Kirby Smart on the foundation that

[WoadBlue]

makes SEC football great.

It is really simple: "Let's be honest,” Smart told the media postgame. “The reason the Southeastern Conference is what it is, is because the states that encompass the Southeastern Conference love football.”

Well, KY really doesn't love CFB because KY loves everything about basketball. But exceptions prove rules.

And that love of football at the grassroots level of its member states is a very large part of what holds ACC football back and down. The only charter ACC state that loves football is SC, and for 30 years, SC has been half an SEC state as well. GA and FL love football, but the ACC was very late to those states, which means we always play catch up in them.

VT is a campus that loves CFB, but VA is a state that cares more about basketball.

MA is a state hard pressed to care any less about CFB. MA loves the Patriots and so cares about the NFL, but MA cares nada about CFB. All of New England cares nada about CFB. BC does not have a single halfway passionate rivalry, nor one that has any meaning to CFB history.

NY didn't even care much about CFB when Fordham had its Golden Age. The only CFB games that have ever mattered a good deal to New York were the classic Army-ND games, and that rivalry was driven by national love of CFB, not by NY love of CFB. Syracuse does not have a single passionate football rivalry, nor one that has any meaning to CFB history.

PA used to love CFB. The PSU campus and alums still do. But Pittsburgh people love the Steelers and barely keep up with Pitt. Since the start of 2 platoon football, the Pitt campus and city have been passionate about only 2 Pitt rivalries: PSU and WVU. Neither school is on the ACC, which means right now Pitt has no rivalry with the slightest bit of passion or historical significance.

So how can ACC football compete against the SEC?

In terms of finding some fans who are passionate about CFB, would be better off with schools in football-loving states like TX and OH than in states like MA and NY that essentially ignore CFB? NC being a basketball-first state, how great a handicap is it that the ACC has 4 schools in NC, including the smallest school in any Major conference?

 

[strummingram]

How the hell can you establish such a thing? "Virginia doesn't LOVE football." Such a broad, indistinct notion.

 

[sctarheel30]

TLDR

 

[JimmyinVA]

How the hell can you establish such a thing? "Virginia doesn't LOVE football." Such a broad, indistinct notion.

i've lived in virginia most of my life. i also lived in alabama for four years. in alabama i was amazed how entire communities live and die for their local h.s. football team. in over fifty years as a virginian i've never seen anything like that.

 

[strummingram]

i've lived in virginia most of my life. i also lived in alabama for four years. in alabama i was amazed how entire communities live and die for their local h.s. football team. in over fifty years as a virginian i've never seen anything like that.

Well, congratulations to Alabama!

 

[tarheel0910]

i've lived in virginia most of my life. i also lived in alabama for four years. in alabama i was amazed how entire communities live and die for their local h.s. football team. in over fifty years as a virginian i've never seen anything like that.

There's also nothing else to do in states like Alabama or Mississippi. That helps a lot.

 

[WoadBlue]

How the hell can you establish such a thing? "Virginia doesn't LOVE football." Such a broad, indistinct notion.

It's as easy as 'establishing' that Texas is absolutely deeply passionate about football at all levels. To not know it is to not know Texas.

 

[WoadBlue]

There's also nothing else to do in states like Alabama or Mississippi. That helps a lot.

That is the exact excuse Pac fans began making at least 30 years ago for lack of passion about Pac football in Pac states. And it always is false. Small towns in AL and TX have the same basic movie houses and roller rinks and restaurants that small towns in CA and New England have. In some, passion for football means those HS kids and their families are at games on Friday, and in the other HS kids and their families have very little interest in Friday Night Lights.

There are 2 basic marketing strategies. One is to sell where there is a proven market for the product. The other is to try to manufacture a market in areas where the product has never sold well.

The SEC and BT have mastered the former. In expanding for football, the ACC gambled that the latter strategy would work, that the northeast would become a larger and much more valuable football market if the ACC expanded there.

The ACC leadership was wrong. You cannot create a passionate football audience out of what is akin to a void.

 

[tarheel0910]

That is the exact excuse Pac fans began making at least 30 years ago for lack of passion about Pac football in Pac states. And it always is false. Small towns in AL and TX have the same basic movie houses and roller rinks and restaurants that small towns in CA and New England have. In some, passion for football means those HS kids and their families are at games on Friday, and in the other HS kids and their families have very little interest in Friday Night Lights.

There are 2 basic marketing strategies. One is to sell where there is a proven market for the product. The other is to try to manufacture a market in areas where the product has never sold well.

The SEC and BT have mastered the former. In expanding for football, the ACC gambled that the latter strategy would work, that the northeast would become a larger and much more valuable football market if the ACC expanded there.

The ACC leadership was wrong. You cannot create a passionate football audience out of what is akin to a void.

I'm not talking about theaters and the local A&W. I mean there is literally nothing else to do. No pro teams, no great beaches, no skiing, no big theme parks. Nothing. Your big event there is football and football.

 

[Archer2]

That is the exact excuse Pac fans began making at least 30 years ago for lack of passion about Pac football in Pac states. And it always is false. Small towns in AL and TX have the same basic movie houses and roller rinks and restaurants that small towns in CA and New England have. In some, passion for football means those HS kids and their families are at games on Friday, and in the other HS kids and their families have very little interest in Friday Night Lights.

There are 2 basic marketing strategies. One is to sell where there is a proven market for the product. The other is to try to manufacture a market in areas where the product has never sold well.

The SEC and BT have mastered the former. In expanding for football, the ACC gambled that the latter strategy would work, that the northeast would become a larger and much more valuable football market if the ACC expanded there.

The ACC leadership was wrong. You cannot create a passionate football audience out of what is akin to a void.

Mr. doom and gloom strikes again.

 

[strummingram]

It's as easy as 'establishing' that Texas is absolutely deeply passionate about football at all levels. To not know it is to not know Texas.

I can believe Texas loves football more than Virginia.

 

[sctarheel30]

SC people love some football. Only problem is they only have one good team to root for and that’s coastal lol. Trying to tick those clemsuck fans off. Lil Carolina fans pull for those idiots win or lose (mainly lose). I know y’all won the dookie bowl game so don’t even start. Good for y’all.

 

[WoadBlue]

I'm not talking about theaters and the local A&W. I mean there is literally nothing else to do. No pro teams, no great beaches, no skiing, no big theme parks. Nothing. Your big event there is football and football.

I'll get back to what should be the main take away from your response at the end.

Texas has great beaches. Texas has large theme parks. Texas has a bunch of pro teams in various sports. And Texas still has huge Friday Night Lights as well as huge audiences for CFB. So you can have both.

How and why can you have both in TX, and in FL and GA and OH, but not in NY or MA or eastern PA?

The necessary take away is: if a conference has more than a couple of teams in states that lack a proven passion for CFB, that conference is going to have difficulty maintaining a sizable audience. And that means that such a conference is always going to be behind conferences that have the vast majority of members is states that do have proven passion for CFB.

In short, however it is that NY and MA, in fact the entire northeast save for the small part that is PSU fandom, came to have little interest in CFB (other than in betting on games - but that is about betting, not caring about CFB), the fact remains that there are very few CFB fans in the entire region who are even a bit close to passionate about CFB. Northeasterners just do not care. They are not going to back your product.

Fewer passionate fans equals smaller paychecks. Smaller paychecks over time destabilize and ruin conferences. Big 12 teams were already getting better money than ACC teams, and the two richest Big 12 programs still jumped to the SEC in order to get much larger paychecks and to be part of the conference with the most passion about CFB.

The Big 12 responded nearly perfectly and quickly, adding BYU (which has a larger football and a larger basketball fan base than any school located in Mountain Time); Cincy (40K students and located in football-passionate OH and excellent recent football success); Houston (40K students with successful histories in both revenue sports, located in football-passionate TX); and UCF (60K students in football-passionate FL and big recent successes in football).

Each one of those Big 12 additions is better for football value and quality than were BC and Syracuse combined.

 

[tarheel0910]

I'll get back to what should be the main take away from your response at the end.

Texas has great beaches. Texas has large theme parks. Texas has a bunch of pro teams in various sports. And Texas still has huge Friday Night Lights as well as huge audiences for CFB. So you can have both.

How and why can you have both in TX, and in FL and GA and OH, but not in NY or MA or eastern PA?

The necessary take away is: if a conference has more than a couple of teams in states that lack a proven passion for CFB, that conference is going to have difficulty maintaining a sizable audience. And that means that such a conference is always going to be behind conferences that have the vast majority of members is states that do have proven passion for CFB.

In short, however it is that NY and MA, in fact the entire northeast save for the small part that is PSU fandom, came to have little interest in CFB (other than in betting on games - but that is about betting, not caring about CFB), the fact remains that there are very few CFB fans in the entire region who are even a bit close to passionate about CFB. Northeasterners just do not care. They are not going to back your product.

Fewer passionate fans equals smaller paychecks. Smaller paychecks over time destabilize and ruin conferences. Big 12 teams were already getting better money than ACC teams, and the two richest Big 12 programs still jumped to the SEC in order to get much larger paychecks and to be part of the conference with the most passion about CFB.

The Big 12 responded nearly perfectly and quickly, adding BYU (which has a larger football and a larger basketball fan base than any school located in Mountain Time); Cincy (40K students and located in football-passionate OH and excellent recent football success); Houston (40K students with successful histories in both revenue sports, located in football-passionate TX); and UCF (60K students in football-passionate FL and big recent successes in football).

Each one of those Big 12 additions is better for football value and quality than were BC and Syracuse combined.

Texas is really the exception to the rule do to size. The rest of your post is tl;dr.

 

[-COUNTRY-CLUB-JOE-]

SC people love some football. Only problem is they only have one good team to root for and that’s coastal lol. Trying to tick those clemsuck fans off. Lil Carolina fans pull for those idiots win or lose (mainly lose). I know y’all won the dookie bowl game so don’t even start. Good for y’all.

SC has some good HS football given it's ~1/2 size of NC.

 

[-COUNTRY-CLUB-JOE-]

i've lived in virginia most of my life. i also lived in alabama for four years. in alabama i was amazed how entire communities live and die for their local h.s. football team. in over fifty years as a virginian i've never seen anything like that.

Yeah, VA has a few (Salem comes to mind), but they're the exception more so than the rule. Their HS football isn't on the same level as years past imo. I think soccer is more popular than it used to be in some the RVA and NOVA schools. Overall, they got beat up pretty bad by out of state schools this year.

 

[-COUNTRY-CLUB-JOE-]

makes SEC football great.

It is really simple: "Let's be honest,” Smart told the media postgame. “The reason the Southeastern Conference is what it is, is because the states that encompass the Southeastern Conference love football.”

Well, KY really doesn't love CFB because KY loves everything about basketball. But exceptions prove rules.

And that love of football at the grassroots level of its member states is a very large part of what holds ACC football back and down. The only charter ACC state that loves football is SC, and for 30 years, SC has been half an SEC state as well. GA and FL love football, but the ACC was very late to those states, which means we always play catch up in them.

VT is a campus that loves CFB, but VA is a state that cares more about basketball.

MA is a state hard pressed to care any less about CFB. MA loves the Patriots and so cares about the NFL, but MA cares nada about CFB. All of New England cares nada about CFB. BC does not have a single halfway passionate rivalry, nor one that has any meaning to CFB history.

NY didn't even care much about CFB when Fordham had its Golden Age. The only CFB games that have ever mattered a good deal to New York were the classic Army-ND games, and that rivalry was driven by national love of CFB, not by NY love of CFB. Syracuse does not have a single passionate football rivalry, nor one that has any meaning to CFB history.

PA used to love CFB. The PSU campus and alums still do. But Pittsburgh people love the Steelers and barely keep up with Pitt. Since the start of 2 platoon football, the Pitt campus and city have been passionate about only 2 Pitt rivalries: PSU and WVU. Neither school is on the ACC, which means right now Pitt has no rivalry with the slightest bit of passion or historical significance.

So how can ACC football compete against the SEC?

In terms of finding some fans who are passionate about CFB, would be better off with schools in football-loving states like TX and OH than in states like MA and NY that essentially ignore CFB? NC being a basketball-first state, how great a handicap is it that the ACC has 4 schools in NC, including the smallest school in any Major conference?

Pretty much comes down to two things that are probably never going to change:

1. SEC has a lot of large public schools whereas the ACC is stuck with smaller private schools.

2. As much as I can't stand Kirby Smart, he's right, football is huge the farther south you go from youth football to high school football on up to college. It's a different culture than what you find in the triangle, DC, Boston.