Iran tests new version of balistic missile

[uncboy10]

There is no argument. I only postulated the questions about life and the BB to show that these are matters of faith.

What claims am I making?

Evolution and the Big Bang are not matters of faith. They are scientifically tested theories, supported by repeatable experiments and in the case of the Big Bang, highly complex mathematics.

The notion that science hasn't yet explained everything, so it's a matter of faith, or on equal footing with religious doctrines is basically the God of the gaps argument which is fallacious.

I tried to steer this back towards the Iran discussion but that part of my post apparently wasn't very interesting

 

[uncboy10]

Oh i'm sorry, a speck

Yeah... Still way off, but okay

 

[uncboy10]

I do send my kids to a private Catholic school. I would never consider public schools again for my kids. No way, no how.

But again, you misread what I wrote. I'm not saying that Christianity should be taught in public schools. But I am saying that because the vast majority subscribe to Christianity, that schools can allow Christian groups to assemble. And while they can and should also allow muslim groups to assemble (or any other faith based group), members of other faith based groups need to understand that Christianity is dominant and therefore might be afforded more of this or that. For example, if a Christian group of 50 kids want to meet for a prayer group, they might be afforded 30 minutes to do so in the auditorium. The muslim group of 1 may be relegated to a small room and only afforded 10 minutes. That's not favoritism or pushing an agenda. That's common sense. And minority faiths need to understand that popularity, to some degree, dictates need.

But that isn't the discussion that's being had in public schools. I can't think of a single instance where I've heard of someone trying to deny Christians or Muslims or anyone else for that matter the right to assemble after school, or during lunch or any other free period of the day. The discussion that has been infiltrating our science classrooms, is whether or not creationism should be taught in schools. As of right now in many places, creationism is placed on equal footing with evolution and that is simply absurd. Biology teachers shouldn't have to constantly stress that evolution is "just a theory" any more than a physics teacher should for gravity.

 

[uncboy10]

Again back to the Iran deal, this deal in no way allows Iran to get nuclear weapons. It reduces the nuclear capacity that Iran already has, and guarantees that any research, or development conducted by their nuclear program is approved by the P-5 who agreed to the deal. They cannot weaponize any of their enriched nuclear material and must meet the inspection requirements for the IAEA.

But then again most of the people who oppose this deal still think Obama is secretly a Kenyan Muslim so I'm not really all that surprised...

 

[heelmanwilm]

Welllllll actually evolution and gravity are both theories. They are mans attempts to label phenomena. As is creationism. Fwiw i embrace a "theistic evolutionary" type of theory.

 

[heelmanwilm]

Again back to the Iran deal, this deal in no way allows Iran to get nuclear weapons. It reduces the nuclear capacity that Iran already has, and guarantees that any research, or development conducted by their nuclear program is approved by the P-5 who agreed to the deal. They cannot weaponize any of their enriched nuclear material and must meet the inspection requirements for the IAEA.

But then again most of the people who oppose this deal still think Obama is secretly a Kenyan Muslim so I'm not really all that surprised...

Hyperbole aside my prob with the deal is that they self monitor some aspects and we didnt get the prisoners back in return.

 

[uncboy10]

Welllllll actually evolution and gravity are both theories. They are mans attempts to label phenomena. As is creationism. Fwiw i embrace a "theistic evolutionary" type of theory.

Yes they are. Unfortunately the word theory is often misrepresented. I think the point of those teachers stressing that is fear of offending religious students.

 

[UNC71-00]

Evolution and the Big Bang are not matters of faith. They are scientifically tested theories, supported by repeatable experiments and in the case of the Big Bang, highly complex mathematics.

The notion that science hasn't yet explained everything, so it's a matter of faith, or on equal footing with religious doctrines is basically the God of the gaps argument which is fallacious.

I tried to steer this back towards the Iran discussion but that part of my post apparently wasn't very interesting

Dude, they are scientific theories. And you know that is what I am saying. Quit being obstinate. The theories, as you know, lack one part. Some might say it is a rather important aspect.

How did each start? That't not a "gap"

 

[UNC71-00]

Again back to the Iran deal, this deal in no way allows Iran to get nuclear weapons. It reduces the nuclear capacity that Iran already has, and guarantees that any research, or development conducted by their nuclear program is approved by the P-5 who agreed to the deal. They cannot weaponize any of their enriched nuclear material and must meet the inspection requirements for the IAEA.

But then again most of the people who oppose this deal still think Obama is secretly a Kenyan Muslim so I'm not really all that surprised...

Right, and most people who support the deal still think that Jimmy Carter was on the right track and that the economy is currently in a period of robust growth.

But I'm sure you are right. When is the last time any country developed a nuclear weapon without the UN super inspectors catching them first and putting an end to the program?

 

[strummingram]

I thought it was called the Law of Gravity.

I know there's the Theory of Relativity. But, I thought "Gravity" was a law! The funny thing is, laws and theories and morals and values and gospels and commandments are all... relative! They're like suggestions that we choose to follow or disregard! Calling them a law doesn't guarantee anymore compliance than calling it a crock of sh*t.

 

[uncboy10]

Right, and most people who support the deal still think that Jimmy Carter was on the right track and that the economy is currently in a period of robust growth.

But I'm sure you are right. When is the last time any country developed a nuclear weapon without the UN super inspectors catching them first and putting an end to the program?

What makes you think they would be any less likely to do so without the deal? This actually provides incentives for them to play by the rules or their entire nuclear energy program will be shut down. Its not like we approved them building a bunch of new centrifuges

 

[UNC71-00]

What makes you think they would be any less likely to do so without the deal? This actually provides incentives for them to play by the rules or their entire nuclear energy program will be shut down. Its not like we approved them building a bunch of new centrifuges

So the only choices were to do nothing or sign this deal? And no, I'm not talking about war being the only third option either.

This deal is about one thing, plain and simple: Obama rolling the dice on trying to get a foreign policy legacy in the Middle East. And it's a safe bet too for him, because if he can't do it, he joins every other president since the lines were redrawn after WWII. And he's got lemmings like you to follow along, basically saying that the Iranians were going to get nuclear weapons anyways, so what difference does it make if the deal doesn't work out, right?

 

[uncboy10]

I thought it was called the Law of Gravity.

I know there's the Theory of Relativity. But, I thought "Gravity" was a law! The funny thing is, laws and theories and morals and values and gospels and commandments are all... relative! They're like suggestions that we choose to follow or disregard! Calling them a law doesn't guarantee anymore compliance than calling it a cr
True. But theory and law are somewhat interchangeable in science. A theory is presented in the form of a law. Sema

So the only choices were to do nothing or sign this deal? And no, I'm not talking about war being the only third option either.

This deal is about one thing, plain and simple: Obama rolling the dice on trying to get a foreign policy legacy in the Middle East. And it's a safe bet too for him, because if he can't do it, he joins every other president since the lines were redrawn after WWII. And he's got lemmings like you to follow along, basically saying that the Iranians were going to get nuclear weapons anyways, so what difference does it make if the deal doesn't work out, right?

I have yet to hear an alternative. This deal was set up by 5 different countries. Once again you're just working backwards from the assumption Obama is a POS.

It's a negotiation. Iran actually has to agree to it. That's called diplomacy. We can't just strong arm any deal we want, and many members of the international community have said they believe the deal accomplished much more than they ever thought possible.

I'm just curious what evidence you have that Obama is so self centered. Let's not forget the last president who started a war in Iraq to advance his own political and financial interests... That guy was a real POS. But Obama is the one who inspires all of this crap about being evil and what not. I wonder why...

 

[UNC71-00]

I have yet to hear an alternative. This deal was set up by 5 different countries. Once again you're just working backwards from the assumption Obama is a POS.

It's a negotiation. Iran actually has to agree to it. That's called diplomacy. We can't just strong arm any deal we want, and many members of the international community have said they believe the deal accomplished much more than they ever thought possible.

I'm just curious what evidence you have that Obama is so self centered. Let's not forget the last president who started a war in Iraq to advance his own political and financial interests... That guy was a real POS. But Obama is the one who inspires all of this crap about being evil and what not. I wonder why...

Are you telling me that these 5 countries are negotiating and setting up deals from the same position and no one country is more important than the other?

Negotiations are what you want when you are speaking as equals or from a position of weakness. But assuming that these were negotiations, we could have gotten a Turkish rug dealer from the Istanbul bazaar to get a better deal than these idiots got. Furthermore, if you think this is a good deal, I hope to have the opportunity to negotiate with you at some point.

To the last point, you and I are so far apart that it is futile to discuss further. However, please don't put words in my mouth. I have never called Obama evil. Why do you have sex with sheep? (See how that works?)

 

[uncboy10]

Are you telling me that these 5 countries are negotiating and setting up deals from the same position and no one country is more important than the other?

Negotiations are what you want when you are speaking as equals or from a position of weakness. But assuming that these were negotiations, we could have gotten a Turkish rug dealer from the Istanbul bazaar to get a better deal than these idiots got. Furthermore, if you think this is a good deal, I hope to have the opportunity to negotiate with you at some point.

To the last point, you and I are so far apart that it is futile to discuss further. However, please don't put words in my mouth. I have never called Obama evil. Why do you have sex with sheep? (See how that works?)

I never said it was a good deal. But when the majority of international diplomats from around the world agree that it is a much better deal than they ever expected Iran to sign then I'm going to at least hear them out. I have and I tend to agree. Is the deal perfect? No. But Iran is a sovereign state. Respecting that fact is how we prevent global conflicts.

And the definition of negotiate is: to reach a compromise by discussion with others. It has nothing to do with a position of weakness or equality.

Just out of curiosity, would you prefer the Bush/Cheney foreign policy? Cause that didn't really work out so well for us either...

 

[UNC71-00]

I never said it was a good deal. But when the majority of international diplomats from around the world agree that it is a much better deal than they ever expected Iran to sign then I'm going to at least hear them out. I have and I tend to agree. Is the deal perfect? No. But Iran is a sovereign state. Respecting that fact is how we prevent global conflicts.

And the definition of negotiate is: to reach a compromise by discussion with others. It has nothing to do with a position of weakness or equality.

Just out of curiosity, would you prefer the Bush/Cheney foreign policy? Cause that didn't really work out so well for us either...

Iran is a sovereign state. One which constantly threatens us and our allies with their words and actions. I'm really not concerned with their feelings, truth be told.

Any chance those diplomats come from countries who want to do business with Iran but could not due to sanctions? Funny how you accuse our own president of invading Iraq to further his own business interests, yet the motives of diplomats of countries who trade with Iran are beyond reproach. Are you that naive?

Negotiations have everything to do with positions of strength and weakness. Please tell me you understand this.

Why did a deal with Iran have to be done? What was the impetus to force a treaty? Bush and Cheney have nothing to do with this- what's the point in bringing them up?

You are too young to remember Carter, the Hostages and the Iranians. Most others on here are not. Obama is doing an excellent Jimmy Carter impression. What we need is a Reagan.

 

[uncboy10]

Negotiations have everything to do with positions of strength and weakness. Please tell me you understand this.

Why did a deal with Iran have to be done? What was the impetus to force a treaty? Bush and Cheney have nothing to do with this- what's the point in bringing them up?

You are too young to remember Carter, the Hostages and the Iranians. Most others on here are not. Obama is doing an excellent Jimmy Carter impression. What we need is a Reagan.

That doesn't mean that it ceases to be a negotiation even if you have all the strengths. I was merely pointing out that it still negotiation, regardless of whether you have all the cards, or none of them.

What we need is a Reagan? Uhh... What? So you want to sell the Iranians guns under the table in exchange for hostages and then later deny it?

Bush and Cheney's policies are very much relevant because they are responsible for destabilizing the region, and were still having to try to rectify the mistakes they made. ISIS wouldn't exist if it wasn't for their foreign policy. Neither would many of the other extremist opportunists who stepped into the void left in the ME.

 

[UNC71-00]

Negotiations have everything to do with positions of strength and weakness. Please tell me you understand this.

Why did a deal with Iran have to be done? What was the impetus to force a treaty? Bush and Cheney have nothing to do with this- what's the point in bringing them up?

You are too young to remember Carter, the Hostages and the Iranians. Most others on here are not. Obama is doing an excellent Jimmy Carter impression. What we need is a Reagan.

That doesn't mean that it ceases to be a negotiation even if you have all the strengths. I was merely pointing out that it still negotiation, regardless of whether you have all the cards, or none of them.

What we need is a Reagan? Uhh... What? So you want to sell the Iranians guns under the table in exchange for hostages and then later deny it?

Bush and Cheney's policies are very much relevant because they are responsible for destabilizing the region, and were still having to try to rectify the mistakes they made. ISIS wouldn't exist if it wasn't for their foreign policy. Neither would many of the other extremist opportunists who stepped into the void left in the ME.

Yeah- you need to study up on the Reagan administration if you believe what you just wrote. Of course, you weren't even an itch in your dad's pants at that point and you are an admitted flaming socialist, so my expectations that you will attempt to countermand your brainwashing arent very high. It's not hard though- just pick any source on the Internet and read up about the Middle East in the mid 80s.

There is no reason to negotiate if you hold all the cards unless you think the person sitting on the other side of the table can help you at some point down the road. It's that simple.

Bush and Cheney had nothing to do with Iran's attempt to develop nuclear weapons, although they did do a lot to stop the effort. Hell, Stuxnet might still be working if your man in the White House had been able to keep his (and his close aides) fat mouth shut.

The only solace to all this is that you are 24 and lots of 24 year olds walk around with their heads up their asses. Having families and mortgage payments tend to cause one to pull his head from his sphincter, so there is hope for you yet. But truth be told, I'm not optimistic.

 

[uncboy10]

Yeah- you need to study up on the Reagan administration if you believe what you just wrote. Of course, you weren't even an itch in your dad's pants at that point and you are an admitted flaming socialist, so my expectations that you will attempt to countermand your brainwashing arent very high. It's not hard though- just pick any source on the Internet and read up about the Middle East in the mid 80s.

There is no reason to negotiate if you hold all the cards unless you think the person sitting on the other side of the table can help you at some point down the road. It's that simple.

Bush and Cheney had nothing to do with Iran's attempt to develop nuclear weapons, although they did do a lot to stop the effort. Hell, Stuxnet might still be working if your man in the White House had been able to keep his (and his close aides) fat mouth shut.

The only solace to all this is that you are 24 and lots of 24 year olds walk around with their heads up their asses. Having families and mortgage payments tend to cause one to pull his head from his sphincter, so there is hope for you yet. But truth be told, I'm not optimistic.

Iran-Contra is a well documented political scandal that happened under the Reagan administration. If you're going to seriously deny that happened then I think its pretty clear whose head is in their ass. I never thought I'd hear someone say we need another Reagan when discussing dealings with Iran.

Please quote my post where I described myself as a socialist? Supporting a candidate who identifies as a democratic socialist hardly makes one a "flaming socialist." Ad hominem attacks are lame anyways... Try to do better.

With regards to the negotiating, we simply don't hold all the cards. I completely agree that the military option should always be on the table, but we would still lose thousands of troops, if not more, in a conflict with Iran. And further destabilize the region. A diplomatic solution does help us not only in the future, but in the present as well. If Iran does violate the deal, then we introduce the ant to the boot.

 

[UNC71-00]

Iran-Contra is a well documented political scandal that happened under the Reagan administration. If you're going to seriously deny that happened then I think its pretty clear whose head is in their ass. I never thought I'd hear someone say we need another Reagan when discussing dealings with Iran.

Please quote my post where I described myself as a socialist? Supporting a candidate who identifies as a democratic socialist hardly makes one a "flaming socialist." Ad hominem attacks are lame anyways... Try to do better.

With regards to the negotiating, we simply don't hold all the cards. I completely agree that the military option should always be on the table, but we would still lose thousands of troops, if not more, in a conflict with Iran. And further destabilize the region. A diplomatic solution does help us not only in the future, but in the present as well. If Iran does violate the deal, then we introduce the ant to the boot.

Of course Iran Contra is well documented. You should read up on it.

You don't think you have identified yourself as a flaming socialist? That's funny. You might not want to label yourself as one, understandably, but a spade is a spade.

3rd graders running lemonade stands strike better deals than Obama and Kerry managed here. Tell me- what cards don't we hold?

EDIT: I should have said "didn't we hold".

 

[coryfly]

Look! The mean old conservatives are doing it too! You know why I posted those. Don't be so damn obtuse.

I'm not sure what you are talking about. I didn't really look at who posted it tbh. It seemed to be something plenty of people on this board would believe (at least some of it).

 

[coryfly]

It's not a comparison of Christians and Islamic radicals. It's supposed to be a comparison between the radical right wing Christians and their Islamic counterparts. Just like with Islam, only a small percentage of the population are extremists. I fully concede there are many moderate Christians who separate their religion from their politics.

Islam is behind the times no doubt about it. Christianity has greatly benefitted from being restrained by secular laws. There used to be plenty of beheadings in dominantly Christian regions.

Anyways, Iran testing ballistic missiles has absolutely nothing to do with our nuclear deal with them. It neither sanctions not prohibits Iran from testing ballistic missiles unless they are armed with nuclear weapons. These were not. And it doesn't allow Iran to get nuclear weapons either for that matter. It may not be a perfect deal but it's a hell of a lot better than just folding our arms or starting another war in the ME

I think there are plenty of crazy right wing Christians out there. Most of them annoy me greatly. However, I don't really think they compare at all to Islamic Militants. I think extremely radical right wing Christians perhaps could in a very loose comparison but they are a very small number. Like I said, the comparison would be extremely loose anyway.

 

[uncboy10]

Of course Iran Contra is well documented. You should read up on it.

You don't think you have identified yourself as a flaming socialist? That's funny. You might not want to label yourself as one, understandably, but a spade is a spade.

3rd graders running lemonade stands strike better deals than Obama and Kerry managed here. Tell me- what cards don't we hold?

EDIT: I should have said "didn't we hold".

I have read up on it extensively. Are you aware of some of the atrocities committed by the people we sold those weapons to? We have something of a trend of doing that. Including Obama's administration. What we should really be worried about IMO is the lack of strategic oversight that allows Islamic radicals to end up using our own weapons against us. Not that Lockheed Martin has a problem with that...

 

[uncboy10]

I think there are plenty of crazy right wing Christians out there. Most of them annoy me greatly. However, I don't really think they compare at all to Islamic Militants. I think extremely radical right wing Christians perhaps could in a very loose comparison but they are a very small number. Like I said, the comparison would be extremely loose anyway.

No, they don't compare in how they act on them but a lot of times their political views are similar, even though the consequences are usually very different. That was really the only point of that meme. Fortunately for us, Christianity has gone through a reformation that Islam has yet to undertake. If you ask me, all religions are dangerous, but Islam is clearly the most dangerous, for now.

 

[tazki]

No, they don't compare in how they act on them but a lot of times their political views are similar, even though the consequences are usually very different. That was really the only point of that meme. Fortunately for us, Christianity has gone through a reformation that Islam has yet to undertake. If you ask me, all religions are dangerous, but Islam is clearly the most dangerous, for now.

And if you ask me you are an idiot.

 

[uncboy10]

And if you ask me you are an idiot.

Ad hominem attacks are lame. Grow up. Do better.

 

[UNC71-00]

I have read up on it extensively. Are you aware of some of the atrocities committed by the people we sold those weapons to? We have something of a trend of doing that. Including Obama's administration. What we should really be worried about IMO is the lack of strategic oversight that allows Islamic radicals to end up using our own weapons against us. Not that Lockheed Martin has a problem with that...

Really? Where did you find the most extensive accounts of atrocities committed by the Iranians who purchased arms? Just a book title or link will do

 

[uncboy10]

Really? Where did you find the most extensive accounts of atrocities committed by the Iranians who purchased arms? Just a book title or link will do

I followed the history. Its not that difficult. The contras who received the financial benefits of that deal were accused of an extensive list of human rights violations, as were the Iranians in the Iran-Iraq war. The same Iranians we traded weapons for hostages. But lets also not forget that Hezbollah immediately kidnapped another 3 Americans, none of which were ever released. It was one of the worst foreign policy blunders in the history of the United States.

And Reagan blatantly lied about it to the American public. We need another Reagan like I need a hole in my roof.

 

[tazki]

Boy, at this point I am more "grown up" than you ever will be. Your blatant attempt to trash Christianity at every turn simply demonstrates your immaturity and hatred for anything Christian. You are so wrong that I actually wish I could help you. If you think for a minute that this Iran deal is a good thing then it only shows how lost you really are and to even remotely compare Christianity to Islam is entirely disgusting.

 

[uncboy10]

Boy, at this point I am more "grown up" than you ever will be. Your blatant attempt to trash Christianity at every turn simply demonstrates your immaturity and hatred for anything Christian. You are so wrong that I actually wish I could help you. If you think for a minute that this Iran deal is a good thing then it only shows how lost you really are and to even remotely compare Christianity to Islam is entirely disgusting.

Lol, are you even aware of how much of the Quran is directly plagiarized from Jewish and Christian texts?

 

[UNC71-00]

I followed the history. Its not that difficult. The contras who received the financial benefits of that deal were accused of an extensive list of human rights violations, as were the Iranians in the Iran-Iraq war. The same Iranians we traded weapons for hostages. But lets also not forget that Hezbollah immediately kidnapped another 3 Americans, none of which were ever released. It was one of the worst foreign policy blunders in the history of the United States.

And Reagan blatantly lied about it to the American public. We need another Reagan like I need a hole in my roof.

So about this extensive reading- just give me one book or article so I too can learn what you know about atrocities committed by the Iranians who bought arms from us through the Israelis.

Just one.

 

[uncboy10]

So about this extensive reading- just give me one book or article so I too can learn what you know about atrocities committed by the Iranians who bought arms from us through the Israelis.

Just one.

http://www.crimesofwar.org/a-z-guide/547/

 

[tazki]

Lol, are you even aware of how much of the Quran is directly plagiarized from Jewish and Christian texts?

I don't give a rat's ass about the Quaran. Tell me how many Christian's are running around cutting heads off you lost soul. Islam is not even remotely related to Christianity.

 

[uncboy10]

I don't give a rat's ass about the Quaran. Tell me how many Christian's are running around cutting heads off you lost soul. Islam is not even remotely related to Christianity.

More ad hominem attacks. You aren't learning...

Islam is directly intertwined with Christianity. Jesus is even considered a prophet of Islam. They are both Abrahamic religions, and the parallels don't stop there. The only difference with the beheadings is that Christians got it out of their system during the Inquisition and Crusades, and are now constrained by secular laws. If Christians actually followed the laws of the bible then the punishment for homosexuality would still be death. Same as Islam. But Christians prefer to take their religion a la carte.

 

[tazki]

More ad hominem attacks. You aren't learning...

Islam is directly intertwined with Christianity. Jesus is even considered a prophet of Islam. They are both Abrahamic religions, and the parallels don't stop there. The only difference with the beheadings is that Christians got it out of their system during the Inquisition and Crusades, and are now constrained by secular laws. If Christians actually followed the laws of the bible then the punishment for homosexuality would still be death. Same as Islam. But Christians prefer to take their religion a la carte.

Wow. Dude you really do need some help. You are reading some funky stuff if you actually believe Jesus is a prophet of Islam. That is pitiful.

 

[strummingram]

Wow. Dude you really do need some help. You are reading some funky stuff if you actually believe Jesus is a prophet of Islam. That is pitiful.

Jesus really is a prophet in Islam.

The Jews don't recognize Jesus Christ at all. Well, I guess Messianic Jews do. But, Orthodox Jews do not recognize Jesus at all. That's one of the things I find interesting about Christians and Israel. At least Muslims give Jesus major props in their Holy Text.

I'm not sure how funky it is, however.

 

[tazki]

Jesus really is a prophet in Islam.

The Jews don't recognize Jesus Christ at all. Well, I guess Messianic Jews do. But, Orthodox Jews do not recognize Jesus at all. That's one of the things I find interesting about Christians and Israel. At least Muslims give Jesus major props in their Holy Text.

I'm not sure how funky it is, however.

The Jews don't believe Jesus is the Messiah. They consider him a great teacher. However, they are his chosen people. Islam and Christ are in NO WAY related. You can post whatever wikipedia BS you want Strum. The Bible is the source I will go with and Jesus Christ is the Son of God who gave his life for those that believe and accept him. He is no prophet of Islam. Wow no wonder this world is so screwed up.

 

[strummingram]

The Jews don't believe Jesus is the Messiah. They consider him a great teacher. However, they are his chosen people. Islam and Christ are in NO WAY related. You can post whatever wikipedia BS you want Strum. The Bible is the source I will go with and Jesus Christ is the Son of God who gave his life for those that believe and accept him. He is no prophet of Islam. Wow no wonder this world is so screwed up.

I used Wikipedia since that was easiest. I can provide much more proof of how Jews reject Christ outright. Muslims are required to accept and recognize Jesus as a great prophet and the Messenger of God.

You can choose to only read the Bible if you want. But, what you can't do is claim that Jesus is not a prophet in Islam. Well, you can claim it, but you're wrong. He absolutely IS a prophet in Islam. SOrry that you have more in common with them than you thought. At least now you know.

 

[strummingram]

http://www.aish.com/jw/s/48892792.html

http://www.simpletoremember.com/articles/a/jewsandjesus/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judaism's_view_of_Jesus

Jews absolutely reject the Father, Son and Holy Spirit Trinity. For them, that is heretical. Your Bible is kind of a split personality where Judaism is concerned. Don't get me wrong, it's awesome to embrace Judaism and Jews, if that's your thing. No need to make enemies of people if they have different beliefs.

From my understanding, Jesus was a pretty outspoken opponent of Judaism. So much so that his followers started a whole new alternative religion to it. Personally, I think Jesus was sort of anti-Religion altogether. He was very much into knowing God and leaving religion behind.

 

[tazki]

I know what Jews believe Sturm. And Jesus may be a prophet of Islam according to Islam but not according to God's Word. Maybe you should read it sometime.