What comes next for Carolina basketball?

[gauchoheel]

Tyson was not a big money transfer. RJ turned down better offers from other schools to return to UNC (Jeff Goodman reported a lot of schools tried to lure RJ into the portal.) Bacot was not one of the top 2-3 highest paid players in the country. In fact Bacot got his money the way NIL was originally intended; his agent got him sponsorship deals that made up the majority of his money.

You don't seem to get it. For the past year our NIL collective money has been pitiful. Every UNC sport is feeling it. We didn't land a single big money transfer this summer. We aren't landing a single top 40 recruit in the class of 2025. This isn't about coaching or roster construction. This is about not having the money to get UNC level talent. There isn't a coach in the world who could get Blue Blood level success with midmajor NIL money.

Next season is going to be so, so, so much worse.

Your points seem pretty surface-level Dave:

1. Tyson was not a big money transfer. I used fairly vague wording on this one, but I stand by the point. I'm certain he was expensive. He had 40+ high-major schools contact him, as he shot 47% from three last year. He's making at least a few hundred thousand. Was he Oumar Ballo? No. But he was pretty in demand and we had to beat out a lot of other big schools for what was supposed to be a lights-out shooter. Hasn't worked out.
2. RJ turned down better offers from other schools to return to UNC (Jeff Goodman reported a lot of schools tried to lure RJ into the portal.) The sentence in parenthesis doesn't support your first point. A school "trying to lure RJ" doesn't necessarily mean they made a higher offer. We "tried to lure" Kalkbrenner and Reynaud into the portal too. Might it be the case that some school offered $2.1M while we only offered $2M? Sure, that's possible -- though you haven't shown any evidence for it. But do I think RJ loves UNC so much that he turned down $4M to play here for half that or something similar? Not a chance. Money talks when there's large differences in offers. I'm sure we were at or very near his peak price point.
3. Bacot was not one of the top 2-3 highest paid players in the country. Okay, what was he then? #5? Doesn't change the fact he was extremely highly paid by college basketball standards, and like any human probably would've left if we weren't at least highly competitive with our financial offer. How did we retain him if not paying top dollar?
4. In fact Bacot got his money the way NIL was originally intended; his agent got him sponsorship deals that made up the majority of his money. Frankly, who cares? He was as highly paid as nearly any player in the country in his time here.
5. For the past year our NIL collective money has been pitiful. Every UNC sport is feeling it. We didn't land a single big money transfer this summer. We landed two top 15 HS recruits and another expensive transfer in Tyson. How do you think we did that? Do you really think Jackson loved UNC so much he turned down a much bigger offer from UK? That's where most people presumed he'd go. And you know at this point these guys can decommit at any time right? Why didn't he decommit for a bigger offer in June? Why didn't Cadeau/Davis/Bacot transfer? You don't think anyone "tried to lure" Cadeau into the portal? Get real.
6. There isn't a coach in the world who could get Blue Blood level success with midmajor NIL money. The team as it stands looks like it's not even going to make the tournament. Forget "blue blood success". We're not even looking like we're going to be competitive in a stinky-bad ACC this year.
7. You don't seem to get it.... Next season is going to be so, so, so much worse. Who's denying that? I think Hubert should be fired if we miss the tournament and there's not a major recruiting influx (which it appears there won't be) slated for the summer.

A really good coach would have a team with 3 top 15 recruits and 3 more top 50 players (including one of the most expensive in all of basketball in RJ Davis) in at least the top 10 or 20 teams. We're nowhere near that, because the roster is really poorly assembled, with almost no frontcourt whatsoever. That's clear as day to me. This is an expensive roster, even if there's a handful of schools spending significantly more. With a more balanced group and better coaching they'd be much better.

 

[Point2Passer]

I wouldn't blame every single coach at UNC for leaving for other jobs. If the donors keep refusing to "play the NIL game" they are effectively telling every UNC coach they will never win anything here.

I don’t think you’re wrong that our NIL doesn’t seem to be on par with Duke, KU, Bama, etc.

But I have to ask, with every daily reader on here being fully aware of your NIL thoughts at this point, why do you feel the need to continue making basically the same post 30 times every week? Do you think that will make something change? Do you think there are lots of millionaires reading on here that will change their minds because of your posts?

Would dialing the NIL rhetoric back a bit kill you? I’d prefer not putting you on ignore because I do often appreciate your perspectives.

 

[tarheels0015]

If HD & or UNC would allow the buying so called of top players we would be fine & winning & a top 5 team !!

 

[notashelbyfan]

The NIL has put Hubert is desperation mode. He's tried his damnedest to address the huge flaws in our front court. At every turn he's been denied because of our broke NIL. He tried the transfer portal. He even tried to add Halaifonua when he reclassed, but Georgetown's NIL outbid us. He's tried to raise the confidence of the bigs we do have with public praise about them.

He's been put in a terrible situation, as have all the other coaches at UNC. They are being given a midmajor NIL fund and being told to recruit blue blood talent. Our boosters refuse to play the NIL game and think recruits should commit solely because it's an honor to wear a UNC jersey.

Frankly we're lucky RJ, Ian, and Elliot are even on this roster. Tons of teams came at RJ with big offers this summer to lure him into the portal, and he stayed purely out of loyalty. Ian and Elliot had big NIL endorsement deals they signed in high school, so they weren't as tempted when colleges came at them with big NIL offers. They chose to play for the coach they connected best with, Hubert Davis.

The reoccurring theme I've heard for months is that recruits/transfers love Hubert. The only reason we don't have a loaded front court this season and an elite recruiting class for next year is our terrible NIL.

So could you please answer my question do you think he is using what he has to the best they can be used?

 

[strummingram]

I don’t think you’re wrong that our NIL doesn’t seem to be on par with Duke, KU, Bama, etc.

But I have to ask, with every daily reader on here being fully aware of your NIL thoughts at this point, why do you feel the need to continue making basically the same post 30 times every week? Do you think that will make something change? Do you think there are lots of millionaires reading on here that will change their minds because of your posts?

Would dialing the NIL rhetoric back a bit kill you? I’d prefer not putting you on ignore because I do often appreciate your perspectives.

He'd be better off writing these incessant complaints to Michael Jordan, or some other wealthy Tar Heel alumni/ Fans. Go petition Eric Church! Yammering here is wasting time and effort! LOL

 

[strummingram]

So could you please answer my question do you think he is using what he has to the best they can be used?

Hubert Davis was in the NCAA tournament championship game, in the ACC tournament championship game, ACC regular season champions, and a #1 seed, and ACC coach of the year since becoming head coach in 2021. I realize there have been some tragic losses and frustrating stretches, off and on... But, his accomplishments have also been noteworthy. Not to mention the two most important beat downs of dook in rivalry history.

 

[notashelbyfan]

Hubert Davis was in the NCAA tournament championship game, in the ACC tournament championship game, ACC regular season champions, and a #1 seed, and ACC coach of the year since becoming head coach in 2021. I realize there have been some tragic losses and frustrating stretches, off and on... But, his accomplishments have also been noteworthy. Not to mention the two most important beat downs of dook in rivalry history.

I don't want to take away from his accomplishments, at all but we all know the further you get away from your first year you are playing more with what is 100% his. He has been pretty good when he has a big man and a 4 that can stretch but he is yet to show us that he can recruit his own players that can win with his style.

So like I was asking before what are people's thoughts on is he getting the best possible out of the players he has now?

 

[GoNtheDistance]

You are obsessed with NIL to the point of delusion that you refuse to evaluate Hubert's faults. This is just another scapegoat to excuse his inconsistent coaching results. You forget in his first couple of years, our recruiting was pretty decent. Many were even praising him for it. What was the excuse then? NIL doesn't excuse his inability to develop a bench over 4 years.

On paper, we have a better roster than the top 5 teams in the AP 25:

UNC - 2 Five star recruits, 5 Top 50 Players, 7 Top 100 Players,

Kansas - 1 Five star recruit, 6 Top 50 Players, 7 Top 100 Players
Auburn - 0 Five star recruits, 1 Top 50 Player, 2 Top 100 Players
Tennessee - 0 Five star recruits, 0 Top 50 Players, 5 Top 100 Players
Kentucky - 0 Five star recruits, 1 Top 50 Player, 5 Top 100 Players
Marquette - 0 Five star recruits, 0 Top 50 Players, 3 Top 100 Players

IDK what Boosters are thinking, but I wouldn't blame boosters for being stingy and not wanting to blow millions of dollars on one year rentals for a coach who' might not even make the tournament with them. Same with Mack and winning bowl games.

We could have had our pick of elite coaches the first time around if we had a real coaching search. Instead we held a dog and pony show for a guy who clearly wasn't ready. This situation is entirely the fault of Roy, and to a lesser extent Bubba for picking a guy who still needs training wheels 4 years in. The only question is how many more double digit loss seasons we need for people like you to comprehend this.

stop Rose. way too much objectivity in your post. If they actually take a step back they’d run out of excuses for Hubert. by no historical measure is averaging 10 losses a season acceptable at UNC but now with Hubert it is.

 

[strummingram]

I don't want to take away from his accomplishments, at all but we all know the further you get away from your first year you are playing more with what is 100% his. He has been pretty good when he has a big man and a 4 that can stretch but he is yet to show us that he can recruit his own players that can win with his style.

So like I was asking before what are people's thoughts on is he getting the best possible out of the players he has now?

They've played 8 games. They're 4-4... losing 3 to top 10 teams. I'll let you know in a few months. It might get better, it might get worse.

This was never going to be a super dominant team. They didn't get a 5 post player. It's going to be a struggle this season. A lot of coaches struggle without a decent player at the 5 and a stretch 4.

The game against Alabama was bad, but I never expected to win that game when I saw it on the schedule. The only loss that I wasn't expecting was Michigan State.

 

[RoseHeel]

Hubert Davis was in the NCAA tournament championship game, in the ACC tournament championship game, ACC regular season champions, and a #1 seed, and ACC coach of the year since becoming head coach in 2021. I realize there have been some tragic losses and frustrating stretches, off and on... But, his accomplishments have also been noteworthy. Not to mention the two most important beat downs of dook in rivalry history.

with Roy's recruits*

 

[zotfirst]

As long as our NIL stinks, more losses.

“Don’t throw good money after bad”

I can’t help but feel like our NIL issues with Basketball are similar to what AJ said about our NIL issues with football.

If I had a lot of money, I wouldn’t want to invest it into NIL unless I had confidence in the head coach. I have a feeling many boosters don’t have lots of confidence in HD.

 

[RoseHeel]

I have a feeling many boosters don’t have lots of confidence in HD.

This is key.

 

[strummingram]

with Roy's recruits*

Oh, yeah... I forgot... Roy's recruits were programmed to win games no matter who was the coach.

 

[tarheels0015]

Shut the program down for 3 yrs while a new Dome is built .. Hopefully we can save enough NIL $$$$ to buy a new team by 2028 season!!

 

[RoseHeel]

Oh, yeah... I forgot...

You forgot that Roy left him with the #1 Recruiting class in College Basketball, despite the constant griping about not having talent. You also forgot that the top performers on all his teams have been a Roy recruit. You also forgot that the ACC has been bog water since Hubcap took over, which makes the ACC accolades far less impressive.

So yeah, fair to point that out since much of the successes you named lack context or have been off the back of Roy's efforts rather than his own.