Our 1 dimensional offense

[WoadBlue]

TOS has an article that gets at the numbers. Yes, we had high numbers generally, but they were due to the large number of plays - most in the ACC. Of ACC teams, we were only 7th in yards per pay and 8th in points per play.

That is exactly middle of the league. Our offense was actually mediocre. That is due to the fact that it was predictable: QB runs.

When the QB runs the ball far more than any RB, your offense is in trouble. It is far too easy for Ds to allow that to happen until they need to cut it off. It means Ds can relax much of the game, not having to worry about passing yards or RB yards - just contain the QB's running.

Long term, it means that your passing game cannot be developed and that tyoiur RBs never get the carries they need.

And Williams as backyard superstar who cannot be questioned? His 6.21 yards per play ranked 87th nationally, 62nd among QBs.

Long term, meaning even by game 3 in 2015, our offense must develop our WRs and RBs, which requires using them much more. And that means that Williams cannot run the ball over and over. And if Williams does not run tne ball over and over, and does not signifricantly improve in the passing game - he is a liability. Even with stats that seem gaudy. Because those gaudy stats are largely meaningless and, worse, are acquired at the expense of our WR and RB development.

 

[UNC_Blue]

Originally posted by WoadBlue:
TOS has an article that gets at the numbers. Yes, we had high numbers generally, but they were due to the large number of plays - most in the ACC. Of ACC teams, we were only 7th in yards per pay and 8th in points per play.

That is exactly middle of the league. Our offense was actually mediocre. That is due to the fact that it was predictable: QB runs.

When the QB runs the ball far more than any RB, your offense is in trouble. It is far too easy for Ds to allow that to happen until they need to cut it off. It means Ds can relax much of the game, not having to worry about passing yards or RB yards - just contain the QB's running.

Long term, it means that your passing game cannot be developed and that tyoiur RBs never get the carries they need.

And Williams as backyard superstar who cannot be questioned? His 6.21 yards per play ranked 87th nationally, 62nd among QBs.

Long term, meaning even by game 3 in 2015, our offense must develop our WRs and RBs, which requires using them much more. And that means that Williams cannot run the ball over and over. And if Williams does not run tne ball over and over, and does not signifricantly improve in the passing game - he is a liability. Even with stats that seem gaudy. Because those gaudy stats are largely meaningless and, worse, are acquired at the expense of our WR and RB development.

 

[Raising Heel]

Read the third post in the thread for that article, Woad. That's me under a different screen name (I hardly post there ever). Our offense was top 20 nationally and 2nd to only GT in the ACC before we phoned in the last two games.

That said, there's validity to your criticisms. Although Williams was a key component of the offense, he needs to continue his development if we're going to reach full offense efficiency and consistency. I'd be willing to bet that well less than half of his carries were by design. He needs to do a better job reading defenses and going through his progressions before looking to run.

And obviously, we need to do a better job establishing a traditional rushing attack. Logan is so, so good with the ball in his hands. The O line needs to improve and Littrell has to commit to running the ball.

 

[TarHeelNation11]

Originally posted by Raising Heel:

That said, there's validity to your criticisms. Although Williams was a key component of the offense, he needs to continue his development if we're going to reach full offense efficiency and consistency. I'd be willing to bet that well less than half of his carries were by design. He needs to do a better job reading defenses and going through his progressions before looking to run.

And obviously, we need to do a better job establishing a traditional rushing attack. Logan is so, so good with the ball in his hands. The O line needs to improve and Littrell has to commit to running the ball.

Yep.

UNC_Blue, I know Woad harps on this alot, but he isn't wrong IMO. Offense needs to step up more. At times, the offense was just flat-out bad when we just needed it to be average (NCSU, VT). Hard to tell if it was awful play-calling or bad QB decisions at times, but BOTH need to improve significantly next season. Inexcusable to fail so many times to get the ball to playmakers not wearing #12

 

[UNC_Blue]

Originally posted by TarHeelNation11:

Originally posted by Raising Heel:

That said, there's validity to your criticisms. Although Williams was a key component of the offense, he needs to continue his development if we're going to reach full offense efficiency and consistency. I'd be willing to bet that well less than half of his carries were by design. He needs to do a better job reading defenses and going through his progressions before looking to run.

And obviously, we need to do a better job establishing a traditional rushing attack. Logan is so, so good with the ball in his hands. The O line needs to improve and Littrell has to commit to running the ball.

Yep.

UNC_Blue, I know Woad harps on this alot, but he isn't wrong IMO. Offense needs to step up more. At times, the offense was just flat-out bad when we just needed it to be average (NCSU, VT). Hard to tell if it was awful play-calling or bad QB decisions at times, but BOTH need to improve significantly next season. Inexcusable to fail so many times to get the ball to playmakers not wearing #12

Go look at the numbers Raising Heel is talking about. Our offense was pretty good before the last two games. That means the anomalies were the last two, not the first eleven.

The VT game... Let's look at the problems, we were down THREE starting O-linemen, started 2 true frosh and a rs frosh in their place.. and even had a true frosh playing RT, when he hadn't even practice there. That is how thin we were.

Now, Williams had a tweeked ankle as well, AND we were still doing the idiotic QB rotation. Remember Trubisky coming in and throwing the immediate pick 6?

This post was edited on 1/9 1:26 PM by UNC_Blue

 

[TarHeelNation11]

Originally posted by UNC_Blue:

Originally posted by TarHeelNation11:

Originally posted by Raising Heel:

That said, there's validity to your criticisms. Although Williams was a key component of the offense, he needs to continue his development if we're going to reach full offense efficiency and consistency. I'd be willing to bet that well less than half of his carries were by design. He needs to do a better job reading defenses and going through his progressions before looking to run.

And obviously, we need to do a better job establishing a traditional rushing attack. Logan is so, so good with the ball in his hands. The O line needs to improve and Littrell has to commit to running the ball.

Yep.

UNC_Blue, I know Woad harps on this alot, but he isn't wrong IMO. Offense needs to step up more. At times, the offense was just flat-out bad when we just needed it to be average (NCSU, VT). Hard to tell if it was awful play-calling or bad QB decisions at times, but BOTH need to improve significantly next season. Inexcusable to fail so many times to get the ball to playmakers not wearing #12

Go look at the numbers Raising Heel is talking about. Our offense was pretty good before the last two games. That means the anomalies were the last two, not the first eleven.

The VT game... Let's look at the problems, we were down THREE starting O-linemen, started 2 true frosh and a rs frosh in their place.. and even had a true frosh playing RT, when he hadn't even practice there. That is how thin we were.

Now, Williams had a tweeked ankle as well, AND we were still doing the idiotic QB rotation. Remember Trubisky coming in and throwing the immediate pick 6?

This post was edited on 1/9 1:26 PM by UNC_Blue

I'm aware of all the factors you pointed out. I'm also aware of the statistics. I'm also aware of the tempo we play at which will pad the numbers a bit (but we still have to put the ball in the endzone obviously). I'm also aware that our defense was horrific, thus necessitating the need for our offense to be dominant in order to win the games. That's unfair on the offense, but life is unfair.

Additionally, none of the factors outlined above played a part in the NCSU and the Rutgers game. Yes, Marquise got hurt later on in the Moo game, but the offense was already nonexistent before that. And the Rutgers game was just plain ugly.

Did the offense play bad A LOT of the time? No. But the several points during the season when it did play poorly, their was a common theme as to why:

- failure to establish a traditional (i.e. RBs) running game
- failure to throw the ball even somewhat vertically (i.e. 9+ yard passes)
- failure to convert first downs / sustain drives (lots of 3 and outs)
- failure to call plays and/or execute plays designed to beat the blitz pressure that our young O-Line couldn't cope with
- failure of the QB to accurately hit an open target.

 

[SeaHawk98]

The offense is the reason I no longer have any faith in Fedora and I see next year being his last. That is supposed to be his bread and butter, but honestly, it was terrible a lot of the season and so inconsistent. The last thing you want when you have a terrible defense is to quick drives and put them back on the field. We had a great number of outstanding running backs, but they were not utilized during the year. If I am Hood or Logan, I leave UNC. They can be superstars elsewhere. They are under utilized at UNC and not shown their full potential. The offense tries to get too cute sometimes. Just move the damn ball. MW was great at running most of the time but over time the defense will catch on and MW will get beat up and then can't throw. Look at the last two games of the year. There was no originality or creativity this year.

 

[ball4me2]

Woad what you/the article are suggesting is correct, but most don't see anything but the results of the one person. The best QB's (similar to a point guard) make the players around them better.

The stats of our RB's, WR's and TE's this year do not reveal anything very good and maybe not even average, which indicates our point guard did not make the players around him better.

IF anyone is really interested in our offense in REAL terms they should look at the amount of games we were getting "waxed" through the first 2 or 3 quarters. IF the game is out of reach (in general terms) and the defense goes into a prevent or somewhat relaxed mode . . . then we start moving the ball and even scoring some points . . . it does not mean our offense is good . . . only the other teams defense has loosened up and began going deeper in their depth charts. Then there is the last 2 games when our opponents wanted to kick our butts all over the field . . . because they like us

And TarHeel Nation, Seahawk, Raising Heel and UNC Blue you've made some excellent points, as well.

 

[franklin street]

golly woad, what do you think we should do?

 

[uncboy10]

He threw for the 2nd most yards of any QB in the ACC. Don't know how you can throw it without someone to catch it. Also, a lot of the times he ran the ball it was a called pass play with broken protection and he made something out of nothing, which is not really a valid reason to criticize a player. Neither is playcalling, if you have a problem with the QB draw that problem should be directed at Fed/Littrell.

If Marquise improves as much this off season as he did last summer he'll be the offensive POY in the ACC next year. He's gotta get more accurate throwing the ball, but the o-line also needs to be much improved to give him better protection. The o-line being much improved will also help with getting Logan, Hood and co. their yards. Having a dangerous running game makes the quick throws much more effective and gives the WR's space to work with.

If Marquise is the problem we have made a ton of progress on offense.

 

[plm]

MW has to improve on his accuracy on the wide open easy throws. Our offense is about getting first downs and keeping the tempo up and wearing out the defense. Too many times MW misses wide open receivers to keep the chains moving and we r three and out. Sure he can be electric with the big plays or for a couple of series but we need more consistency

 

[TarHeelNation11]

^^

Exactly. He needs to be more consistent. His highs are HIGH, and he is incredibly good when he's on, but his lows can be pretty low and the offense stalls horribly. In particular, the 8-12 yard passes over the middle seem to be the ones he struggles most with. On deep balls and sideline routes, he's usually pretty accurate.

Look, I know it's nitpicking because Marquise is a darn good player and competitor, but he needs to continue to improve so we can maintain consistency. Now, hopefully the defense improves slightly so that the offense is afforded the luxury of having a few bad drives per game without the game quickly getting out of reach. The pressure on the offense to score virtually every possession was very unfair and probably affected #12 and the rest of the offense in a negative way

 

[JimmyinVA]

Originally posted by TarHeelNation11:
^^

... I know it's nitpicking because Marquise is a darn good player and competitor, but he needs to continue to improve so we can maintain consistency....

i don't think it's nitpicking to expect consistency from your quarterback. in fact, it's one of the most important qualities you want for that position. being dependable (i.e. consistent) is a big part of leadership.

 

[TarHeelNation11]

Originally posted by JimmyinVA:

Originally posted by TarHeelNation11:
^^

... I know it's nitpicking because Marquise is a darn good player and competitor, but he needs to continue to improve so we can maintain consistency....

i don't think it's nitpicking to expect consistency from your quarterback. in fact, it's one of the most important qualities you want for that position. being dependable (i.e. consistent) is a big part of leadership.

Agreed. It isn't nitpicking, I was just softening the blow before I typed the criticism haha.

 

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

Jeez, the football and basketball boards are night and day. I wish Woad would take a trip over to the bball board and have some back and forth with some of the guys over there. It might bring both to an equilibrium.

Football board: a lot of people pointing out flaws in the team and being overly pessimistic about the possibility of turning it around.
Basketball board: a lot of people throwing around somewhat undeserved praise, being overly optimistic, and ready to lynch anyone that suggests that Roy is anything less than God incarnated.

Maybe I need to go hit up the baseball board more often to get a more even keel

This post was edited on 1/16 2:12 PM by Hark_The_Sound_2010

 

[TarHeelNation11]

Originally posted by Hark_The_Sound_2010:
Jeez, the football and basketball boards are night and day. I wish Woad would take a trip over to the bball board and have some back and forth with some of the guys over there. It might bring both to an equilibrium.

Football board: a lot of people pointing out flaws in the team and being overly pessimistic about the possibility of turning it around.
Basketball board: a lot of people throwing around somewhat undeserved praise, being overly optimistic, and ready to lynch anyone that suggests that Roy is anything less than God incarnated.

Maybe I need to go hit up the baseball board more often to get a more even keel

This post was edited on 1/16 2:12 PM by Hark_The_Sound_2010

I agree at your overall description of Radar and Blitz

.....especially the part I underlined above.

I will say though, that you should try out the premium football board, if you have the means. The outlook on Blue Heaven is much more positive than on Tar Heel Blitz (in general, but especially right now). I can't give anything away, but certain things are happening / about to happen

 

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

Originally posted by TarHeelNation11:

I will say though, that you should try out the premium football board, if you have the means. The outlook on Blue Heaven is much more positive than on Tar Heel Blitz (in general, but especially right now). I can't give anything away, but certain things are happening / about to happen

Hmmm, the premium board is intriguing. I've vaguely considered it in the past, but may give it a more serious look now. I do like being privy to inside info

 

[Raising Heel]

Originally posted by Hark_The_Sound_2010:

Hmmm, the premium board is intriguing. I've vaguely considered it in the past, but may give it a more serious look now. I do like being privy to inside info

I originally bought a membership for the info. I've kept it because of the posters. It's a much more even keel there. Also, the outlooks on the FB and BB programs have a lot to due with their relative success.

By the way, baseball season starts in a month. Come on over!