So, without Theo for a large slice of the season...
- Thread starter DSouthr
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I actually think we play less small ball now. Theo was the "4" in our small ball rotation and I'm not sure who could adequately fill that void. I'm guessing Nate will start the season at SG with Seventh and Kenny backing him up. BRob will get minutes backing up JJ and possibly a few minutes backing up Nate.
What I mean to say with the small ball now was more along the lines of would we play small ball now more so than suggesting we would go to more of it. We could small ball with BRob/Kenny/7th to back up Justin but we could as well move Luke to the 3 as a more old school small forward as we did with Matt Doherty for example. I think I kinda like having Luke to back up Justin more than going to BRob for now.
1. We won't play much small.
2. I suspect Nate will start now (at least at first, that could change) with KW being the utility Wing sub with starter minutes
3. Having Stilman will be very valuable and allows Nate, JJ and KW to form a three-man wing rotation.
4. The Bigs rotation is the same and just fine.
Folks need to remember that BRob and 7th aren't ready for big minutes just yet so they'll still have the luxury of blending in slowly.
who plays minutes at the 3 for JJ will depend on the opposition
I don't see Luke keeping up with faster 6'4 - 6'6 slasher types on defense
will be interesting to see how it all unfolds leading into Jan
I don't see Luke keeping up with faster 6'4 - 6'6 slasher types on defense
will be interesting to see how it all unfolds leading into Jan
I also would have serious doubts about Maye guarding wing players at the 3 spot as well. Plus would Roy want our fourth big picking up fouls trying to guard opposing wing players and risk not having Maye available to play the 4 spot if Hicks gets in serious foul trouble in a game? Robinson is a freshman and might be outmatched by stronger players at the 3, and K Williams is only 6-4, so all three options have drawbacks.
Yeah it's a bit of a quagmire. I said yesterday on the "who can we least afford to lose thread"(oh the irony) that it was probably berry but that I really felt like this team can't afford to lose anyone. What you elucidated is partly the reason why.
If Isaiah, Kennedy and Tony can handle most of the front line duties, I'd give that a try, too. But each of those guys has to prove he can handle that many minutes.
My best guess is that Nate starts and I am not a fan of that at all. I also think Brandon now becomes the primary backup at SF, with Luke possibly getting a few minutes there. Our small ball lineup, so effective last year, is now shot to shite. Kennedy and Isaiah must now stay out of foul trouble and prove they can go 28+ MPG and Tony at least 20 MPG.
This is a huge blow to our chances of going back to the FF, much more significant than Giles's cleanup surgery. MUCH more.
This is a huge blow to our chances of going back to the FF, much more significant than Giles's cleanup surgery. MUCH more.
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I tend to agree. I'm pretty bummed about losing Theo. Honestly, I don't see a final four type team without him. He just does so much and means so much to the team. Just his presence on the court loosens everyone up. Without him, I could see the offense not flowing nearly as smooth. Here's to hoping he makes a speedy recovery and then knocks off the rust quickly.
Disagree that this is a blow to our FF chances, could be a blessing in disguise w/other guys getting meaningful PT & Theo potentially returning w/enough time to round into form at the right time. Not to mention less wear & tear though the season with less total minutes logged.
well 58 said a few posts ago 2-3 months after surgery... I do not know if that is coming form him as wishful thinking or he has heard/read some more info from Drs etc or the team.
IF that is the case that is probably best case and would put his return some time in Jan or more likely February HOPEFULLY that is what happens but who knows how this will heal etc. This sucks for Theo wish him the best and as usual Carolina suffers a huge injury to a key player SOS different day for oh 35 years now
IF that is the case that is probably best case and would put his return some time in Jan or more likely February HOPEFULLY that is what happens but who knows how this will heal etc. This sucks for Theo wish him the best and as usual Carolina suffers a huge injury to a key player SOS different day for oh 35 years now
God Bless Theo, and Roy, and the team. I am surely tired of this bad luck, so I can only imagine how they all must feel.........
well 58 said a few posts ago 2-3 months after surgery... I do not know if that is coming form him as wishful thinking or he has heard/read some more info from Drs etc or the team.
IF that is the case that is probably best case and would put his return some time in Jan or more likely February HOPEFULLY that is what happens but who knows how this will heal etc. This sucks for Theo wish him the best and as usual Carolina suffers a huge injury to a key player SOS different day for oh 35 years now
Theos dad said 8-12 weeks
Nate starts now because he is the most trustworthy. Robinson/Woods/Williams need to fill the void by committee. Jackson has to be superb this season imo.
Yeah, there would be a disadvantage to Luke backing up Justin but there would be advantages as well. Luke can shoot, be hard for that smaller wing to defend his jumper, Luke has a nose for rebounds should be able to establish rebounding position easier vs the smaller defender. Luke down low posting up a smaller wing, could force opposing coaches to match his length and take that smaller wing out of the game.
This would be for back up minutes, Justin would have the lion share of the time here. I just am not sure 7th or BRob are ready, thinking Roy may try them both to see if they can and we will have to see how that works.
allegedly came from Theo's dad.well 58 said a few posts ago 2-3 months after surgery... I do not know if that is coming form him as wishful thinking or he has heard/read some more info from Drs etc or the team.
IF that is the case that is probably best case and would put his return some time in Jan or more likely February HOPEFULLY that is what happens but who knows how this will heal etc. This sucks for Theo wish him the best and as usual Carolina suffers a huge injury to a key player SOS different day for oh 35 years now
I agree with most of that.
Nate will do fine starting, but he will have several guys competing for that spot.
Roy is comfortable with starting a freshman. Maybe not comfortable having a lot of frosh on the floor at the same time, but certainly having 1 start and occasionally 2 on the floor at the same time - assuming they earn it, of course.
So while I would expect Nate to start against tougher opponents early in the season, I won't be at all surprised to see 7th, Kenny or Brandon start in some of the early games against easier foes.
The thing is that in our first 8 games we probably face #16 UConn, then either #5 Oregon or #10 Wisconsin, followed by #12 Indiana - all on the road. I will be very surprised if anyone other than Nate starts in those games.
As others have said, I expect to see Brandon and Luke be given opportunities to back up at SF. Any time Brandon is the backup, I would expect Nate and Joel to be on the floor. Probably also whenever Tony is subbing on the front line. Maximize experience elsewhere when you have the newest guys in the game.
Later in the season, when Roy knows how the youngsters will handle themselves, he may not feel he needs Nate in there. So, for example, if Brandon is in at SF, we might also see Kenny in at SG. But Nate still might be in there, because he's a solid competitor. Especially if his shot is falling this year.
It seems we all agree that no one player is going to compensate for Theo being out. JJ is now going to have to be consistently excellent, as are Isaiah and Joel. Nate, Luke, Kenny, Brandon, and 7th are going to be counted on more heavily than previously thought.
As our most versatile player by far, Theo's loss changes everything. Luke and Brandon may be forced to play SF, something I don't think many of us had anticipated. Nate's role will probably be significantly expanded by necessity. And the learning curve of the underclass men will be steepened, again by necessity. Some of them will simply have to play more.
But with those problems comes opportunity. Mark my words, at least one or two players will step up and exceed prior expectations. And we certainly need that to happen.
As our most versatile player by far, Theo's loss changes everything. Luke and Brandon may be forced to play SF, something I don't think many of us had anticipated. Nate's role will probably be significantly expanded by necessity. And the learning curve of the underclass men will be steepened, again by necessity. Some of them will simply have to play more.
But with those problems comes opportunity. Mark my words, at least one or two players will step up and exceed prior expectations. And we certainly need that to happen.
I looked at Hicks, Meeks, and Tony as our primary front court rotation prior to Theo's injury. I saw Luke as the 4th guy, like the Joel James guy (meaning in PT usage and not in style of play). Kinda saw Luke and Theo in a bit of a tie for that role, Theo when we went small ball. Well now that changes and Luke owns that 4th big spot.
Sorry guys, just not comfortable right now with BRob being Justin's primary back up, he is just so thin. He will get a shot and we will have to see what we see. Understand, not in love with Luke at the 3 either due to foot speed and quickness but his size as an additional forward that is not easy to move out physically could have an upside as well as a down.
What may be interesting could be Joel/7th/KennyHicks/Meeks. Lot of shooting, Kenny and 7th I think can defend at least with the foot speed. Kenny showed vs Brogden that he can defend a bigger guy and kenny has added some good weight room work this off season. Then 7th, may be the most athletic over all guy we have outside of Theo. We could go big or little when Justin comes out. Having said that, Justin is the real key here, need 30mins + at least until someone else can step up.
Definitely gonna need JJ to be more consistent than ever before. He will have to pick up the scoring load and certainly need more than 2-3 rebounds per game from him. Brice was a walking double/double. Without him, JJ has to get better at rebounding.
Hate it for Theo first off, but we do need to find a natural SG and this gives Kenny Williams and Woods solid playing time. Nate is prolly the best option to start and Maye backs up JJ I guess. Theo provides versatility and experience that is hard to replace.
Amen Heels05, amen. I think many have been underestimating Brice's double doubles, even before Theo's injury. Double doubles don't just grow on trees. And while I feel Isaiah is capable of them if he can average 30+ MPG, we are going to miss Brice's rebounding badly. Isaiah, Kennedy, JJ, Tony, et al are all going to have to compensate. Our rebounding prowess, particularly on the offensive boards, has been crucial to our success the last two years. Some are worried about scoring this year. And while I have some concerns there(particularly with regard to perimeter scoring), rebounding will determine our success this year. If we remain a great rebounding team, we will be able to get out and run and will thrive. If not, we won't.
Dave I do understand your concern with the lack of Brobs size and how that "can" affect us on the defensive end. The other side of the coin is the offense that he may be able to bring. Me personally, I believe he looked better than you are giving him credit for in our late night. I know and do realize the lack of d in those types of games, but kenny and everyone else was in that same situation. He looked good to me. Aggressive and ready and willing to do some great things. My opinion, he's JJs backup.
Well, the cool thing is we are about to find out and not have to speculate as much. That is the way of these kind of discussions, we are about to the point where we can see and not wonder. These kind of discussion held in the summer get crazy at times, folks galvanize in to groups that see things one way while others see things differently. But this time of the season we are about to see how things actually will work rather than how they may work.
Can BRob handle the back up 3 spot minutes, don't know, but we will soon get a lot better idea, as it is every season. I hope the kid can, love his shooting stroke but I don't put a lot of stock in late night scrimmage games, I need to see these guys vs another team and not their own team mates. This is the exciting time for me, the anticipation of a season that has almost reached us after such a long off season. Can't wait!
I'm real high on Brandon as well. I realize he's thin but so is JJ. I just think he'll bring more offense to the table and I think we're going to need Luke backing up the four spot.
Remember, Isaiah(constant foul trouble) and Kennedy(health/stamina issues) played less than 40 MPG combined. There's no guarantee they won't have the same issues again. It's why I think Tony must play 20 MPG and be effective if we're to be solid inside.
Bottom line is I think Brandon can effectively backup JJ at SF. Especially in an era when more teams are going small, many times playing 3 guards. It would also allow us to go small at times, sliding JJ to the PF spot. It would also give 7th a chance to get a few minutes. Win-win situation, IMO.
Remember, Isaiah(constant foul trouble) and Kennedy(health/stamina issues) played less than 40 MPG combined. There's no guarantee they won't have the same issues again. It's why I think Tony must play 20 MPG and be effective if we're to be solid inside.
Bottom line is I think Brandon can effectively backup JJ at SF. Especially in an era when more teams are going small, many times playing 3 guards. It would also allow us to go small at times, sliding JJ to the PF spot. It would also give 7th a chance to get a few minutes. Win-win situation, IMO.
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At SF Justin plays 30+ per game, Brandon and Luke spell him depending on whether we are facing a shorter, quicker team (BRob) or a bigger, slower team (Luke).
If we are playing a bigger, quicker team, we may be in trouble. Roy will just have to use his timeouts to help Justin play more minutes.
Roy likes to use our depth and avoids timeouts to wear teams down. Even if that means having a less capable team on the floor for a few minutes. But if we need to slow it down, we have fouls to give. We can always foul a bad foul shooter so guys like Justin and Joel get a breather. With any luck, this will be the year when Kennedy doesn't have stamina problems, but he could benefit from that strategy, too.
If we are playing a bigger, quicker team, we may be in trouble. Roy will just have to use his timeouts to help Justin play more minutes.
Roy likes to use our depth and avoids timeouts to wear teams down. Even if that means having a less capable team on the floor for a few minutes. But if we need to slow it down, we have fouls to give. We can always foul a bad foul shooter so guys like Justin and Joel get a breather. With any luck, this will be the year when Kennedy doesn't have stamina problems, but he could benefit from that strategy, too.
At SF Justin plays 30+ per game, Brandon and Luke spell him depending on whether we are facing a shorter, quicker team (BRob) or a bigger, slower team (Luke).
If we are playing a bigger, quicker team, we may be in trouble. Roy will just have to use his timeouts to help Justin play more minutes.
Roy likes to use our depth and avoids timeouts to wear teams down. Even if that means having a less capable team on the floor for a few minutes. But if we need to slow it down, we have fouls to give. We can always foul a bad foul shooter so guys like Justin and Joel get a breather. With any luck, this will be the year when Kennedy doesn't have stamina problems, but he could benefit from that strategy, too.
Yeah, I would suggest the bigger teams we will play that luke could do a solid job vs a big wing and those teams that look to go small that maybe BRob or 7th could match the smaller wings. Teams, rare as they may be, that are bigger and quicker, well teams like that are just gonna be tuff. If you have a 6'9" wing that can nail jumpers or put it on the floor and drive past you then any team will struggle against that. Fortunately there are not to many of those 6'9" wings that can do that consistently.
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