ADVERTISEMENT

The kick Roy and the players while they are down thread

keysersosay#1

Hall of Famer
Apr 7, 2006
11,298
3,844
113
Since everyone seems to be in such a state of despair, I thought it would be economical to have all these various negative thoughts about Roy and the team put into ONE thread. We have about four or five and the theme is all the same, so why not just use this thread as sort of an all purpose place to trash our entire program.

Go right ahead now and bash bash bash away to your hearts content.
 
  • Like
Reactions: tarheel0910
Since everyone seems to be in such a state of despair, I thought it would be economical to have all these various negative thoughts about Roy and the team put into ONE thread. We have about four or five and the theme is all the same, so why just use this thread as sort of an all purpose place to trash our entire program.

Go right ahead now and bash bash bash away to your hearts content.
LOL - Keyser. Good idea. I have nothing good to take from last nights loss, but don't find value in just trashing kids, Roy, etc. either. Roy is what he is - not changing - we need to learn to live with it / him.

Will be interesting to see what sort of character this team musters over the next few games. It sometimes seems Duke is just in this team's collective head. We seize up shooting against them.

Last note: I commend your courage for posting this with an implicit support for the program. Because I guarantee, while you haven't overtly painted a naïve, rosy, delusional picture of last night, an army of posters are going to swoop in and beat down on you for being a "sunshine boy" and being a "site cop, trashing posters in touch with reality"
 
I do not agree that dook is "in their heads". Nah they have just NOT executed whether MAKING shots or getting stops in all five of their losses. A combination of coaching and the players that is very disappointing and frustrating to say the least.

BTW I am NO sunshine and roses type guy. A realist yeah and I believe we CAN win Saturday and get back on the right track BUT it will take a real commitment and honest effort on all parts ,coaches ,team etc....
 
I do not agree that dook is "in their heads". Nah they have just NOT executed whether MAKING shots or getting stops in all five of their losses. A combination of coaching and the players that is very disappointing and frustrating to say the least.

BTW I am NO sunshine and roses type guy. A realist yeah and I believe we CAN win Saturday and get back on the right track BUT it will take a real commitment and honest effort on all parts ,coaches ,team etc....

So if we beat Miami, that means we are on track to win it all? Really? Miami isn't that good and if we beat them at home, it doesn't mean anything. It just means that we salvaged another home win while waiting for our next road loss or Duke loss.
 
  • Like
Reactions: jah420
It is pitiful that people cannot vent their frustrations with our program without being labeled. Anyone who cannot see that UNC has some glaring issues as well as the hall of fame coach being on the downside simply has their head in the sand. I pulled for the heels during the 8-20 season and expected a win every game. I understood the circumstances of that year and looked forward to righting the ship the following year. I even gave my best to support that coach who was clearly over his head.
But we are in a much different situation now. We have players that obviously settle for loses. Our coach God bless his soul, cannot manage a way to beat our greatest rival with an obvious advantage at home with a rockin crowd and the whole world watching.
So much is to blame for this situation we are in. AFAM, recruiting, roy past his prime, roys health, caliber of players we are landing, MOO stirring the pot, and so on and so forth.
Do I think they can win it all, yes. But there has to be some drastic changes in our line up and in our coaches approach to the game. But we have not saw much change in his philosophy outside of the occasional zone defenses he employs once a month now. I give him credit for this much, last night, I did not see the help defense allow Dook 30 open looks. How many years did it take to get to that point?
I dont think the majority of fans who are thread bare with the product of the past 3 years are wrong for feeling this way. We get enough preaching about potential of players, this one is the second coming of lawson, its just a slump, we will right the ship, roy will quit tinkering with the lineups, and all the other spin we see here.

I think its time we shake the program up a bit. One example I can see would be benching Meeks. HE checked out before the season began. If an NBA team picks him, they deserve bankruptcy for such a sorry pick. HE has proven nothing. I made a comment earlier in the season when he was injured about his body language. It seemed he was fine sitting on the bench and cheering the team on. Paige proved a player can play thru injury if they have heart. Meeks appears to be healthy, but no motor. Roy needs to be the man and put his behind on the bench. Yes, it would definitely crush his dreams of an nba team, but without effort, he wont be in the league anyway. Also, roy should look at retirement. His health is not the greatest at the moment. I wanted him to be up the officials behind for much of this season and when he did, he passed out. I think the game has passed him. I want a clean program, and he will keep it that way as long as he is here. But I really think his efforts should be finding someone to take his place. If it happens over the next year or so, then fine. I hear all this talk of carolina style basketball will be gone. How do we really know that if some option isnt explored. I am afraid that whatever success Roy has this year will be his last chance at a chip. With the horses we have coming in, i am not sure we can maintain his style of play for the coming years. Plus with how the NCAA is hosing us right now.
 
It is pitiful that people cannot vent their frustrations with our program without being labeled. Anyone who cannot see that UNC has some glaring issues as well as the hall of fame coach being on the downside simply has their head in the sand. I pulled for the heels during the 8-20 season and expected a win every game. I understood the circumstances of that year and looked forward to righting the ship the following year. I even gave my best to support that coach who was clearly over his head.
But we are in a much different situation now. We have players that obviously settle for loses. Our coach God bless his soul, cannot manage a way to beat our greatest rival with an obvious advantage at home with a rockin crowd and the whole world watching.
So much is to blame for this situation we are in. AFAM, recruiting, roy past his prime, roys health, caliber of players we are landing, MOO stirring the pot, and so on and so forth.
Do I think they can win it all, yes. But there has to be some drastic changes in our line up and in our coaches approach to the game. But we have not saw much change in his philosophy outside of the occasional zone defenses he employs once a month now. I give him credit for this much, last night, I did not see the help defense allow Dook 30 open looks. How many years did it take to get to that point?
I dont think the majority of fans who are thread bare with the product of the past 3 years are wrong for feeling this way. We get enough preaching about potential of players, this one is the second coming of lawson, its just a slump, we will right the ship, roy will quit tinkering with the lineups, and all the other spin we see here.

I think its time we shake the program up a bit. One example I can see would be benching Meeks. HE checked out before the season began. If an NBA team picks him, they deserve bankruptcy for such a sorry pick. HE has proven nothing. I made a comment earlier in the season when he was injured about his body language. It seemed he was fine sitting on the bench and cheering the team on. Paige proved a player can play thru injury if they have heart. Meeks appears to be healthy, but no motor. Roy needs to be the man and put his behind on the bench. Yes, it would definitely crush his dreams of an nba team, but without effort, he wont be in the league anyway. Also, roy should look at retirement. His health is not the greatest at the moment. I wanted him to be up the officials behind for much of this season and when he did, he passed out. I think the game has passed him. I want a clean program, and he will keep it that way as long as he is here. But I really think his efforts should be finding someone to take his place. If it happens over the next year or so, then fine. I hear all this talk of carolina style basketball will be gone. How do we really know that if some option isnt explored. I am afraid that whatever success Roy has this year will be his last chance at a chip. With the horses we have coming in, i am not sure we can maintain his style of play for the coming years. Plus with how the NCAA is hosing us right now.


I agree with you 100% and feel the exact same way.

My biggest problem outside of Roy's bad coaching is how we are told every year how great the incoming recruits are. Yet every class we get, the players don't show much until year 3 or 4. Meeks and Hicks were supposed to be awesome. They are not. Berry, Pinson, and Jackson were supposed to be studs. They are not. Why do our recruits come here and either get worse or plateau and never get better? I don't see that happening at the other big time programs. We are not getting the best players. If I were a highly sought after recruit, I would not go to UNC and play in an old system that doesn't win titles. I wouldn't want to play in an arena that is filled with old people that don't want to get loud.

These team and program has issues that need to be addressed. Winning 20 games a year against teams like Clemson, BC, Moo U, etc. etc. doesn't mean anything. We are not getting the wins against the better teams in the country and are losing some games to bad/average teams. The same old song and dance is getting old.
 
I dont think Roy is a "bad" coach. Not right to really say that. Over his career he has been a good coach. He has not lived up to his billing as of late. But he has proven he can coach during in game situations. We took Cuse out of their game because of Roys adjustments. But he has never been able to prepare for dook. Last night proved it. I must be seeing things different that others. And Roy has taken several years to develop players into championship teams while at UNC. Now its taboo to stay more than 2 years and it shows. That hurts recruiting as well. DES saw the writing on the wall and left gracefully.
And Roys style of play on offense is fine. Kids love an uptempo game. But it takes time to learn that system. If you master it, it is hard to compete against. I really dont know how much time he spends teaching half court offense, but it is a glaring weakness.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Heelicious
We're not very good, yet dominated from start to finish against a team who's even less good (and much thinner in depth), yet we still lost. We're also really bad at putting the ball through the hoop on non-layup shots.

Doesn't take a basketball savant to figure out the train has come off the tracks. Sorry if that's construed as "bashing."
 
I agree with you 100% and feel the exact same way.

My biggest problem outside of Roy's bad coaching is how we are told every year how great the incoming recruits are. Yet every class we get, the players don't show much until year 3 or 4. Meeks and Hicks were supposed to be awesome. They are not. Berry, Pinson, and Jackson were supposed to be studs. They are not. Why do our recruits come here and either get worse or plateau and never get better? I don't see that happening at the other big time programs. We are not getting the best players. If I were a highly sought after recruit, I would not go to UNC and play in an old system that doesn't win titles. I wouldn't want to play in an arena that is filled with old people that don't want to get loud.

These team and program has issues that need to be addressed. Winning 20 games a year against teams like Clemson, BC, Moo U, etc. etc. doesn't mean anything. We are not getting the wins against the better teams in the country and are losing some games to bad/average teams. The same old song and dance is getting old.
I think you should just assume almost every recruit will struggle initially. That's the norm. Of course everyone is going to say recruits are great. Wouldn't be PC or really necessary to say a 16 or 17 year old sucks and can't play. You're never going to hear that.
 
Roy is not a good coach. You've heard it for 20 years and nights like last night make it hard to argue in his behalf. He's been blessed with a ton of talent during his time but looking back, even with the few titles he won, you are hard pressed not to say he's underachieved with the talent he's had.

Marcus Paige was a superstar on a mediocre Carolina team. He has regressed and now a decent college player that can't be counted on to get it done in crunch time. He's a player that we will all remember for being really good early in his career but never good enough to lead his team to any accomplishments of merit.

Kennedy Meeks has turned into JP Tokoto. He decided long ago that he would declare for the NbA draft and his lack of effort and motor are glaring. In looking at interactions with some of his teammates, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to see the tension there. His teammates aren't stupid. They see his lack of effort and passion especially when the going gets tough. I hope he's not a cancer to the team but anybody that plays with a motor like his will almost certainly be seen as a waste and create some animosity among teammates. Think about how you all have felt when you played on a team with a kid who was lazy and gave minimal effort and never fought when you needed him to. You hated those type of teammates and would rather do without them no matter how good they were. If I'm Roy I bench him unless I absolutely need him. He's a waste.

Theo Pinson. Why the obsession with playing him so much lately. He quite possibly has the lowest basketball IQ of anybody other than Joel James on our roster. He makes mind boggling dumb passes, turns it over, gets lost on defense, can't shoot, can't dribble, etc. all he does is play with effort but even that can't overcome his errors. This is UnC not UnCw. He doesn't belong on the floor.

Did I say how bad Roy is? Wow
 
And for those that act like Roy can coach. Everybody references in game situations against teams like Syracuse, Virginia Tech, NC State, etc. Generally speaking those teams aren't very good year in and year out. Name a time in which he coached his tail off in a big game and we won? Against Dook, Kentucky, Kansas,etc. that's right you can't.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Deezheelz
Roy is not a good coach. He's been blessed with a ton of talent during his time but looking back, even with the few titles he won, you are hard pressed not to say he's underachieved with the talent he's had.

Dean won 2 NCAA titles as well, right?
 
The camera showed Jamison and Rasheed Wallace's faces after the game, sitting in the stands. Their expressions told the story. "I cannot believe they lost and he didn't call a time out."

By the way, to those above talking about Syracuse not being good year-in-and-year-out, as well as Miami... you're wrong. Boeheim is a HOF coach, too. Larranaga is going to bring his top 20 Miami team in on Saturday and they will win. I'm afraid Miami is going to beat us even worse. Our losses coming to Miami and UVa are going to make the dook loss look like a win.

When I saw this team struggle against BC (after losing to Louisville and ND), I knew it was pretty much over.
 
good thread idea...

i hate roy's system, always have...it might be easy to recruit to carolina because of brand, but it appears as though it's getting harder to get players that fit his brand.

imo, mentioning dean's name last night was a chicken sh t move and immediately put a bullet proof vest on him to deflect media scrutiny...after all, who would in their right mind argue about what coach smith taught anyone?

it's super frustrating and i'm not "quitting" like some have deemed must be the case if you disagree or question the direction of the program.

as it stands now, i hope they win the damn thing and he retires...imo, it's what's best for the program.
 
i hope they win the damn thing and he retires...imo, it's what's best for the program.

Absolutely. While I want to see them win every season, winning this year could be monumental for the program. For once living up to the preseason hype - that will look good to recruits. And with all the stuff Roy has dealt with, he may actually consider hanging it up at the end of the year if he were able to go out on top - also very good for the program given the coaching ability he has shown recently. And third, with the weak freshman class we have now, paired with ok but not great recruits coming in - the future doesn't look to bright. Winning a title this year, would prevent a lot of people from running their cars in their garages and taking a nap over the next few seasons.
 
Since everyone seems to be in such a state of despair, I thought it would be economical to have all these various negative thoughts about Roy and the team put into ONE thread. We have about four or five and the theme is all the same, so why not just use this thread as sort of an all purpose place to trash our entire program.

Go right ahead now and bash bash bash away to your hearts content.



Wood meet Worms indeed...
 
The camera showed Jamison and Rasheed Wallace's faces after the game, sitting in the stands. Their expressions told the story. "I cannot believe they lost and he didn't call a time out."

By the way, to those above talking about Syracuse not being good year-in-and-year-out, as well as Miami... you're wrong. Boeheim is a HOF coach, too. Larranaga is going to bring his top 20 Miami team in on Saturday and they will win. I'm afraid Miami is going to beat us even worse. Our losses coming to Miami and UVa are going to make the dook loss look like a win.

When I saw this team struggle against BC (after losing to Louisville and ND), I knew it was pretty much over.



how many wins did Syracuse forfeit because of their head Coach and/or others closely associated with the Syracuse program...? Nice work...
 
how many wins did Syracuse forfeit because of their head Coach and/or others closely associated with the Syracuse program...? Nice work...
How many will we forfeit? Maybe wait til the penalties come down before throwing stones from within our glass house.

That aside, academic infractions have zilch to do to negate the fact that Syracuse has been good consistently for many years.

But by all means, continue to pretend to live in a golden city on the hill.
 
I think we will beat Miami sat, for some reason this team and IMO our last 3 season teams have had to have their backs to the wall before they came out fighting for 40mins. the last 5 games has this teams back squarely against the wall. Then we will go on a mini run and folks expectations will ramp back up, we will likely get disappointed in the ACCT, and then go on a nice lil run in the NCAAT, where that ends is still open ended.
 
Dave I hope you are correct. Our fan base is fractured at the moment. No one to point fingers at except the team and coaches. On the same token, the team and coaches can right the ship. The 8-20 team played to their potential. They were just not good that year. This team has always played below their potential. That's what hurts so bad. How many games this year have they lost because of that? No one has really run them out of the gym or handed it to them. They lost most of their games just like Wednesday night. If this lose doesnt motivate them to do better, then nothing ever will. I am finally past being angry over Wednesday night. Effort is all I every want. Win/lose isn't as important as leaving it all on the floor
 
Last edited:
Just enjoy the ride and don't let your ego and selfishness prevent you from wearing the Carolina colors proudly. Just get your dancing shoes ready for March and your appetite on the low side so that you can enjoy a big bowl of crow when the dance ends.
 
  • Like
Reactions: shun1
you guys know any alabama football fans, like real fans????

listen to them talk about winning and losing and going years without beating your rival, etc.
 
I wish the idea of combining all these issues into this one thread caught on. It's time consuming to read all of them. Maybe this would be easier if we made a rule that everyone had to say one good thing and one bad thing in each post. That way everyone can be equally pissed off and happy at the same time. :)
 
All this kind of stuff makes me long for the good old days, before the internet.
Lee Pace had a nice little rag he put out that we gobbled up and read every week.
Some of our fan base are in too big a hurry these days.
 
  • Like
Reactions: tarheel0910
I think we will beat Miami sat, for some reason this team and IMO our last 3 season teams have had to have their backs to the wall before they came out fighting for 40mins. the last 5 games has this teams back squarely against the wall. Then we will go on a mini run and folks expectations will ramp back up, we will likely get disappointed in the ACCT, and then go on a nice lil run in the NCAAT, where that ends is still open ended.
I think we beat Miami too... But it's normal for a team to perform well after a loss like that. But that isn't exactly uncommon from this team. The great teams are able to motivate themselves under prosperity too. How often do you see a team upset us or Duke, then lose to a team like Georgia Tech the following game?

I just think this team is who they are. They're older, not necessarily significantly better. Better in spots, worse in others.... Net result.... Slightly better due to experience, but not good enough.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ltrogdon
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT