Do we still have a "system"?

[NorCalTarheel]

The narrative for a long time has been that it takes a while for a point guard in the Carolina system to get up to speed. I'm wondering with Elliot Cadeau, Ian Jackson and possibly Boogie Fland a year removed (minus reclass), if we find a point guard in the portal to run the show for one year. Conventional knowledge says that does not work because of how complex Carolina system is. The offense I've seen in the last two years makes me wonder if we even have a system anymore and if a pass first facilitator from the portal would not make a world of difference with next year's team.

Thoughts?

 

[Tarheelsman71]

We have plenty of people to bring the ball up....we need people that can freaking shoot and MAKE the shot. Period. We get good looks and miss. We do DUMB stuff (insert any of Loves stupid airball layups here) and take dumb shots and miss them. Our big misses 1ft shots. DUNK the freaking ball. Quit trying to put it back as you are falling back to earth.

 

[NorCalTarheel]

We have plenty of people to bring the ball up....we need people that can freaking shoot and MAKE the shot. Period. We get good looks and miss. We do DUMB stuff (insert any of Loves stupid airball layups here) and take dumb shots and miss them. Our big misses 1ft shots. DUNK the freaking ball. Quit trying to put it back as you are falling back to earth.

I tend to agree with you. We could have a hybrid of cota/ butter/ Lawson running the point and if we don't have shooters to pass to, it's not going to make much difference.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

This thread looks worth a bump.

What sort of "system" do we think we'll see this coming season - with and without Cadeau?

We're counting on more reliable outside shooting. Which obviously makes a lot of other things easier. But assuming we get at least a modest bump in 3pt shooting, what will our "system" look like?

 

[superstar57]

This thread looks worth a bump.

What sort of "system" do we think we'll see this coming season - with and without Cadeau?

We're counting on more reliable outside shooting. Which obviously makes a lot of other things easier. But assuming we get at least a modest bump in 3pt shooting, what will our "system" look like?

With Cadeau, it appears if you would want to go old school. Forward and center down low. Wing and Guard jacking threes, and Cadeau orchestrating where the ball should go.

Without, more of an emphasis on playing fast and pushing the ball, getting a quicker shot before defense sets.

 

[al would]

The "system" is dependent on the coach. At this point I'm not sure what UNC's direction is TBH,

 

[Mrs.Jeans15]

Hell no.

 

[NorCalTarheel]

The UNC "system" used to be reliant on the primary and secondary break putting pressure on opposing defenses and required discipline. Everyone had to know where to go, RUN to their spots, pass ahead rather that dribble, etc. That style, when run properly, not on put pressure on the other team, it relieved pressure on our offense to make every shot because the points were coming. I haven't seen it yet in Hubert's tenure. I hope to see it again but, for as much as I love him, isn't in RJ's DNA. It IS in EC's!!!

As silly as it seems, we have also gotten away from "pointing to the passer" to acknowledge the player who set up the made basket and I miss it! I always loved how Carolina was always about "we not me". That doesn't seem as prevalent now either. 😔. Hope it returns.

Go Heels!!!

 

[Archer2]

The UNC "system" used to be reliant on the primary and secondary break putting pressure on opposing defenses and required discipline. Everyone had to know where to go, RUN to their spots, pass ahead rather that dribble, etc. That style, when run properly, not on put pressure on the other team, it relieved pressure on our offense to make every shot because the points were coming. I haven't seen it yet in Hubert's tenure. I hope to see it again but, for as much as I love him, isn't in RJ's DNA. It IS in EC's!!!

As silly as it seems, we have also gotten away from "pointing to the passer" to acknowledge the player who set up the made basket and I miss it! I always loved how Carolina was always about "we not me". That doesn't seem as prevalent now either. 😔. Hope it returns.

Go Heels!!!

It’s much easier to score against a defense that is scrambling to get back vs one that is set. And for goodness sake Hubert, bring that point to the passer back. It epitomizes team basketball mentality, something this year’s team lacked.

 

[Mrs.Jeans15]

It’s much easier to score against a defense that is scrambling to get back vs one that is set. And for goodness sake Hubert, bring that point to the passer back. It epitomizes team basketball mentality, something this year’s team lacked.

It's like we invited playing against half court defense.

 

[ChiShankCity]

The "system" is dependent on the coach. At this point I'm not sure what UNC's direction is TBH,

The UNC "system" used to be reliant on the primary and secondary break putting pressure on opposing defenses and required discipline. Everyone had to know where to go, RUN to their spots, pass ahead rather that dribble, etc. That style, when run properly, not on put pressure on the other team, it relieved pressure on our offense to make every shot because the points were coming. I haven't seen it yet in Hubert's tenure. I hope to see it again but, for as much as I love him, isn't in RJ's DNA. It IS in EC's!!!

As silly as it seems, we have also gotten away from "pointing to the passer" to acknowledge the player who set up the made basket and I miss it! I always loved how Carolina was always about "we not me". That doesn't seem as prevalent now either. 😔. Hope it returns.

Go Heels!!!

Any system is dependent on having great players. You can argue whether it's more important to have the most talented players or players that fit the best. Obviously a combination of the two is most ideal.

Roy's system looked really good when he had an NBA/all conference level PG, an NBA wing, an NBA/all conference level big guy. Roy's system looked really bad when LD2 was at the PG, when Will Graves was the wing. Roy's system looked pretty bad when James Michael McAdoo/Desmond Hubert/Joel James was his big man rotation before he went small with PJ Hairston. Roy's system looked really bad when Cole Anthony got hurt and Leaky Black was getting time at PG. And Roy's system looked pretty bad when Caleb Love was his PG and he started Garrison Brooks ahead of 2 NBA big guys.

And I think it's pretty clear what direction Hubert wants his offense to go to. Whether people accept it is another question. It can definitely be successful, but he needs to find the best players to fit into his system... Just like Roy.

Any system can work. The archaic princeton offense that Georgetown ran worked when they had 2 skilled NBA guys running it. Wisconsin's archaic flex offense got them to the national title game and they had 2 first round picks. Not a single person on this message board would be in favor of adopting those 2 offensive styles, yet both have reached Final Fours in the past.

Get better players. Get better players who fit your system. Your system will look great and everyone will romanticize about it generations later.

 

[al would]

Any system is dependent on having great players.

Not really. They are neither mutually inclusive or exclusive. There are a lot of successful teams in the NCAA/ACC that do not have really great or NBA level talent yet still have a system that consistently produces successful seasons. UVA is a prime example.

 

[ChiShankCity]

Not really. They are neither mutually inclusive or exclusive. There are a lot of successful teams in the NCAA/ACC that do not have really great or NBA level talent yet still have a system that consistently produces successful seasons. UVA is a prime example.

During Tony Bennett's best run at UVA he had: Justin Anderson, Joe Harris, Malcolm Brogdon, Kyle Guy, Ty Jerome, DeAndre Hunter. All of those guys played in the NBA. Three of those guys signed contracts making them worth 8 figures per year.

If you think that's all system and coaching development, then I'll disagree slightly. I think you need to be pretty talented to make the NBA to begin with.

However, I may very well be wrong with the changing nature of college basketball. We had no pros last year and made it to the title game. San Diego State probably had no pros and made it that far. So maybe it's a different game now. That remains to be seen. What I do know is the teams that did win it all the last 2 seasons had several pros on their team.

 

[Tarheelsman71]

i think we upgraded our shooting (leaky and Caleb helps). I think we still dont have a guy that will DUNK on you with authority or protect the rim. We have great rebounders (Bacot and Davis). I think with out depth we really need to play 10 deep and RUN, but giving the pickups I think they are better in the half court set. No tyler zellers to throw it to. Our athletes kind of left. I just wonder if if will be possible to ever get that running and running going again. was so fun to watch the other teams struggle to keep up. or try to shut it down.

 

[midline]

No

 

[gauchoheel]

However, I may very well be wrong with the changing nature of college basketball. We had no pros last year and made it to the title game. San Diego State probably had no pros and made it that far. So maybe it's a different game now. That remains to be seen. What I do know is the teams that did win it all the last 2 seasons had several pros on their team.

People should put a lot less weight on NCAAT results when assessing how good a team is. The tournament being single elimination leads to a lot of wacky results that elevates non-great teams. Neither us in 22 nor SDSU this year were great teams, though they were good.

The top 2 teams in Kenpom, which I'm using not because it's perfect but because it's a full season metric that takes into account efficiency and SOS, were Uconn and Houston. They were both great teams with multiple NBA players.

Back when UVA was really good they also had quite a few good NBA players.