Why Roy has played Joel James all year

[Ozheelfan]

Sure he struggles to catch the ball clean and he gets called for 2-3 moving screens per game but with Kennedy out Joel is the only true centre left on the Heels roster.

So now take a trip back in your hot tub time machine and witness the head-scratching substitutions in November and December, the times you yelled at the TV or computer, or posted on a game thread questioning why #42 is in Tar Heel Blue.....

Now go back further, to the class of 2012 and hear Joel James say yes when almost every high school big man said no.

Roy showed faith in him then, and he's continued to show faith by giving Joel game time and coaching him to be the best he can be..... not the second coming of Brad Daugherty, Eric Montross or Brendan Haywood, just a guy who can fill a hole and hopefully help limit the impact from a first team all-American.

It's time for Joel to repay the faith shown by Roy and, warts and all, it's time for us to get behind him!

 

[GoNtheDistance]

That made me feel all warm and fuzzy until I remind myself just how unrealistic this is.

 

[toophly1124]

I've, admittedly, been one of James biggest critics ... I want to eat my words and watch him be clutch when we need him most .. Don't see it happening but again I'd be more than happy to be wrong

 

[bleeduncblue]

He's not a complete disaster and I'm happy that he's comfortable playing a good amount of minutes ...we need him now like crazy!

 

[TarHeelMark]

If he could do a better job of catching and holding on to the ball, he could provide some positive minutes, because the dude actually does have a nice touch on those turn around jumpers.

 

[WoadBlue]

Originally posted by TarHeelMark:
If he could do a better job of catching and holding on to the ball, he could provide some positive minutes, because the dude actually does have a nice touch on those turn around jumpers.

There's more to it than that. James is a clod on D - bad footwork and slow. Kaminsky on the perimeter will eat him alive. James cannot cover Kaminsky more than 10 feet from the basket. And this year, he also cannot cover Hayes more than 10 feet from the basket, because Hayes has become all around player.

 

[TarHeelMark]

^the defensive liability is a given. Even with Meeks we are going to be challenged stopping Frank the Tank. I'm just hoping that JJ can give us a little bit on the offensive end. If we let Kaminsky get his but control the deep ball threat, we have a chance. Not a great one, but a chance nonetheless.

 

[Ozheelfan]

Originally posted by GoNtheDistance:
That made me feel all warm and fuzzy until I remind myself just how unrealistic this is.

I'm sorry it's unrealistic for us to support Joel. That's all the OP was about.

What he achieves is up to him, we can't do bugger-all to influence that.

 

[thaUNCshow]

Does any team have worse luck with injuries than us? We probably missed out on two championships with Kenny Smith and Kendall Marshall's injuries. We almost missed one in 05 with McCants's sickness and even in 09 Hansbrough missed several games and Ginyard missed the whole season. We also lost Strickland and LMac in 2012 which forced us to try to win an Elite 8 game with Stillman White and Justin Watts playing heavy minutes. Henson probably wasnt 100% either. Basketball aint fair lol

 

[Tru Blu Tar Heel]

Originally posted by WoadBlue:

Originally posted by TarHeelMark:
If he could do a better job of catching and holding on to the ball, he could provide some positive minutes, because the dude actually does have a nice touch on those turn around jumpers.

There's more to it than that. James is a clod on D - bad footwork and slow. Kaminsky on the perimeter will eat him alive. James cannot cover Kaminsky more than 10 feet from the basket. And this year, he also cannot cover Hayes more than 10 feet from the basket, because Hayes has become all around player.

Then play primarily zone. Let's go James! Conjure up some chant or spell to channel your inner "Big Game James Worthy" and let's do this thing!!!

 

[Ozheelfan]

Originally posted by TarHeelMark:
........ I'm just hoping that JJ can give us a little bit on the offensive end.

100% Kaminsky isn't Okafor. He won't handle the pounding if James gets deep on offence and puts all 280 pounds to work! Hell, even Okafor found it tough going body-to-body with Joel.

 

[scoutsupreme]

The Desmond Hubert injury rears its ugly head as well. 5 less fouls to give plus we lose a decent ball handler. The senior Jackson Simmons needs to step up.

 

[IDUNK4HEELS]

Correct me if I am wrong but wasn't there a bunch of posters here who said Britt was a waste of a scholarship and was not a D1 point guard and should have very limited minutes playing on court. Crickets after the Arkansas game. James is a Tar Heel and he has a hard 5 fouls to give so I say support the kid instead of putting him down. Like Britt last week he may surprise and then shut up a bunch of people.

 

[ElizabethtownHeel]

James reminds me of a couple of goofy big men Dean had. I think one was Warren Martin maybe ? Ed Geth maybe ?

 

[mikeirbyusa]

Originally posted by ElizabethtownHeel:
James reminds me of a couple of goofy big men Dean had. I think one was Warren Martin maybe ? Ed Geth maybe ?

And a few others too!

Wendstrom-or was he Guts?
Serge

 

[Steat]

The difference this year is that the Heels are not favored to win. It's all gravy after the Arkansas win. Even with Meeks, the Heels would be underdogs in the Wiskey game. The Kenny Smith and Butter injuries probably caused the Heels at least one NCAA title. The key to this game is Johnson staying out of foul trouble. If he gets 2 quick fouls in the first half it will be a long night for the Heels. It would be great for Paige to go wild and put up a 30 spot. The Heels have a chance.

 

[gunslingerdick]

Originally posted by mikeirbyusa:

Originally posted by ElizabethtownHeel:
James reminds me of a couple of goofy big men Dean had. I think one was Warren Martin maybe ? Ed Geth maybe ?

And a few others too!

Wendstrom-or was he Guts?
Serge

Matt Wenstrom was Dean's. He played on the 93 championship team. Well, he didn't really play. He sat behind 2 other 7 footers - Montross and Salvadori. But despite never playing, he had a cup of coffee in the NBA. Celtics, I think.

 

[DSouthr]

Sure there are several things that stick out to us as things Joel needs to improve on but I think folks get so caught up in that they don't see the things that Joel has really worked on and improved on. The kid actually has a very good shooting stroke, kinda in a way that is not really expected but from the mid range his shooting stroke is maybe the best we have from a big man, at least on par with Brice in that aspect. And don't forget, at 6'10" & around 285, Joel is easy our biggest big, that in itself offers advantages, hard to block out, sets screens that are huge, and gets him some rebounds. His going mano-E-mano vs Ochafor for me was one of the highlites of this season, the big kid said not today and he ment it.

 

[RP12]

I'm calling it right now....double double from Big Joel.

 

[ROYANDDEAN]

lol im not sure we see a double double but it does piss me off that people give this kid so much trouble. Easily the most improved guy on our team this year and hes done some great things for us. He has sure helped us a lot more than he has hurt us.

 

[parheel]

Originally posted by ROYANDDEAN:

lol im not sure we see a double double but it does piss me off that people give this kid so much trouble. Easily the most improved guy on our team this year and hes done some great things for us. He has sure helped us a lot more than he has hurt us.

Indeed -- it's night and day from last year to this year. He's improved his defense, his shooting and his IQ. I'm not saying all of those categories are game-changers, but kudos to him and the coaching staff for the hard work leading to noticeable improvement.

 

[JimmyinVA]

Originally posted by ROYANDDEAN:

lol im not sure we see a double double but it does piss me off that people give this kid so much trouble. Easily the most improved guy on our team this year and hes done some great things for us. He has sure helped us a lot more than he has hurt us.

i agree 100%. people have focused entirely on his liabilities and completely ignored his contributions. i remember years ago the same thing happened to brendan haywood. opposing teams would focus their game plans on stopping him but carolina fans would slice and dice him relentlessly. thank goodness pro scouts saw what carolina fans couldn't see resulting in a nice pro career. re:joel i think his strengths outweigh his negatives, especially his shooting touch taking some pressure off our perimete offense. but even if his plusses/minuses were even roy has been smart to play him to give some rest for still slightly overweight and now injured meeks.

 

[Tom79]

IDUNK, if anyone was paying attention, Nate was a starting point guard on a national championship HS team (Oak Hill). Most of that five are all on D1 teams.

Joel, in the old days, is a project. He has come a long way. He does need to attack the basket rather than spin move/fade away jumper. While I don't care for that shot from him, it usually leaves Brice or Hicks weak side with the follow.

Low post Kaminski will catch turn, roll with full extension and he is at the rim, quickly. If Kaminski is 10 feet from the basket, one dribble, one step and again he is finishing at the rim. Either hand, no problem.
Recall that Joel has only been playing about 4-5 years max. If he can do some of what coach needs and do it well, great. Do not get ahead of yourself, stay within yourself. And against Wisc go get those defensive rebounds.

 

[BillyL]

Originally posted by RP12:

I'm calling it right now....double double from Big Joel.

Ya know, RP12 . . . if we get a double-double from Joel, I truly believe we have a very excellent shot at winning Thursday night.

If, your call is right, I'm buying you dinner . . (dessert included) . . but, pay for your own cocktail drinks(only 'cause I know your the always thirsty kind).

 

[RobJones__]

Say what you will about Mr. James, one thing you can never question is his effort and tenacity. After watching people in this forum bash players and their lack of effort and/or fire, I've never had to question where Joel's effort was.

 

[bleeduncblue]

Completely agree ...double-double. 11 walks, 13 dropped passes

 

[ThunderBox]

I'm pulling for James but man, he's terrible

 

[berens007]

Originally posted by IDUNK4HEELS:
Correct me if I am wrong but wasn't there a bunch of posters here who said Britt was a waste of a scholarship and was not a D1 point guard and should have very limited minutes playing on court. Crickets after the Arkansas game. James is a Tar Heel and he has a hard 5 fouls to give so I say support the kid instead of putting him down. Like Britt last week he may surprise and then shut up a bunch of people.

Key word on the fouls for our team and for him is HARD fouls. Don't waste them on slapping at the ball and giving them and-1s, don't waste them away from the basket, and definitely don't get them on offense. That could make a big difference for us.

 

[imajericho]

Pretty sad how you are all trying to justify his use and think positive by how hard he can foul someone.

That's a joke. We don't play thug ball.

We need players who can play. Not foul hard.

 

[bleeduncblue]

Originally posted by imajericho:
Pretty sad how you are all trying to justify his use and think positive by how hard he can foul someone.

That's a joke. We don't play thug ball.

We need players who can play. Not foul hard.

There is a difference in "thug ball" and fouling with effort ...we have WAY too many "and ones" where we make a half attempt at the ball and allow the shooter to get off an easy shot near the rim. If you're gonna foul then FOUL, for crying out loud.

 

[berens007]

Originally posted by bleeduncblue:

Originally posted by imajericho:
Pretty sad how you are all trying to justify his use and think positive by how hard he can foul someone.

That's a joke. We don't play thug ball.

We need players who can play. Not foul hard.

There is a difference in "thug ball" and fouling with effort ...we have WAY too many "and ones" where we make a half attempt at the ball and allow the shooter to get off an easy shot near the rim. If you're gonna foul then FOUL, for crying out loud.

Yep - the joke is how many and-1s and touch fouls that we get hit for - i get that some of it is the refs, but not all of it.

No one is saying commit flagrant fouls, try to injure people, or do anything else generally like Creighton employed against us in 2012. Just commit hard "professional" (bad word for college kids) fouls that actually make people earn it at the FT line, and limit the ticky tack and offenseive fouls. Think NBA playoff fouls.

And that's not the only way Joel can help us, but it's one way. If he can channel "at Dook this year" Joel James, he can be a plus.
This post was edited on 3/24 5:26 PM by berens007

 

[Bur-Heel]

James's play is going to surprise many come Thursday!!

 

[Bernheel]

I thought James played tremendously well in the 1st duke game and has given us decent minutes since then. He will play his ass off Thursday!

 

[WoadBlue]

Originally posted by Bernheel:
I thought James played tremendously well in the 1st duke game and has given us decent minutes since then. He will play his ass off Thursday!

There is a huge difference between Dook and Wisconsin per Joel James playing. Okafor is not a stud at the 3 point line. James 20 from the basket could trip up half our team as he stumbles his 280 pounds trying to keep up with Kaminsky. James can guard Okafor much more easily because Okafor is a down low guy.

 

[Detroit Heel]

Originally posted by bleeduncblue:

Originally posted by imajericho:
Pretty sad how you are all trying to justify his use and think positive by how hard he can foul someone.

That's a joke. We don't play thug ball.

We need players who can play. Not foul hard.

There is a difference in "thug ball" and fouling with effort ...we have WAY too many "and ones" where we make a half attempt at the ball and allow the shooter to get off an easy shot near the rim. If you're gonna foul then FOUL, for crying out loud.

Agreed. So sick of hearing "thug ball" thrown around everywhere because a team presses and gets up in your face. People act like basketball is a game where if you breathe on someone there should be a whistle. I like the game a little more physical (not in a dirty way) and have no problem with hard fouls. As you said...I've seen WAAAAAAY too many and-ones from this team because they let the other team get the shot up. If you're going to foul on a drive to the basket, make it count.

 

[gunslingerdick]

Originally posted by Detroit Heel:

Originally posted by bleeduncblue:

Originally posted by imajericho:
Pretty sad how you are all trying to justify his use and think positive by how hard he can foul someone.

That's a joke. We don't play thug ball.

We need players who can play. Not foul hard.

There is a difference in "thug ball" and fouling with effort ...we have WAY too many "and ones" where we make a half attempt at the ball and allow the shooter to get off an easy shot near the rim. If you're gonna foul then FOUL, for crying out loud.

Agreed. So sick of hearing "thug ball" thrown around everywhere because a team presses and gets up in your face. People act like basketball is a game where if you breathe on someone there should be a whistle. I like the game a little more physical (not in a dirty way) and have no problem with hard fouls. As you said...I've seen WAAAAAAY too many and-ones from this team because they let the other team get the shot up. If you're going to foul on a drive to the basket, make it count.

X2

 

[Steat]

It's very simple. Winning takes care of a lot things. If the Heels somehow, someway make it to the Final Four I don't think we will see another complaint about Joel the rest of his career. Okay, that may be taking it overboard, but you get my point.

 

[heelmanwilm]

I think coach will have to try a lot of zone. We cant risk joel getting into foul trouble.

I dont know, its just the worst possible match up for us even with a healthy meeks
Posted from Rivals Mobile

 

[RP12]

Originally posted by BillyL:

Originally posted by RP12:

I'm calling it right now....double double from Big Joel.

Ya know, RP12 . . . if we get a double-double from Joel, I truly believe we have a very excellent shot at winning Thursday night.

If, your call is right, I'm buying you dinner . . (dessert included) . . but, pay for your own cocktail drinks(only 'cause I know your the always thirsty kind).

You know me well Billy.

My prediction was slightly tongue-in-cheek but it could happen. It would be the best game of his career clearly, since 6 and 5 in 12 mins against dook this year was his best probably, but I think rebounds is the bigger stretch.

 

[Archer2]

X3.

If you're going to foul a guy, don't let him get the ball up to the rim. It's not dirty ball, it's getting your money's worth and not allowing the three point opportunity.