Extremely quick stuff (Wake game)...

[gary-7]

...and this is one I can't blame the coaching staff for.

This really is gonna be extremely quick:

- You want a game summary? Ok: We defended them into shitty looks all night, but they hit just enough of them.

- Meanwhile, we got consistently great looks all night, but DIDN'T hit enough.

- All of the above enabled a predictably horrible officiating job to let them win it from the line.

So... there ya go. Eliot tried his best with 14/13/7, but that second number could've easily been 20 by our guys converting just a decent pct of the other good ops he created. We always struggle in Winston, but this year it unfortunately means so much more, so coming close is no consolation... and that f^^^ing sucks. Sorry --- dunno what else to say. Good night all...

 

[Sk1310]

It baffles me how bad we are at shooting. This team couldn't afford a down year from RJ behind the arc but here we are

 

[gkss]

...and this is one I can't blame the coaching staff for.

This really is gonna be extremely quick:

- You want a game summary? Ok: We defended them into shitty looks all night, but they hit just enough of them.

- Meanwhile, we got consistently great looks all night, but DIDN'T hit enough.

- All of the above enabled a predictably horrible officiating job to let them win it from the line.

So... there ya go. Eliot tried his best with 14/13/7, but that second number could've easily been 20 by our guys converting just a decent pct of the other good ops he created. We always struggle in Winston, but this year it unfortunately means so much more, so coming close is no consolation... and that f^^^ing sucks. Sorry --- dunno what else to say. Good night all...

That about sums it up- not a lot needs to be said. I will add that we need Ian and Drake hitting shots and attacking, get enough production from the front court, get more offensive rebounds, and be decent beyond the arc. We came back late with pressure defensively and pushing tempo. Hell even Jalen loosened up and hit a three! Bad body language was noticed by @sctarheel30 during the game, and I would agree. I hope we keep fighting and competing- I feel like we will. As always, Go Heels!!

 

[Oak ridger]

Great game in WS, atmosphere was entertaining and Deacons fans were giving me crap the whole game. The year of " just can't make a shot". I still stick with this team finishing with a 500 record this seaon.

 

[JovialMuse]

Agree that the coaching staff can't really be blamed for this one. Although I guess it can be argued that not utilizing the talent that definitely exists on this team to their full potential up to this point in the season has put UNC in a position where there's almost no room for error or bad shooting nights. So tired of these seasons that can best be described as parades of mediocrity. Even Roy was not immune to this his last two seasons, but one really good season last year just isn't enough when you're Carolina. I think it hurts more b/c duke hasn't seemed to miss a beat during their coaching transition. Although anyone could probably coach that team to success but even their "down" years are 4-seed NCAAT teams. In my line of work there's a saying: fail quick. This allows you to identify issues and move on/forward and not drag out problems. Hard for me not to want that here even though it goes against everything in my sense of fanhood.

 

[Kool1234567]

Shot 0 Free Throws 2nd half but did manage to jack up 18 3s…Basically playing like they are a AAU team….No coaching just roll the ball out and old Hubert says okay go win…


It’s NIL though….Sad when Stanford and Wake are out spending UNC….

 

[Goheels83]

EC was breaking them down all night!
Have no idea why we didn’t press more?
When Rj didn’t give it up to Jackson on that 2 on 1 fast break he should’ve went straight to the bench.

 

[Bubspub88]

This team has as little margin for error as any UNC team I can recall. They simply cannot afford an off night shooting from any level, numbers need to be around 50%, 40% and 80% to beat comparable talent. Missed a ton of open looks but also forced too many. I was excited about Tyson when he signed but now do not want to see him on the floor. Same with Withers.

Dook's frontcourt will eat Carolina alive. Can't blame coaches for missed shots but I think they have lost this team. Up something like 13-7 at a tv break and instead of going for the jugular they looked to just be going through the motions. Corey Alexander was talking about Hubert saying this team doesn't have that team leader to yell at them and pull them together. That is very telling.

The Heels have a game with BC then a brutal 4-game stretch followed by road game at Cuse. A mid-February record right around .500 is likely. Wonder if they will play the NIT game in Carmichael?

 

[39 Feet Above Sea Level]

Put yourself in RJ or Elliot’s shoes. They break down a defender, draw contact in the lane (several times on
shot attempts) and GO TO THE LINE FOR NO FREE THROW ATTEMPTS IN HALF TWO. 🤭🤨🤔

That’s how you lose a one point game, again.

 

[NathanFielder]

I thought UNC missed a lot of really makable shots throughout the night. Kind of been that story all season.

The margin for error is razor thin. If they don’t get to the FT line, they struggle to win games. Credit to Cadeau. He balled out. But top to bottom this team is just so inconsistent.

Pretty disastrous game from Powell and Jackson. Those 2 obviously need to turn things around quickly.

There’s a lacking of winning DNA on this team.

I did think there were a couple of positives:
- Cadeau didn’t pick up moronic fouls and Hubert basically played him wire to wire
- Hubert called some money set plays
- Hubert rode Cadeau, RJ, Jackson. Like it or not, this team isn’t deep and their ability to win games lies in those 3 every game. Ride them.

 

[alabamaheel]

The two freshmen were non existent. We finally get a first half lead and for some reason Tyson and Claude are on the floor at the same dang time and there goes all our momentum and lead. Seth with a weird game in my opinion. Had several defensive brain farts and couldn’t finish. Hd gave him the worst look I’ve ever seen him give someone.

EC and RJ got it done for the most part. EC with an awesome game for sure. He was all over this game in every facet. RJ with better shot selection and passing, although like Gary said, others didn’t finish the play with makes. They both still drive too deep into the middle and lose the ball at times but at least it’s to create when things get stagnant. All around it’s tough to watch and enjoy at this point. Heck when you lose this much arguing isn’t even any fun lol @gary-7

 

[JovialMuse]

Shot 0 Free Throws 2nd half but did manage to jack up 18 3s…Basically playing like they are a AAU team….No coaching just roll the ball out and old Hubert says okay go win…


It’s NIL though….Sad when Stanford and Wake are out spending UNC….

Is this really true? I recall the excitement around snatching the NIL guy from Kentucky and how many thought this was a difference maker for UNC athletics, but I haven't seen any evidence that he's helped at all. I guess coaching staffs have the final say on where NIL money goes but still seems odd that a school like Wake has more NIL to be out spending UNC. Unless you're saying UNC isn't using the NIL money?

 

[sctarheel30]

That about sums it up- not a lot needs to be said. I will add that we need Ian and Drake hitting shots and attacking, get enough production from the front court, get more offensive rebounds, and be decent beyond the arc. We came back late with pressure defensively and pushing tempo. Hell even Jalen loosened up and hit a three! Bad body language was noticed by @sctarheel30 during the game, and I would agree. I hope we keep fighting and competing- I feel like we will. As always, Go Heels!!

Can’t help but notice their body language and will to fight just seems to quickly go away too easily the minute things head south. A lot like past teams that have been here but hopefully it doesn’t get as bad as when MD was here. Would be nice to find something positive and begin our run now kinda like moo last year but sooner.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

I miss the days when my DVR had slow motion. I have to think some of the times EC went sprawling on the floor were "assisted" but I couldn't really tell.

In any case, a terrific game by EC. I'm hard on him sometimes, because this is more what I expect. He probably should have been MVP even though on the losing side.

There are always "ifs" in games like these. It seemed like Hildreth got close to the basket a whole lot, only to miss those close shots. To be fair, he had to really work to get that close. But if I'm a Wake fan, I'm thinking this game shouldn't have been close. If Wake had lost, I'm sure Wake fans would be screaming about the times he was fouled without calls.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Can’t help but notice their body language and will to fight just seems to quickly go away too easily the minute things head south. A lot like past teams that have been here but hopefully it doesn’t get as bad as when MD was here. Would be nice to find something positive and begin our run now kinda like moo last year but sooner.

Just think where this team would be if Ingram had come back for another season. Not only would he fill a big hole, but he was a cheer leader on the floor.

Can't blame him for leaving, but still....

 

[sctarheel30]

This team has as little margin for error as any UNC team I can recall. They simply cannot afford an off night shooting from any level, numbers need to be around 50%, 40% and 80% to beat comparable talent. Missed a ton of open looks but also forced too many. I was excited about Tyson when he signed but now do not want to see him on the floor. Same with Withers.

Dook's frontcourt will eat Carolina alive. Can't blame coaches for missed shots but I think they have lost this team. Up something like 13-7 at a tv break and instead of going for the jugular they looked to just be going through the motions. Corey Alexander was talking about Hubert saying this team doesn't have that team leader to yell at them and pull them together. That is very telling.

The Heels have a game with BC then a brutal 4-game stretch followed by road game at Cuse. A mid-February record right around .500 is likely. Wonder if they will play the NIT game in Carmichael?

And RJ saying he doesn’t want/know how to lead for the fear of hurting feelings (seems corey said something along those lines as well) piss on that hurt their feelings I don’t care.

 

[sctarheel30]

Just think where this team would be if Ingram had come back for another season. Not only would he fill a big hole, but he was a cheer leader on the floor.

Can't blame him for leaving, but still....

Somebody has to take the leadership role and do it quickly

 

[notashelbyfan]

...and this is one I can't blame the coaching staff for.

This really is gonna be extremely quick:

- You want a game summary? Ok: We defended them into shitty looks all night, but they hit just enough of them.

- Meanwhile, we got consistently great looks all night, but DIDN'T hit enough.

- All of the above enabled a predictably horrible officiating job to let them win it from the line.

So... there ya go. Eliot tried his best with 14/13/7, but that second number could've easily been 20 by our guys converting just a decent pct of the other good ops he created. We always struggle in Winston, but this year it unfortunately means so much more, so coming close is no consolation... and that f^^^ing sucks. Sorry --- dunno what else to say. Good night all...

EC was great last night, the game was a shitshow.

Couldn't throw one in the ocean.

When you jack up 32 threes you are not going to get to the freethrow line.

Everyone can see that he needs to keep his emotions in check better, but let's get back in the real world, shall we?
He is never "really bad" --- and AYFKM?... "they helped him out by scoring'???
LMAO. Just stop.

Stop. Please. You're making my side hurt laughing at you. Apparently you don't seem to understand that it's the assistER that helps out the assistEE. 😂

I guess I shouldn't be surprised though. If you knew what the heck you were looking at, or could see past your silly false narrative, you'd also know Eliot doesn't need to anyone to "make him look better". Moreover, that's not how the game works, bubba. Do yourself and everyone here a favor and just sit these basketball threads out.

Funny how you chastised and made fun of me when I said his teammates help him out by scoring, and now you're are referring to his numbers could've have been better if they would have scored from his passes.

 

[RP12]

Agree that the coaching staff can't really be blamed for this one. Although I guess it can be argued that not utilizing the talent that definitely exists on this team to their full potential up to this point in the season has put UNC in a position where there's almost no room for error or bad shooting nights. So tired of these seasons that can best be described as parades of mediocrity. Even Roy was not immune to this his last two seasons, but one really good season last year just isn't enough when you're Carolina. I think it hurts more b/c duke hasn't seemed to miss a beat during their coaching transition. Although anyone could probably coach that team to success but even their "down" years are 4-seed NCAAT teams. In my line of work there's a saying: fail quick. This allows you to identify issues and move on/forward and not drag out problems. Hard for me not to want that here even though it goes against everything in my sense of fanhood.

This is my thinking as well...so coaching in a development sense rather than in game. I would argue that we've seen better 3pt shooting over the long term from Ian and Drake than projected before the season. For this team to have a meaningful ceiling JWash and Tyson had to be factors on offense at least some of the time. So you had to stick with them and if they didn't find a groove the ceiling would be first weekend outside of shooting luck. For all the talk of how nice Hubert is, if he's yelling the same tired clichés while he jumps around on the sidelines I could see that getting old. And his usage certainly has killed any chance for some players to turn the corner thusfar.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Funny how you chastised and made fun of me when I said his teammates help him out by scoring, and now you're are referring to his numbers could've have been better if they would have scored from his passes.

Touche.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

I guess it can be argued that not utilizing the talent that definitely exists on this team to their full potential up to this point in the season has put UNC in a position where there's almost no room for error or bad shooting nights.

Recently I've been wondering whether Gut could have turned our cluster-F of bigs into a competitive unit.

I mean is the talent really that weak, or is it just poorly developed?

To my layman's eyes some (all?) of our bigs show the skills we want . . . on occasion. So why not all the time - or at least a lot more?

Any of our gurus willing to speculate on that?

 

[HoopsCoach42]

Give Brown some more run...at least he plays with a little passion and fire!

 

[NathanFielder]

Recently I've been wondering whether Gut could have turned our cluster-F of bigs into a competitive unit.

I mean is the talent really that weak, or is it just poorly developed?

To my layman's eyes some (all?) of our bigs show the skills we want . . . on occasion. So why not all the time - or at least a lot more?

Any of our gurus willing to speculate on that?

I know this sounds insane but it wouldn't surprise me if Washington got some looks by NBA teams mainly because he has height/length and at least looks like he can shoot the ball from the perimeter. It wouldn't surprise me if an NBA team that's paying a bunch of dudes a lot of money and needs really cheap players takes a look at him. So if that happens, you know the criticism will be harsh here that Hubert had an NBA big. I think Jalen has a couple of skills that the NBA likes, but I don't think he's all that good.

I think any reasonable fan will say that Lubin is a role player. And James Brown is a role player on his best day right now. And Withers has been this kind of player for 5 years. I don't see any talent in his game that makes him special.

I understand the criticism of player development. But we've seen bad bigs remain bad in the past (Desmond Hubert, Will Shaver, Joel James, Brandon Huffman). Those bigs were coached by the messiah compared to Hubert and none of them were any good. I don't think Jalen has the talent that several on this board think he has. People will point to the development of Isiah Hicks or Brice Johnson. Idk about everyone else but it was crystal clear that Brice had a unique ability to put the ball into the basket from day one and it was really clear he had a pogo stick type of quick vertical. And Isiah Hicks was a top 10 recruit so there was more there with him to begin with.

I think this team just woefully missed on some talent evaluation. Jalen Washington isn't a starting caliber big at this level. Lubin isn't a starting caliber big for a contending major conference team. Withers has been who he's been for 5 years now. And escaping only the big guys, they probably mis-evaluated Cadeau to a degree. They massively misevaluated on Cade Tyson.

So idk if it's about development. Seth has developed into probably a starting caliber guard on quality teams and that's quite a lot of developing since his freshman year. RJ developed into a 1st team All American. So I think the staff has developed some guys and I think they've missed on the evaluation process of other guys.

We try to make things black and white. There's probably a bunch of gray when something like this is happening though.

 

[DSouthr]

Recently I've been wondering whether Gut could have turned our cluster-F of bigs into a competitive unit.

I mean is the talent really that weak, or is it just poorly developed?

To my layman's eyes some (all?) of our bigs show the skills we want . . . on occasion. So why not all the time - or at least a lot more?

Any of our gurus willing to speculate on that?

While I would not say this is a great team talent wise, it does have enough talent to win at a much higher level that the results show. The problem is easy to see but I don't know that I can explain why it is there or what to do about it, not sure I have ever seen such a thing? This team plays hard, at least most of he time, I really don't see it as a effort problem. What I see is a in your face degree of mental softness, the smallest thing seems to take away any confidence they have as individual players. I have seen many players lose confidence before but for basically an entire team to lose confidence at the same time, kind of amazing?

There seems to be no, zero leadership, none, zip nada. I see guys confident in their ability for example to shoot because they pump up shots but those shots look sadly un-confident. Example, Jalen can shoot, we have seen that he can but when he is wide open and has a moment to think about it he is missing badly. Yet late in this game he takes a trey and didn't have the time to think about it and splashes his first one of the season? RJ been struggling to shoot all season yet hit a fall away last split second trey in a recent game? Drake and Jack have both showed us they can hot jumpers but all the sudden nada? Tyson comes in a s balley hood shooter, so far waste of NIL, really bad misses. Even Seth was hitting treys before that concussion and now all the sudden he can't buy one? It is the whole team, it is treys and it is mid range open looks, it is even wide open lay ups? It is a severe lack of mental toughness and a lot of it is brought on by taking to many bad shots, miss enough bad shots the easy ones also become a challenge.

 

[gunslingerdick]

For our coach to be one of the best shooters in our program's history, I find it odd that we're a bad shooting team. Not only are we a bad shooting team, but our guys seem to get worse under Hubert's tutelage. What has happened to Washington? His shot looks awful now and he was supposedly "the best shooter on the team"; "best shooting big man of all time!"

I didn't watch a second of last night's game. I can't do it. My 13 year old was hollering in the basement and then he came up the stairs and I asked how the game went and he just asked, "why do we suck?". I told him the list was too long to get into at 11:00 pm. Poor roster construction, not disciplined, downright terrible in end game situations, the team doesn't feel close at all, no leadership, too small on the perimeter, bigs that are weak, small or have stone hands, low IQ players, etc.

The Hubert experiment has failed. I'm sorry that it has but it has. If we want a team with a great person as a head coach, then we should keep Hubert. If we want to win more, then we need a new one. I just hope that we're not so stupid as to try the "in-the-family" thing again and go to Wes with hat in hand. And now I fear that a commit from Caleb Wilson keeps Hubert around another year - a year that forecast to be barren as I suspect pretty much the whole team will leave. I could see Drake staying and that's about it.

 

[DSouthr]

Cadeau was the best we had last night, 14pts 13 assists, 5 boards, 2 steals, and was not in foul trouble. Both he and RJ shot 50% from the field but both took the wrong shot at the wrong time and we paid for it, not just them, Drake and Jack as well. Look, 32 treys, proof right there that making only 8 of 32 treys, not shooting enough treys is not nor has it ever been the problem, taking and making to few good shots is the problem. Things get tight, we are up by 1, saw our small lead slip away and what do we do, take a rushed trey, they board and get an easy 2, we now down 1. At critical times last night we took hero shots, not good shots.

We went in to the half with w tiny lead, Wake had their key players in this game all with 2 fouls each because we worked to get our front court involved and guards drove. But second half, it was bombs away from trey. WE went to the free throw line 6-10 for the game Wake was 21-27, why the difference, go back to the 32 treys taken, you draw very few fouls when you are bombing away from trey. Sure, a call here or there should have gone in our favor but didn't but don't blame the refs for our not taking shots that tend to draw fouls in that second half. You do what ever you have to do to expand the foul trouble they went in to the half with, you especially force Reid to defend so that maybe you don't lose the rebounding numbers, they ended up out boarding us 41-33. Spillers alone had 9 boards, our collective at the 4 Drake/JWit/Tyson had a combined of 4 boards, geez, little Cadeau had 5? Is anyone blocking out, is anyone going hard to the boards? Our starters had a collective 1 lone offensive board, as a team we had 8 with no one having more than 1. Their starters had 8 of their 10 offensive boards?

We got drilled on the boards, shot 25% of our 32 treys, didn't do things that get you to the free throw line while the other team did, deserved to lose.

 

[DSouthr]

Give Brown some more run...at least he plays with a little passion and fire!

I did feel like Brown played well for his few minutes, felt he was robbed on what should have been a and 1, refs called travel, have not re-watched that but I didn't see him walk, maybe he did and I missed it?

 

[alabamaheel]

Cadeau was the best we had last night, 14pts 13 assists, 5 boards, 2 steals, and was not in foul trouble. Both he and RJ shot 50% from the field but both took the wrong shot at the wrong time and we paid for it, not just them, Drake and Jack as well. Look, 32 treys, proof right there that making only 8 of 32 treys, not shooting enough treys is not nor has it ever been the problem, taking and making to few good shots is the problem. Things get tight, we are up by 1, saw our small lead slip away and what do we do, take a rushed trey, they board and get an easy 2, we now down 1. At critical times last night we took hero shots, not good shots.

We went in to the half with w tiny lead, Wake had their key players in this game all with 2 fouls each because we worked to get our front court involved and guards drove. But second half, it was bombs away from trey. WE went to the free throw line 6-10 for the game Wake was 21-27, why the difference, go back to the 32 treys taken, you draw very few fouls when you are bombing away from trey. Sure, a call here or there should have gone in our favor but didn't but don't blame the refs for our not taking shots that tend to draw fouls in that second half. You do what ever you have to do to expand the foul trouble they went in to the half with, you especially force Reid to defend so that maybe you don't lose the rebounding numbers, they ended up out boarding us 41-33. Spillers alone had 9 boards, our collective at the 4 Drake/JWit/Tyson had a combined of 4 boards, geez, little Cadeau had 5? Is anyone blocking out, is anyone going hard to the boards? Our starters had a collective 1 lone offensive board, as a team we had 8 with no one having more than 1. Their starters had 8 of their 10 offensive boards?

We got drilled on the boards, shot 25% of our 32 treys, didn't do things that get you to the free throw line while the other team did, deserved to lose.

And one would think after shooting 32 deep balls that we should end up with a few extra offensive rebounds. I didn’t mind any of the shots. If they go in great but hustle and get some extra opportunities.

 

[alabamaheel]

For our coach to be one of the best shooters in our program's history, I find it odd that we're a bad shooting team. Not only are we a bad shooting team, but our guys seem to get worse under Hubert's tutelage. What has happened to Washington? His shot looks awful now and he was supposedly "the best shooter on the team"; "best shooting big man of all time!"

I didn't watch a second of last night's game. I can't do it. My 13 year old was hollering in the basement and then he came up the stairs and I asked how the game went and he just asked, "why do we suck?". I told him the list was too long to get into at 11:00 pm. Poor roster construction, not disciplined, downright terrible in end game situations, the team doesn't feel close at all, no leadership, too small on the perimeter, bigs that are weak, small or have stone hands, low IQ players, etc.

The Hubert experiment has failed. I'm sorry that it has but it has. If we want a team with a great person as a head coach, then we should keep Hubert. If we want to win more, then we need a new one. I just hope that we're not so stupid as to try the "in-the-family" thing again and go to Wes with hat in hand. And now I fear that a commit from Caleb Wilson keeps Hubert around another year - a year that forecast to be barren as I suspect pretty much the whole team will leave. I could see Drake staying and that's about it.

My youngest leaves for college this year and he’s not watching very many with me now, which stinks. The landscape of college sports in general is not appealing to me as it once was. Of course priorities change in different seasons of life but I still need my UNC fix while living in Alabama now lol.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Even Seth was hitting treys before that concussion and now all the sudden he can't buy one?

Actually, his shot deserted him before the concussion. He was 50% from deep until Alabama. Starting with the Alabama game - where he went 1 of 4 - he's been hitting 16%.

This worries me a bit because I remember his freshman season. You'll probably remember how well he did at first. Some even thought he might be OAD. And then he had a terrible time against UVa, and never recovered.

As a soph, Seth looked like what many of us expected as a frosh. Really good but not as far along as he should have been as a soph. Good outside shot, but didn't show confidence in it.

Then this season, he had clearly turned the corner. Until Alabama, he was shooting and playing with confidence. Swagger, even.

I hope he gets that back. And quickly.