TarHeelIllustrated - Daily Drop: Could UNC Play 5 Out Next Season?
As North Carolina continues its quest to land another big forward in the transfer portal, one interesting question has
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Daily Drop: Could UNC Play 5 Out Next Season?
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Oh dear Lord. There is a reason that I and others (including some former players) referred to that nonsense as the Unfortunate Offensive Experiment when we tried it 2 seasons ago.
TarHeelIllustrated - Daily Drop: Could UNC Play 5 Out Next Season?
As North Carolina continues its quest to land another big forward in the transfer portal, one interesting question has
Even if we rolled with the current roster as it stands, there would be no good reason for that. Please don't even risk speaking that into existence.
Depends on the final personnel, a big part of a coaches job is to put thier players in the best position to succeed with their skill sets. Some very successful teams use 5 out really well. I would be surprised if we don't see some of it as the roster is currently configured, but not exclusively. Plenty of time for additions though, Hubert has a task ahead in any event to find the best combinations.
With TWO consistent outside shooters in RJ and Tyson (if you want to add Jalen then say two and a half) - I hope not. Gonna be an interesting year for Coach Davis - he has shown what he can do when he the roster/talent to play how he wants. When he doesn't, well he has not shown that he can adapt that well.
It depends on what the 5-out offensive plays/motion is. UConn ran 5-out sets with Clingan and ran it with ruthless efficiency. But UConn also has the most intricate half-court offense in the country and that's a reason why they play at such a slow half-court pace. BYU played a 5-out offense and had a really efficient offense without spectacular talent (they just had a ton of shooting).
It all depends on what you're actually running from your base offense. I'll say this though... You typically need a really mobile and skilled 5 to run 5-out because your big is going to have a ton of responsibility. I would argue he has more responsibility playing 5-out than being in the paint. I'm not sure that fits Jalen's skillset.
But to completely dismiss this because we ran 5-out with a regressing Caleb Love, a 0 threat Leaky Black, a relative 0 threat Pete Nance, and a traditional 5 in Bacot is silly. That was a bad job by Hubert and also, the offense was very basic and not intricate at all.
The 5-out can absolutely work, but like any offensive system, it needs to be layered, intricate, and have counter-action. And it needs to fit your players. For me, Cadeau and Washington are not 5-out players. Cadeau needs the ball in his hands because his best asset is passing. You can't pass without the ball in your hands. And I don't think you can run your entire offense through Washington like other 5-out offenses can.
It all depends on what you're actually running from your base offense. I'll say this though... You typically need a really mobile and skilled 5 to run 5-out because your big is going to have a ton of responsibility. I would argue he has more responsibility playing 5-out than being in the paint. I'm not sure that fits Jalen's skillset.
But to completely dismiss this because we ran 5-out with a regressing Caleb Love, a 0 threat Leaky Black, a relative 0 threat Pete Nance, and a traditional 5 in Bacot is silly. That was a bad job by Hubert and also, the offense was very basic and not intricate at all.
The 5-out can absolutely work, but like any offensive system, it needs to be layered, intricate, and have counter-action. And it needs to fit your players. For me, Cadeau and Washington are not 5-out players. Cadeau needs the ball in his hands because his best asset is passing. You can't pass without the ball in your hands. And I don't think you can run your entire offense through Washington like other 5-out offenses can.
Fortunately, I'm told that nonsense is not under consideration here... and hopefully that will remain the case.
There is a difference between running that 5 out offense and having your 5 man shoot from outside on occasion. I am not a fan of a 5 out look for college teams because college teams don't often have the players that fit it. You must have 5 solid jump shooters from distance that have the ability to defend on the other end. When we tried to run it with that team we had 2 weak outside shooters in Leaky and Bacot, one sketchy one in Nance and RJ & Caleb that could shoot. Well of course teams were going to release Bacot and Leaky, many times Nance as well to shoot all they wanted and keep their defenders in great rebound position.
Make no mistake, I am all about Jalen taking jumpers, I want to see a MINIMUM of 3treys attempts from Jalen every game and at times more. Jalen sets the high screen, takes a step as if he is rolling down but peals back as RJ cuts under and both defenders naturally follow RJ as Jalen peals back for the hook pass and wide open look, we ran that couple times and Jalen splashed it both times for treys. Darn right I am using that action, rinse and repeat until they adjust. But because my 5 man has stepped out to the 3pt arch does not and should not mean his mates are also out there.
WE just don't have the shooters to try a 5 out look, how can we when Cadeau, Seth, JWit, maybe a Lubin, High are on the floor? RJ, Tyson, and Jalen are really our only real outside shooting threats, that means there will most all ties be 2 weak shooters that defenses will dare to shoot, whose defenders can back to the paint and have great rebounding position?
Make no mistake, I am all about Jalen taking jumpers, I want to see a MINIMUM of 3treys attempts from Jalen every game and at times more. Jalen sets the high screen, takes a step as if he is rolling down but peals back as RJ cuts under and both defenders naturally follow RJ as Jalen peals back for the hook pass and wide open look, we ran that couple times and Jalen splashed it both times for treys. Darn right I am using that action, rinse and repeat until they adjust. But because my 5 man has stepped out to the 3pt arch does not and should not mean his mates are also out there.
WE just don't have the shooters to try a 5 out look, how can we when Cadeau, Seth, JWit, maybe a Lubin, High are on the floor? RJ, Tyson, and Jalen are really our only real outside shooting threats, that means there will most all ties be 2 weak shooters that defenses will dare to shoot, whose defenders can back to the paint and have great rebounding position?
I don't really like the 5 out look either. I am more hopeful though that EC and Seth will prove not to be "weak" shooters by next season. I saw strides with Seth already and I believe both suffer from confidence more than any other reason! Get in the gym boys!
TP, I believe shooting is 60% confidence, 30% shot selection, and 10% form. That 60% confidence is a beast to handle and it isn't always that a kid is not confident in taking the shot, some times it is to much confidence. Seth and Cadeau lack confidence in their shooting, you see a wide open kid hesitate just before the shot or turn down wide open shots, sure sign of a lack of confidence. On the other hand I watched to many times JWit seem to have to much confidence in his shot that lead to some poor decisions as to when to shoot it (aka shot selection). You work with a kid in his form but kids tend to revert back to bad habits in a game, they go back to the lowest common denominator under pressure, hard to replicate that in the practice gym.
You can work with a kid and he can get better but it isn't often you see a weak shooter become a great shooter, even a reliable shooter, most often a weak shooter will remain a weak shooter but over time can become not as weak. The not as weak is what I am hoping for from those guys.
The more positive spin on "not as weak" is "respectable"! It is a shade more, but it is enough to keep the D honest! If the D is honest and has to pay attention to our entire unit, peeps like Seth, EC, and JWash will thrive! It opens up driving lanes for peeps like Capt. EC, Seth, RJ, JWit, and others. I bet that at least Seth and EC become more than merely respectable shooters too. I don't think either Seth or EC is a typical player, so I don't expect typical progression!
Is it the chicken or the egg? Seth and Cadeau need to have some confidence in their shot. In the Bama game even after knocking down "dare you" looks, both were hesitant when having looks afterwards. They have to believe outside of games in their shooting work, but until it translates to this is a good look to create in game, do they really believe?
I think Cadeau's stroke looks more likely to find a comfort zone. I struggle to recall Seth ever looking to create an in rhythm look from outside. Only afterthought gotta take this one predicated on low clock or dee disrespect. Without one being able to attack a 3, they have a hard time being on the court together.
I think Cadeau's stroke looks more likely to find a comfort zone. I struggle to recall Seth ever looking to create an in rhythm look from outside. Only afterthought gotta take this one predicated on low clock or dee disrespect. Without one being able to attack a 3, they have a hard time being on the court together.
Yeah, I think the not as weak should more be the expectations, that should be enough to achieve what we need. You have to shoot enough that defenders must stay near you and not able to either go double someone else or play you exclusive to drive but not get close enough that you can drive around them.
Now I would suggest that Seth's jump shooting was vastly improved from his freshman season, another increase to that extent would be amazing. Cadeau, if his shooting can uptick like Seth's from freshman to soph then we may be cookin with gas as we say!
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