Increasing the minimum wage is treating the symptom, not the disease.
legalize pot
- Thread starter gteeitup
- Start date
I'm sure all people that don't make that much think it's a fantastic idea but I make way more than that and it ain't really THAT much with the cost of living these days. It will just make everything go up and we will be no better off in the long run.
No. Liberalism is about spending other people's money to force everybody to be the same. This country was founded on individuality and as usual you are FOS.
And that makes two people on this thread that have proved my point for me. Easy posting day for me.
Nice. I notice he didn't answer your question about laborers having to give back pay if the company is failing.
The whole idea about income inequality is garbage. So there are people that make more money than someone else. The only thing that riles me up about that is that I'm not one of those making a killing.
Also, all this shit about "it's not fair, it's not fair". Who the f**k are you to decide what's fair?
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That's what's astonishing to me. Businesses are not going to take the hit. The hit will be passed on. And I don't blame them.
Avoiding questions that debunk his entire argument. At least he's walking the walk of being a liberal.
This isn't about not being fair because someone makes more money than someone else. No one working at McD's is expecting to be paid the same as a brain surgeon. This is about being able to work and make enough to take care of basic human needs. Being able to pay rent, feed and clothe your family, pay your insurances, keep the heat on, etc. and not have to worry about ending up on the street if you get the flu and have to miss work. Things you guys obviously take for granted.
Oh it's all about "fair." Don't kid yourself. They expect to be paid like some skilled tradesman. Why is McDonalds responsible for paying them more than what any unskilled laborer should receive? McDonald's didn't ask them to have more, unplanned kids whose basic needs they can't meet. Trying to bully employment providers won't work, they'll just reconfigure to use cheaper labor elsewhere or will automate certain tasks as to reduce the need for laborers who demand more than they are worth.
McDonald's is not a career, sorry. Jobs like these should be supplemental in nature and not sole sources of income if you are trying to start your life or are in retirement and want to stay busy while earning a few bucks. If you want a better life then go earn it. Take trade classes at night, work construction and learn a trade. There are tons of free and fee-assisted opportunities for training programs and schools for those not able to afford or attend college. But keep in mind, the route won't be easy. It's going to suck for awhile. But then again, worthwhile gains are never easy.
Sighhh. You guys just don't get it. You're generalizing and stereotyping as usual. I KNOW the ones out there barking for the increase in minimum wage are a lot of the people you speak of. Whether we like it or not, they will always be around. I do believe $15 is very high for minimum wage and would just snowball inflation and in the end would do absolutely nothing. The real problem is our dollar but that is an entirely different discussion.
As for this situation, it is not just the ones having unplanned kids and wanting to scoot by collecting welfare, food stamps and working these low wage jobs though. What about the single, young person who IS in college, putting themselves through with grants, loans and working? The ones who do not have mommy and daddy's money to support them and have to still come up with rent and daily living needs, who don't party, smoke, do drugs but have to pay everything we all pay for the most part, utilities, insurance, unexpected costs like tires or car repairs.... the wage needs to be at least something where people like that can manage.
Try living on minimum wage for one month and you will see. My children do it... they pay $500 in rent, utilities total around $300 a month, put gas in their car (Honda Fit so it is good on gas), buy their food and necessities (toilet paper, soap, laundry, etc.) and they make 50 cents above min wage BUT jobs do not allow over 32 hours anymore (most only allow 25 hours) and pay NO benefits, that has been the case since they started working years ago and they might be lucky to have $150 left over every month. I pay their car payment, car insurance, cell phones, cable/internet, pay for one's health costs because they do not make enough money to qualify for Obamacare so I have to pay for them out of my pocket to go to the doctor or get prescriptions. They cannot afford those things. One is starting radiology tech school in the fall, the other is mentally ill and can barely hold down this simple part-time job, so when the one is out of school she will be able to afford this much better but if they did not have me to rely on, they would not have a car, not have a way to get her medicines or medical care and would struggle and struggle until they can get things figured out and completed with school. THAT is what I am talking about, a-holes!
The ones you stereotype are a problem, yes, but they are NOT THE ONLY ONES struggling! Do you understand that??? Deal with those moochers in a different way but we don't have to penalize those who ARE trying because of those idiots!
There are single people working minimum wage jobs, paying rent/bills and going to school now. How are they doing it?
You think the solution is to increase min wage? That is actually the worst thing that could happen for your kids, that will force that min wage employer to either cut more jobs to deliver the profits or it could force that employer to either shut down or move it labor base outside this country.
The real solution is to bring jobs back in to this country, not continue to force them out. You raise the labor cost in business and profitability demands that you either reduce the numbers of laborers or you out source to cheaper per head labor costs.
Your kids problem is not what min wage is set at, their problem is the lack of good middle class jobs that have been shipped out of this country because manufactoring had to either reduce the per head labor costs or shut down. Government regulations are the reason for this, combined with our being totally screwed in trade deals. Bringing jobs back and education is what takes your kids from those min wage jobs in to middle class jobs.
ALL raising the min wage does is kick the can down the road and increase the cost of a Big Mac, it artifically raises the inflation pace so you do not have more buying power and the lines at the unemployment office grow? How does that help anyone?
Their lives are SUPPOSED to be like that; thus the term minimum wage. You know what that's designed to do? Motivate them to go get education or training so they can get a higher-paying job. Which is exactly what your one child is doing, so I salute her on that! Once she finishes school, she'll get a better-paying job and will live more comfortably
they are struggling in some way, giving up something, medical care, new tires, car repairs, something.....My kids pay their rent and keep their lights on with min wage but don't let anything unexpected happen because without me they would be screwed.... they would have to go get assistance somewhere from our lovely government (local or otherwise), they would need food stamps... whatever it is. THAT is the struggle.
Their lives are SUPPOSED to be like that; thus the term minimum wage. You know what that's designed to do? Motivate them to go get education or training so they can get a higher-paying job. Which is exactly what your one child is doing, so I salute her on that! Once she finishes school, she'll get a better-paying job and will live more comfortably
yes, one daughter is doing that but the other struggles with mental illness. I have had her in and out of mental hospitals, she cannot get any government help, because she does not make enough money to get healthcare and Nikki Haley opted out of any sort of medicaid help for low income people. I have to pay cash for a HUGE hospital bill for her several visits to the ER, hospital admissions, mental health care, and mental hospital stays, without me what would she do???? She is trying very hard by working the only job she can actually handle but what would she do if she did not have me? Not EVERYONE IS A BUM is my point! geez
And you know what the real irony in this thread is with what I have stated about my daughter who is mentally ill..... the ONLY thing that actually helps her..... marijuana!
I stated earlier that $15 would cause more problems and just push the problem under the rug essentially but $8.00 an hour is just WAY too low too. I am thinking $10 might be helpful right now until the real problem with our dollar and jobs can be resolved. I am SURE The Donald will fix all of that for us!
Their lives are SUPPOSED to be like that; thus the term minimum wage. You know what that's designed to do? Motivate them to go get education or training so they can get a higher-paying job. Which is exactly what your one child is doing, so I salute her on that! Once she finishes school, she'll get a better-paying job and will live more comfortably
You know, this thread in the beginning was a discussion of allowing weed to be legal and has morphed in to a discussion of raising the min wage. But TH11, you hit on a common theme between the 2 discussions, and it is a point that seems totally lost on the progressives out there.
It is about personel responsibility for your own choices. Don't go make bad choices in life and blame others for your own choices? IMO, you want to smoke weed IMO go for it, just don't blame others if you have any side effects from it. Don't want to go to college, want to have un-protected sex and have un-planned for children, your choices led you to where you are. Want that new car don't blame Micky Ds cause it is hard to pay for it, no one put a gun to your head and forced you to make the choices you made that put you where you are right now.
This progressive movement wants people to be forgiven for their bad choices, they don't want to have to pay the cost, they do not believe in personal responsibility, they believe they can make what ever choice they want and the rest of the world owes it to them to bail them out? Well ya know what, the rest of the world doesn't owe you a darn thing, your choices put you where you are and it has to be your making better choices that gets you out if you do not like where you are.
These progressive have things backwards, they want those that made good choices to pay for those that don't and erase any need for personel responsibility and that was not the way I was raised. I get it, as a parent you do not want to see your kids struggle but they have to be held accountable for their own decisions because the world can be a cold hard place if you make bad decisions and expect others to bail you out when things get hard.
Well if you speak in generalizations, such as your quote I responded to was, then you may get some generalizations thrown back your way. But trust me, I get it, that's why I responded the way I did, your "experiences" not withstanding.
I stated earlier that $15 would cause more problems and just push the problem under the rug essentially but $8.00 an hour is just WAY too low too. I am thinking $10 might be helpful right now until the real problem with our dollar and jobs can be resolved. I am SURE The Donald will fix all of that for us!
IDK if Trump will fix the problem or just talk about it but at very least he is talking about the problem in terms every day people can understand, Hillary does not want to talk about this at all and for good reason, her hubby pandered to wall street as Hillary herself does and wall street does not like anything but increased profits. easy way to drastically increase profits is to greatly reduce labor costs and more and more wall Street achieves this by out sourcing jobs to other countries and shipping the finished good back to this country for sale at a lower unit price that yields higher profits and more volumn sold to American buyers that have jobs.
We are happy a shirt costs $3 dollars less at Wal-mart but it would be easier to pay for that shirt and pay more for it if you are actually employed. Have you driven by any old textile mills in the south lately?
Ok. So they struggle. Life is not meant to be without struggle. Some have it worse than others. That's life. It's character building. But I see why there is less character now than in previous times - because people are so afraid of "struggle".
I admittedly don't have the answer for those that are mentally handicapped. That's a special circumstance.
And it is supposed to be the struggle when you work on minimum wage. It's supposed to be a motivator to better yourself.
I find it almost impossible to believe that your community doesn't have a private NPO where you can seek assistance. I'm sorry for your daughter's situation.
No one has a right to all of that though. There is a reason it says pursuit of happiness instead of just happiness. I know it's harsh to say (and I can relate to it all), but that's the truth. I don't understand why people think it is a right to have certain things. Medicare/Medicaid hasn't been around forever. Before it was around people weren't dying in the streets. People were surviving without social security. Before all of that, people and churches would help other people if they needed it. That still happens now, but not as much because of "entitlements." That's another discussion that could be it's own thread, so I'll just stop right there on that subject.
Exactly. These smart, more mature folks chick is talking about are the ones I wouldn't be so concerned about anyway. Usually they are smart enough to realize how to cut out unnecessary expenses while finding ways to reduce others. I have personal experiences with them too. For example I knew a guy who worked within walking distance to the campus so as to eliminate the need for a car. So he didn't pay for the insurance and cost of owning a vehicle. Since his dad bought him a "beater" there was no car payment, and honestly, when you are in school, maybe not getting into a car loan is the best thing anyway. He's a dentist now. And he is awesome with cars too!
In 1995, I started living on my own in Louisville and took a job making slightly more than minimum wage. I got a shitty little 400 square foot apartment on the 2nd floor of a run-down two-story complex for $300 a month. It had no dishwasher and the A/C unit ran constantly in the summer because it could never cool the place down. I couldn't afford car payments (or gas, or insurance, or maintenance, or property taxes) so I either rode the bus or rode my bike everywhere. I couldn't afford to eat out and didn't have much of a social life either. I had no health insurance. It was tough.
I worked that job for about a year, during which I managed to pay down about $1200 in credit card bills I had accumulated after college. In my spare time, I taught myself how to type and 10-key by touch. On weekends, I spent hours in the bookstore reading about how to use Microsoft Word and Excel (I couldn't afford to buy the software or even the books). So when I walked into the temp agency looking for a better job, I got one right away. That job allowed me, years later, to start taking accounting classes at the local community college at night and eventually get into grad school so I could get an accounting degree.
I did all this on my own without support from parents, the government, or anybody else (although I did need student loans for grad school). It was a long road and it was a lot of work. The end.
I worked that job for about a year, during which I managed to pay down about $1200 in credit card bills I had accumulated after college. In my spare time, I taught myself how to type and 10-key by touch. On weekends, I spent hours in the bookstore reading about how to use Microsoft Word and Excel (I couldn't afford to buy the software or even the books). So when I walked into the temp agency looking for a better job, I got one right away. That job allowed me, years later, to start taking accounting classes at the local community college at night and eventually get into grad school so I could get an accounting degree.
I did all this on my own without support from parents, the government, or anybody else (although I did need student loans for grad school). It was a long road and it was a lot of work. The end.
Struggle as in "I can't afford anything but Ramen Noodles this week" is one thing, but struggling to keep the heat on or pay the rent or have a busted tire and not have $80 to get it fixed, things like that. never mind... I'm talking to trump's wall! geez I'm getting back to work now while I still have this wonderful job... yeah, the government is changing sh*t up again and eventually they will take this great job from me and I will be needing food stamps!
and I have not checked the validity of the meme below BUT what if it is actually true???? you're "mitching" about less than 40.00 a year! smh that is A-hole status for sure!
I wish I could like that poast a million times. That's a clinic on how to travel a tough road and make it not suck as bad as it could.
How much should every American that makes $50k a year have to pay into food stamps? Keeping in mind the other welfare programs he still is paying for.Struggle as in "I can't afford anything but Ramen Noodles this week" is one thing, but struggling to keep the heat on or pay the rent or have a busted tire and not have $80 to get it fixed, things like that. never mind... I'm talking to trump's wall! geez I'm getting back to work now while I still have this wonderful job... yeah, the government is changing sh*t up again and eventually they will take this great job from me and I will be needing food stamps!
and I have not checked the validity of the meme below BUT what if it is actually true???? you're "mitching" about less than 40.00 a year! smh that is A-hole status for sure!
Yep lol. That meme is CLASSIC Liberal. Dance around a ton of other facts and go straight for the "tug on the heart strings" angle.
Do not get me started on Food Stamps. You can buy fuggin Red Bull on food stamps and in some states you can use the damn thing like a credit card. Food stamps should cover the following and NOTHING more:
- bottles of water
- milk
- orange juice
- fruit
- bread
- lettuce
- cheese
- chicken breasts
- peanut butter and jelly
- eggs
That's it. Not Red Bull, not Cliff Bars, not potato chips, none of that. Also, LOL that they changed the name because "food stamps" sounded too offensive.
I completely agree on the abuses of the system that you all are talking about BUT it is not all that way. I wish it were sometimes, because then it would be so easy for even myself to say screw you people, you are on your damn own, feed yourself BUT I unfortunately know and know OF too many who are not that way... veterans, elderly, single moms who work A LOT and still cannot swing it and they are not abusing the system..... I'm wasting my time.... I forgot. I don't mind paying to help those that need help.
I guess I am just a sucker... if someone is in line at a store in front of me and does not have enough money or their card is rejected... I just buy it for them. I am blessed and I don't forget it. I know what it is like to raise two kids without child support and struggle because my ex-husband who makes 100K+ a year got mad at me for leaving him so he took it out on the kids. He beat the sh*t out of me and I was not about to risk him doing that to my babies. He never, ever paid one damn cent and our life was hard even with the help of my wonderful family and yes, I survived it, but I also see others who have it much, much worse than I even thought of a human being having to deal with and I just don't mind helping them. Sorry. I am just not an a-hole about those things... I am, however, when it comes to other things so don't worry!
Maybe some people need that $36.50 for their own family. $50,000 doesn't go far in NYC. Or maybe I could donate $36.50 a year to a non profit. I guarantee you that would be put to better use than giving it to the government to mostly pay for the cost of government instead of actual food stamps.
The food stamp money comes from somewhere so if $36 is not going towards it, where are they getting it then? that made no sense! ???
Or.......if you didn't tax the shit out of people, maybe then they would DONATE more money to charities such as community food banks which, wait for it, give food to the needy.
He is referring to the overall welfare burden of the taxpayer. There is more than 36.50 that goes into that part of the tax for someone who makes 50k.
I know if I was making 50k a year and was made to spend 100 or more a year on what I consider welfare programs then the first place I will choose to pull back from if it comes to that will be the organizations you mentioned. Too bad for them I guess.
I am sure there is. I'd love to know how much exactly. Is there a website that is not one of those right and left stupid sites that would show me? I'd really like to know the truth of where all that money I just sent them went.
Great job on working through the tough times, I commend you on the hard work put in. I also assume there's some lazy bum out there that also commends you on the hard work you put in, so that he can reap the benefits of the taxes you now pay in, so that he doesn't have to put the hard work in himself.
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