September 11, 2001

[keysersosay#1]

Always remember that day and keep the victims and their families in your thoughts and prayers.

Hard to believe it was 16 years ago...I can still remember that day vividly

Rest in Peace to all who died at the hands of the Islamic terrorists, especially the heroes of flight 93 who probably SAVED lives.

 

[BillyL]

 

[BillyL]

Perhaps this is not the thread to bring this up, but, I was always under the impression that Flight 93 was shot down by the Gov't.

 

[keysersosay#1]

No the flight was not shot down .The passengers, upon learning that the attacks on NYC had taken place, took it upon themselves to storm the cockpit and try to overpower the Terrorists.

They pounded and pounded on the cockpit door and the scum terrorists decided that they should take the plane down themselves and crashed it in the cornfield in PA



That is where the phrase ""Lets Roll" became popular

Read the book FLIGHT 93 by Tom McMillan for more details on this heroic group

 

[BillyL]

I have no doubt that the passengers were aware of the day's previous events, and they were planning a revolt. I do believe that the plane was shot down, reports of a military aircraft flying around Flt. 93 and IIRC, they located one of the jet's engines over a mile away from the crash site.
Passenger revolt saving countless others while sacrificing themselves is a much better story than an Air Force F16 Fighter jet shooting down a commercial passenger aircraft.

jmho

 

[bleeduncblue]

I have no doubt that the passengers were aware of the day's previous events, and they were planning a revolt. I do believe that the plane was shot down, reports of a military aircraft flying around Flt. 93 and IIRC, they located one of the jet's engines over a mile away from the crash site.
Passenger revolt saving countless others while sacrificing themselves is a much better story than an Air Force F16 Fighter jet shooting down a commercial passenger aircraft.

jmho

the problem, @BillyL, is that there are too many accounts (7 i believe) of people on the ground who got calls from family members/friends on the plane with the exact same details of what was going on. So if the government did it, it was a highly coordinated effort across multiple families and States.

 

[TarHeelNation11]

@BillyL and @bleeduncblue are both right, in a way.

It was shot down (and I honestly agree with the decision, given the earlier events of the day). The passengers attempting to overthrow the hijackers also happened -- it isn't a contrived story.

 

[keysersosay#1]

Sorry but there has been some detailed examination of all cockpit Voice recordings including the noise from the group that is trying to knock the door down The terrorists are actually heard to say we will take it down. This notion that the plane was shot down is absurd just absurd and it requires a conspiracy that would include the pilots of the planes that supposedly shot the plane down.


All of the above can be verified by watching a minute by minute examination that was superbly done by the History channel... It covers every detail leading up to 9/11... the weeks prior and a minute by minute detailed and thorough replay of that day including ATC controllers, stewardesses on board the plane... all the communications including the cockpit VR that included the words of the hijackers and the calls made to and from the wives, families etc of those on Flight 93. It also includes the PILOTS of those F15 and F 16s that were in the air .Sorry that plane was taken down by the hijackers not shot down

 

[TarHeelNation11]

You should trust me on this one. All I'll say.

 

[toophly1124]

You should trust me on this one. All I'll say.

You sound like G7.

 

[strummingram]

This is an interesting new page. I haven't seen or heard people arguing about Flight 93 crashing, but rather being shot down.

 

[toophly1124]

This is an interesting new page. I haven't seen or heard people arguing about Flight 93 crashing, but rather being shot down.

A first for me as well.

 

[strummingram]

A first for me as well.

That whole day's events needed more controversy and dispute about what people really saw and what really happened.

 

[tarheel0910]

You should trust me on this one. All I'll say.

I know what info you have that you are talking about. I can't say how I know this. Just know that I do know it. You should trust me on this when I say you're wrong. That's all I'm going to say.

 

[BillyL]

@BillyL and @bleeduncblue are both right, in a way.

It was shot down (and I honestly agree with the decision, given the earlier events of the day). The passengers attempting to overthrow the hijackers also happened -- it isn't a contrived story.

You guys should really trust THN11 on this . .

 

[uncboy10]

There was no chance that plane was making it within 10 miles of a major city after the first three planes had already hit their marks. If it wasn't shot down then it certainly was about to be.

I don't have a position either way. But the story of heroism on flight 93 sounds a lot better to the public than a highjacked American plane having to be shot down by our own Air Force. There's no reason why they couldn't have tried to overthrow the highjacks prior to, or even at the moment of the plane being shot down.

 

[Nuk'EM Heels]

Here's to hoping the various 9/11 Memorial statues remain forever.

 

[gteeitup]

You sound like G7.

completely...nailed

 

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

Here's to hoping the various 9/11 Memorial statues remain forever.

Someone will inevitably find something to be offended about with them and they'll be torn down.

 

[gunslingerdick]

Here's to hoping the various 9/11 Memorial statues remain forever.

Exceptional poast.

 

[notashelbyfan]

And yet people still wonder why some people can't just love up to Muslims.

 

[CanuckChuck]

Here's to hoping the various 9/11 Memorial statues remain forever.

Even the ones that honor the terrorists?

CC

 

[tarheel0910]

Even the ones that honor the terrorists?

CC

I'll bite. Which ones honor the terrorists?

 

[strummingram]

I'll bite. Which ones honor the terrorists?

I think you missed the comparison.

 

[tarheel0910]

I think you missed the comparison.

Maybe I did. I assumed it was one of the following:

1. Comparing it to the civil war statue discussion in some way
2. He is some sort of conspiracy theorist who thinks the government is behind 9/11
3. Blames our foreign policy for creating the terrorist

All three are equally stupid, so I'm hoping I missed it.

 

[strummingram]

Maybe I did. I assumed it was one of the following:

1. Comparing it to the civil war statue discussion in some way
2. He is some sort of conspiracy theorist who thinks the government is behind 9/11
3. Blames our foreign policy for creating the terrorist

All three are equally stupid, so I'm hoping I missed it.

I'm guessing #1

 

[tarheel0910]

I'm guessing #1

That was my first guess. It's a stupid comparison.

 

[TarHeelNation11]

That was my first guess. It's a stupid comparison.

As is the comparison of the Confederate statues to Germany and them not having statues to honor Nazis.

 

[strummingram]

As is the comparison of the Confederate statues to Germany and them not having statues to honor Nazis.

I don't quite understand the comparison of the Confederacy to Nazi Germany either. I understand the need to try and make them seem as though they were identical, or at least similar, but I don't think they were either one.

They did lose the Civil War, however. And, it would help if people observe that they lost, and believe that "the good guys" won, and therefore not a lot of need to glorify the Confederacy, or what it stood for, fought to maintain, or has represented to most of society since then. If you're not convinced the United States "should have won the war", then it will continue to be an issue.

As far as 9/11 statues, there are never going to be statues of the terrorists (I hope not). But, maybe in 150 years, or so, the terrorists will be seen differently than they are now. I don't agree with the actions of terrorism. But, I certainly understand the motivation. Unintended consequences are not always pleasant. As long as they believe the USA (and the West, in general) is responsible for the chaos in their homeland, it will just continue.

 

[strummingram]

That was my first guess. It's a stupid comparison.

It's not stupid. Just not very accurate.

 

[nctransplant]

I don't quite understand the comparison of the Confederacy to Nazi Germany either. I understand the need to try and make them seem as though they were identical, or at least similar, but I don't think they were either one.

They did lose the Civil War, however. And, it would help if people observe that they lost, and believe that "the good guys" won, and therefore not a lot of need to glorify the Confederacy, or what it stood for, fought to maintain, or has represented to most of society since then. If you're not convinced the United States "should have won the war", then it will continue to be an issue.

As far as 9/11 statues, there are never going to be statues of the terrorists (I hope not). But, maybe in 150 years, or so, the terrorists will be seen differently than they are now. I don't agree with the actions of terrorism. But, I certainly understand the motivation. Unintended consequences are not always pleasant. As long as they believe the USA (and the West, in general) is responsible for the chaos in their homeland, it will just continue.

So you get the fact that they want a caliphate and jihad, they want to spread Sharia throughout the world?

 

[Raising Heel]

RIP this thread

 

[strummingram]

So you get the fact that they want a caliphate and jihad, they want to spread Sharia throughout the world?

I get that all religions are intended to spread throughout the world. And, if conditions are such that violence and war are present, then what better way to validate your religious incentives and convictions than them? Abrahamic religions have pretty much "conquered" the world. What's funny to me is; Even if there was only "Christianity" left in the world, there'd be enough sub-groups to keep people happily slaughtering each other in the name of Jesus, if the secular conditions allowed the activity to be more prevalent.

 

[CanuckChuck]

I'll bite. Which ones honor the terrorists?

Exactly - so which one's will be removed?

CC

 

[Nuk'EM Heels]

Even the ones that honor the terrorists?

CC

You appear to infer moral equivalence where none should exist. But, for the sake of your stupid post...

Do you infer moral equivalence between AQ terrorists and American Confederate soldiers?

What about Bin Laden and Thomas Jefferson?

Or, are you inferring moral equivalence between AQ terrorists and and the victims of 9/11, those who were killed in the attack.

Or perhaps, ISIS and our Special Forces fighting all over the world.

Or, are you inferring moral equivalence between Christopher Columbus and Mohammed?

What the hell are you saying?

 

[strummingram]

American Confederate soldiers?

Who?

 

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

And, it would help if people observe that they lost, and believe that "the good guys" won

I think it's obvious they lost. I'm a born and bred Northerner, was taught about the Civil War from a Northern perspective, and even I can't bring myself to call one side "good" and one side "bad". Everyone involved in that war was American.

 

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

I think you missed the comparison.

The comparison was an attempted equivalence between Confederate Generals and 9/11 terrorists... As mind boggling stupid as that was, I got it.

 

[strummingram]

I think it's obvious they lost. I'm a born and bred Northerner, was taught about the Civil War from a Northern perspective, and even I can't bring myself to call one side "good" and one side "bad". Everyone involved in that war was American.

It was two cultures that were poised against one another. One included chattel slavery. The American Civil War was an extremely complex, multi-layered event. Most people need everything to be simple.

I don't consider any war as having good or bad sides. That's why I used quotation marks. There are, however, winners and losers. And, I don't believe those are correctly characterized in traditional historical perspectives.

 

[Nuk'EM Heels]

Who?

Confederate States of America. CSA. That was the official Name. The soldiers who fought for the South considered themselves to be Americans.