is not adaptive. When he came on board I seem to recall him saying that he wanted to play 4 around 1. I took that to mean he was looking have a traditional post and 4 shooters surrounding. That works IF you can get a true stretch 4 who can guard an opposing big. We got Manek and then Ingram for that role in the portal but doesn't seem like any have been recruited for that slot. If they were they sat so much first year they transferred.

This season UNC has a very limited frontcourt, both in terms of size and talent. The result is that the 3 best players are all guards with two being undersized. The best freshmen are also best suited to play the 2/3 slots. If Hubert wants to play a certain style he needs to recruit that way. This is where the NIL/portal nightmare is biting the Heels. Ideally Washington would be that stretch big but he needs a big who can be the physical force inside to do so.

In my opinion this roster is built to play small and FAST. They need to push tempo to create enough extra possessions to offset the half court set weaknesses. I do not mean Arkansas or UNLV of the 90's full court defense but the defense needs to be aggressive and try to force turnovers or at least take an opponent out of their comfort zone.

Whoever you blame for the current roster it ain't going to change. The staff needs to create a game plan that emphasizes the talent on the roster, not continue to use the same style they did when Bacot was in the middle and there were consistent shooters spacing the floor.

I am just so grateful Cadeau did not go to dook. Put him on the court running an offense with that talent would be scary.
 
The issue is there's too damn much "NBA" junk influencing the approach, and (ironically) not enough Carolina stuff.
As maybe the only person here who watches equal amounts of college basketball and the NBA, there's really nothing that UNC does that mimicks a modern NBA offense. NBA offenses are usually triggered through a skilled big guy or a wing. NBA teams are very rarely absolutely dependent on their PG1 like UNC has been for the last 20 years or so. UNC's bigs aren't skilled enough to pass or handle (at least they haven't shown it on tape) and their wing is 6'3".

I know the counter will be "SMALL BALL" or "TOO MANY THREES". UNC isn't even shooting that many 3's. They rank 279th in the country in 3PT rate. And of course UNC will play small ball. The bigs aren't good, lol. 47% of the Boston Celtics' points have been scored on 3s.

And on a personnel level, there isn't one NBA team that would trot out 6'1", 6'0", and 6'3" as their starting 1-3 today. They know they would get demolished. This isn't anything like an NBA team.

I've even seen more freelance this year out of UNC than last year and it's been a freaking disaster. Hubert's sets are not really like NBA sets either. Hubert has really static, college-like sets. Mark Pope runs NBA and European type sets where the action isn't static and the movement has a lot of misdirection in it. Hubert runs much more college type sets likely because it's easier to run at this level.

I think this is rapidly becoming a "playing the results" analysis. If UNC is playing well and winning a lot... Clearly it's because they're playing UNC basketball! If not, clearly they're playing too much like an NBA team!

Despite all that, UNC's offense is top 10 nationally in offensive efficiency. So clearly running the secondary break probably wouldn't make this already fairly elite offense that much better. The offense hasn't been a problem for the most part. And that's considering UNC isn't shooting nearly as many 3s as it should be factoring in their personnel.

And of course this team will struggle defensively. They're really freaking small and they have really limited bigs. They're right now like 60th in the country in defensive efficiency. If you had all the UNC run-and-jump and multiple defenses that you could possibly dream of, what do you think they would be defensively? Maybe top 40? That's certainly better, but it's nowhere near where it needs to be if you think this is a Final Four caliber team. In the NBA, when a team has a really tiny backcourt, they immediately acquire a rim protector big. UNC has a really tiny backcourt and 0 consistent rim protection.

It's just a lazy connection. And made by those who don't watch the NBA. UNC doesn't play like an NBA team. In fact, if they did, more of you would be pissed off because UNC would never shoot a 2, lol.

TLDR:
The coach should be a schemer and not a scheme. I think it's moronic to think this personnel group can run the traditional UNC offense with any consistency. I also think it's moronic that Hubert's sets are as static as they are for this personnel group. Your scheme has to fit your personnel group. So the coach has 2 options. Number one, he adjusts his scheme to fit his personnel group. Or number two, he recruits exclusively to his scheme.
 
My $0.02, Hubert may be a good coach but he is not adaptive. When he came on board I seem to recall him saying that he wanted to play 4 around 1. I took that to mean he was looking have a traditional post and 4 shooters surrounding. That works IF you can get a true stretch 4 who can guard an opposing big. We got Manek and then Ingram for that role in the portal but doesn't seem like any have been recruited for that slot. If they were they sat so much first year they transferred.

This season UNC has a very limited frontcourt, both in terms of size and talent. The result is that the 3 best players are all guards with two being undersized. The best freshmen are also best suited to play the 2/3 slots. If Hubert wants to play a certain style he needs to recruit that way. This is where the NIL/portal nightmare is biting the Heels. Ideally Washington would be that stretch big but he needs a big who can be the physical force inside to do so.

In my opinion this roster is built to play small and FAST. They need to push tempo to create enough extra possessions to offset the half court set weaknesses. I do not mean Arkansas or UNLV of the 90's full court defense but the defense needs to be aggressive and try to force turnovers or at least take an opponent out of their comfort zone.

Whoever you blame for the current roster it ain't going to change. The staff needs to create a game plan that emphasizes the talent on the roster, not continue to use the same style they did when Bacot was in the middle and there were consistent shooters spacing the floor.

I am just so grateful Cadeau did not go to dook. Put him on the court running an offense with that talent would be scary.
Purely in terms of coaching... Roy's teams weren't any good when they didn't have premium talent. Hubert's teams haven't been all that good without premium talent. I actually thought they slightly overachieved last year in the regular season. But their season ended the way most UNC teams seasons ended similarly when they lacked elite talent. That's ending relatively early in the NCAA Tournament.

This roster needs to shoot more 3s. They're not going to get enough quality 2PT looks without having teams have to really respect their 3PT shot. They're shooting 37% from 3 this season. They need to chuck it more often from deep. They're in the 270s in the country in 3PT rate. That doesn't fit this team. The best equation for this team is their guards shoot it with confidence from deep and their bigs become better offensive rebounders. The bigs aren't good or consistent enough to depend on scoring. They need to focus purely on offensive rebounding.

Tempo isn't a problem for this team. They're top 10 in the country in tempo. Will playing 2 more possessions per game change everything? I don't think so. I would actually argue that if this team becomes a precise 3PT shooting team and shoots enough of them, then they should probably play slower. That would make each 3 much more impactful. But I know everyone will disagree with that. There's just 0 correlation between teams that make the Final Four and those that play really fast. In fact, more teams that play ridiculously slowly that make the Final Four.

I'll emphasize all season. The coach should be a schemer and not a scheme.
 
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