ADVERTISEMENT

Tax Plan pushed through - What does it mean?

That's true, but I'm not sure it's a good idea to be putting into place regulations just in case sometime down the road two business might decide that they want to merge. That just seems unnecessary. In theory the chances of that happening are almost zero because of laws in place governing mergers and acquisitions. Of course, the government hasn't shown that they are willing to enforce those laws very much.
You answer your first question with your last statement.

My question is how did Net Neutrality impede anything? What downside did it have? If the big ISPs have promised to uphold the rules of NN, then why did they lobby so hard to remove it?

It could be argued NN allowed companies like Netflix and Amazon Prime to proliferate. If NN had never been in place, I’m sure the big ISPs would have come together to create a toll for Netflix-like companies.
 
  • Like
Reactions: strummingram
My question is how did Net Neutrality impede anything? What downside did it have?
I don't think it really impeded anything, but I don't think it had any benefit either. It was an unnecessary regulation put in place to stop a non existent bogey man.

If NN had never been in place, I’m sure the big ISPs would have come together to create a toll for Netflix-like companies.
If that happened then they would have been in violation of current law, so I seriously doubt that would have happened. Companies can't conspire together to raise prices. And if I'm one of those big companies, I would be extremely excited for one of the other companies to try that. It would mean my customer base would grow by hundreds of thousands since customers would leave the other company and Netflix would pull it's services from that company.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Hark_The_Sound_2010
I don't think it really impeded anything, but I don't think it had any benefit either. It was an unnecessary regulation put in place to stop a non existent bogey man.


If that happened then they would have been in violation of current law, so I seriously doubt that would have happened. Companies can't conspire together to raise prices. And if I'm one of those big companies, I would be extremely excited for one of the other companies to try that. It would mean my customer base would grow by hundreds of thousands since customers would leave the other company and Netflix would pull it's services from that company.
Companies do that shit all the time. And customers wouldn’t have the option to move because of limited ISP options in markets.
 
Anyways, getting back to the tax bill. It looks like there is a hitch in the plan thanks to the child tax credit.
 
I think they raised the child deduction from $1000 to $2000 and the hold outs want $3000.
The issue is Rubio. It got increased to $2,000 but that amount wouldn't be available to certain families. It could be reduced to as low as $1,100

I’m still pissed at how pass throughs aren’t getting the same benefit as big C-Corps.
That's a you problem. My taxes should be reduced, so I'm fine with it. ;)
 
The issue is Rubio. It got increased to $2,000 but that amount wouldn't be available to certain families. It could be reduced to as low as $1,100


That's a you problem. My taxes should be reduced, so I'm fine with it. ;)
I think Mike Lee is pissed too. They can't lose but 2 votes and Corker is out no matter what.
 
My biggest issue with the tax system is that you can get back more than you put in. They should put a provision in the bill that says you have to at least pay $1 in federal taxes. That way everyone has skin in the game.
 
My biggest issue with the tax system is that you can get back more than you put in. They should put a provision in the bill that says you have to at least pay $1 in federal taxes. That way everyone has skin in the game.
That always gets me too. How in the hell is it a refund if you get back more than you paid in?
 
The issue is Rubio. It got increased to $2,000 but that amount wouldn't be available to certain families. It could be reduced to as low as $1,100


That's a you problem. My taxes should be reduced, so I'm fine with it. ;)
But I’m a jobs creator. Most small businesses are. Big C-Corps will use the savings to spread around the top executives and buy more company shares. Big business is largely at full employment. Small business is struggling and freed up tax dollars allow them to invest in human capital along with PP&E.
 
But I’m a jobs creator. Most small businesses are. Big C-Corps will use the savings to spread around the top executives and buy more company shares. Big business is largely at full employment. Small business is struggling and freed up tax dollars allow them to invest in human capital along with PP&E.
Translation: That's a you problem.
 
  • Like
Reactions: nctransplant
My question is how did Net Neutrality impede anything? What downside did it have?

I don't think it really impeded anything, but I don't think it had any benefit either. It was an unnecessary regulation put in place to stop a non existent bogey man.

This is my take on it as well. The burden of proof should be on why we need a law/regulation. It shouldn't be a "well there's no reason to repeal it, so might as well keep it on".
 
  • Like
Reactions: tarheel0910
Your insight is appreciated.
Well, I knew that.

Hey, look! Furniture socks:

gallery-1435096143-cabb88fe50a6a69cda1c8faa467bf8f3.jpg
 
  • Like
Reactions: tarheel0910
Translation: That's a you problem.

If you understood Macro Economics, you’d understand it’s an ‘all of us’ problem.

This is my take on it as well. The burden of proof should be on why we need a law/regulation. It shouldn't be a "well there's no reason to repeal it, so might as well keep it on".

History suggests unfettered big business has not had the people’s best interest. Profit is the singular thing that drives corporations.

This is my favorite part about the plan. I work for, invest in, and buy from C-Corps. I don't do much business with Mom and Pop places.

So you’re a globalist? I prefer to buy local as much as possible.
 
If you understood Macro Economics, you’d understand it’s an ‘all of us’ problem.
If you understood this board, you'd understand that was a joke. Would it help if you got a better deal? Sure, but the majority of people are going to get some relief from this bill. I'm happy about the relief I'm getting. I'm not going to bitch about the amount of relief I'm getting. No matter what the bill says, someone is always going to be unhappy. It's never going to be enough for some people. Why do nothing just because you can't satisfy everyone?

History suggests unfettered big business has not had the people’s best interest. Profit is the singular thing that drives corporations.
That's a very cynical way to view the world.
 
Profit is the singular thing that drives corporations.

Agreed. And I own [a portion of] these big businesses so the more profit they make, the better for me.

So you’re a globalist? I prefer to buy local as much as possible.

I buy what I consider to be the best value. If that's a product from India, fine. If that happens to be from a company within a mile of my house, that's fine too. If all else is equal, sure I guess I might shade towards buying local. But if I can get something "global" for $300, but would need to pay $320 to get the same thing from a local manufacturer....I'm saving the $20 and buying global.

One thing I do make a point to buy local is craft beer. But not because I wanna be a nice guy and help out the local brewers at the expense of myself... it's because I think the quality of fresh beer canned that week is worth the premium I have to pay over more national brands.
 
  • Like
Reactions: tarheel0910
If you understood this board, you'd understand that was a joke. Would it help if you got a better deal? Sure, but the majority of people are going to get some relief from this bill. I'm happy about the relief I'm getting. I'm not going to bitch about the amount of relief I'm getting. No matter what the bill says, someone is always going to be unhappy. It's never going to be enough for some people. Why do nothing just because you can't satisfy everyone?


That's a very cynical way to view the world.
So why rush a bill through for a political win? Let’s spend a little longer getting it right.
 
So why rush a bill through for a political win? Let’s spend a little longer getting it right.
People have been saying "let's spend a little longer" for decades. Some group will always say the bill isn't right and we should just spend a little longer getting it right. That train of thought is why nothing ever gets solved in DC. It's never going to be perfect. And you haven't even argued that the bill is bad because it hurts you, you've been arguing it's bad because it doesn't help you more. That's a ridiculous train of thought.
 
People have been saying "let's spend a little longer" for decades. Some group will always say the bill isn't right and we should just spend a little longer getting it right. That train of thought is why nothing ever gets solved in DC. It's never going to be perfect. And you haven't even argued that the bill is bad because it hurts you, you've been arguing it's bad because it doesn't help you more. That's a ridiculous train of thought.
I’ll be more direct. The bill is bad because it is being rushed. The SALT caps are bad. It’s too top heavy for corporations. It creates $1.5B extra debt. It’s only being written by one side of the political aisle. It sucked when Dems didn’t include Pubs and it sucks now.
 
The bill is bad because it is being rushed.
I don't really think it's being rushed, but that's really a subjective thing. Would it make you feel better if they waited another month or would that still be "rushed"?

The SALT caps are bad. It’s too top heavy for corporations.
My solution for that is to get rid of all deductions. That would make the playing field level.

It creates $1.5B extra debt.
It decreases projected revenue by $1.5B. The spending causes debt.

It’s only being written by one side of the political aisle.
That's how life is today unfortunately. It would be nice if both sides could come together, but it's not going to happen.
 
  • Like
Reactions: nctransplant
Oh cmon, the ACA was stuffed through with a bunch of holes in a rush for a political win - and that turned out great. What makes you think this will be any different?


First, I wasn't thrilled with ACA. But people seem to forget that it took over a year for it to be signed into law after it was presented. It was hardly rushed relative to what the GOP has done with healthcare and taxes.
 
I don't really think it's being rushed, but that's really a subjective thing. Would it make you feel better if they waited another month or would that still be "rushed"?


My solution for that is to get rid of all deductions. That would make the playing field level.


It decreases projected revenue by $1.5B. The spending causes debt.


That's how life is today unfortunately. It would be nice if both sides could come together, but it's not going to happen.


- if you don't think it's being rushed, then you have no clue about any of this stuff. We are talking about major tax reform that has broad reaching impacts over just a matter of months.

- it's not as simple as getting rid of all deductions. Entire industries have arisen around tax code. Big lobby. Corporations. It won't happen. It can't happen. You know who doesn't want a flat tax? Rich people and big business.

- Its a problem if you decrease revenue and increase spending. A big problem.

- Pubs had the chance to be different. They aren't. I'm hopeful Dems will down the road. The madness has to stop
 
- if you don't think it's being rushed, then you have no clue about any of this stuff. We are talking about major tax reform that has broad reaching impacts over just a matter of months.
Ok, so how long would a good time period be? We've been talking about tax reform for decades. Should we talk about it for a few more decades?

- it's not as simple as getting rid of all deductions. Entire industries have arisen around tax code. Big lobby. Corporations. It won't happen. It can't happen. You know who doesn't want a flat tax? Rich people and big business.
I know it's not that simple. I'm just saying that would be the best solution.

- Its a problem if you decrease revenue and increase spending. A big problem
Then decrease spending. Pay for what you can afford.

- Pubs had the chance to be different. They aren't. I'm hopeful Dems will down the road. The madness has to stop
Yes, just like Dems had the chance to be different in the beginning of the Obama administration. It's just a cycle back and forth. There is no difference between the two parties. I hope it stops as well. I also hope I win the lottery even though I don't buy tickets. I'm guessing I'll win the lottery before they work together.
 
Ok, so how long would a good time period be? We've been talking about tax reform for decades. Should we talk about it for a few more decades?


I know it's not that simple. I'm just saying that would be the best solution.


Then decrease spending. Pay for what you can afford.


Yes, just like Dems had the chance to be different in the beginning of the Obama administration. It's just a cycle back and forth. There is no difference between the two parties. I hope it stops as well. I also hope I win the lottery even though I don't buy tickets. I'm guessing I'll win the lottery before they work together.


- don't be melodramatic. I don't think there should be a finite time period, but certainly something as important as tax reform shouldn't be passed through in a matter of months. ACA/Obamacare was called rushed and it took well over a year from beginning to end.

- the best solution would be a consumption tax

- You're making my point. Republicans are introducing a budget increase while suggesting a tax plan that decreases revenue. We want to spend like a socialist country and tax like a capitalist one.

- Perhaps. Or maybe people get sick and tired and begin to demand better.
 
Ok, I just did the math on my own taxes based on 2016 Gross income and applied the new brackets and new standard deduction.

Personally, I would keep around $10,000 more of my own money versus current tax law, assuming no deductions except standard and child tax credit.

I make very large charitable contributions and is not clear how they are affected, so I assumed no benefit.

Thank you GOP! I just booked a Disney cruise. Trickle down economics.....
 
  • Like
Reactions: nctransplant
- the best solution would be a consumption tax

I think a consumption tax is the most fair way to do it. However you know that people will be up in arms saying it's not fair that low wage earners are taxed on pretty much their entire income (because they spend it all) and high earners only pay taxes on a fraction of their income because they save most of it. They'll find a way to continue to pit the classes against each other.

The one potential problem of a consumption tax is that is disincentivizes spending, which isn't good for the overall economy.
 
I think a consumption tax is the most fair way to do it. However you know that people will be up in arms saying it's not fair that low wage earners are taxed on pretty much their entire income (because they spend it all) and high earners only pay taxes on a fraction of their income because they save most of it. They'll find a way to continue to pit the classes against each other.

The one potential problem of a consumption tax is that is disincentivizes spending, which isn't good for the overall economy.
The only way I would ever support a consumption tax is if we fully repeal the 16th amendment. Otherwise we would end up with a consumption tax AND and income tax. That is why I was not in favor of Herman Cain's 9-9-9, because it would eventually end up 9-9-30, etc.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Hark_The_Sound_2010
I think a consumption tax is the most fair way to do it. However you know that people will be up in arms saying it's not fair that low wage earners are taxed on pretty much their entire income (because they spend it all) and high earners only pay taxes on a fraction of their income because they save most of it. They'll find a way to continue to pit the classes against each other.

The one potential problem of a consumption tax is that is disincentivizes spending, which isn't good for the overall economy.

I think the psychology of a consumption tax would spur spending even further. Gas prices move a $1 per gallon and people buy SUVs and trucks again. Imagine if people took home their entire paycheck? And then got to choose how they were taxed? Someone make $100k nets around $5k a paycheck. Under the consumption tax, they would take home $8,333. There would be plenty of spending.

I do think there would be a tax reduction on basic food items.

The only way I would ever support a consumption tax is if we fully repeal the 16th amendment. Otherwise we would end up with a consumption tax AND and income tax. That is why I was not in favor of Herman Cain's 9-9-9, because it would eventually end up 9-9-30, etc.

Agreed. A consumption tax has to be the only tax in the game. And the corporate tax has to virtually go away.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Louigi
ADVERTISEMENT

Latest posts

ADVERTISEMENT