Giles injury....
- Thread starter gary-7
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There is no over reaching, 2 major knee injuries one to each knee and still in high school, NBA scouts will already be watching and now absolutely will factor in the injury question. IF, and I say if he does play in college and re-injure either knee again, it will be considered a bad move to have risked it by playing college ball. Would he be better served to play a year in college and take that risk of another injury or sit out and work on strengthening his body and making sure both those knees are as close to 100% as possible? Thing about a knee, kids can come back in a year and play well but it is always more of a 2 yrs deal before they get back as close to 100% as they can get.
Would he take a hit by not playing college ball yeah, would the hit be harder if he got hurt again, absolutely, no great choices for him with minimum risk. if he took the year off and worked out at a place like IMG he would have to show case to the NBA scouts that he is fully recovered and the draft he could enter being 2yrs from now he should be as close to 100% as he will get. Long term IMO he would have less risk by bypassing that one season of college ball.
One of the potential reasons why this knee git hurt is that he could have been placing a bit more weight on that good knee and trying to be careful on the one he first hurt. He may have tried to come back from the first knee injury to soon so maybe he should not make that same mistake again? If he wants to play college ball commit to a school and red shirt that first season and play as a soph.
I, for one, don't like seeing our rival get the #1 player in the country. Maybe that's just me though.
I think the problem is that you're underestimating how much a second ACL injury has already hurt his draft stock. If he doesn't play next season, that would mean he would have spent 3 of the past 4 basketball seasons rehabbing his knees. I just don't think NBA teams are going to go for that -- especially when the rumor mill gets started about the health of his knees -- which is something that always happens. I agree he should be really cautious about coming back early, and definitely should not try to push it just to get back for the start of next season if he's not 100% ready to go. With that said, if he really didn't play next season, I just don't think anyone would roll the dice on him with a high pick. He'd be looking at best at a second half of the first round stock or even worse depending on how it gets spinned. I think we sometimes overestimate how much these NBA draft projections will change. Perry Jones, for instance, was a guy who went from universally being considered a top 3-5 pick to #28 in one season b/c of the the combo of a slightly subpar collegiate career + concerns about the longterm health of his knees. Unfortunately for him, he's going to have to do something to convince teams that the risk is worth it.
While I agree, his not playing as a frosh in college would hit his draft stock, his playing in college and re-injuring one of those knees could devistate his draftability as well as his career as well as long term health. I don't care what school he elects to play for, I would suggest the same if he committed to UNC, that it would be in his best interest if he wants to play college ball to red shirt as a freshman and play his soph season.
Again, working in this field, this is not overly concerning. It's a partial, single tear in the opposite knee. One year? Won't take that long. Keep up the hype though.
One torn ACL is concerning and 2 is 2X concerning. ACL's injuries are much more prevalent in football RB's. A lot of guys are never the same and mentally it is a big weight on his shoulders. Spin it any way you want and I don't give a flip what field you are in some times common sense is all you need.
He shouldn't worry about his NBA draft stock. The Suxers will take him with the first pick and put him on the bench with all their injured other guys that can't play
You obviously skipped where I typed ONE INJURY IN SEPERATE KNEES. IF the injury was to one of the two rebuilt ligaments from before, then YES, his future could have much more doubt. The issue here, however, is that many are forgetting that this is in a different knee, and is only a PARTIAL tear. The long-term success rate of a rebuild is 82-95%, even in high-impact athletes. Giles still has a bright future ahead of him. So, no, there is no spinning here, in fact I believe you are doing the spinning by using your "common sense". That'd be the same as me going into your line of work and making a "common sense guestimation". Yep, that makes sense - let's keep years and years of supporting clinical data out of this (even with athletes making up all or most of the cohort).
And yes, SK, I have worked extensively in the field of medicine. What is the point of your "comeback"? I am not here to flame, rather, I am here to clarify this kids chances of having a normal career in college and beyond.
You do not know if he has a bright future or not it is just speculation knee problems or not so STFU cause that is spin. Rebuild may have 82-95% success rate but that does not mean he will ever return to his past form. You also don't know if it is a partial tear or not just because his father(who I am fairly sure isn't a doctor) says so. It is obvious the family will down play as much as possible Many athletes have successful ACL surgery but just don't return to form. Yes , you can now go back to the dook board.
So, you are a orthro surgeon that has seen the kid's x-rays? So you know EXACTLY what the situation is with this kid? Guy was busted last night and charged with selling and distribution of meth, has a long record of similar offenses, according to him he has spent his career in the medical field to, for the record he has not seen Giles x-rays either. What is the street name for Meth again, I hear when it is really potient they call it LOUD? What was your screen name again...
MY harshly worded point is that you have not seen this kid's x-rays, have you ever had a major joint injury that you had to come back from, if you have then you would know 100% recovery both physically and mentally does not mean the very same as it was prior to the injury. It isn't like a broken leg that heals back to the same strength it originally had.
It has been confirmed as a partial tear, but don't let that stop you with your wicked rebuttal of "STFU". Again more athletes return to "form", and some even stronger than before, after a ligament rebuild/replacement. Yes, I can go back to the Duke board, but watching people like you blast a kids injury with inaccuracy is just wrong.
Did you really compare meth to an athletes injury? Wow.
Now, back on topic - why would I diagnose a knee instability with an x-ray? If you are so in-tune with the field, please explain how a series of films is going to give me enough to make a clear diagnosis with a knee ligament? Again, stop spewing your opinion and read clinical, athlete-related studies and knee repair (not broken bones). That's a poor comparison. And yes, I've had a major "joint injury" (that's a broad statement btw) and I know not everyone heals the same. Again read the cumulative stats.
Good day gentlemen. I will step off of this out of respect for one of your mods (Mike), but if you'd like to be educated further on this topic, come over to the Duke board. Otherwise stick to things you know, best of luck on the upcoming season, a season with limited to no injury.
I know we're all couch coaches. I know sometimes I am. But the truth is I don't know ish compared to D1 coaches.
Let's stop trying to be couch doctors. Please???
There's a lot of scenarios when it comes to individuals rehabs. Not all are the same. And medicine has came a long way.
If any ones up for arm wrestling, I'm in.
Let's stop trying to be couch doctors. Please???
There's a lot of scenarios when it comes to individuals rehabs. Not all are the same. And medicine has came a long way.
If any ones up for arm wrestling, I'm in.
You upset dude, you upset because I don't out the gate buy your claims of being an expert? I don't claim to be an expert in medical science as you claim to be. But I have lived thru a complete reconstruction of my shoulder and one of my best friends found his college football days ended by a knee injury. So excuse me if I don't buy your 100% claims of 100% recovery.
No, I did not compare an athletes injury to meth, I stated your screen name is street slang for highly potent meth. I suspect your major joint injury was a result of you puffed and didn't pass!
And if it makes you feel any better, I will be glad to exchange the word X-ray for MRI, just so tonight you can sleep well.
By all means slink on out of here when it gets to hot for you to handle, you came in to MY house talking bull, climb back in bed with your boys sho-nuttin and gas-bag-a-toe. YOU are dismissed !
I know we're all couch coaches. I know sometimes I am. But the truth is I don't know ish compared to D1 coaches.
Let's stop trying to be couch doctors. Please???
There's a lot of scenarios when it comes to individuals rehabs. Not all are the same. And medicine has came a long way.
If any ones up for arm wrestling, I'm in.
Agree JC but I am not gonna buy some crank head's claim of being an expert just cause he said so. You know me better than that man and just as you stated, Not all recoverys are the same no matter what stats his google search comes up with.
Folks see 100% recovery terms thrown around and unless you have ever gone thru major joint re-construction yourself you can't know that it is never the same as before you got hurt. I understand it is being said that this is ONLY a part tear and of course that isn't nearly as bad as his first knee injury was. But I can promise ya, his coming back as soon as he did from that first issue contributed to this injury. You compensate for the weak joint, even if you don't realize it completely, when you do you place additional stress on the other joint.
I am not saying this because I don't want him to play for duke next season, if he really wants to play for K and duke play for them but it would be smart for him to red shirt as a freshman and play for them as a soph if he wants. It is his long term career and his future health that to me should be the more important aspect of this discussion. If he comes back to soon and re-injures either of those knees the NBA will devalue his ability to help them and question how much they can in good reason invest in the kid. That is IMO more risk than he should take just so he can play next season.
of course duke fans do not like me saying that because it risks him skipping college all together if he doesn't play as a freshman for them. That would rather the kid accept the risk of re-injury from coming back to soon than the risk that he will skip college and not play for them. But the bottom line is this kid now has 2 major knee injuries and has yet to graduate high school and if he can get healthy has what should be a solid NBA career ahead of him. But if he risks re-injury by coming back to soon from this latest injury, the NBA can quickly get scared and he see his draft stock drop like a rock and could see his NBA career stunted.
David u know the technology is vastly different today than it was when I got hurt in the seventies. IMO he will probably be ok physically, but being able to perform without fear of rein jury is the toughest part of coming back. Before the knee I never even thought about getting hurt . Afterwards I could think about anything but how unstable the knee was
I agree with Oz, time to close this one. I wish Giles a complete recovery and a very short stay in Derm.
After this post I will back out of this thread but I do want to answer toppsy coach, he is my bud and on this topic he knows because he saw a promising football career ended by a serious knee injury.
Ken, I absolutely agree that the technology has greatly improved since your knee in the 70s and my shoulder in the 80s, the technology has improved but the body is the same as is the mind. The mental aspect of this aside, which I as well agree is or was for me the hardest part. But ken, my question for you is what if this was kenny? What if Kenny was being projected as the 1st pick in the first NBA draft he could enter and yet just had his second major knee injury before finishing high school? Your love for duke runs as deep as mine does for my Heels but I know for a fact your love for any of your kids, your love for kenny runs much deeper than anything as small as a college basketball program. How comfortable would you be with Kenny coming back in time to play as a true freshman in college? Or how strongly would you consider him sitting out and making double sure BOTH of those knees were as sound as they can become? That way if it is important and he really wants to play for duke he not only can but can do so on 2 knees that would be as sound as they can become.
That is all I am and have been saying, that it is very possible the kid came back from the first knee injury to soon and making that same decision again may not be the wise move. I know you understand my point about compensating for a bad joint by placing additional pressure on the other joint, in this case putting more weight on the good knee to take some of the stress off the bad knee. In doing so putting more stress on the good knee increases the likelyhood of injury to the good knee. With now injury to both knees within the last 2yrs which knee can take the additional stress, can either take it as well as they did before either injury?
The crank dude came here talking in terms of technology and how this is only a part tear, it will be easy, no problem, MINOR. Ken, you & I have talked about MINOR surgery before haven't we. The definition we both agreed that minor surgery is the kind OTHER people have!
A lot of athletes come back from these kinds of injuries just fine. What was ignored is that he could be genetically predisposed to these types of injuries. Some athletes are simply more prone to injuries. Hopefully that is not the case with Giles but of course NBA teams will be wary. Even if he looks great for his year in college, which he probably will, it would be ignorant to think that some teams won't have him flagged.
It really does not matter what UNC or Duke (fans or coaches) think about Giles playing next year for Duke. It falls on Giles and if he thinks playing next year is a benefit for him than I hope it works out for him from a health standpoint. I hope he fails miserably from a performance standpoint. Two different issues.
We all know that there is some bias involved here for some fans. If Giles had committed to UNC, many would want him to play and hope for the best. I don't blame Dukes fans for being optimistic. Regardless, Giles will not be the same player with those injuries which makes it easier for the opponents.
We all know that there is some bias involved here for some fans. If Giles had committed to UNC, many would want him to play and hope for the best. I don't blame Dukes fans for being optimistic. Regardless, Giles will not be the same player with those injuries which makes it easier for the opponents.
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