Stats and stuff (Michigan game)...

[gary-7]

Manley plays way to upright on the defensive end. He has to get big and wide. Guys go around him like it's nothing. Actually, all 3 freshmen bigs do.

Spot on, Coach. I'm giving Sterling more of a pass because of his previous leg injuries, but yeah, being that tall works in HS, but ya better learn to set a base and use your feet at this level.

Coach gave B-Rob every chance to prove he needs more minutes last night, and he just didn't perform. He took a lot of the minutes Platek had been getting, but I expect to see that even back out in Andrew's favor.

As you know, I've been on the Platek bandwagon since I saw him play in EYBL... it was easy to see exactly what Roy saw in him --- kid will be a player for us. On the other hand, I got good reports on BRob from the summer (which usually never fail to come to fruition) and I was excited to see a Sophomore jump. Thus far at least, that hasn't happened. I hate for it to be an either/or situation, but when Cam comes back and the rotation tightens he is in danger of losing priority.

I thought 7th looked good in his short minutes last night. I wish we would just play him a few minutes off the ball and see how comfortable he looks.

Bingo. He looked better offensively, but mostly to the extent that he knocked down a couple of Js. Truth is, in half-court O the floor spacing still collapses, and he was getting bailed out by being paired with JB. I'm sure you're seeing this --- Joel was having to restore order. On one jumper 7th actually got caught in no-man's land and fortunately he didn't get trapped. That being said he did some nice things in transition, BUT all that can be just as easily accomplished from any perimeter position.

I love Kenny. He's like the guard version of George Lynch (had to throw him in since they were honoring 93 team).

Terrific analogy. Nuff said...

 

[gary-7]

No trolling please. We’re trying to discuss basketball here.

Perfect image choice, Arch... That derailment attempt crashed and burned just like your pic depicted

 

[gary-7]

I am aware. If you recall, I had a lot to say about what a boneheaded move it was for him to break his hand because he was mad at a video game. But I won't get back into that.

Does a broken hand change decision making? Does a broken hand change body control. Does a broken hand limit command of the team? He's just not been that tone setter that I was expecting. I think there's a bit of complacency due to the title last year and his MOP performance. It's almost like how some NBA guys don't really wake up until April arrives. I think Joel realizes it's a long season and he's just biding time before having to put in max effort. That's just a hypothesis but if it's not that, I'd be more scared of what it could be.

No offense, but what was wrong with his decision-making? Joel was excellent on both ends last night --- and an absolute terror and clinic on defense. I didn't see the first bit of complacency... and for the first game with that junk off his lead hand he looked very comfortable and you can expect the gathering and ball-control on drives to be back at pre-injury level very shorty.

 

[gunslingerdick]

I didn't see the first bit of complacency... and for the first game with that junk off his lead hand he looked very comfortable and you can expect the gathering and ball-control on drives to be back at pre-injury level very shorty.

He's not Joel of March and April last year. Let's hope you're right and he returns to that level. We'll see, I reckon.

 

[DSouthr]

Berry is still not Berry. I hope he will look more himself in the weeks and months to come and I think he probably will. But right now something is off with him.

Slinger, for now I think we are getting the real Joel, not a dig at the kid but more an assessment of his game. Kid is a solid catch and shoot guy, extended his shooting range and accuracy last season, his other scoring move is driving and putting the ball up high off the back board, high degree of difficulty but he has a knack for it. He isn't the guy that creates his own space with the ball or a guy that is going to get you double digit assists, when he drives he is looking to finish first rather than like Theo who is looking to pass first on his drives.

Now Joel has the heart of a lion but he is on the smallish side for PGs now days and he isn't a quickster, not saying he is slow but typically smallish PGs tend to be quicker and have great lateral feet and from what I see those are not things Joel was born with and ya kinda do have to be born with that stuff. He makes the best out of what he has.

Last season Justin drained off a lot of the focus that for now is on Joel from defenses, Luke is draining some of that away but we don't have those big bail out guys. Cam coming back will certainly help, Jalek getting his game going will as well, Kenny is playing much sharper on the offensive end this season by driving much more but Joel is the primary guy that defenses will look to stop. Watch his shot selection for a gauge on how effective a defense is on Joel, when you see him taking a bunch of step back extended long treys or falling away treys they are getting to him. Give Joel clean looks and he will hit a high % of them but no one hits a high % of fall away treys. Joel moves really well off the ball but we do have some inexperienced kids trying to set solid screens for him that will be more effective 2yrs from now than they are today. Joel will look a LOT better when and if he can get another near 40% 3pt threat out there with him, that guy may be Cam, it could be Jalek or Platek and kenny has his average well up. Being our 4 and 5 Luke can only do so much to drain defenses off Joel in the back court.

 

[gary-7]

Slinger, for now I think we are getting the real Joel, not a dig at the kid but more an assessment of his game. Kid is a solid catch and shoot guy, extended his shooting range and accuracy last season, his other scoring move is driving and putting the ball up high off the back board, high degree of difficulty but he has a knack for it. He isn't the guy that creates his own space with the ball or a guy that is going to get you double digit assists, when he drives he is looking to finish first rather than like Theo who is looking to pass first on his drives.

Now Joel has the heart of a lion but he is on the smallish side for PGs now days and he isn't a quickster, not saying he is slow but typically smallish PGs tend to be quicker and have great lateral feet and from what I see those are not things Joel was born with and ya kinda do have to be born with that stuff. He makes the best out of what he has.

Last season Justin drained off a lot of the focus that for now is on Joel from defenses, Luke is draining some of that away but we don't have those big bail out guys. Cam coming back will certainly help, Jalek getting his game going will as well, Kenny is playing much sharper on the offensive end this season by driving much more but Joel is the primary guy that defenses will look to stop. Watch his shot selection for a gauge on how effective a defense is on Joel, when you see him taking a bunch of step back extended long treys or falling away treys they are getting to him. Give Joel clean looks and he will hit a high % of them but no one hits a high % of fall away treys. Joel moves really well off the ball but we do have some inexperienced kids trying to set solid screens for him that will be more effective 2yrs from now than they are today. Joel will look a LOT better when and if he can get another near 40% 3pt threat out there with him, that guy may be Cam, it could be Jalek or Platek and kenny has his average well up. Being our 4 and 5 Luke can only do so much to drain defenses off Joel in the back court.

JB can and will create his own shot. The wrap is gone. Watch and enjoy.

 

[nctransplant]

I love Berry but he is not the best passer we have had(not even close) nor is he a good finisher in the lane(Roy himself said that). He is a leader by example and his refusal to lose. He's not quick or a great leaper but he's tough and plays hard. Best thing is he's a Tar Heel.

 

[TheFamily22]

I think Joel realizes it's a long season and he's just biding time before having to put in max effort.

Does anyone think that with all the playing minutes that our core 4 are getting and how hard they are playing (hitting the floor for loose balls) along with the lack of production from our bench, that this could burn us out come late Feb, early March?

 

[Archer2]

Does anyone think that with all the playing minutes that our core 4 are getting and how hard they are playing (hitting the floor for loose balls) along with the lack of production from our bench, that this could burn us out come late Feb, early March?

Anything’s possible, if we continue to do so all season long. I’ve certainly seen the LOM do it a few seasons. But Roy has always played his bench more that K.

Right now, we need our starters to log big minutes in order to win and hopefully earn a high seed. Because right now, there’s a big drop off from our starters to the bench. Part of that is Cam being hurt and Seventh dealing with PF. And part of it is inexperience.

Hopefully the young guys will come along, we get Cam back, and we can play our bench a little more.

 

[mikeirbyusa]

Tuff crowd.

 

[TheFamily22]

Anything’s possible, if we continue to do so all season long. I’ve certainly seen the LOM do it a few seasons. But Roy has always played his bench more that K.

Right now, we need our starters to log big minutes in order to win and hopefully earn a high seed. Because right now, there’s a big drop off from our starters to the bench. Part of that is Cam being hurt and Seventh dealing with PF. And part of it is inexperience.

Hopefully the young guys will come along, we get Cam back, and we can play our bench a little more.

I think I am just more concerned with Maye and Williams. Maye is playing twice as much as he did last year. Can he do that for 30 more games? Williams is playing hard coming off those injuries. Does that have an effect late in the season? I'm just hoping we can get more production out of our bench so we can rely less on these guys.

 

[MWHeels]

I love how Manley stayed at the building after last night's game to get some extra work. For most kids, the talent and production will come if they have the right work ethic.

 

[Ozheelfan]

I think I am just more concerned with Maye and Williams. Maye is playing twice as much as he did last year. Can he do that for 30 more games? Williams is playing hard coming off those injuries. Does that have an effect late in the season? I'm just hoping we can get more production out of our bench so we can rely less on these guys.

Was thinking about this after Michigan State.... I think the team needs a couple of cupcake games.... rest the startes legs whilst giving the bench some much needed court time.

 

[gary-7]

Anything’s possible, if we continue to do so all season long. I’ve certainly seen the LOM do it a few seasons. But Roy has always played his bench more that K.

Right now, we need our starters to log big minutes in order to win and hopefully earn a high seed. Because right now, there’s a big drop off from our starters to the bench. Part of that is Cam being hurt and Seventh dealing with PF. And part of it is inexperience.

Hopefully the young guys will come along, we get Cam back, and we can play our bench a little more.

...and fellas, we're gonna have to face the reality of this unbalanced, freshman-heavy roster. The Core Four are going to have to play big minutes for us to be successful. Hopefully that will expand to include Cam getting bigger minutes as he works back in, but still. Many championship teams have relied on big minutes from a few guys. Roy will work his bench in for sure and get the starters as much relief as he can afford to do, but when push comes to shove in March JB, Theo, KW and Luke --- especially JB and Luke --- are going to need to be 30+ mpg guys for us to be our best.

 

[trestyles]

Did I really read Joel cant create his own shot?? Guess we throwing all of last year out the window huh? Smh

Please don’t become a basketball scout.

 

[Archer2]

...and fellas, we're gonna have to face the reality of this unbalanced, freshman-heavy roster. The Core Four are going to have to play big minutes for us to be successful. Hopefully that will expand to include Cam getting bigger minutes as he works back in, but still. Many championship teams have relied on big minutes from a few guys. Roy will work his bench in for sure and get the starters as much relief as he can afford to do, but when push comes to shove in March JB, Theo, KW and Luke --- especially JB and Luke --- are going to need to be 30+ mpg guys for us to be our best.

I don't think there's much doubt about that, Gary. I think all four are going to have to play at least 28-30 MPG if we're to contend for the conference regular season title. Hopefully the other players will step up their play and the gap between the starters and the suns won’t be so wide.

 

[TheFamily22]

...and fellas, we're gonna have to face the reality of this unbalanced, freshman-heavy roster. The Core Four are going to have to play big minutes for us to be successful. Hopefully that will expand to include Cam getting bigger minutes as he works back in, but still. Many championship teams have relied on big minutes from a few guys. Roy will work his bench in for sure and get the starters as much relief as he can afford to do, but when push comes to shove in March JB, Theo, KW and Luke --- especially JB and Luke --- are going to need to be 30+ mpg guys for us to be our best.

No doubt, I agree with you. I just wonder if our core 4 can make it 30 minutes a game for the rest of the year. Berry, I have no doubts can, but the other three have never played a full season at 25-30 mins a game. I just hope they can hold up to the pounding. Hopefully Cam will be able to take some some of those minutes, 7th and Jalek can continue growing to take some pressure off of them.

 

[MWHeels]

I agree with what many on here are saying about the extended playing time for the "core 4" of the team. I think it will work itself out as the season goes on. Cam coming back into the rotation will definitely help, as will the continued development of the freshmen bigs, and more importantly, Felton. If Roy can get to a point where he trusts Felton on defense, that will take a lot of the pressure off playing Berry for extended minutes.

The good thing is that we have a couple of low drama games coming up followed by a nice break before the Tennessee road game.

 

[Archer2]

Fact is most teams play their starters 30+ MPG. We’re just so used to Roy spreading the PT around. It’s a bit ironic that we’re discussing whether we should be playing the starters less when it’s usually the opposite.

I trust Roy to work out the optimal equation, based on how all the players progress. It’s one of his fortes.

 

[TPFKAPFS]

If 7th continues progressing (we got a glimpse of some progress last game) and the game slows a bit for Felton, JB can get the rest he needs. Felton's development would also allow 7th some time off the ball too. CJ returning in Jan is perfect timing for our ACC run too. It looks to me that we can count on Brooks and Manley to receive increased minutes due to their progress. I believe BRob just had a bad game last outing so I'm counting on him to recover and he should be motivated by the play of Platek.

We have the pieces and for the most part they are developing solidly so I am not worried about minutes. We could easily have a solid 9 man rotation (possibly 10-11) by ACC time and that would be great! (then peeps could return to complaining about Roy playing too many or subbing too much, lol)

 

[mikeirbyusa]

JB can and will create his own shot. The wrap is gone. Watch and enjoy.

Agree 100%.

 

[soap - new and improved]

It still boggles my mind how rarely JB gets a foul call on his drives, regardless of how much contact he absorbs, especially considering they way many guards get whistles with little to no contact at all. Repeatedly. And not only those who play for dook.

 

[gobblercalls]

It still boggles my mind how rarely JB gets a foul call on his drives, regardless of how much contact he absorbs, especially considering they way many guards get whistles with little to no contact at all. Repeatedly. And not only those who play for dook.

He doesn't "sell" the contact with arms flailing and head flopping. I hope he doesn't change.

 

[soap - new and improved]

He doesn't "sell" the contact with arms flailing and head flopping. I hope he doesn't change.

You are probably right, I do wonder if it goes beyond that at times. You shouldn't have to "sell" a foul, and imo you should be T'd up for acting/flopping etc. Add those to the list of things I don't care for in this era of basketball.

 

[gobblercalls]

You are probably right, I do wonder if it goes beyond that at times. You shouldn't have to "sell" a foul, and imo you should be T'd up for acting/flopping etc. Add those to the list of things I don't care for in this era of basketball.

I agree 100%. That's 1 of the things ratface has done to ruin college basketball.

 

[Archer2]

I agree 100%. That's 1 of the things ratface has done to ruin college basketball.

Beat me to it. I was just going to say that is one of the LOM’s contributions to college basketball.

 

[gary-7]

You are probably right, I do wonder if it goes beyond that at times. You shouldn't have to "sell" a foul, and imo you should be T'd up for acting/flopping etc. Add those to the list of things I don't care for in this era of basketball.

Yeah, as gobbler said, he doesn't flail and head-whip. Another reason is that JB is just so damned strong. His body holds his line thru contact. That SHOULDN'T affect the calls --- contact is contact --- but...
Bottom line is you're absolutely right, soap. Joel has been hammered over and over during his career with nowhere near the appropriate number of FTs to show for it.

 

[TPFKAPFS]

He gets the Baby Shaq treatment!
No flop, no foul!