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Quick stuff (State game)...

gary-7

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Jan 27, 2003
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...and well, ya don't see that every day.

I mean, when's the last time you saw two ACC teams go 0-fer-a-half from 3?... or combine for a whoppin' total of 12 Assists for a game? #ugh

- Reality is we won this one in two areas, and one was at the line. We shot 39 FTs, but make no mistake, we EARNED every blessed one of them --- hell, Mando alone coulda easily gone to the line 5 or 6 more times just from the missed hacks --- and we pretty much NEEDED our scorching 90+ FT pct on an otherwise miserable offensive night.

- On that note, for the second straight game we just seemed clunky on offense, especially in the first half. I blame a lot of that on a dearth of transition. I was really puzzled at our lack of dedication to pushing the rock --- only 17 pts in transition --- especially with us cleaning the defensive glass. We spent way too much of the game playing at State's preferred tempo. And for the umpteenth time, when we don't run, welp, we get clunky on offense.

- Fortunately, the other thing that came thru for us was defense. State's perimeter guys are a tough cover, but we did so mostly very well in the second half. For the game we held Smith and Joiner to a combined 11/33 and 1/10 from 3. Their fat-boy Big didn't do anything til Mando picked up a couple of phantoms, and even after that, we thankfully figured out it wasn't worth it to double him, as they weren't gonna beat us with him backing in for late shot-clock 2s.

- Speaking of D, this was easily RJ's best defensive game here --- really worked his tail off and avoided most of his old footwork glitches, and Leaky forced his guy into several awkward forces. And despite Dunn having an uncharacteristically miserable go at shooting today, he really locked in on defense, especially after Leaky got ejected.

- As for Leaky, I dare say that if there hadn't been an injury on that play, they would not have called a Flagrant 2 --- but anyway, I hope the kid is ok.

- Obvious congrats to Mando on those two UNC milestones, and he continues to be a warrior no matter what they throw at him --- another monster game at 23 and 18, while tubby only got 4 boards for the game. Pete helped out with 8 boards as well. And Caleb, well, no matter what has transpired previously, when we need somebody for a big take, he's up for the challenge.

- Finally (and I'll talk more about this later) we've GOT to find a way to make things mesh better offensively with Pete back in the lineup (Hint: It starts with the transition scheme).

Anyway, always good to put State in their place --- and actually see US make a desperation shot-clock heave for once --- but we damn well need to shoot better Tuesday up there vs a much-improving Cuse team!... :cool: :oops:
 
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I love these Quick stuff threads. I'd like to add rebounding. Heels outrebounded 42-27. Additionally, Nance had 8 of those. Thought this was the most integrated he has looked. Yes his D is suspect. Wish he wouldn't lean in so much. But he looked quicker on the boards. Good team win. PS Armando is a Legend and RJ is a tough little nut.
 
At half I said there are games to sit your dogs and get some bench minutes and others that aren't made for that. This was the latter. Caleb and RJ were vital. Their aggression against the heavy ball pressure was the difference. Dunn & Trimble were defensive with the rock.

I thought Caleb was the difference. In a poor statistical game where he was not seeing the ball drop, he probed and played his ass off. Many of those misses ended up as easy Mando put backs or free throws. It also demanded the defenses attention which makes it easier for Mando to feast.

Last year Leaky, RJ, and Caleb all shot over 80% from the line comfortably. Today the trio got there 30 times and knocked down 28 of them. Mando going 7 for 7 was a welcomed surprise. Getting RJ & Caleb to the line more is a key stat.

Burns is a skilled, HUGE body, but making him work pays dividends with his stamina, he is a target. We also put him " in the wash" and he is helpless at that point. RJ had at least 3 uncontested layups from a half court set from his inability to move laterally.

Leaky was lock down, Caleb and RJ were solid. That is a talented perimiter scoring trio for them that got locked up today.

Huge, hard fought quad 1 win!
 
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- Reality is we won this one in two areas, and one was at the line. We shot 39 FTs, but make no mistake, we EARNED every blessed one of them ---

- On that note, for the second straight game we just seemed clunky on offense, especially in the first half. I blame a lot of that on a dearth of transition. I was really puzzled at our lack of dedication to pushing the rock --- only 17 pts in transition --- especially with us cleaning the defensive glass. We spent way too much of the game playing at State's preferred tempo. And for the umpteenth time, when we don't run, welp, we get clunky on offense.

- As for Leaky, I dare say that if Joiner hadn't gotten hurt on that play, they would not have called a Flagrant 2 --- but anyway, I hope the kid is ok.


- Obvious congrats to Mando on those two UNC milestones, and he continues to be a warrior no matter what they throw at him --- another monster game at 23 and 18, while tubby only got 4 boards for the game. Pete helped out with 8 boards as well. And Caleb, well, no matter what has transpired previously, when we need somebody for a big take, he's up for the challenge.
1. The ACC office won't like the 39 FTs one bit and unfortunately we will see the blowback on tuesday. Mark my word.

2. The more I watch Hubert coach the more I'm afraid our patented transition is a thing of the past. He's coaching like it's the NBA(half-court sets and 7 man rotations)

3. That F2 on Leaky was a joke, but when Bert Smith is the head official that can be expected. But all in all I sincerely hope Smith is ok.

4. Caleb will go down as one the most clutch players in UNC and ACC history.
 
It was great to see the former 93 team players honored.

Was a big game for Armondo getting both the RB & DD records, so, congrats to him on that accomplishment, as it is a historical game for him and the team.

RJ was also a critical factor in this game as well, he had a great game all around.

Don't know about you, but I am sick and tired of us having at least 1 player out in what seems like every game.

Well, Hubert played his bench...., and got O-fer, nada, (1 point on a FT). Those guys have to contribute more going forth.

Once again puzzled by Caleb.... had next to nothing to contribute to the 1st half.
No fouls committed, no fouls drawn, no assists, no rebounds, but did shoot 1-5
in the 1st half. Caleb has to give the team a lot more than this. He continues to
be an enigma. His 2nd half play was somewhat better though.

We are still not sharing the ball enough...., we had 5 assists on 20 made FG 25%...NOT GOOD.

Thankfully, we shot our FT's well, as this was as much the story line for the game as anything else.

I have watched State play some games this year, and they are pretty good too. What I did notice in the games I watched was that they fouled.... a lot. One of my pals that I attend games with mentioned to our group that State is last in the league FTA/FGA.

All that means is that they foul well above the average per game and on the regular, so, what may look like a FT disparity, it's not. If your defense is centered around committing a lot of fouls (like dook) and knowing that the officials won't call them all, is playing a BB version of Russian roulette, as it will eventually catch up to you and kill you.

State tried to play the bully in this game and got their arses handed to them.
It's going to be a real challenge for our guys when we go to Raleigh to play them at their place.

I am not for sure certain, but I think our group saw the Smith kid leaving with some medical personnel. He appeared to have either a splint or a cast up past the elbow. I heard talk of elbow and wrist injuries, but like I mentioned, I am not sure. Just wish him a speedy recovery.

Got a tough one Tuesday at Syracuse, hope the players are up to winning that one.
 
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WOWZA, a game where the officials actually blew their whistles and called fouls attributed to DELIBERATE
contact that creates an advantage for the defender!! I guess that’s why we lived at the ft line (and should have had a
few more attempts, tbh).
Who among us would have ever imagined that Armando Bacot, ARMANDO LINWOOD
BACOT
, would become MR. DOUBLE DOUBLE AND eclipse Psycho T’s rebounding totals in his career at Carolina?
IN LESS THAN FOUR FULL SEASONS.
Totally unpredictable! And it just demonstrates his dedication and hard work to date.
Don’t let up, big fella. Do work, son! You and RJ can keep carrying us as far as we can go.
GDTBATH
 
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...and well, ya don't see that every day.

I mean, when's the last time you saw two ACC teams go 0-fer-a-half from 3?... or combine for a whoppin' total of 12 Assists for a game? #ugh

- Reality is we won this one in two areas, and one was at the line. We shot 39 FTs, but make no mistake, we EARNED every blessed one of them --- hell, Mando alone coulda easily gone to the line 5 or 6 more times just from the missed hacks --- and we pretty much NEEDED our scorching 90+ FT pct on an otherwise miserable offensive night.

- On that note, for the second straight game we just seemed clunky on offense, especially in the first half. I blame a lot of that on a dearth of transition. I was really puzzled at our lack of dedication to pushing the rock --- only 17 pts in transition --- especially with us cleaning the defensive glass. We spent way too much of the game playing at State's preferred tempo. And for the umpteenth time, when we don't run, welp, we get clunky on offense.

- Fortunately, the other thing that came thru for us was defense. State's perimeter guys are a tough cover, but we did so mostly very well in the second half. For the game we held Smith and Joiner to a combined 11/33 and 1/10 from 3. Their fat-boy Big didn't do anything til Mando picked up a couple of phantoms, and even after that, we thankfully figured out it wasn't worth it to double him, as they weren't gonna beat us with him backing in for late shot-clock 2s.

- Speaking of D, this was easily RJ's best defensive game here --- really worked his tail off and avoided most of his old footwork glitches, and Leaky forced his guy into several awkward forces. And despite Dunn having an uncharacteristically miserable go at shooting today, he really locked in on defense, especially after Leaky got ejected.

- As for Leaky, I dare say that if there hadn't been an injury on that play, they would not have called a Flagrant 2 --- but anyway, I hope the kid is ok.

- Obvious congrats to Mando on those two UNC milestones, and he continues to be a warrior no matter what they throw at him --- another monster game at 23 and 18, while tubby only got 4 boards for the game. Pete helped out with 8 boards as well. And Caleb, well, no matter what has transpired previously, when we need somebody for a big take, he's up for the challenge.

- Finally (and I'll talk more about this later) we've GOT to find a way to make things mesh better offensively with Pete back in the lineup (Hint: It starts with the transition scheme).

Anyway, always good to put State in their place --- and actually see US make a desperation shot-clock heave for once --- but we damn well need to shoot better Tuesday up there vs a much-improving Cuse team!... :cool: :oops:
Spot on Gary. I don’t understand why we don’t push it more, and work inside out to force teams to guard Bacot one on one, or double him leading to swinging the ball for wide open looks and drives to the basket? You are so right though- this team stalls when not attacking the basket in transition, and standing around watching one player dribble and attempting to create which leads to forced shots and no chance for offensive rebounds because nobody is in a rebound position. I learn a lot by reading here and this is just my humble opinion. This team has got to be more consistent offensively and play to its strengths! Go Heels!
 
Boy, you’re giving Love a huge pass. Perhaps that’s something Love should consider when he‘s shooting 21%.
Yea there is a disconnect there right now with Caleb. Gary called the offense “clunky “. Staff and players have to get on the same page. Caleb has to play aggressively but under control, and regain his confidence. He’ll be fine.
 
1. The ACC office won't like the 39 FTs one bit and unfortunately we will see the blowback on tuesday. Mark my word.

2. The more I watch Hubert coach the more I'm afraid our patented transition is a thing of the past. He's coaching like it's the NBA(half-court sets and 7 man rotations)

3. That F2 on Leaky was a joke, but when Bert Smith is the head official that can be expected. But all in all I sincerely hope Smith is ok.

4. Caleb will go down as one the most clutch players in UNC and ACC history.
Good analysis.
 
Very good win and much needed considering the schedule. There was some good and bad to take from this game, most of which has been pointed out ITT. Cuse will be a tough game and I get the feeling that when we go to State there will be whistles swallowed at their place.

OTOH, it is difficult to see the demise of thanking the passer and the patent Carolina transition game. It is also strange to see a Carolina team that is allowed to bark at the refs the way our guys do. That stuff was absolutely not tolerated by Roy or Dean, but it seems to be acceptable now with HD.
 
Mando is our best and most consistent player. Caleb is perhaps our most talented but least consistent player(except in poor shot selection). Yet Caleb has missed almost as many shots(188) as Mando has attempted(210). Mando is shooting 58.1% to Caleb’s 37.7%. Even when you consider that Caleb has played more minutes(4.5 more MPG), that is still an indication that Caleb is taking too many shots(often bad shots).

Caleb is averaging 3 more shot attempts per game despite RJ shooting much better(6.3% points better in FG% and 12% points better in 3P%). Caleb’s career FG% is 35.7%, 31.3% from long distance. Has any UNC player who shoots so poorly ever had a light this green and played so much, especially given his inconsistent effort on defense?
 
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Yea there is a disconnect there right now with Caleb. Gary called the offense “clunky “. Staff and players have to get on the same page. Caleb has to play aggressively but under control, and regain his confidence. He’ll be fine.
Things Caleb has never been in his career minus 5 or so games last March.

Syracuse game will be really interesting. They don’t allow opponents to shoot FT. They’re pretty bad defensively. They allow a ton of 3pt attempts. We’re gonna settle a lot and shoot a lot of 3’s.

Caleb will have opportunities for rhythm 3’s and shots in this game. A slump busting game candidate.
 
Mando is our best and most consistent player. Caleb is perhaps our most talented but least consistent player(except in poor shot selection). Yet Caleb has missed almost as many shots(188) as Mando has attempted(210). Mando is shooting 58.1% to Caleb’s 37.7%. Even when you consider that Caleb has played more minutes(4.5 more MPG), that is still an indication that Caleb is taking too many shots(often bad shots).

Caleb is averaging 3 more shot attempts per game despite RJ shooting much better(6.3% points better in FG% and 12% points better in 3P%). Caleb’s career FG% is 35.7%, 31.3% from long distance. Has any UNC player who shoots so poorly ever had a light this green and played so much, especially given his inconsistent effort on defense?
I don't believe so for an entire career, but what I found very surprising is Joel Berry in his great senior year. His shots per game and percentage is almost identical to Caleb this year.

Caleb 38.5% on 15.2 shots per game.

Joel 39.6% on 14.6 shots per game
 
...Has any UNC player who shoots so poorly ever had a light this green and played so much, especially given his inconsistent effort on defense?
hubert apparently feels that caleb's offense will be necessary for a final four run and is allowing him to shoot his way out of the slump. i disagree with that, prefer caleb driving to the basket then dishing off when covered or drawing a foul. firing up threes will not help caleb or the team.
 
It is also strange to see a Carolina team that is allowed to bark at the refs the way our guys do. That stuff was absolutely not tolerated by Roy or Dean, but it seems to be acceptable now with HD.
That is because there is some tail wagging the dog going on with Hubert, ypu see it in the barking at the refs and with Love shooting any shot at anytime with no regard of consequences!
 
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All that means is that they foul well above the average per game and on the regular, so, what may look like a FT disparity, it's not. If your defense is centered around committing a lot of fouls (like dook) and knowing that the officials won't call them all, is playing a BB version of Russian roulette, as it will eventually catch up to you and kill you.
Another Keatts M.O., right off the Pitino tree.
 
Yea there is a disconnect there right now with Caleb. Gary called the offense “clunky “. Staff and players have to get on the same page. Caleb has to play aggressively but under control, and regain his confidence. He’ll be fine.
And look, I'm not here to apologize for any particular player, but in fairness, in half-court situations Caleb often goes as our offense goes.

Especially when it gets clunky, and players aren't moving with purpose, he in particular struggles. We all know that Caleb's instinct is to be the alpha and create shots, and that comes in handy at the right times, but when guys are standing around it encourages the bad side of that instinct.
 
Thanks for the analysis G7. That was a very satisfying game because I love it when we put Moo in their place! This is another example of our team's growth! ~ Peeps will soon see that they must find something other than Bully ball to beat us. Was it a perfect win, absolutely not, but that is OK since perfection doesn't exist on the court! I give them a pass on the assists since we spent a great deal of time on the line and many of our baskets came from Bacot working Big Shorty in the post! I was upset by a few of Caleb's shots in the first half, but he proved Hubs correct by impacting the game during winning time through great D and timely makes! If we did not stick with Caleb and RJ while they were improving, we would really be in trouble right now instead of trending toward the top (just like last year)

Way to go Hubs! Peeps often misunderstand change, but we know true growth comes from discomfort. I love how our bench is shaping up (even though it gave a goose egg today for points) and I cannot wait to see us cooking with our entire lineup healthy!

GDTBATH!
 
I agree that Davis' defense has looked noticeably better the last few games. I hope it continues; last year he stepped it up in the second half too. That makes penetration much more difficult, especially when we substitute Dunn/Trimble for Love.

I actually thought Love was a bit better in this game, despite the poor shooting numbers. No turnovers and only one real headscratcher shot (IIRC), which is unforunately progress for him. A few rimmed out but most of them were decent shots, and he got to the line/rim more. I didn't really notice if he was better on D overall, but he definitely got beat a few times, albeit on tough assignments.

Not a good game for Dunn with the shooting and a bad turnover at halfcourt, but in general I'm glad to see him round into our best bench contributor. I'm still a bit skeptical he can start at UNC given his lack of handle, which limits chances to score, and his mediocre size for a wing. Apart from tonight he's been our first solid bench contributor in 2 years though. His shooting, ball control, and decent on-ball D is sorely needed on this team. And Trimble continues to really struggle offensively.

Bacot utterly dominant tonight so not much playing time for Washington, but I hope he can get a bit more time in the coming games. Syracuse may be a good place to start since we need the shooting. Since I am thinking Bacot will return next year I'm curious to see more of whether Washington can play alongside Bacot and guard 4's.
 
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And look, I'm not here to apologize for any particular player, but in fairness, in half-court situations Caleb often goes as our offense goes.

Especially when it gets clunky, and players aren't moving with purpose, he in particular struggles. We all know that Caleb's instinct is to be the alpha and create shots, and that comes in handy at the right times, but when guys are standing around it encourages the bad side of that instinct.
" in half-court situations Caleb often goes as our offense goes."... That is a bit of a which came first chicken or the egg situation. Isn't it just as true that the offense goes as Caleb goes, it kinda has to considering the volume of shots Caleb gets up.

Frankly, I have never seen a UNC player like this, not so sure I want to see another one. I do get it, absolutely amazing that Caleb can go 1-10 or more on a regular basis up to the last 3-5mins of a game and then add scoring that makes the efficiency look better, better not good but looks better. My issue is all the missed shots that have to come in order for the end of game heroics to even be needed. If this kind of thing happened on rare occasions it would be one thing but to see it game in and game out is just strange for a UNC team. Folks talk in terms of Caleb being in a slump but truth is Caleb has never been an efficient shooter for us yet he dominates the shots taken stats and plays huge minutes?

We won that game vs the wuffs by what Bacot and RJ did over the course of the whole game, don't look now but RJ is having a NCAA AA like season, he should be a no brainer pick for ACC 1st team.

Smith and that injury, yeah, hate to see any kid get hurt but that is the risk they all take when they suit up. Plain and simple that flagrant 2 was BULL! They called that ONLY, repeat ONLY because of the result of the play, not what actually happened. It was a common foul in my view, Leaky went up hard to block the shot and to prevent the and 1, same thing happens multiple times each game. Don't toss the kid just because the refs decided to allow the game to get physical, our guys were being roughed up just as bad if not worse, the wuffs were fouling multiple times each possession, yes they called a lot of fouls, they also let a LOT go. There were hard fouls al over the place, our guys were having to check their dental work constantly, what we got 1 tech when Caleb gets hit in the mouth, if you are going to punt Leaky then Morisel should have got the boot then as well. Be consistent, call it both ways or don't call it but don't wait on the results to blow the whistle, blow it on the act. How many times a game does RJ or Caleb get mugged with no call, Bacot is assaulted nearly every game, they may call 1 foul for every 3 they let go on guys defending Bacot.

I will as well add, karma is a beast sometimes isn't it, Smith shoots his mouth off in the days leading up to this game and he is carted off the court, maybe keeping his mouth shut would have been smarter?
 
I don't believe so for an entire career, but what I found very surprising is Joel Berry in his great senior year. His shots per game and percentage is almost identical to Caleb this year.

Caleb 38.5% on 15.2 shots per game.

Joel 39.6% on 14.6 shots per game
Caleb is 15x more talented than JB was. The frustration with Caleb isn’t that he’s inefficient. The frustration is how talented he is and how he tries to utilize that talent.
 
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Caleb is 15x more talented than JB was. The frustration with Caleb isn’t that he’s inefficient. The frustration is how talented he is and how he tries to utilize that talent.
I get that and Caleb is down to 37.8 % I think after the State game. It just surprised me that Joel had the same green light and very similar %. Joel's senior year was excellent, but he also was the de facto get a shot up on the rim guy when possessions got late in the clock.
 
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Although we eventually put the big guy from State (Shaq Jr) in foul trouble which directly led to us pulling away, I’m not sure why we don’t force the ref to make a charge / block call when he was backing down our defensive player whoever that was at the time. A little flop action where you end up on your butt when the guy bangs you I believe would have been an easy way to get him off the floor earlier. What’s to loose? A foul on Washington or Nance? A flopping call? Mando was able to take the banging and hold his own but all others could have taken a charge any time IMO.
 
I wondered the same thing. Nance and Washington would have to be in the same jersey to have a chance to hold position against Big Shorty! Selling the obvious contact couldn't hurt and the worse result would be for him to score. He did that anyway so sell it biguns! Nance looked aggressive on O but he still is not an instinctive defender. He often hesitates to rotate and gets caught napping when the ball moves quickly. I think he will continue to integrate more on O and I hope he buckles down a bit more on D + rebounding!
 
Caleb did better at getting to the line. That’s the only clutch thing he did on offense. I’m proud he at least did that much. His d was better. We need him for a deep run for sure, so I hope he finds his way.
Btw Caleb is taller and can jump higher than jb. That’s it. Jb was the lead dog and controlled our team. Caleb, not so much. So I definitely don’t agree with said posts. But I do find those numbers interestingly close.
 
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Things Caleb has never been in his career minus 5 or so games last March.

Syracuse game will be really interesting. They don’t allow opponents to shoot FT. They’re pretty bad defensively. They allow a ton of 3pt attempts. We’re gonna settle a lot and shoot a lot of 3’s.

Caleb will have opportunities for rhythm 3’s and shots in this game. A slump busting game candidate.
Caleb can get out of control, but he is that guy that is fearless and willing to be aggressive in crunch time. He provides toughness and creativity to us- “Love” his contribution to our team overall. I do see your points in your reply.
 
I don't believe so for an entire career, but what I found very surprising is Joel Berry in his great senior year. His shots per game and percentage is almost identical to Caleb this year.

Caleb 38.5% on 15.2 shots per game.

Joel 39.6% on 14.6 shots per game
conveniently didn't mention % from 3point. If Caleb was shooting 35% from 3 not many would be criticizing him
 
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I have said it before in various threads, and so will say it again. Hubert needs to get control of this team. Especially in the first half, all kinds of three’s jacked up early in the shot clock. And apparently Leaky has a green light as he took two of the quickest ones. RJ started hitting near the end of the half, but he and Caleb both went through their dribbling stretches where they were either auditioning for the NBA, or maybe the Globetrotters. Half of the points Bacot gets come off of offensive rebounds. Every attempt should be made to funnel the ball through him every time down court. But it isn’t. I don’t know if Hubert is actually teaching this heater, skelter, type of play, or if for some reason is too intimidated by some of the players to do anything about it. Recruiting is going well, so he (or either whatever NIL collective is in place) is attracting the talent, but I am waiting on the disciplined team that UNC has had a history of being.
 
Never seen so many people in my life complain because the point guard dribbles. Especially when he is arguably our best player on the team.

Dude just has a objectively GREAT game and people still complaining about him dribbling?
 
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RJ's PER is over 20. Bacot is the only one higher at 27 and PER slants towards rebounders.

He is at 45/39/89 slashes which isn't too far from the vaunted 50/40/90 unicorn gold standard season.

His plus minus versus the average is our 2nd highest easily as well as his win shares. And people just complain about his dribbling. He is the point guard playing the system Hubert has installed.

He cannot make UNC run a high paced transition game. He cannot make people cut. People get open.

Heck, in one scenario last game Leaky refused to pass to a literally wide open next to the basket Washington and passed to RJ instead and RJ tried to get that pass to him after the oversight but the window closed. RJ tends to kick out to open shooters a lot on drives, they just tend to miss them a bunch. However when is the last time we saw a unc player backdoor on an alley oop? Is that cuz we don't pass to it, it is because our personnel doesn't run it.

If RJ tightened up his bad shots just slightly, he would be a 50/40/90 player. However, people still complain. It's bewildering.
 
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