"build that wall"
- Thread starter blazers
- Start date
I don't think Trump supporters are more susceptible to it than any other group of political activists.
Here's the thing.
For those of you saying "**** our allies" I would implore you to reconsider that line of thinking. No, America isn't here to appease other nations, that was my issue with Obama. But you can't expect doing the exact opposite will work either. Nations like England, Germany, France, Italy, Japan, South Korea and others need to be our priority in maintaining good relations. Above all, we need to be an example for others to follow. If we have a President that eschews all manners and proper political norms, that's not someone I can trust.
You don't make deals that way, something Trump claims is his specialty. You don't assure nations that way, and you don't ensure world cooperation that way. Promote America's interests while making the other side feel as if they've achieved something. Or, in the case of North Korea or Iran, toe the line but don't draw it. Obama made plenty of gaffs, but Trump is worse. He's just lucky Rex Tillerson is doing a semi-decent job.
For those of you saying "**** our allies" I would implore you to reconsider that line of thinking. No, America isn't here to appease other nations, that was my issue with Obama. But you can't expect doing the exact opposite will work either. Nations like England, Germany, France, Italy, Japan, South Korea and others need to be our priority in maintaining good relations. Above all, we need to be an example for others to follow. If we have a President that eschews all manners and proper political norms, that's not someone I can trust.
You don't make deals that way, something Trump claims is his specialty. You don't assure nations that way, and you don't ensure world cooperation that way. Promote America's interests while making the other side feel as if they've achieved something. Or, in the case of North Korea or Iran, toe the line but don't draw it. Obama made plenty of gaffs, but Trump is worse. He's just lucky Rex Tillerson is doing a semi-decent job.
As opposed to Bernie Sanders supporters, black lives matter supporters, or radical feminists? The extremism in this nation isn't limited to the right.
If you think Bernie Sanders supporters are extremists then you're extremely naive.
I never said that extremism is limited to the right. I never said anything about extremism actually. I thought we were talking about confirmation bias... You don't have to be an extremist to ignore evidence that contradicts your position.
But those who subscribe to confirmation bias are more likely to be more stubborn or have more extreme views.
And no I am not naive, Bernie Sanders supporters aren't the same kind of extreme that Trump promotes, but they're just as adamant everything he says is right and he can do no wrong.
I just read this...
"— Massive, multi-billion dollar investments in manufacturing being made in the USA. Thus tens of thousands of jobs to be created.
— One million new jobs created in first 6 months.
— Jobless claims are the lowest in 28 years.
— Food stamp use is down by 4%.
— $4 Trillion added to stock market value.
— Reduced corporate regulations.
— Veterans Affairs Department being cleaned up significantly.
— USA pulls out of TTP.
— USA pulls out of Climate Accord.
— New trade agreements with South Korea, China, Mexico and Canada in the works.
–Keystone Pipeline re-opened.
— Oil production up by 500k barrels per day (1.3M total).
— Consumer confidence is at a 16 year high.
Cavuto’s list, although awesome, fails to mention a few items worth noting.
A. Illegal border crossing are down significantly.
B. Deportations are up.
C. Kate’s Law passed in the House.
D. Travel ban on six terror laden countries is in effect.
E. ISIS has pulled out of Mosul.
F. More countries are paying into the NATO defense fund since Trump’s visit to Europe.
G.DOJ cracking down on transnational criminals at rapid pace. 1260 convictions since January"
http://dennismichaellynch.com/list-trumps-accomplishments-just-6-months/
Yep, simply the facts. And the most important factor of all is still left out of both lists: the Conservative SCOTUS apptointment(s).
Imagine how that list would look if Killary had been elected, gahhhhh!
You may want to double check your facts. There is a list provided just north of this post that will help. Keep tryin, Libby!
Are you one of those people who are dim enough to think that calling someone a liberal is an insult?
I think it's pretty easy to argue that some of that has nothing to do with Trump being president. Some similar things happened under Obama (stock market, job creation) so I'm assuming you give him the same credit for that correct? Also, it's too early to tell if some of those things will be a positive in the long run.
Exactly. Some things happen with or without the direction of the president. He may be the easiest to praise or criticize depending on the circumstances, but he doesn't have jurisdiction over many of the things mentioned in this thread. The economy especially.
Nope, just dont know your name and I can tell you're a Libby, hence the reference. And I see you avoided the main point about the things that TrumpWins administration HAS indeed accomplished. Well done!
This list is a joke. None of this has anything to do with any legislation passed by the Trump administration. Because it is a fact that they have not passed any major bills since he took office.
"— Massive, multi-billion dollar investments in manufacturing being made in the USA. Thus tens of thousands of jobs to be created.
Automation will eliminate 99% of manufacturing jobs in the next 25 years. Also, this has nothing to do with Trump. He didn't sign any legislation to make those investments happen. He had nothing to do with it.
— One million new jobs created in first 6 months.
Job growth had already spiked before Trump took office. Over 150,000 jobs were created nearly every month for the last six months of Obama's administration as well.
— Jobless claims are the lowest in 28 years.
Yeah... Because job growth has been trending upwards. This has nothing to do with Donald Trump being elected president.
— Food stamp use is down by 4%.
See: Job growth
— $4 Trillion added to stock market value.
Just like the job market, the stock market was already trending upwards before Trump took office. And he has passed no financial legislation that would have impacted Wall Street in any way shape or form.
— Reduced corporate regulations.
Which corporate regulations? Why is this even inherently a good thing? Its generally a good thing for society when businesses have rules. Market fundamentalism has been completely debunked as an economic theory.
— Veterans Affairs Department being cleaned up significantly.
Okay... Lol
— USA pulls out of Climate Accord.
This has strengthened the resolve in the international community to continue combatting climate change. There is an idiot in the White House who apparently doesn't believe in the scientific method, and that's a total embarrassment to us as a nation.
–Keystone Pipeline re-opened.
And has already begun leaking. None of that oil will even be sold in the United States.
— Oil production up by 500k barrels per day (1.3M total).
Burning fossil fuels produces hydrocarbons that are trapped in our atmosphere.
"— Massive, multi-billion dollar investments in manufacturing being made in the USA. Thus tens of thousands of jobs to be created.
Automation will eliminate 99% of manufacturing jobs in the next 25 years. Also, this has nothing to do with Trump. He didn't sign any legislation to make those investments happen. He had nothing to do with it.
— One million new jobs created in first 6 months.
Job growth had already spiked before Trump took office. Over 150,000 jobs were created nearly every month for the last six months of Obama's administration as well.
— Jobless claims are the lowest in 28 years.
Yeah... Because job growth has been trending upwards. This has nothing to do with Donald Trump being elected president.
— Food stamp use is down by 4%.
See: Job growth
— $4 Trillion added to stock market value.
Just like the job market, the stock market was already trending upwards before Trump took office. And he has passed no financial legislation that would have impacted Wall Street in any way shape or form.
— Reduced corporate regulations.
Which corporate regulations? Why is this even inherently a good thing? Its generally a good thing for society when businesses have rules. Market fundamentalism has been completely debunked as an economic theory.
— Veterans Affairs Department being cleaned up significantly.
Okay... Lol
— USA pulls out of Climate Accord.
This has strengthened the resolve in the international community to continue combatting climate change. There is an idiot in the White House who apparently doesn't believe in the scientific method, and that's a total embarrassment to us as a nation.
–Keystone Pipeline re-opened.
And has already begun leaking. None of that oil will even be sold in the United States.
— Oil production up by 500k barrels per day (1.3M total).
Burning fossil fuels produces hydrocarbons that are trapped in our atmosphere.
I believe that a good portion of new jobs during Obama's tenure were government jobs. Maybe that's my own confirmation bias that makes me think that, so that I can continue thinking he was a shitty president that tried to make the government as overreaching as he possibly could, who knows. Maybe that's the same case for Trump too, I'm not sure - I haven't really cared to look at the breakdown of new jobs.
I don't think a President should get a pat on the back for creating government jobs. Those jobs are paid for by tax dollars. For every job created, more money is taken from the rest of the public (or probably more accurately, less money goes to other things as the taxes don't adjust daily). Now I realize that some government jobs are necessary to have the country function. But I think hiring 5 people to do the work that one person could do just in the name of saying you created X jobs is disingenuous at best - and harmful to the rest of the country at worst.
The single most important reason that I and millions of Americans voted for TrumpWins is this: the Conservative SCOTUS appointment ... which has already happened once and will likely happen at least two more times. You can spin and discredit the Prez for the list above if you'd like, but you absolutely cannot discredit him for the SCOTUS appointments .... HRC's appointments would have been the polar opposite. So we win ... again.
I don't know the exact breakdown either, but I'd be willing to bet at least one job created under Obama wasn't a government job. So, my point stands. If Trump gets credit for creating jobs then Obama should get the same credit.
Agreed. I also don't think a president should get a pat on the back for creating private sector jobs, because I don't think a president creates jobs. Companies create jobs. They are going to do what is in their best interest, which means hiring people if they need them. Just because a job is created while a president is in office doesn't mean they should get credit for it. Should Clinton get credit for jobs created during the beginning of the internet era? Maybe Bush is actually the mastermind behind Facebook since a lot of those jobs were created under him. Presidents get way too much credit/blame for things that happen during their administration simply because people think the president has more power than he really does.
Agreed. I alluded to this either earlier in this thread or in another thread, as the reason why I voted for Trump. I thought it would be good for the country to see that you don't need a buttoned-up politician lifer as president. The media perpetuated the belief that electing Trump would create mass hysteria. He has shown that a late-night-tweeting, hand-size-worrying, potentially senile reality television star can function just fine as president.
I would say the jury is still out on that. Unlike some of his detractors, I'm willing to give him more time though. It doesn't make much sense to me to say a president is a failure less than a year into his presidency.
But would investors feel good about investing under another President that wasn't as friendly to corporations? I don't know the answer to that. But the logical assumption to make is that investors feel comfortable that Trump will help them succeed. And that's what I was talking about in my earlier poast. Where the President is most powerful is in the tone they set. If Trump talks about trickle down economics and how he feels tax breaks for corps helps the economy, that rhetoric is going to be more influential to a potential investor than a President who talks about making corporations "pay their fair share" (whatever that means).
In the short run it can help because markets are irrational in the short run. In the long run results are all that matters. Trump can say whatever he wants, but if coke sales take a dive, then coke stock takes a dive too.
ETA: Obama should be a good example of that. He was pretty much the opposite of Trump, but the market went up substantially under him.
Correct, and there's not much Trump can do/say to impact Coke sales (outside of saying "that stuff sucks" and having all his haters buy the stuff in droves to spite him).
However, sales (revenue) is not where large corporations derive their valuations. They're priced off their earnings multiples. With a more friendly tax rate, they get to keep more of their sales revenue as bottom line earnings - and their valuation will increase as a result.
That contributes to it as well, but it's not solely based on earnings multiples or sales. It's a combination of many things. I just said sales since it was the easiest thing for most people to understand. All the other technical stuff can be harder for most people to understand without going into a dsouth type post.
As long as there is revenue. You can have a zero percent tax rate, but if you don't make any money it's not going to matter what your tax rate is. $1 taxed at 35% will give you more earnings than 10 cents taxed at 0%
Sure. But what we're discussing is the president's impact. The president doesn't have the ability to make the revenue go from $1 to 10 cents or vice versa. Technically he doesn't have the ability to make the tax rate go from 35% to 0% and vice versa either, but he has some influence on that fluctuation.
That's what I've been saying this whole time. Short run he can have an impact, long run he doesn't.
Gun, I swear I'm not trying to be a smartass. That said, I don't think Trump is capable of talking about any of that. He just doesn't have the brain power for it. Anything more than a few words tweeted is beyond his ability. He has showed the whole country that over and over again....
Why would I want to spin a horrible SCOTUS pick? We're already well aware of the fact that Trump is willing to appoint dinosaurs. He proved that with Sessions.
Thanks for perfectly demonstrating the tribalistic simplicity of conservative politics though. I mean you really summed it up perfectly. As long as your team wins you aren't really too concerned with what is or isn't actually good for the country.
It's been obvious for awhile that you've bought the "Trump is incapable of doing anything right whatsoever" that has been sold to you. Maybe you have a case in terms of foreign policy and similar things. However if there's one thing that the man understands, it's the corporate tax code.
It really boggles my mind how Trump's haters try to have their cake and eat it too. Throughout the campaign and election all we heard about was how Trump is such a schemer, finding loopholes in the tax code in order to not pay taxes he should have owed. It's not possible to manipulate something you have no idea about. Now we have his haters saying he doesn't have a clue about the tax code or how it works. Get the damn story straight.
I base what I said on what has come out of the man's own mouth....period
It actually wasn't a horrible pick. You can disagree with his decisions all you want, but it doesn't make Neil Gorsuch any less qualified. And if you can't see that, you're just as tribalistic as bleed is.
Despite his unprovoked eraticism, not every pick Trump has made for a cabinet member has been bad. I trust John Kelly and James Mattis especially.
If you really think liberals and progressives don't reduce important issues down to sound bites as much as far right people do, you're crazy.
No, my view is that ANYONE BESIDES another Clinton would have been good for the country .. and I was right. Enjoy the next 8 years!
I would have picked anybody before Trump and I would have picked anybody before Clinton except Trump
That's absurd.
You just can't handle that your ego got crushed after you spent a year and lost $100 telling us all that Trump had no shot.
LOL
So I guess you and other leftists are the only ones that know what is "actually good for the country".
