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Roy and B list guys...

DSouthr

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Aug 15, 2002
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Folks are screaming that UNC has to get back to getting those super star talents, they are tired of watching duke, Ky, and kansas get those mega talents.

Yeah, I would love us to get some star guys to but I really do love watching UNC players play for UNC for more than just a single season. Being honest with ya, I just don't see Brandan Wight or Marvin in the same manner as I see many of those like Hansbourgh or Danny Green. Of course I love UNC winning titles but I love watching UNC players develope over their Tar Heel careers, I loved watching Big Joel James come on last season, doubt he ever plays in the NBA but I enjoy the big kid.

Roy, IMO has done a really good job with a team of B-list guys, that is what we have right now, a team of B listers, we won our last title with a team of B listers, we didn't have a lot, well any one & doners. Our last 2 titles, both with Roy as the coach were won with Jr & Sr dominated teams, all starters were Jr or Sr year guys. We have not had that dominating super star since Roy has been at UNC, TYler maybe but he was not even ranked as high as McRoberts was, most of the real super stars in his class went direct to the NBA. Point is no Parkers, no Ochafors, no Anthony (davis or mello), no Durant.

Look for example at Brice, he was well respected but even on our priority list he was not at the top, he was well down our list as that recruiting season began, many UNC fans, most maybe, considered our getting Brice as geez, we went after the best of the best and this guy is all we got? No disrespect to brice but you know the feeling abck when we were recruiting his class. Paige, while well respected, tell the truth, were you ready to jumkjpo out of your chair when ya heard he committed, gurantee ya you were not nearly as excited as you were when Barnes committed.

Roy has crafted a pretty darn nice team out of what I would call B list guys, developed some in to being lotto level draftees but most of Roy's recruits developed in to that more so than being that coming in. matter of fact one of the 2 suppose to be "great" talents for us really never became that in JMM< who was considered to be a clear one & done level guy coming in.

And whats my point you ask, it is that Roy has not done a bad job with talents less than what some other programs have had. We are favored right now to win it all next season and I am not sure we have a lotto guy on our roster, some could be after next season but every big time contributor will be a multi year guy next season. IN todays world, where folks believe you have to have multiple one & doners on your roster to win it all Roy has gone down a different path and has done pretty darn good. Amazing good if you factor in some of the real challenges he has had to deal with since our last Natty.

Think about it, since our last natty we have had a team that blew away the old record of players missing games due to injury in a season , had to deal with problem children like Drew, Ed Davis, Wears, Will Graves, PJ, Lmac, AFAM, Dean passing, his best friend passing, Kendal's foot, JMM never really becoming the super star he was touted ot be coming in. Last season we started the year with what, 5 PGs on our roster at in Jan we could not hold more than shoot arounds in practice because we only had one healthy Pg? Meeks developing some kind of mystery illness that very noticabally effected his last 2 months last season, Page & pinson with very serious injury issues?

Love UNC or not, you have to admit, those things are WAY ABOVE what a normal team has to deal with, take those strange things away and then consider how Roy has done with such a B list of talents, it is pretty amazing when you look at it thru that lens.
 
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Folks are screaming that UNC has to get back to getting those super star talents, they are tired of watching duke, Ky, and kansas get those mega talents.

Yeah, I would love us to get some star guys to but I really do love watching UNC players play for UNC for more than just a single season. Being honest with ya, I just don't see Brandan Wight or Marvin in the same manner as I see many of those like Hansbourgh or Danny Green. Of course I love UNC winning titles but I love watching UNC players develope over their Tar Heel careers, I loved watching Big Joel James come on last season, doubt he ever plays in the NBA but I enjoy the big kid.

Roy, IMO has done a really good job with a team of B-list guys, that is what we have right now, a team of B listers, we won our last title with a team of B listers, we didn't have a lot, well any one & doners. Our last 2 titles, both with Roy as the coach were won with Jr & Sr dominated teams, all starters were Jr or Sr year guys. We have not had that dominating super star since Roy has been at UNC, TYler maybe but he was not even ranked as high as McRoberts was, most of the real super stars in his class went direct to the NBA. Point is no Parkers, no Ochafors, no Anthony (davis or mello), no Durant.

Look for example at Brice, he was well respected but even on our priority list he was not at the top, he was well down our list as that recruiting season began, many UNC fans, most maybe, considered our getting Brice as geez, we went after the best of the best and this guy is all we got? No disrespect to brice but you know the feeling abck when we were recruiting his class. Paige, while well respected, tell the truth, were you ready to jumkjpo out of your chair when ya heard he committed, gurantee ya you were not nearly as excited as you were when Barnes committed.

Roy has crafted a pretty darn nice team out of what I would call B list guys, developed some in to being lotto level draftees but most of Roy's recruits developed in to that more so than being that coming in. matter of fact one of the 2 suppose to be "great" talents for us really never became that in JMM< who was considered to be a clear one & done level guy coming in.

And whats my point you ask, it is that Roy has not done a bad job with talents less than what some other programs have had. We are favored right now to win it all next season and I am not sure we have a lotto guy on our roster, some could be after next season but every big time contributor will be a multi year guy next season. IN todays world, where folks believe you have to have multiple one & doners on your roster to win it all Roy has gone down a different path and has done pretty darn good. Amazing good if you factor in some of the real challenges he has had to deal with since our last Natty.

Think about it, since our last natty we have had a team that blew away the old record of players missing games due to injury in a season , had to deal with problem children like Drew, Ed Davis, Wears, Will Graves, PJ, Lmac, AFAM, Dean passing, his best friend passing, Kendal's foot, JMM never really becoming the super star he was touted ot be coming in. Last season we started the year with what, 5 PGs on our roster at in Jan we could not hold more than shoot arounds in practice because we only had one healthy Pg? Meeks developing some kind of mystery illness that very noticabally effected his last 2 months last season, Page & pinson with very serious injury issues?

Love UNC or not, you have to admit, those things are WAY ABOVE what a normal team has to deal with, take those strange things away and then consider how Roy has done with such a B list of talents, it is pretty amazing when you look at it thru that lens.
Dave, points well taken. The uncertainty OADs create is a concern, especially in a system like ours that has a bigger learning curve than Cal or K's. And my feeling has always been that role players are vital to good teams. It's a matter of identifying the right guys.
Now, I will say that Brice did become a big priority for Roy late in the process. He was a late bloomer who blew up his Sr year. Roy jumped on board after Peach Jam performance down here. Unfortunately Brice's head blew up as well for a minute during his freshman season but he has bought in and developed into an A-list frontline player (Just hoping he keeps learning and improving his defensive footwork!)
Here is where I depart. This is not a team of B-listers amymore since the last recruiting class. Berry, Jackson and Pinson are championship-nucleus players. JB and JJ were my 2 biggest wants at their respective positions long before they committed and Theo is no slouch (and I'll put my talent evalution chops up against anyone who writes for these websites).
 
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Dave, points well taken. The uncertainty OADs create is a concern, especially in a system like ours that has a bigger learning curve than Cal or K's. And my feeling has always been that role players are vital to good teams. It's a matter of identifying the right guys.
Now, I will say that Brice did become a big priority for Roy late in the process. He was a late bloomer who blew up his Sr year. Roy jumped on board after Peach Jam performance down here. Unfortunately Brice's head blew up as well for a minute during his freshman season but he has bought in and developed into an A-list frontline player (Just hoping he keeps learning and improving his defensive footwork!)
Here is where I depart. This is not a team of B-listers amymore since the last recruiting class. Berry, Jackson and Pinson are championship-nucleus players. JB and JJ were my 2 biggest wants at their respective positions long before they committed and Theo is no slouch (and I'll put my talent evalution chops up against anyone who writes for these websites).
I agree, I love watching the players develop over a 3 or 4 year period. However the last title team in 09 had the number 1 rated point guard, shooting guard, and I believe Tyler was top 5 at his position, even though 2 out of the 3 stayed 3 years. I think you need a good mix of 3-4 year players along with 1 or 2 studs that could be 1 and done. I also think Lawson would have left after his second year if he would not have gotten into a little trouble with that traffic stop. So glad he didn't!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
A great thread, highlighting what I've believed for a while: Roy's best teams are not filled with 'A list'-type players.... or maybe we should clarify that - not A+ talent, rather he gets A- guys. The sort of guys who are McD AA's but not necessarily OAD's .... and there's nothing wrong with it!

And, as the OP says, watching a young player grow and develop with the program is much more fun than seeing them play a handful of games and then bolt.

*** Re the A+ and A- its a matter of viewpoint but the way I see it, most A+ type guys are either super can't miss talents (Durant, Davis) or they're physically more mature for their class (Winslow, Oubre)
 
Exactly Oz. In the OAD era, how many clear cut OAD's has Roy had? Barnes and Henson both had the potential to be OAD's but neither was perceived as a can't miss OAD.
 
Didn't Roy offer Skal Labissiere? He's widely regarded as the best pro prospect, a certain one-and-done. Jaylen Brown is a consensus top 3 pick next year. Didn't Roy offer him too? And Brandon Ingram is projected as a middle lottery pick who everyone expects to be one and done.

Just because Roy isn't landing one-and-dones doesn't mean he isn't recruiting them.
 
Didn't Roy offer Skal Labissiere? He's widely regarded as the best pro prospect, a certain one-and-done. Jaylen Brown is a consensus top 3 pick next year. Didn't Roy offer him too? And Brandon Ingram is projected as a middle lottery pick who everyone expects to be one and done.

Just because Roy isn't landing one-and-dones doesn't mean he isn't recruiting them.
I don't think anybody said he doesn't recruit or offer OAD's. Although I didn't read every post word for word.
 
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