Kris Wilkes...

[DSouthr]

No, Wilkes is not an alternative to PJ (other than in some paranoid posters' heads). He is however a versatile Forward who the coaches likely see as giving us small-ball flexibility (a la Theo).

My concern with Knox is he seems determined to play away from the basket which may steer him elsewhere.

Gary, I agree and disagree at the same time, I agree PJ is more a under sized 4 but from what I have seen of Wilkes, not sure I see him shooting like I would typically see from a wing. I agree, he is more in the Theo mold for a wing but I see him as a kid that can hit the weight room and become a stud at the 4. I don't know that his motor runs as hot as PJs but that is like saying a kids motor does not run like Hansbourgh, it really is not fair to begin with and people don't seem to realize that a motor that runs as strong as that is in itself a talent that few have.

On Knox, ok, so I am just going to say it, I think the kid is making a mistake by putting himself exclusively in to a wing box. I think he is a power forward that dreams of being Durant/Dirk/Lebron/Mello. Same dream Hension had until he woke up and realized, I am what I am, why not be the best I can be

 

[DSouthr]

Honestly I think it's fair to say Roy is pragmatic as one must sometimes be in recruiting. Those three are obviously his primo targets who fit the system as well as being elite players, but he has others up his sleeve, be it a Watson or whoever.

I'm just gonna put this out there: Anyone who tells you they know we're not getting any of the three elite targets is just guessing and/or blustering. Could it work out that way? Sure --- there are only so many of those guys to go around. But it will NOT mean anyone knows anything. There's a lotta wishful thinking among the faithful (and "analysts" tied to certain programs) at this point.

To answer your direct questions, 1. Yes --- Roy is (quite properly) going all-in to secure at least one of the elite three Bigs we mentioned and isn't gonna give up all his schollies before summer is over. And 2. Yes, to some degree I think it's fair to say Roy is adjusting to look for more versatile players who can shoot --- especially at the Wing/Forward position --- as elite Bigs (who are willing to act like Bigs) become more scarce.

gary, I think it is pretty darn clear that Roy still feels he has a shot at either bamba or PJ or maybe even both. If he did not then we would see a bunch more offers out to 2016 big men, we don't see that.

What we have a lot of is folks watch sites like 247 and because someone votes for some other program they take that as gospel. Now some of those projections are based on some intel but much of it is based on perception, the same kind of perception we see repeated here day after day. When it comes to carter, yeah, I think we can close that book, Knox maybe not totally closed but darn near. But best I can tell there is no reason to close the book on Bamba, PJ, or Vanderbilt. You don't back away from a kid just because of rumors or some guy casting his vote on a site like 247, you base your decisions off of absolute fact and let message board folk sweat over expert guesses.

 

[gauchoheel]

I think the one caveat to that DSouthr is that if we wait until absolute fact is established we could be waiting until next April, at which point most of our other big targets are gone. That is what is worrying people. It would be helpful to read the tea leaves if there is some truth to them.

I don't have any tea leaves, hopefully Roy does! As I said a bit earlier on the thread, I think Roy's offer strategy makes perfect sense if we're only looking to sign 2 bigs.

 

[DSouthr]

I think the one caveat to that DSouthr is that if we wait until absolute fact is established we could be waiting until next April, at which point most of our other big targets are gone. That is what is worrying people. It would be helpful to read the tea leaves if there is some truth to them.

I don't have any tea leaves, hopefully Roy does! As I said a bit earlier on the thread, I think Roy's offer strategy makes perfect sense if we're only looking to sign 2 bigs.

I agree, actually I have been begging for more big man offers to go out but there are reasons more have not gone out considering our strong area of need and the fact there are some 3 and 4 star big men that can really help us. When you ask yourself why no more big man offers have gone out, the only real answer has to be that Roy feels a lot stronger that he will get guys like PJ, Bamba, or vanderbilt than this and many message board posters do.

 

[gary-7]

Yeah I read it, so what?

First of all, I'd like to know specifically who these three elite targets you talked about are.

Second of all, you can claim all you want people saying we aren't landing any of them are just "blustering." I call it reality. The winds aren't blowing in our favor for most, if not all, of the top 5 or 6 big guys.

And lastly, why are you claiming "no one knows" anything? You're just grasping at straws trying to believe that somehow, someway, an elite top 15 prospect is coming our way when there has been no indication of that. That's your own wishful thinking.

What winds exactly?

And let's set the record straight: I'm not wishing or grasping for a damned thing. You're the one who grasps for every negative straw out there.

 

[gary-7]

Gary, I agree and disagree at the same time, I agree PJ is more a under sized 4 but from what I have seen of Wilkes, not sure I see him shooting like I would typically see from a wing. I agree, he is more in the Theo mold for a wing but I see him as a kid that can hit the weight room and become a stud at the 4. I don't know that his motor runs as hot as PJs but that is like saying a kids motor does not run like Hansbourgh, it really is not fair to begin with and people don't seem to realize that a motor that runs as strong as that is in itself a talent that few have.

On Knox, ok, so I am just going to say it, I think the kid is making a mistake by putting himself exclusively in to a wing box. I think he is a power forward that dreams of being Durant/Dirk/Lebron/Mello. Same dream Hension had until he woke up and realized, I am what I am, why not be the best I can be

Yes, the Henson analogy has come to mind, Dave. And I guess Roy did finesse that one by promising him a shot at the 3 (which he gave him), and reality brought John around. That being said my other caveat with us getting Knox is that he sounds more and more like he's thinking OAD. I'm not saying that's a disqualifier, but will he have the time to figure out what Henson did?

 

[DSouthr]

Yes, the Henson analogy has come to mind, Dave. And I guess Roy did finesse that one by promising him a shot at the 3 (which he gave him), and reality brought John around. That being said my other caveat with us getting Knox is that he sounds more and more like he's thinking OAD. I'm not saying that's a disqualifier, but will he have the time to figure out what Henson did?

I tend to worry, with these kids that near demand they be one & done, are there coachability concerns? Are they really willing to accept coaching or do they feel like they already know all they need to know? Seems to me they spend way more time trying to do the job the coach is paid for like selecting who the coach wants on his team as opposed to bring in me and my package deal, or I will be a wing and not a power forward, isn't that supposed to be up to the coach to put his players in the position he feels most benefits his team? It just does not sit well with me, be the best player you can be and let the coach do his job.

 

[Steat]

Here is the latest on Bamba. It's not over until the fat lady sings, but looks like Duke is the favorite. Kiss Bamba goodbye folks....

https://www.sny.tv/college-recruiting/news/mohamed-bamba-plans-uconn-visit-talks-duke/192850098

 

[carolinablue34]

Here is the latest on Bamba. It's not over until the fat lady sings, but looks like Duke is the favorite. Kiss Bamba goodbye folks....

https://www.sny.tv/college-recruiting/news/mohamed-bamba-plans-uconn-visit-talks-duke/192850098

@gary-7

You were asking what 'winds' I was referring to.

This answer your question?

I'm not negative, merely I just prefer a harsh reality than hold false hope.

 

[RP12]

There is nothing in that link from Mo himself that says dook is a favorite. There are lots of positive quotes about us from guys who went elsewhere.

 

[gary-7]

@gary-7

You were asking what 'winds' I was referring to.

This answer your question?

I'm not negative, merely I just prefer a harsh reality than hold false hope.

And that's your determinant of reality? OK.

Just a suggestion, but instead of hanging on every word on every website about recruiting, some of y'all might wanna take a lap.

 

[gary-7]

There is nothing in that link from Mo himself that says dook is a favorite. There are lots of positive quotes about us from guys who went elsewhere.

Ding Ding Ding! Winner.

 

[carolinablue34]

And that's your determinant of reality? OK.

Just a suggestion, but instead of hanging on every word on every website about recruiting, some of y'all might wanna take a lap.

I'll tell you what gar, if we land any of these targets (you still haven't specified which ones yet), just one, I will be glad to admit I was wrong. I will tag you in a post and say so. Cross my heart.

Which ones? PJ, Bamba, and Carter? Are those the three?

Well let me go out on a limb here and say we won't get any of them. I guarantee you right now. I don't give a damn if it comes off as negative, none of these recruits give a crap about people talking on a message board.

We're not getting them. Unless something big happens. But I stand by my prediction.

 

[carolinablue34]

Ding Ding Ding! Winner.

And that's what you use to back up your argument? Ok guy

 

[Sk1310]

There is nothing in that link from Mo himself that says dook is a favorite. There are lots of positive quotes about us from guys who went elsewhere.

Yup, plus he was asked what he liked about Duke. It's not like he just mentioned Duke out of the blue

 

[gary-7]

And that's what you use to back up your argument? Ok guy

Wasn't an argument, Einstein. @RP12 just hit the nail on the head. That signals agreemnent, ICYMI.

 

[carolinablue34]

Wasn't an argument, Einstein. @RP12 just hit the nail on the head. That signals agreemnent, ICYMI.

Your argument, your opinion rather, is that anyone saying we won't land 3 of those elite recruits, which you STILL have not named, is blustering and doesn't know anything.

Well here's mine. Come next year, you will not see any of the elite big men we have tried to recruit come to Chapel Hill (this is excluding Wilkes). NMJFHWJSZZZ or whatever stupid acronym you always do.

Stop trying to rouse false hope in people with these baseless speculations.

 

[gary-7]

I'll tell you what gar, if we land any of these targets (you still haven't specified which ones yet), just one, I will be glad to admit I was wrong. I will tag you in a post and say so. Cross my heart.

Which ones? PJ, Bamba, and Carter? Are those the three?

Well let me go out on a limb here and say we won't get any of them. I guarantee you right now. I don't give a damn if it comes off as negative, none of these recruits give a crap about people talking on a message board.

We're not getting them. Unless something big happens. But I stand by my prediction.

Wow. What a bold soothsayer thou art. Go with the flow so you can hope to say you were right? Somebody call Kreskin. Whether that earth-shaking pronouncement comes true or not it doesn't change the simple fact that at this point you don't know a damned thing one way or the other.

 

[carolinablue34]

Wow. What a bold soothsayer thou art. Go with the flow so you can hope to say you were right? Somebody call Kreskin. Whether that earth-shaking pronouncement comes true or not it doesn't change the simple fact that at this point you don't know a damned thing one way or the other.

Yeah well that's not much coming from you, seeing as you don't know anything either.

I don't hope I'm right, it's simply what I believe despite my frustrations that for whatever reason, guys 6'8 and above simply seem to want to go to dook and Kentucky and not us.

 

[RP12]

What we're talking about here is really OADs. The fact is bigs are more likely to be OAD and so our struggles with elites is more around their OAD outlook than their size. This has been discussed repeatedly including the factors of NCAA junk, Roy's system, his preferences, loyalty to current players, and the cyclical nature of these things. 2017 provides a unique opportunity for a OAD to come in and have a clearer path to PT than has been the case for some time at UNC, so we'll get a better idea of how much of this is a stigma and how much was situational.

 

[Ned Cota]

Yeah well that's not much coming from you, seeing as you don't know anything either.

I don't hope I'm right, it's simply what I believe despite my frustrations that for whatever reason, guys 6'8 and above simply seem to want to go to dook and Kentucky and not us.

You're both just guessing, even admittedly. Gary is choosing to leave the door open because none of these recruits have eliminated us yet, and because Roy hasn't moved on from them yet. That's all that ANYONE knows.

You piss people off when you pretend to know more, especially when it's in a bad direction. You didn't ask for it, but my advice is to cool down a little and enjoy watching Roy work through the process. Hope for the best and be glad that as a Carolina fan that's normally what we get.

If you're at all interested, I bet we get a 5 star big man to go with Watson.

 

[gary-7]

Yeah well that's not much coming from you, seeing as you don't know anything either.

I don't hope I'm right, it's simply what I believe despite my frustrations that for whatever reason, guys 6'8 and above simply seem to want to go to dook and Kentucky and not us.

And there's my point. Of the remaining targets I don't purport to know yet where they'll end up, and a lot of these sites write up what they think (or in many cases hope) will happen and ask interview questions tailored to their narrative (like the one referenced above).

When I do feel like I know, I put it out there. And truth be told I'll stand on my track record when I have done so in the past.

 

[CarolinaBlue5]

When asked these kids are always gonna have something good to say about EVERY school recruiting them! Even when not asked they're gonna make comments like this! I think ppl look into and over analyze these interviews way to much! Not too long ago he was praising us in an interview if I'm not mistaken!

 

[gary-7]

When asked these kids are always gonna have something good to say about EVERY school recruiting them! Even when not asked they're gonna make comments like this! I think ppl look into and over analyze these interviews way to much! Not too long ago he was praising us in an interview if I'm not mistaken!

He was indeed. Mo is a very intelligent and seemingly media-savvy young fella --- knows the right things to say to whomever is asking.

 

[UNC Blue Hup]

We won't know anything on these young men for a while..let's enjoy the fact Roy Williams is one of the BEST recruiters to ever live...I'm always thankful he came home and if you think he's lost a step you need to look at his results through the worst academic accusations that led to negative recruiting throughout the country against UNC in modern history.. He's trying to make Carolina basketball the best in the country as he always has...I shake my head if you don't share the same thoughts as a true Tar Heel fan...Go Heels!

 

[UNC Blue Hup]

By the way, I want Wilkes worse than anyone..Bamba, PJ...young man can play with an attitude

 

[carolinablue34]

You're both just guessing, even admittedly. Gary is choosing to leave the door open because none of these recruits have eliminated us yet, and because Roy hasn't moved on from them yet. That's all that ANYONE knows.

You piss people off when you pretend to know more, especially when it's in a bad direction. You didn't ask for it, but my advice is to cool down a little and enjoy watching Roy work through the process. Hope for the best and be glad that as a Carolina fan that's normally what we get.

If you're at all interested, I bet we get a 5 star big man to go with Watson.

Well I certainly hope we get a 5 star, but those kids just don't seem to feel UNC is the best option currently, especially when it comes to going pro.

I don't pretend to know anything, Gary does that. I only state, that given what we've seen the past few years, I wouldn't count on getting a 5 star big guy. That's what I'm basing my prediction on. I want to be wrong, but I'd rather be pleasantly surprised than hold any false hope.

 

[gary-7]

Well I certainly hope we get a 5 star, but those kids just don't seem to feel UNC is the best option currently, especially when it comes to going pro.

I don't pretend to know anything, Gary does that. I only state, that given what we've seen the past few years, I wouldn't count on getting a 5 star big guy. That's what I'm basing my prediction on. I want to be wrong, but I'd rather be pleasantly surprised than hold any false hope.

Let's get something straight once and for all: I don't "pretend" a damned thing.

 

[Ned Cota]

Let's get something straight once and for all: I don't "pretend" a damned thing.

I was hoping my post would calm or end this little spat with you two, so for the sake of a lot of us that just wanna talk hoops can y'all cut it out? Its nice to have 2 different viewpoints even if sometimes they're equally apocalyptic and pollyanna. But the back and forth with no substance is getting old.

 

[carolinablue34]

I was hoping my post would calm or end this little spat with you two, so for the sake of a lot of us that just wanna talk hoops can y'all cut it out? Its nice to have 2 different viewpoints even if sometimes they're equally apocalyptic and pollyanna. But the back and forth with no substance is getting old.

Alright that's fine. Let's get back to discussing recruiting.

 

[gary-7]

I was hoping my post would calm or end this little spat with you two, so for the sake of a lot of us that just wanna talk hoops can y'all cut it out? Its nice to have 2 different viewpoints even if sometimes they're equally apocalyptic and pollyanna. But the back and forth with no substance is getting old.

Ned, this isn't a "y'all" thing, This is all on him. All he has to do is stay away from my posts, and trust me, I'll gladly stay away from his. I didn't start this but I'm not gonna let some newbie come on here and question my integrity (which he has done over and over again). Most folks know I'm here to talk hoops. If it's left at that I am more than fine.

 

[carolinablue34]

Ned, this isn't a "y'all" thing, This is all on him. All he has to do is stay away from my posts, and trust me, I'll gladly stay away from his. I didn't start this but I'm not gonna let some newbie come on here and question my integrity (which he has done over and over again). Most folks know I'm here to talk hoops. If it's left at that I am more than fine.

You know very well this is not all on me. I have every right (and reason) to take your tidbits with a huge grain of salt. Especially when you imply I'm somehow a duke fan.

However, let's agree to disagree and move on. You stay away from my posts, I'll stay away from yours.

 

[Ned Cota]

Alright that's fine. Let's get back to discussing recruiting.

With the Wilkes offer and this Stokes offer, along with the love for PJ and Knox it is just becoming more and more obvious to me that Roy loves the small ball 4. Marvin and Jawad were precursors to this, and we saw David Noel play some of that a little while back. Pinson last year. Roy is clearly paying attention to this NBA driven trend.

I haven't fleshed this out yet, but maybe Roy isnt saving 1 slot for an elite big and 1 for a project big, but more 1 for a traditional back to the basket big and 1 for a small ball 4.

 

[carolinablue34]

With the Wilkes offer and this Stokes offer, along with the love for PJ and Knox it is just becoming more and more obvious to me that Roy loves the small ball 4. Marvin and Jawad were precursors to this, and we saw David Noel play some of that a little while back. Pinson last year. Roy is clearly paying attention to this NBA driven trend.

I haven't fleshed this out yet, but maybe Roy isnt saving 1 slot for an elite big and 1 for a project big, but more 1 for a traditional back to the basket big and 1 for a small ball 4.

I'm fine with whomever he gets, as long as they're tall, can rebound and get us wins.

It's still not clear at this point who exactly we will end up with or what big men seem to favor us the most.

 

[gary-7]

You know very well this is not all on me. I have every right (and reason) to take your tidbits with a huge grain of salt. Especially when you imply I'm somehow a duke fan.

However, let's agree to disagree and move on. You stay away from my posts, I'll stay away from yours.

I know no such thing, but yes, that's exactly what I suggested --- you stay away from mine and I'll gladly stay away from yours and I'm good with that.

 

[Ned Cota]

I know no such thing, but yes, that's exactly what I suggested --- you stay away from mine and I'll gladly stay away from yours and I'm good with that.

There. You guys actually agreed on something. Enough.