Starting Lineup

[TarHeelFanWV]

Anyone else think that the 2nd half lineup with Love, Davis, Trimble, Leaky, and Bacot was our best lineup so far this year? I think that is going/should be the answer going forward. Trimble brings a lot of energy and defense to the team that Nance doesn't do. I know we lose a lot of size but Houston also plays with 3 guards and look at them. Leaky isn't the ideal 4 man but he can be a lot quicker than other teams 4's on the offensive end if he can at least do half of what he did last night.

Of course, unless Nance is hurt for a long period of time, I don't see Hubert taking Nance out of the starting lineup. We tried Puff and McKoy in Nance's place last night at first, and nothing worked or looked better than the one with Trimble in it.

 

[Tarheelsman71]

I love that idea. Sometimes you roll the ball out there with who you have available. I really like Trimble. his shooting mechanics are kind of weird, but his athleticism is excellent. Hustle is great too...That block he had in the lane was very nice. Now if he could knock down a 3 too...That would be a no brainer, but surely he can go 1-7 like Love.

 

[gunslingerdick]

I think we will see a lot of 3 guard line ups in the future of UNC basketball. Just not sure it will be this season, even though I totally agree with the OP.

 

[DSouthr]

Anyone else think that the 2nd half lineup with Love, Davis, Trimble, Leaky, and Bacot was our best lineup so far this year? I think that is going/should be the answer going forward. Trimble brings a lot of energy and defense to the team that Nance doesn't do. I know we lose a lot of size but Houston also plays with 3 guards and look at them. Leaky isn't the ideal 4 man but he can be a lot quicker than other teams 4's on the offensive end if he can at least do half of what he did last night.

Of course, unless Nance is hurt for a long period of time, I don't see Hubert taking Nance out of the starting lineup. We tried Puff and McKoy in Nance's place last night at first, and nothing worked or looked better than the one with Trimble in it.

"Anyone else think that the 2nd half lineup with Love, Davis, Trimble, Leaky, and Bacot was our best lineup so far this year?"

No sir, I actually do not think that is our best line up, it was really effective last night and considering the situation it was working great for us. If I consider how guys are playing right now, never mind how they may have played in the past or may play in the future, if I just look at how players are playing right now our starting line up I would make 3 changes.

First I would sit Nance because I need him to get over the back issues, going to limit his PT for a while. I would go to Puff as a starter at the 4 knowing he and Leaky will do a lot of switching between their assignments. I would go early and often to Nickel at the 4, he is the closest guy we have to Manek and would open up a lot of those Manek ops with his shooting, the more he plays the better he will play.

Second, RJ Davis, I would move him off the ball to the 2 spot, he is a shoot first guy, put him in the spot that you want a guy to have that shoot first mindset.

Third, Trimble as our starting PG moving Caleb to the bench. I still want Caleb to get solid PT but truth is he is not one of our 5 best players right now and I feel Trimble absolutely is. Notice when Love started playing defense last night, it was when Seth came in and got extended minutes, Love realize if I am not scoring I better play some D or this kid is going to steal my minutes. I think it is pretty clear, Seth gets in a game good things happen for us, may not see it on the stat sheet but that kid comes in and he just changes the game, our intensity immediately elevates.

And ya know, where Caleb's head is right now, I think it could benefit him to watch the game a bit before he comes in, kind of let that competitive spirit that kid has ferment a bit, let him feel the hunger to play before actually getting in. I really think that would help Caleb and the team over all.

 

[TarHeelFanWV]

"Anyone else think that the 2nd half lineup with Love, Davis, Trimble, Leaky, and Bacot was our best lineup so far this year?"

No sir, I actually do not think that is our best line up, it was really effective last night and considering the situation it was working great for us. If I consider how guys are playing right now, never mind how they may have played in the past or may play in the future, if I just look at how players are playing right now our starting line up I would make 3 changes.

First I would sit Nance because I need him to get over the back issues, going to limit his PT for a while. I would go to Puff as a starter at the 4 knowing he and Leaky will do a lot of switching between their assignments. I would go early and often to Nickel at the 4, he is the closest guy we have to Manek and would open up a lot of those Manek ops with his shooting, the more he plays the better he will play.

Second, RJ Davis, I would move him off the ball to the 2 spot, he is a shoot first guy, put him in the spot that you want a guy to have that shoot first mindset.

Third, Trimble as our starting PG moving Caleb to the bench. I still want Caleb to get solid PT but truth is he is not one of our 5 best players right now and I feel Trimble absolutely is. Notice when Love started playing defense last night, it was when Seth came in and got extended minutes, Love realize if I am not scoring I better play some D or this kid is going to steal my minutes. I think it is pretty clear, Seth gets in a game good things happen for us, may not see it on the stat sheet but that kid comes in and he just changes the game, our intensity immediately elevates.

And ya know, where Caleb's head is right now, I think it could benefit him to watch the game a bit before he comes in, kind of let that competitive spirit that kid has ferment a bit, let him feel the hunger to play before actually getting in. I really think that would help Caleb and the team over all.

I can agree with sitting Love (at least for now) and starting Trimble. If we are talking about how they are playing "right now". Love has shown at times he can be good and I think it will click again. It's not a matter of "if" but "when" is it going to click? It has never clicked for Nance in my opinion. He would be good off the bench but his defense is a liability and his offense is too inconsistent. I would feel more comfortable keeping Love in the lineup over Nance because as I previously stated, he has had some huge games for us. We have not seen much of Nickel other than the game against The Citadel. I am not sure if this caliber of basketball is for him, or if it will ever be for that matter. Puff has never been remotely close to his brother, Cam. I am not sure he is the answer either. With Trimble, regardless of what he does on offense, he is going to help us defensively. Honestly, if Nance would provide great defense he could be as big of an asset as Brady was for us last year, but his defense is pretty bad thus far, so he hasn't been able to help on either end of the floor consistently.


This team needs consistency. Either offensively or defensively. So far we haven't had either. Last night with our 3 guards was the first time I have seen a consistent offense and defense. Love may be really bad on offense right now, but he is still one of our better defenders. Let's be honest, Puff or Nickel is not going to provide more offense than Love can (at this point) in my opinion. I still trust Love more than those 2 based on history.

 

[DaveChapelle]

Making our best defensive wing (Leaky) start every game guarding power forwards is a good way to have him get early foul trouble.

Also, who do you want to be our defensive stopper on the wing since you want to take that job away from Leaky?

 

[tarwhiz]

Anyone else think that the 2nd half lineup with Love, Davis, Trimble, Leaky, and Bacot was our best lineup so far this year? I think that is going/should be the answer going forward. Trimble brings a lot of energy and defense to the team that Nance doesn't do. I know we lose a lot of size but Houston also plays with 3 guards and look at them. Leaky isn't the ideal 4 man but he can be a lot quicker than other teams 4's on the offensive end if he can at least do half of what he did last night.

Of course, unless Nance is hurt for a long period of time, I don't see Hubert taking Nance out of the starting lineup. We tried Puff and McKoy in Nance's place last night at first, and nothing worked or looked better than the one with Trimble in it.

Nance or Washington MUST play big min vs Virginia or we have no chance. Can't play 3 guards for extended min against their personnel.

 

[DSouthr]

I can agree with sitting Love (at least for now) and starting Trimble. If we are talking about how they are playing "right now". Love has shown at times he can be good and I think it will click again. It's not a matter of "if" but "when" is it going to click? It has never clicked for Nance in my opinion. He would be good off the bench but his defense is a liability and his offense is too inconsistent. I would feel more comfortable keeping Love in the lineup over Nance because as I previously stated, he has had some huge games for us. We have not seen much of Nickel other than the game against The Citadel. I am not sure if this caliber of basketball is for him, or if it will ever be for that matter. Puff has never been remotely close to his brother, Cam. I am not sure he is the answer either. With Trimble, regardless of what he does on offense, he is going to help us defensively. Honestly, if Nance would provide great defense he could be as big of an asset as Brady was for us last year, but his defense is pretty bad thus far, so he hasn't been able to help on either end of the floor consistently.


This team needs consistency. Either offensively or defensively. So far we haven't had either. Last night with our 3 guards was the first time I have seen a consistent offense and defense. Love may be really bad on offense right now, but he is still one of our better defenders. Let's be honest, Puff or Nickel is not going to provide more offense than Love can (at this point) in my opinion. I still trust Love more than those 2 based on history.

I am clearly higher on Nance than you seem to be, if he is healthy I do want him starting. But here is my concern, as so many have said all season, Nance is not Brady, they play 2 VERY different styles, the way you played one does not fit the way you need to play the other. Manek made his living at the 3pt arch with a ready to shoot quick trigger from deep, that is not at all what nance should be doing. Just because he can hot the occasional trey does not mean he should be putting a bunch of the up any more than you would have wanted to see Hansbourgh putting up multiple treys a game.

Nance shot motion is way slower than Maneks was, in fact I would call it methodical in nature, read that as slow but deliberate, you just can't play them the same way. You didn't want Manek spending the whole game inside the paint because not only would you be wasting a fantastic 3pt marksman with a really quick trigger you would have him in the least favorable aspect of his game. Same is true for Nance, put him in position to play to the real strength of his game.

Nance is really good hitting mid range jumpers, especially when he can get his man on his back, back him down, and hot that turn around jumper. He is also a really good passer, especially from the foul line in to a guy like Bacot, he has hit some really nice looking passes in to Bacot that Bacot may not have finished but the pass was nice. And yes, occasionally have him step out for a trey but I want the majority of his time spent closer in the paint, even if it is just cutting thru setting a cross screen and popping back thru on a curl cut, tag and then move out of the lane. Need to keep him active rather than camping out beyond the arch with the ball on the opposite side of the court, he has to occupy a defender. His defender is dropping down and clogging up Bacot's room to operate and that is the problem the 4 out look is supposed to do away with.

If you don't have a stretch 4 that is deadly from beyond the arch then you do NOT have a stretch 4 and defenders are not going to worry about it much. So greatly reduce his stretching out like that and put him where he is a serious coring threat, mid range and in with the jump hooks and turn around jumpers augmented by his ability to pass it to Bacot. I wish we had him as a freshman because I would have had him live in the weight room, he needs to be playing at around 235-240lbs so he could more physically battle in deep paint.

 

[DSouthr]

Making our best defensive wing (Leaky) start every game guarding power forwards is a good way to have him get early foul trouble.

Also, who do you want to be our defensive stopper on the wing since you want to take that job away from Leaky?

Yeah, I mean, Leaky can fill in at the 4 as needed but I do not want to see him playing there on the regular. I would much prefer Nickel and his shooting at the 4, 6'8" and 220-225lbs should be able to hold his own in there. Kid play with a moxy kind of grit I enjoy and the stretch positions we have been putting Nance in fits Nickel much more than it does Nance. I start Nance if he is healthy but if he isn't I would start either Nickel or Puff my gut says Nickel could be the better choice.

IN the event I did not make this clear, I want Leaky starting at the 3 and a starting back court of RJ and Trimble, for now, until Caleb gets his mojo back. That way I have my 2 best defenders starting the game and UNC brings big time energy from the opening tip. Now we would not be as potent on the offensive end but that is OK.

There is an aspect of this game everyone knows about but they rarely appreciate it for what it really is. Fans tend to judge a players value based on HOW MANY POINTS DID HE SCORE. That not only is NOT how you should consider a players real value it is most of the time fools gold. I will give you 2 players as example, one still plays for us and 1 does not.

First there is Caleb, Caleb has the ability to be a great defender but Caleb is totally offensive minded. Go back and watch, when Caleb is not scoring he does not defend, one on one he is blown by like a stop sign. He will play solid defense for stretches, so you know he can do it, but a typical thing for him is he will defend rather well for most of the shot clock and then in the last 5sec of the shot clock he wil take a un-necessary risk, on a guy that is not his assignment for a steal, his man will find a open spot, the ball will go to him and he splashes in Caleb's face? Fans say hey, look at what huge shots Caleb made vs duke for example, OK, how about the points he gave up on the other end? If you score 20, fans say you had a great game, they don't look at the fact we won a nail biter because the guy Caleb was supposed to be guarding hit 25, that is a net negative of 5 point we have to find a way to make up, how much did you help your team if you put them in a 5pt hole they have to dig out of?

Second example is Kerwin Walton, one of the most pretty jump shots you will see from a freshman, problem was he was constantly being scorched on the other end of the floor, kid went from starting last season the the very end of the bench because you do not help your team if you give up more than you score. That is why guys like Leaky and Seth are so important, they may not score a lot but they don't give up much either, you score on them and you had to earn it.