Who Are Our Top Recruiting Competitors?

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Just for fun I took a quick and dirty look at which teams signed the kids we offered then they didn't come to UNC. I looked at the classes from 2012-2017 on 247. I would have gone back a little further but their records only show commits before then.

No big surprises, but still somewhat interesting. Also interesting to look at the competition by conference. Huge with the SEC, Big 10 and PAC 12, surprisingly little with the Big 12.

Number of UNC offers signed by each school, 2012-2017

13 - Duke
11 - Kentucky
06 - Arizona
05 - Indiana
04 - NC State
03 - UCLA
02 - Syracuse
02 - Kansas
02 - Cal
02 - Mississippi St
02 - Texas
02 - UNLV

A bunch of teams poached 1 player from those receiving UNC offers

Miami
Michigan State
Maryland
Ohio State
Wisconsin
Michigan
Iowa
Florida
Alabama
LSU
S.Carolina
Missouri
Memphis
Washington
Oregon
Marquette

 

[TPFKAPFS]

Only surprises are that Kansas has so few and Moo/Indiana have so many!

 

[Grayhead]

Need to compare pre and post "scandal" stats for this to be accurate. Also compare how many we took from those schools as well

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Need to compare pre and post "scandal" stats for this to be accurate. Also compare how many we took from those schools as well

I agree. Too much work. Maybe later.

What year would you use to demarcate the pre and post periods?

 

[RoseHeel]

Just for fun I took a quick and dirty look at which teams signed the kids we offered then they didn't come to UNC. I looked at the classes from 2012-2017 on 247. I would have gone back a little further but their records only show commits before then.

No big surprises, but still somewhat interesting. Also interesting to look at the competition by conference. Huge with the SEC, Big 10 and PAC 12, surprisingly little with the Big 12.

Number of UNC offers signed by each school, 2012-2017

13 - Duke
11 - Kentucky
06 - Arizona
05 - Indiana
04 - NC State
03 - UCLA
02 - Syracuse
02 - Kansas
02 - Cal
02 - Mississippi St
02 - Texas
02 - UNLV

A bunch of teams poached 1 player from those receiving UNC offers

Miami
Michigan State
Maryland
Ohio State
Wisconsin
Michigan
Iowa
Florida
Alabama
LSU
S.Carolina
Missouri
Memphis
Washington
Oregon
Marquette

Roy has offered a lot of guys that were obviously going to Dook over the past couple of years. We offered every player they landed in the 2014.

You also have to take into account the guys we offer and never really recruited. If there was a list to look at, some of these numbers could probably be reduced.

 

[Grayhead]

I agree. Too much work. Maybe later.

What year would you use to demarcate the pre and post periods?

I suggest the same amount of years as how long we have been dealing with this mess.

 

[uncfan in ky]

Holy crap !!!!! Who's the 4 kids that picked NC State over us & what's wrong with them?

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Roy has offered a lot of guys that were obviously going to Dook over the past couple of years. We offered every player they landed in the 2014.

You also have to take into account the guys we offer and never really recruited. If there was a list to look at, some of these numbers could probably be reduced.

Good point. It's also the case that Roy has put out more offers in recent years than previously. Which only makes sense. I mean we almost struck out in 2015 (despite the fact that we are now happy with the 2 guys we got). If Luke hadn't walked on and Shaka Smart hadn't moved to Texas....

Without going back to try to figure out our needs for each year here's a count of the offers extended (per 247, just because they make it easy). Number of recruits in paren.

2011 - 8 (5)
2012 - 12 (4)
2013 - 12 (3)
2014 - 11 (3)
2015 - 15 (2)
2016 - 22 (3)
2017 - 16 (5)

Here's a look ahead - offers and (commits) so far. Presumably not done yet on either offers or commits, although we might be done with 2018 offers.

2018 - 9 (2)
2019 - 8 (0)

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Holy crap !!!!! Who's the 4 kids that picked NC State over us & what's wrong with them?

Some pretty good ones (not all, but some).

TJ Warren
BJ Anya
Maverick Rowan
Dennis Smith

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

I suggest the same amount of years as how long we have been dealing with this mess.

I don't think there was an instant impact on recruiting. And I don't really know what year that would be.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Another way to look at the impact of the NCAA and OAD messes on recruiting is to see how far down in the recruiting pool Roy has had to offer.

Our 2017 class with its dip into the 2nd hundred and then into the 3rd hundred in the search of big men who were being offered lots of PT, was (and still is) downright scary.

Another way to look at the NCAA/OAD impact would be to look at how many - or, more accurately, how few - of our top ranked offers actually came to UNC.

2012 was Roy's first class without a 5* recruit (not counting 2007). Roy extended 12 offers and the top 7 by ranking went elsewhere.

To me, that year was a wakeup call. The Marcus class - with Brice, JP and Joel James - was a nice class and went a long way to proving that Roy could win without having the cream of the crop. But it was also a tough patch both on and off the court.

In 2013, Roy offered 12 guys in the top 25 - and none came to UNC. Still a pretty good class with Kennedy, Isaiah and Nate.

The 2014 class seemed to right the recruiting ship, with Justin, Joel and Theo. But then the NCAA thing got really intense.

Jalek really helped us with his very early commitment. Finally a highly ranked player willing to come to UNC despite the cloud.

Getting Tony was a big deal in the 2016 class. It had been a while since we had signed a well-ranked big man (Isaiah). But it's also worth pointing out that he wasn't a 5* and didn't think of himself as an OAD when he committed.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Here are the numbers for Duke for those who are interested.

Number of Duke offers snagged by competitors 2011-2017

8 - Kentucky
4 - UCLA
3 - Texas
2 - NC State
1 - UNC (Theo)
1 - Syracuse
1 - Notre Dame
1 - Miami
1 - Arizona
1 - Oklahoma
1 - LSU
1 - Ohio State
1 - Michigan
1 - UConn
1 - Georgetown
1 - Wisc
1 - Tenn
1 - Baylor
1 - Memphis
1 - UNLV
1 - Cal
1 - Marquette
1 - Maryland
1 - Purdue
1 - Missouri
1 - Oregon
1 - Villanova

Duke offers (commits) by year

2011 - 7 (5)
2012 - 5 (1)
2013 - 10 (3)
2014 - 12 (4)
2015 - 10 (6)
2016 - 11 (6)
2017 - 19 (6)

 

[Tom79]

The truth is kids have a great many D1 schools to choose from in recruiting. Among the top 10-15 schools in NCAA basketball we have fierce competition. We also have some unscrupulous recruiters out there that have persisted in false statements regarding UNC on the recruiting trail.
Of the current 17 offers, I am hopeful we will be pleasantly surprised in who picks UNC.
I am also hopeful we are cycling out of the perceptions regarding the investigation and back to reality. August 16-17, 2017 now loom large.

 

[truetarheelraider0806]

Some pretty good ones (not all, but some).

TJ Warren
BJ Anya
Maverick Rowan
Dennis Smith

Bj Anya would have been a beast for roy Williams met the guy nice guy he admitted if he had it all over to do again he probably comes to UNC with meeks

 

[Archer2]

Bj Anya would have been a beast for roy Williams met the guy nice guy he admitted if he had it all over to do again he probably comes to UNC with meeks

If he could have gotten into shape, he could have played pro ball. Jonas would have been a great help to him.

 

[DSouthr]

Unfortunately our main recruiting adversary has been beating us hard for the last several years and there has been painfully little we could do about it. Wish I could tell ya we were about to be able to reverse those fortunes but I can not, not when that main adversary is the NCAA...

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Bj Anya would have been a beast for roy Williams met the guy nice guy he admitted if he had it all over to do again he probably comes to UNC with meeks

Yeah, the difference between how Meeks turned out and how Anya turned out should be instructive.

Anya had that amazing wingspan, and he seemed to genuinely have a good time playing the game and to be a nice fellow.

Maybe he would have struggled for us, too. But I bet he'd be getting NBA tryouts if not contracts as a UNC grad.

 

[udsig91]

Right now...the NCAA!

 

[Archer2]

Unfortunately our main recruiting adversary has been beating us hard for the last several years and there has been painfully little we could do about it. Wish I could tell ya we were about to be able to reverse those fortunes but I can not, not when that main adversary is the NCAA...

Between the never ending NCAA witch hunt and the perception that UNC isn't conducive to being a OAD, UK, d00k, KU, AU, and UCLA are recruiting on a completely different level right now. We're left to focusing on 2nd and 3rd tier recruits, with an occasional top tier player thrown in.

Thank goodness Roy has shown he can win with talent that is very good by most standards but certainly not up to elite levels.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

In light of the current scandal, I thought I'd bump this thread. I wonder how many (if any) of the kids we missed on went elsewhere due to pay or other corrupt shenanigans?

Obviously there are "good" reasons why some kids don't pick us. More PT, starting opportunities, family ties and so on. But now we have to consider money.

 

[DSouthr]

In light of the current scandal, I thought I'd bump this thread. I wonder how many (if any) of the kids we missed on went elsewhere due to pay or other corrupt shenanigans?

Obviously there are "good" reasons why some kids don't pick us. More PT, starting opportunities, family ties and so on. But now we have to consider money.

Let me share an interesting theory, the NCAA goes all out to nail us over simply having easy grade classes, a fact at every other D-1 school has as well. The NCAA tries to move OUTSIDE of its authority to hammer us and that is still an ongoing issue.

Now flash forward to last Tues, the FBI hammers several big time programs, ALL so far being indicted are Addias programs, some being programs that have hit us especially hard on the recruiting trail. The FBI put a deal together with who, Marty Blazer, guy involved with Chris Hawkins that got us in hot water with the NCAA in the first place with footballers and led to the AFAM stuff.

Marty Blazer, who was shortly after our football problem indicted in federal court. What if UNC tipped off either the feds or Blazer that he knew a lot of dirt and that it may be a great idea to see what he knows and may be willing to do to maybe stay out of jail. That would be a huge F U to the NCAA and it would take years for them to even realize it, years that ended last Tuesday? It does seem that Blazer for some reason worked to take down schools in the Addias world more than the NIke schools, uh UNC is a Nike school so maybe they didn't want their own taken down?

Mess with us over something every other program is doing and portray it as if we were the only school with easy classes, OK, then we have a lil something to fire back with, something that we are not doing but those Holier than thou programs you turn your head away from when they do their dirty deeds are knee deep in. And not only will ya not see it coming, you will never know who really fired the shot, now that would be some pay back for messing with us.

 

[TPFKAPFS]

Sounds like you are saying UNC = Illuminati, lol!

I really hope we did do that, but I suspect we would not sink to that level of revenge. The NCAA Mafia is facing the same thing as the real Mafia did. They are imploding from: corruption within; feeling they are above the law; the complacency of making their own rules/ignoring their own rules for decades; FBI holy crusades; and finally, people fearing the FBI more than the Mafia!

The entity that rises from these ashes will be the one that finally drops their vendetta against our Family and offers a public, "Mea Culpa" to the Tar Heel Way!

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Let me share an interesting theory, the NCAA goes all out to nail us over simply having easy grade classes, a fact at every other D-1 school has as well. The NCAA tries to move OUTSIDE of its authority to hammer us and that is still an ongoing issue.

Now flash forward to last Tues, the FBI hammers several big time programs, ALL so far being indicted are Addias programs, some being programs that have hit us especially hard on the recruiting trail. The FBI put a deal together with who, Marty Blazer, guy involved with Chris Hawkins that got us in hot water with the NCAA in the first place with footballers and led to the AFAM stuff.

Marty Blazer, who was shortly after our football problem indicted in federal court. What if UNC tipped off either the feds or Blazer that he knew a lot of dirt and that it may be a great idea to see what he knows and may be willing to do to maybe stay out of jail. That would be a huge F U to the NCAA and it would take years for them to even realize it, years that ended last Tuesday? It does seem that Blazer for some reason worked to take down schools in the Addias world more than the NIke schools, uh UNC is a Nike school so maybe they didn't want their own taken down?

Mess with us over something every other program is doing and portray it as if we were the only school with easy classes, OK, then we have a lil something to fire back with, something that we are not doing but those Holier than thou programs you turn your head away from when they do their dirty deeds are knee deep in. And not only will ya not see it coming, you will never know who really fired the shot, now that would be some pay back for messing with us.

So . . . the FBI works for us.