Stats and stuff (UVA game ACCT w/ Tourney wrap -up)....

[gary-7]

...and right off the bat the rotation on Marcus' 3-ball did not look like it did last 2 games (ruh-roh), and when I saw the officiating crew (again, well, ruh-roh) --- but y'know what? We played through it.

The bad:
- Give-away TOs --- But here's a mitigating factor: Of our 10 total TOs , 5 were absolutely zebra-aided. I mean, when Gill is allowed to knee and undercut Hicks and knock him to the floor for a traveling call? GMAB.

- 3 pt shooting. 3/12 ain't good enough but each one was huge.

- We allowed too many Offensive Rebounds, but there were a lot of long ones because we had them struggling from the field. They got 16 BUT only scored 6 pts off of them because our defense was so damned good.

The good:
- Given the typical uncalled UVA stuff inside, we took care of the ball pretty well and passed aggressively. Brice quietly got 5 Assists on interior passing.

- Once again, DEFENSE. What an effort. Help-D was spot on again, our Bigs were protecting the rim, and our Guards were just plain nasty.

- Speaking of D --- Kenny Williams stepped in and gave is another sequence of good defense on Brogdon, and JB and Nate took him for a few turns, but HUGE kudos to Marcus for a herculean effort on Brogdon, whom he was guarding most of his 34 minutes.

- Speaking of our Guards --- how did UVA's vaunted Senior backcourt do against Joel Berry and Marcus Paige? Well, lessee:
London Parrentes (ACC leading 3-pt shooter) 3/14 FGs, 2/8 from 3
Malcolm Brogdon (ACC Player of the Year) 6/22 FGs, 2/9 from 3
'Nuff said.
[edit: see the pretty astounding addendum below in this thread]

- JJ had a rough offensive game, but Buckets came up with some key second half plays, including the steal and score and put-backs.

- Brice was again a grown-ass man in the very "physical" trenches tonight.

- Kudos also to Marcus for not letting his outside shooting woes (0/7 from 3) deter him from being an offensive factor. He fought and drove and created and scored in traffic and did what he had to do. He was 5/6 on his 2 pt shots.

- And finally a well-deserved tourney MVP to Joel Berry. Besides another nasty defensive effort, our cold-blooded dog scored 19, including all our 3s (3/3) and was ice-water from the FT line (6/6).
And for the 3 games of the tournament: 51 points, 17/24 FGs, 7/10 3s, 10/10 FTs

Bonus -Tournament wrap-up:
- Congrats to JB, Marcus and Brice for making the All-Tournament team.

- Finally folks, it comes down to this - D E F E N S E .
Check it out --- we just beat three NCAA Tourney teams, and held them to these FG numbers:
UVA 23/63
ND 15/50
Pitt 24/54
-------------
That's a tourney total of 62/167 = 37.1%... oh, and that's an average of 58.3 PPG. Are you kidding me?

Our guys wanted this one bad and they played through it and were tough as nails.
We're ACCT Champions, bitches!!! Enjoy.Then let's go get the next one......

 

[wilsinnc]

One of the best defensive tourney performance i have in a looooong time. Our guys took roys words to heart and played like we knew this team could. Its hard to do for an entire yr but i think they have a laser focus right now. Thats a very good thing headed to the big dance

 

[Steat]

Well done Gary!

 

[gary-7]

One of the best defensive tourney performance i have in a looooong time. Our guys took roys words to heart and played like we knew this team could. Its hard to do for an entire yr but i think they have a laser focus right now. Thats a very good thing headed to the big dance

Here's a tourney defensive addendum from our nasty backcourt:
UVA
Parrentes 3/14 FGs, 2/8 3s
Brogdon 6/22 FGs. 2/9 3s

ND
Jackson 1/10 FGs, 1/5 3s
Vestuvia 0/6 FGs , 0/1 3s

Pitt
Robinson 3/8 FGs , 1/1 3s
Johnson 2/10 FGs, 0/4 3s

OPPOSING STARTING BACKCOURT TOTALS
15/70 (21.4%) FGs , 6/28 (21.4%) 3s

Are you f***ing kidding me???

 

[soap - new and improved]

Great write up, the foul that cause Hicks "travel" a frigging blind man could have seen. I stopped counting the uncalled UVA fouls at 32. Truth is I despise Bennet because he preaches the same "foul a lot they'll never call them all" philosophy as Coach Kry and that asshat Rick Barnes. That philosophy is ruining college basketball.

 

[HeelFan58]

I mean really the officials had called all of 11 fouls in the 2nd half almost at game end? They should have their pay docked. Marcus and Nate each had a 3 that was almost down but came back out. The mugging Isaiah absorbed on the traveling call was a chargeable assault. Bryce's put back on a 2nd rebound was huge. Justin's steal and run out dunk was also huge. I questioned Gary's praise of JB in the preseason and I was wrong. He gets better every game. I am on the JB bandwagon.

 

[mikeirbyusa]

So very proud of all our backcourt guys, especially Marcus and JB, those two showed out!

 

[Archer2]

Thanks, Gary. Always enjoy your perspective, even on those rare occasions when I disagree. Gutty performance last night, especially defensively.

 

[DSouthr]

J-ACCT MVP-B3 ! Has a heck of a ring to it don't it fellas!

O got really upset earlier this season, we went in to that extended road trio of games, struggled and watched posters here say some crazy things. What really upset me was the assertion that this season's team was no different than last season's team and to some even the season before that. Some one that has watched us play for that span, I just can not understand how folks could be so short sited.

Of freakin course this team is different than we were last season and thou our only additions were 2 frosh that play very little. Last season the guy that was far to often trying to be our defacto PG was JP? Yall remember JP don't ya, great athlete, high riser, couldn't shoot a lick (being nice) and was a "sketchy" passer, to say he was an adventure at the free throw line is being overly nice? yall remember him don't ya, yall remember his role last season don't ya? He left after last season, yall remember that don't ya, well this season he is none of those things in a UNC uniform.

Anyone still wonder who our PG is, anyone still wonder who our PG should be, anyone see our PG start a single game last season, I didn't? Joel Berry does not just make this team some what different. Joel berry makes this team night & day better on both ends of the court. You could press us last season if you got the ball out of marcus's hands, not recomended this season because we have a junk yard dawg that will take your lunch money if ya try. Everyone complained at the lack of tuffness, what I call grit in our team last season but no one that has watched Joel berry play a single game this season should question the grit in that young man. When Joel did begin to get more PT late last season, he tended to deferr pretty much everything to marcus, Joel Berry does not defer anything now days.

But there is another kid on this team that comes off our bench that has that same kind of grit, he got hurt last season just as he was beginning to get PT. Kid didn't really have an off season to work on his game, he was in a cast so his start to his soph season was a bit slow. But NO ONE that watched Theo Pinson play should question if that kid has that grit that we beg for.

There is another kid to, he as well comes off our bench, had a good soph season but not great. This season thou he has flipped the switch, he has become a monster inside, kid attacks the basket, I mean attacks it as if his life were on the line and he does not seem to care if it is thru contact or not. Issiah Hicks won 6th man of the year and best i can recall he did not win that honor last season nor would I suggest he should have.

There is this other fella, he starts for us, he was at best a late first round NBA selection, could well have fallen to the second round, last season played sometimes with a strong motor and sometimes that motor didn't really rev up that high. But yall know who Brice Johnson is don't ya? Well he now is IMO the best player in the ACC, no disrespect toward Brogden but I will take Brice any day of the week and twice on the 7th. His jersey will now be forever raised in honor of what he has achieved in his UNC career, he is 1st team NCAA, and he is now a no brainer NBA lotto selection and very likey one of the first 3-5 names called. Brice did not play like this last season as I recall it, yall recollect it different?

FREE THROW shooting, we were pretty much the punch line to a joke for the prior 3 years at the free throw line. It was news at times that some of our players even touched the rim with their free throws. Last season when Brice, Hicks, Joel James, Meeks, JP went to the line I cringed, don't think I was the only one that did. Not looking at any stats I would think we were the worst free throw shooting team in the ACC last season and maybe the worst in the nation, hate to see the team that was worse. But look now, if we are not the best free throw shooting team in the ACC we are not far behind who ever is. WE have gone from one of the worst free throw shooting teams in the country to one of the best and no one seems to have noticed that fact? A pretty smart fella named Dean stongly believed that one of his pillars for winning basketball was hitting your free throws, yeah, he knew a thing or 2.

Issiah or Brice step to the line, those fellas are in the high 80's% wise now! Rather than JP marching to the line and feeling good that at least he hit one of them (which didn't always happen) we have Joel berry putting the game out of reach last night by canning 2 huge back breaking free throws. There is actually not a single guy that I cringe when he steps to the line for this team this season and that is night and day different from last season.

So we were soft last season, we are not soft this season. When you can see defense played against 3 NCAAT teams in 3 days at the level UNC has just shown you, lose that word soft as a descriptor for this UNC team. We absolutely FLIPPED THE SCRIPT on UVa, we out defensed them, we beat them at their own game, nobody does that to UVa, we just did that!

Oh yeah and by the way, couple final little tid bits, were we the ACC Regular season champions last season? Did we beat duke in Cameron last season? Did we win the ACCT last season? Was a player that came off our bench last season named ACCT MVP last season?

yeah, that is what i thought, no, that is what I knew, this team is MUCH BETTER than we were last season, that was true when folks were making those crazy statements and it is no less true today!

And that is not a I TOLD YA SO moment, it is nothing more than my attempt to show folks, let things play out, don't be so rash to judge, it is a long season with a lot of twists & turns and every team is going to have its peaks and valleys. No need to freak when we hit a valley, you should know there is another peak just around the corner waiting to happen. Don't demand perfection but expect improvement, no need to panic & give up at the first sign of adversity. I wish our fans would at times practice as much at patience as they do rashness to gloom. You would revolt if this team quit, why is so easy for our fans at times to give up on these players and coaches? Don't demand those players not give up if you can not practice what you preach...

 

[gary-7]

I mean really the officials had called all of 11 fouls in the 2nd half almost at game end? They should have their pay docked. Marcus and Nate each had a 3 that was almost down but came back out. The mugging Isaiah absorbed on the traveling call was a chargeable assault. Bryce's put back on a 2nd rebound was huge. Justin's steal and run out dunk was also huge. I questioned Gary's praise of JB in the preseason and I was wrong. He gets better every game. I am on the JB bandwagon.

That's a fair description, 58... that crew was friggin' useless. What kills me is that the league PTB are supposedly evaluating refs to decide who gets to do the big games. Seriously? These 3 clowns are a virtual rogues gallery of bad-zebra culprits, yet sadly they're 3 of the most recognized names in the ACC rotation. I literally cringe any time I see any of them at one of our games. Hell (referring back to the late 20th Century), Roy seeing those guys probably reprised the sick feeling I'm sure Dean got walking out and seeing Lenny Wirtz, Dick Paparo and Teddy Valentine wearing striped shirts at a Carolina game. Sad thing is, the crew Friday (Les Jones, Brian Dorsey, Jerry Heater) did a damn fair job --- which of course meant there's no WAY we would see any of them in the championship game .

As for Berry, I know I have probably sounded like his PR agent sometimes but there was a good reason for that. Young fella was 3-times statewide Player of the Year in the 3rd most populous state in America (with a lot of schools that recruit). That never happened before and most likely will never happen again. But even that didn't do it for me --- what did it was my eyes. Back in 2013 before he committed, my most trusted AAU source texted me "Roy has his PG". Obviously I checked him out, and 58, it took me just one half of one game to figure out what we had. The kid is special --- and yeah, Carolina is Point Guard U --- even by those jaded standards. I posted on here when he committed, "we have our next great Carolina PG". Not just as a fan, but from a system standpoint, I'm a Carolina guy, and we run a PG dependent system, so I don't say stuff like that lightly .

 

[gary-7]

J-ACCT MVP-B3 ! Has a heck of a ring to it don't it fellas!

O got really upset earlier this season, we went in to that extended road trio of games, struggled and watched posters here say some crazy things. What really upset me was the assertion that this season's team was no different than last season's team and to some even the season before that. Some one that has watched us play for that span, I just can not understand how folks could be so short sited.

Of freakin course this team is different than we were last season and thou our only additions were 2 frosh that play very little. Last season the guy that was far to often trying to be our defacto PG was JP? Yall remember JP don't ya, great athlete, high riser, couldn't shoot a lick (being nice) and was a "sketchy" passer, to say he was an adventure at the free throw line is being overly nice? yall remember him don't ya, yall remember his role last season don't ya? He left after last season, yall remember that don't ya, well this season he is none of those things in a UNC uniform.

Anyone still wonder who our PG is, anyone still wonder who our PG should be, anyone see our PG start a single game last season, I didn't? Joel Berry does not just make this team some what different. Joel berry makes this team night & day better on both ends of the court. You could press us last season if you got the ball out of marcus's hands, not recomended this season because we have a junk yard dawg that will take your lunch money if ya try. Everyone complained at the lack of tuffness, what I call grit in our team last season but no one that has watched Joel berry play a single game this season should question the grit in that young man. When Joel did begin to get more PT late last season, he tended to deferr pretty much everything to marcus, Joel Berry does not defer anything now days.

But there is another kid on this team that comes off our bench that has that same kind of grit, he got hurt last season just as he was beginning to get PT. Kid didn't really have an off season to work on his game, he was in a cast so his start to his soph season was a bit slow. But NO ONE that watched Theo Pinson play should question if that kid has that grit that we beg for.

There is another kid to, he as well comes off our bench, had a good soph season but not great. This season thou he has flipped the switch, he has become a monster inside, kid attacks the basket, I mean attacks it as if his life were on the line and he does not seem to care if it is thru contact or not. Issiah Hicks won 6th man of the year and best i can recall he did not win that honor last season nor would I suggest he should have.

There is this other fella, he starts for us, he was at best a late first round NBA selection, could well have fallen to the second round, last season played sometimes with a strong motor and sometimes that motor didn't really rev up that high. But yall know who Brice Johnson is don't ya? Well he now is IMO the best player in the ACC, no disrespect toward Brogden but I will take Brice any day of the week and twice on the 7th. His jersey will now be forever raised in honor of what he has achieved in his UNC career, he is 1st team NCAA, and he is now a no brainer NBA lotto selection and very likey one of the first 3-5 names called. Brice did not play like this last season as I recall it, yall recollect it different?

FREE THROW shooting, we were pretty much the punch line to a joke for the prior 3 years at the free throw line. It was news at times that some of our players even touched the rim with their free throws. Last season when Brice, Hicks, Joel James, Meeks, JP went to the line I cringed, don't think I was the only one that did. Not looking at any stats I would think we were the worst free throw shooting team in the ACC last season and maybe the worst in the nation, hate to see the team that was worse. But look now, if we are not the best free throw shooting team in the ACC we are not far behind who ever is. WE have gone from one of the worst free throw shooting teams in the country to one of the best and no one seems to have noticed that fact? A pretty smart fella named Dean stongly believed that one of his pillars for winning basketball was hitting your free throws, yeah, he knew a thing or 2.

Issiah or Brice step to the line, those fellas are in the high 80's% wise now! Rather than JP marching to the line and feeling good that at least he hit one of them (which didn't always happen) we have Joel berry putting the game out of reach last night by canning 2 huge back breaking free throws. There is actually not a single guy that I cringe when he steps to the line for this team this season and that is night and day different from last season.

So we were soft last season, we are not soft this season. When you can see defense played against 3 NCAAT teams in 3 days at the level UNC has just shown you, lose that word soft as a descriptor for this UNC team. We absolutely FLIPPED THE SCRIPT on UVa, we out defensed them, we beat them at their own game, nobody does that to UVa, we just did that!

Oh yeah and by the way, couple final little tid bits, were we the ACC Regular season champions last season? Did we beat duke in Cameron last season? Did we win the ACCT last season? Was a player that came off our bench last season named ACCT MVP last season?

yeah, that is what i thought, no, that is what I knew, this team is MUCH BETTER than we were last season, that was true when folks were making those crazy statements and it is no less true today!

And that is not a I TOLD YA SO moment, it is nothing more than my attempt to show folks, let things play out, don't be so rash to judge, it is a long season with a lot of twists & turns and every team is going to have its peaks and valleys. No need to freak when we hit a valley, you should know there is another peak just around the corner waiting to happen. Don't demand perfection but expect improvement, no need to panic & give up at the first sign of adversity. I wish our fans would at times practice as much at patience as they do rashness to gloom. You would revolt if this team quit, why is so easy for our fans at times to give up on these players and coaches? Don't demand those players not give up if you can not practice what you preach...

Testify, Brother Dave

 

[HeelFan58]

Testify, Brother Dave

serious testifying.

 

[soap - new and improved]

That's a fair description, 58... that crew was friggin' useless. What kills me is that the league PTB are supposedly evaluating refs to decide who gets to do the big games. Seriously? These 3 clowns are a virtual rogues gallery of bad-zebra culprits, yet sadly they're 3 of the most recognized names in the ACC rotation. I literally cringe any time I see any of them at one of our games. Hell (referring back to the late 20th Century), Roy seeing those guys probably reprised the sick feeling I'm sure Dean got walking out and seeing Lenny Wirtz, Dick Paparo and Teddy Valentine wearing striped shirts at a Carolina game. Sad thing is, the crew Friday (Les Jones, Brian Dorsey, Jerry Heater) did a damn fair job --- which of course meant there's no WAY we would see any of them in the championship game .

I used to fantasize about those guys blowing a knee or snapping an ankle so badly they could never ref again. Frankly they were so bad and/or corrupt they deserved it. And then we got saddled with Karl Friggen Hess. I wish we had back all the games he cost us, and dook would have lost all the games he helped hand them.

Based on the officiating Roy and UNC have had to face in the last 10+ years I would say the main criteria for being judged "one of the ACC's best Refs" is being found "most likely to screw UNC Hard whenever given the chance". I am still pissed about the ref-rumping we took in last years ACC Title game. Total one way traffic. ND allowed to foul like hell and get many steals/tos with no call, and UNC whistled for even a hard look at an opponent handling the ball. Did it get into our guys heads? Damn right it did, and it would have messed with ANY team anywhere. Roy and UNC were flat out robbed in that game.

And last night vs UVA late in the game what happens? a Key BLOWN Call gives UVA another unearned possession. Johnson never touched that ball that hit the top of the backboard. Really wasn't close enough for a good ref to EVER think he actually did.

 

[Ozheelfan]

.......And that is not a I TOLD YA SO moment, it is nothing more than my attempt to show folks, let things play out, don't be so rash to judge, it is a long season with a lot of twists & turns and every team is going to have its peaks and valleys. No need to freak when we hit a valley, you should know there is another peak just around the corner waiting to happen. Don't demand perfection but expect improvement, no need to panic & give up at the first sign of adversity. I wish our fans would at times practice as much at patience as they do rashness to gloom. You would revolt if this team quit, why is so easy for our fans at times to give up on these players and coaches? Don't demand those players not give up if you can not practice what you preach...

A lotta words there Dave and every one of them is gold. last paragraph is super appropriate given the activity on here over the last month or so. No post policing, just wishing everyone could enjoy the ride till the end.

Oh yeah, and the Heels are ACC champs and a #1 tourney seed baby

 

[Archer2]

And that is not a I TOLD YA SO moment, it is nothing more than my attempt to show folks, let things play out, don't be so rash to judge, it is a long season with a lot of twists & turns and every team is going to have its peaks and valleys. No need to freak when we hit a valley, you should know there is another peak just around the corner waiting to happen. Don't demand perfection but expect improvement, no need to panic & give up at the first sign of adversity. I wish our fans would at times practice as much at patience as they do rashness to gloom. You would revolt if this team quit, why is so easy for our fans at times to give up on these players and coaches? Don't demand those players not give up if you can not practice what you preach...

Amen, brother Dave.

What if we had a player who went on social media after a bad loss and said "it's time Roy Williams retired", or "player A is a wasted scholarship", or "player B doesn't play a lick of defense", or "player C will never make it in the pros", or "player D cost us that game", or "players E/F/G shouldn't be getting any PT", or "I've had it with this team", etc...? As fans, we'd say that player was out of line and was not being a good teammate, and rightfully so.

Yet we have fans who routinely say those very things. Fans who don't routinely practice with the other players and interact with the coaches. Fans who don't have 1% of the blood, sweat, and tears invested in this team that the players do. Fans whose very future is not impacted by what happens on the court, unlike the players themselves. Fans who, by and large, are much older and supposedly, more mature than the players.

Yet we hold these youngsters to a higher standard than we hold ourselves as fans. One of the most important lessons I learned from sports, and it was ingrained in me from an early age, is that you win together and you lose together. It's easy to be a gracious winner, but true character is displayed when you can lose with grace.

I realize that UNC has a basketball tradition that is paralleled by few. As such, fans have come to expect a certain level of excellence every year. I get that. But the wonderful thing about college sports is that every team is unique and has it's own identity. Players are constantly coming and going, roles are constantly evolving. Some teams have a better work ethic than others, some a higher basketball IQ, some more talent, and some more grit. But every one is unique. So to expect every team to play as hard, as smart, or as well as it's predecessors is not realistic.

We have been blessed, some would say spoiled, to have had over half a century of sustained success, with relatively few down years in the process. But every preseason I try to have realistic expectations for the cast of characters that particular team is going to have. And I always look forward to watching that group develop and improve, based on their particular skill set, not those of past teams.

It's why I stated that I've never been prouder to see a UNC team win the ACC than I am of this team. They've dealt with adversity and thrived. We've had significantly more talented teams, but it's one of the finest groups of young men ever to represent the university, something that can't be overstated, IMO.

 

[Archer2]

As for Berry, I know I have probably sounded like his PR agent sometimes but there was a good reason for that. Young fella was 3-times statewide Player of the Year in the 3rd most populous state in America (with a lot of schools that recruit). That never happened before and most likely will never happen again. But even that didn't do it for me --- what did it was my eyes. Back in 2013 before he committed, my most trusted AAU source texted me "Roy has his PG". Obviously I checked him out, and 58, it took me just one half of one game to figure out what we had. The kid is special --- and yeah, Carolina is Point Guard U --- even by those jaded standards. I posted on here when he committed, "we have our next great Carolina PG". Not just as a fan, but from a system standpoint, I'm a Carolina guy, and we run a PG dependent system, so I don't say stuff like that lightly .

Well, I was beginning to wonder if you were in line to get a percentage when he turns pro, Gary.

Seriously, you and Dave have been touting him all along. And both of you were adamant in saying he should be handed the reins to the team from the gitgo this year. Quite a few were against that, insisting Marcus should remain our PG. Those adverse to Roy's " two point guard system" even wanted to start Theo at the two and bring JOel off the bench. But Roy knew what JOel could be for this team and made the right decision.

Theo brings a big jolt of energy off the bench and JOel has become the heartbeat of this team, assuming more and more of the leadership mantle every day. Despite their lack of heigth, he and Marcus have become one of the better defensive backcourts in the country.

Joel's ACCT line says it all. An MVP worthy 51 points, 17/24 FGs, 7/10 3s,10/10 FTs!

 

[gary-7]

Well, I was beginning to wonder if you were in line to get a percentage when he turns pro, Gary.

Seriously, you and Dave have been touting him all along. And both of you were adamant in saying he should be handed the reins to the team from the gitgo this year. Quite a few were against that, insisting Marcus should remain our PG. Those adverse to Roy's " two point guard system" even wanted to start Theo at the two and bring JOel off the bench. But Roy knew what JOel could be for this team and made the right decision.

Theo brings a big jolt of energy off the bench and JOel has become the heartbeat of this team, assuming more and more of the leadership mantle every day. Despite their lack of heigth, he and Marcus have become one of the better defensive backcourts in the country.

Joel's ACCT line says it all. An MVP worthy 51 points, 17/24 FGs, 7/10 3s,10/10 FTs!

Arch, I've said many times I understood Roy's dilemma with Tokoto at the beginning of last season.and being gun-shy after Nate having to start as a freshman didn't go well. Hey, he made the wrong call in a tough situation, but this season he had no doubts. But the things that made my head hurt were the silly notions put forth by some here that JB somehow wasn't "ready", and worse that there was no difference between him and Nate. Good Lord. He was as ready as any PG can be coming into the demanding Carolina system.

But again, here we are and the good news is that Roy knows what he has in JB, and this season he knew from the get-go he had it right... the fact is had Tokoto returned he would have come off the bench and if you heard his on-court interview after the championship game, he absolutely blistered critics of his Guard alignment (and BTW debunked the idea that Marcus wanted to play point). This team has chemistry and everyone knows their roles and it works.

 

[DSouthr]

Arch, I've said many times I understood Roy's dilemma with Tokoto at the beginning of last season.and being gun-shy after Nate having to start as a freshman didn't go well. Hey, he made the wrong call in a tough situation, but this season he had no doubts. But the things that made my head hurt were the silly notions put forth by some here that JB somehow wasn't "ready", and worse that there was no difference between him and Nate. Good Lord. He was as ready as any PG can be coming into the demanding Carolina system.

But again, here we are and the good news is that Roy knows what he has in JB, and this season he knew from the get-go he had it right... the fact is had Tokoto returned he would have come off the bench and if you heard his on-court interview after the championship game, he absolutely blistered critics of his Guard alignment (and BTW debunked the idea that Marcus wanted to play point). This team has chemistry and everyone knows their roles and it works.

Yeah Gary, I don't think a lot of folks understood that Roy had a experienced team that was talented before last (not this past) had begun. Roy saw his solid freshman class and elected to start maybe the one with the most upside in Jackson. But doing that means he had to move JP to another position or just not start him. I would have found it hard to not start JP at the BEGINNING of last season and the 4 spot being out of the question forced JP in to the 2 spot. And of course Marcus was gonna start at either the 1 or the 2, JP at the 2 forces Marcus to the point and Joel to be on the bench. Roy felt he could develope Jackson faster and was going to do that first and then bring Theo and Joel along afterward.

Thing is, I am not so sure Jackson actually did come along as fast or as far as Roy or any of us invisioned and we can all look back now & realize that JP at the 2 was not the best coaching move Roy ever made. But that is easy for me to say now that we see how it turned out, Roy did not have the benefit of hind site when he made that decision. WE see that very clearly in the later stages of the season when Joel's PT amped up and Jp's deminished and I agree with many others, you included gary, that believed that Joel would have started earlier had he not had to deal with being hurt and sickness. By the time Joel had got over those things it was maybe to late to really shake things up by benching JP, it could have destroyed team chemistry and keep in mind, Roy was still coaching for a solid tourney march, did not want to risk chemistry at that point so he let JP continue to start but Joel got the key minutes. Problem was that late in the season Joel was not comfortable as a starter so he tended to really defer most of the running the team to Marcus, meaning he still had that bench player mindset, understandable, especially for a freshman.

Now you, myself, a few others really wanted Berry to start early season to get him game ready for later season. I think we agreed that JP sits or Jackson comes off the bench but a wing trying to be a 2 guard is usually a big problem made worse in that JP seemed to feel he could be a defacto PG unless marcus had the ball in his hands. And I think that the longer that season went on that out of the public view, we started to have some real chemistry issues on this team with some players questioning (as in 2 guys that are seniors now) why we have a wing trying to act like a PG and failing big while doing so. Joel's PT really amped up AFTER a players only meeting occurred and our starting 2 at the time was not exactly happy about the out come of that meeting, note how quickly the decision to enter the NBA draft was made and an agent contract signed...

 

[gary-7]

Yeah Gary, I don't think a lot of folks understood that Roy had a experienced team that was talented before last (not this past) had begun. Roy saw his solid freshman class and elected to start maybe the one with the most upside in Jackson. But doing that means he had to move JP to another position or just not start him. I would have found it hard to not start JP at the BEGINNING of last season and the 4 spot being out of the question forced JP in to the 2 spot. And of course Marcus was gonna start at either the 1 or the 2, JP at the 2 forces Marcus to the point and Joel to be on the bench. Roy felt he could develope Jackson faster and was going to do that first and then bring Theo and Joel along afterward.

Thing is, I am not so sure Jackson actually did come along as fast or as far as Roy or any of us invisioned and we can all look back now & realize that JP at the 2 was not the best coaching move Roy ever made. But that is easy for me to say now that we see how it turned out, Roy did not have the benefit of hind site when he made that decision. WE see that very clearly in the later stages of the season when Joel's PT amped up and Jp's deminished and I agree with many others, you included gary, that believed that Joel would have started earlier had he not had to deal with being hurt and sickness. By the time Joel had got over those things it was maybe to late to really shake things up by benching JP, it could have destroyed team chemistry and keep in mind, Roy was still coaching for a solid tourney march, did not want to risk chemistry at that point so he let JP continue to start but Joel got the key minutes. Problem was that late in the season Joel was not comfortable as a starter so he tended to really defer most of the running the team to Marcus, meaning he still had that bench player mindset, understandable, especially for a freshman.

Now you, myself, a few others really wanted Berry to start early season to get him game ready for later season. I think we agreed that JP sits or Jackson comes off the bench but a wing trying to be a 2 guard is usually a big problem made worse in that JP seemed to feel he could be a defacto PG unless marcus had the ball in his hands. And I think that the longer that season went on that out of the public view, we started to have some real chemistry issues on this team with some players questioning (as in 2 guys that are seniors now) why we have a wing trying to act like a PG and failing big while doing so. Joel's PT really amped up AFTER a players only meeting occurred and our starting 2 at the time was not exactly happy about the out come of that meeting, note how quickly the decision to enter the NBA draft was made and an agent contract signed...

Dave I can't argue with any of that, but I'll only offer one sight correction. Granted it's subtle in our system, as they are at times interchangeable, but Roy actually started JJ at the 2 and JP at the 3 last season. One of the issues was that JP would rotate to the 2 role in our continuity/freelance offenses, and JJ enabled that because he was just never gonna be a 2. Jackson's game is what we see: constant movement off the ball and slashing ---- a classic 3. So JP was more than happy to play de facto 2. If you remember, late in the season Roy actually came out and said publicly that he was trying to get JP to play more like a 3 should. Anyway, that's neither here nor there --- bottom line as you said it was just a poor fit all around.

Now one side note: Last week there was a weird discussion on here (that was simultaneously amusing and vexing) about what position Marcus was actually playing in the Syracuse game (and/or should be playing). The amusing part (the idea that I don't know what a damned Secondary Break is ) was prompted by a frankly off-base idea that Marcus should move back to the 1, and some folks incorrectly claiming he was playing the 1 when he perpetrated some excellent passing in that game. Well, when our own Andrew Jones (bless his heart) brought that up at the next presser, Roy was having none of it and told him so. Roy called the notion "invalid" and directly alluded to the two Secondary Break plays in dispute on here (imagine that), and asked back at Andrew, "Do you know what position Marcus was playing [on those two plays]?... He was playing the 2."

Then Saturday night Roy dismissed the meme that Marcus wanted to play at the 1. Now, in the aforementioned presser Roy did say that Marcus had been playing some Point when Nate was in with him over the past couple of games leading up to Cuse (something I advocated in pre-season), but absolutely none with JB on the floor. And that it didn't matter because we have ample sets to get Marcus the ball as the off-guard anytime we want to. And honestly, from the last dook game thru the tourney I don't recall Marcus playing even a second of 1. Bottom line is our backcourt works on both sides of the ball and I'll take it over anyone's.