Late stuff (uk game)...

[al would]

If you’re going to criticize Hubert, criticize every coach in America.

Some players on some teams need to be on the court a lot of minutes and their teams style of play allows that. I think UNC would be better off using their bench more. And its more for a longer term benefit than short term, but it seems anymore long term in NCAAMBB is one season.

 

[notashelbyfan]

The last 2 games were lost on the glass and you can analyze that all you want.

 

[notashelbyfan]

Their primary ball handlers (Dilly and Wagner) had 6 assists vs 3 TOs, our primary ball handlers (Cadeau and RJ) had 7 assists vs 7 TOs. That actually is a strong indicator of what team was more secure with the ball.

You are 100% right but you might as well got tell your mailbox.

 

[Deezheelz]

What would Roy do? Rebounding seems like one of the biggest differences from his era.

I was thinking that this might just be the trade-off for having a better 3pt shooting team, but a quick glance at Roy's pre-COVID numbers doesn't seem to bear that out. Comparable 3pt shooting percentage, but better rebounding.

Are we maybe defending against the three better - meaning less packed in where defensive rebounding is easier?

Are we taking more treys - meaning fewer guys in position for offensive rebounding?

To me is just a matter of wanting to

 

[notashelbyfan]

To me is just a matter of wanting to

Yes 100% Dean Smith and Roy Williams woul have had a stroke if their teams would have gotten out rebounded like they have in the last 2 games and they wouldn't have gave a damn about being smaller. They might have got it out rebounded in one game and they might have lost the next game but you could bet they wouldn't have got out rebounded in the 2nd game.

 

[Mrs.Jeans15]

The layoff hurt.

Fun game. Kentucky hit tough shots. Easy missed rebounds lost us the game

Reminds me of 2017..

 

[Mrs.Jeans15]

Kentucky is bigger at every position.

Of course we were out rebounded. Thats why you can't have crazy TOs..

 

[ChiShankCity]

Some players on some teams need to be on the court a lot of minutes and their teams style of play allows that. I think UNC would be better off using their bench more. And its more for a longer term benefit than short term, but it seems anymore long term in NCAAMBB is one season.

Zach Edey has played 20-25 minutes 4x this season. Purdue is clearly managing his minutes especially in blowouts. He’s played 33+ minutes 6 times against good teams and in close games (Northwestern).

This is normal. Even Donovan Clingan on UConn played over 30 minutes at Kansas when he was routinely under 20 minutes in early season blowouts.

 

[gkss]

It wasnt sound. But you have a right to your opinion.

We’ll never know- we didn’t apply the pressure that we should have.

 

[montana_heel]

Don't think the switching helps us with box outs on the defensive end. That is another negative to doing it constantly. I think mixing up when to switch would really help make us less predictable. Mixing up defenses seems like a good way to maybe get a team out of rhythm. I would try to put a stop to switching any not on ball screens. Fight through those. If Bacot is guarding a guard and he shoots, then an opposing center is getting boxed out by a small guard. Not a rosy picture.

UK wanted it more in my opinion. They were flying around, getting on the floor first for loose balls. Getting out to an early lead really boosted their confidence and that allowed them to play very free. They just had the energy tonight and that was just enough to get it done

 

[Geth]

I usually can't be fussed with the incessant waste of time that is "why didn't we didn't do this or that" when it comes to a game --- BUT --- I still cannot understand why we didn't apply pressure more often at least in a hand full of scenarios late on. If any group of players would have been affected by it- IMO it would have been this young UK team who already looked suspect at times.

Another game vs an upper echelon talent where we got close- actually game back from a big deficit but couldn't seal it. Much rather take those L's and learn than a W from a 40 point blow out vs a team that does nothing for us except falsely inflate our player's egos.

 

[Bubspub88]

Kentucky played a better game. I was hoping Cal would try to coach them and do something stupid like play two bigs together. Instead he just let them play. UNC played a good game but cannot win against a quality opponent turning it over 17 times. UK had almost 10 blocks and UNC had 6 offensive boards.

The last TO was inexcusable. Unfortunately with the ACC this year, this may have been the last chance for a quality quad 1 win. I was hoping we would not be having any bubble talk in February but that now a real possibility.

UNC has the talent to make some noise in March but they have to start showing more intensity. I remember one loose ball when a UNC was just reaching down for it while a UK freshman (Dillingham, maybe) dove for it from about 6 feet away - he just wanted that ball more.

Bacot was not even a factor - 4 fg attempts from a preseason AA is ridiculous. I hate to admit it but this is same movie from previous seasons - the team looks good an paper, shows some nice things along the way but when it comes to crunch time against one of the big boys they just shoot themselves in the foot.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Imagine if any of the rumored wings had come and we had Ryan coming off the bench. My gosh this team would be good. Even if Ryan wouldn't have been willing to do that, frankly I would've been willing to lose him/Withers to get the right wing.

I initially wanted Matthew Cleveland (from FSU) who is doing really well at Miami, now. But that was because I thought we'd only get 1 guy of the 3 we were looking at. Instead we got the other 2 - Ingram and Ryan - and that seemed even better.

At the moment this lineup

Cadeau
RJ
Cleveland
Ingram
Bacot

... with Ryan playing starter-level minutes backing both wing positions, looks like a winning lineup, albeit on the short side.

I wasn't the only one who thought Withers would be better. And I still hope he'll get there. We need help in that part of the lineup.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

I still cannot understand why we didn't apply pressure more often at least in a hand full of scenarios late on.

I always want to see more of that, but I wonder if they were just too quick for that to work more than a few well-chosen times in a game like this. Hard to know.

 

[DSouthr]

OK, maybe, but I'm under the impression that when there is a clear path to the basket I think they call flagrant 98% of the time on the hard swing through from behind alone. I think you are giving away a possession and probably the points anyway as well. Clear path with contact from behind clearly going to foul.

Look, you challenge a break away like that you are pretty much going to get called for the foul automatically if you are not able to make a play on the ball, your only hope is to be able to touch the ball and not wrap with your off arm, which of course Paxson was able to do neither. You beg for the F-1 (at least) if you make a play on the man and not the ball in open court like that. I get it, in the heat of a battle after a bad TO you want to challenge it, you want to make them have to earn the points from the line, maybe even send a physical message in doing so. But if you can't make a play on the ball you have to let it go and Paxon didn't.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

The last TO was inexcusable. Unfortunately with the ACC this year

I'm just glad Elliot got his Freddie Brown moment out of his system early, and I hope it charges him up rather than demoralizing him. Hey, at least he didn't pass it to a UK player.

Cadeau is still the talent we thought he was. Just maybe not quite as far along as we thought he'd be by now. Very close, though.

Just for fun, I looked up Freddie Brown. He played 13 years in the NBA. That pass may define him for us, but it didn't break him.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

I'm under the impression that when there is a clear path to the basket I think they call flagrant 98% of the time on the hard swing through from behind alone.

You're probably right but it always pisses me off when a call is made because "they're always going to call that" rather than because there was an actual foul (or an actual flagrant, in this case).

That was clearly a foul. Paxson was also clearly going for the ball. And, to me, the amount or type of contact didn't rise to the level of "flagrant." Obviously people can disagree, but it shouldn't be called just because they always call it that way.

/rant

 

[DSouthr]

I always want to see more of that, but I wonder if they were just too quick for that to work more than a few well-chosen times in a game like this. Hard to know.

If a team presses us, I am very comfortable in putting the ball in Cadeau's hands because he is the level ball handler that breaks presses on his own, Dillingham is the ball handler with quickness that is able to do the same thing, even Seth struggled defending his quickness. Wagner is a big guard yet still a really good ball handler, really hard to press a duo like that. But with Cadeau struggling and in some foul trouble, with RJ not exactly the greatest on ball guard defender, don't think pressing Ky was a great move. Press a weak ball handling back court but a strong one will make you pay for the press.

I think the better tactic would have been to go to Bacot inside when Bradshaw picked up his 4th foul to get their rim protector out of the game. I would have put length in that game, as I have said with Jalen at the 4 and Ingram at the 3. Hubert rather went with Withers at the 4 with Ingram at the 3 with Bacot but Withers has not been producing on the offensive end like Jalen has.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

If a team presses us, I am very comfortable in putting the ball in Cadeau's hands because he is the level ball handler that breaks presses on his own, Dillingham is the ball handler with quickness that is able to do the same thing, even Seth struggled defending his quickness. Wagner is a big guard yet still a really good ball handler, really hard to press a duo like that. But with Cadeau struggling and in some foul trouble, with RJ not exactly the greatest on ball guard defender, don't think pressing Ky was a great move. Press a weak ball handling back court but a strong one will make you pay for the press.

I think the better tactic would have been to go to Bacot inside when Bradshaw picked up his 4th foul to get their rim protector out of the game. I would have put length in that game, as I have said with Jalen at the 4 and Ingram at the 3. Hubert rather went with Withers at the 4 with Ingram at the 3 with Bacot but Withers has not been producing on the offensive end like Jalen has.

Withers is the better defender. Clearly we need to put Washington and Withers in a Star Trek transporter together and have an "accident." Washington's scoring and finesse, Withers's motor and quickness.

 

[IDUNK4HEELS]

Let’s face getting dominated on the boards is not the Carolina way. It is so unfair to expect Bacot to get every rebound and for Davis to lead the team in rebounding against Kentucky. Nobody is going to like my response to solving the problem but it is pretty obvious and that is to put Withers in and take Cadeau out for the time being.

Carolina got back into the game and stayed close the last ten minutes of the contest with that lineup on the court. Withers might not score but neither does Cadeau but Withers is a defensive stopper as his three blocks showed.

Ingram should be getting more boards but for some reason is not. Put Davis at the point and Ryan at the two and see what happens.

 

[ChiShankCity]

Let’s face getting dominated on the boards is not the Carolina way. It is so unfair to expect Bacot to get every rebound and for Davis to lead the team in rebounding against Kentucky. Nobody is going to like my response to solving the problem but it is pretty obvious and that is to put Withers in and take Cadeau out for the time being.

Carolina got back into the game and stayed close the last ten minutes of the contest with that lineup on the court. Withers might not score but neither does Cadeau but Withers is a defensive stopper as his three blocks showed.

Ingram should be getting more boards but for some reason is not. Put Davis at the point and Ryan at the two and see what happens.

So change the lineup because we lost a close game to Kentucky... Got it. Go back to RJ Davis as the PG because we lost the rebounding battle and that hurts your ego.... Got it.

Idk, maybe Ryan and RJ could make one of their wide ass open corner 3's late 2nd half?

Damnit, missing open corner 3's isn't the Carolina Way! START WOJCIK!

What the hell is going on?

 

[Heels5150]

Bradshaw should had already fouled out. The refs gave the foul to someone else when it was clearly on Bradshaw. That not withstanding it wasn’t the reason we lost but it sure didn’t help.

 

[alabamaheel]

Bradshaw should had already fouled out. The refs gave the foul to someone else when it was clearly on Bradshaw. That not withstanding it wasn’t the reason we lost but it sure didn’t help.

No doubt, considering it was him who was in each rebound and play down the stretch. Lol

 

[Assasin3200]

They gave Bradshaw's obvious 5th to Dillingham when Bradshaw mugged Mondo on the low block.

 

[al would]

Nobody is going to like my response to solving the problem but it is pretty obvious and that is to put Withers in and take Cadeau out for the time being.

Carolina got back into the game and stayed close the last ten minutes of the contest with that lineup on the court. Withers might not score but neither does Cadeau but Withers is a defensive stopper as his three blocks showed.

Ingram should be getting more boards but for some reason is not. Put Davis at the point and Ryan at the two and see what happens.

Yup .. don't think putting RJ at the pg is the solution .. that's a no brainer.
Let's just lay it out here. We are an undersized team and any size we might have going forward needs to be developed and played. RJ is not a pg. Bacot is not that athletic and struggles bigly against players with size, has no handle (even though he thinks so), has no real go to shot from anything outside the lane and not many inside the lane. Cormac looked good against UK but he seems to be streaky as a shooter .. so far. Ingram seems to be finding his niche and is worth his PT and can make a difference. JWash, if he stays healthy, gains 30 in muscle is an NBA player. Not sure how or where Seth fits in on this team but he is freaky athletic and when he learns to control it he can make good coin playing somewhere and he may well make a diff @UNC before his time is done.

Question is .. drum roll ... is the coaching staff getting the best out of, and using this team to it's best potential. I don't think so. jmo

 

[dtodd4475]

You're probably right but it always pisses me off when a call is made because "they're always going to call that" rather than because there was an actual foul (or an actual flagrant, in this case).

That was clearly a foul. Paxson was also clearly going for the ball. And, to me, the amount or type of contact didn't rise to the level of "flagrant." Obviously people can disagree, but it shouldn't be called just because they always call it that way.

/rant

I hear ya. But just swinging hard at the ball if it is not a normal "strip" action from behind on a clear path rising up is going to get called flagrant. In my humble opinion, ya gotta call that. Damn, sure would want it if RJ had a breakout, and a big swung through him fom the back. Not a basketball move, a foul move, from behind while swinging toward the ball move, yes he did do that.

 

[alabamaheel]

I hear ya. But just swinging hard at the ball if it is not a normal "strip" action from behind on a clear path rising up is going to get called flagrant. In my humble opinion, ya gotta call that. Damn, sure would want it if RJ had a breakout, and a big swung through him fom the back. Not a basketball move, a foul move, from behind while swinging toward the ball move, yes he did do that.

I agree but I liked it. No problem sending a message without hurting someone.

 

[dtodd4475]

I agree but I liked it. No problem sending a message without hurting someone.

I hear that. He did pull it off safely. I think they got it right, flagrant 1, not flagrant 2, which he could have done, but not a common foul.

 

[al would]

I agree but I liked it. No problem sending a message without hurting someone.

Anytime you get a flagrant you didn't "do it right".

 

[alabamaheel]

Anytime you get a flagrant you didn't "do it right".

That’s your opinion. Sometimes u send messages but without hurting anyone. Could have been harder. And same applies for coaching with technicals, sometimes u send a message

 

[DSouthr]

They gave Bradshaw's obvious 5th to Dillingham when Bradshaw mugged Mondo on the low block.

Yes they did and that was a turning point, Bradshaw came down on the other end and scored & just played big for the last few minutes.

 

[al would]

That’s your opinion. Sometimes u send messages but without hurting anyone.

And I agree. But giving up a possession and a couple chances from the line in a close game just doesn't make sense to me. And sometimes you just never know what any one particular ref or crew is gonna call it. There were some interesting calls made in that game .. and that's pretty common anymore.

 

[gauchoheel]

Yup .. don't think putting RJ at the pg is the solution .. that's a no brainer.
Let's just lay it out here. We are an undersized team and any size we might have going forward needs to be developed and played. RJ is not a pg. Bacot is not that athletic and struggles bigly against players with size, has no handle (even though he thinks so), has no real go to shot from anything outside the lane and not many inside the lane. Cormac looked good against UK but he seems to be streaky as a shooter .. so far. Ingram seems to be finding his niche and is worth his PT and can make a difference. JWash, if he stays healthy, gains 30 in muscle is an NBA player. Not sure how or where Seth fits in on this team but he is freaky athletic and when he learns to control it he can make good coin playing somewhere and he may well make a diff @UNC before his time is done.

Question is .. drum roll ... is the coaching staff getting the best out of, and using this team to it's best potential. I don't think so. jmo

Idk where this optimism on Washington is coming from. He's tall and can shoot, which is a great combo, but he can't defend even at the college level. To be honest I'm worried about him ever starting at UNC. Even if he put on muscle to rebound better, he is too slow to defend anybody.

 

[tarwhiz]

Idk where this optimism on Washington coming from. He's tall and can shoot, which is a great combo, but he can't defend even at the college level. To be honest I'm worried about him ever starting at UNC. Even if he put on muscle to rebound better, he is too slow to defend anybody.

I gotta say, in the preseason and even after a few games, I was confident that J Wash would continue to evolve and stake his claim as the starting 5 in 2024-25.
Recently I have become less and less confident that Carolina can trust freely giving that position over to Jalen next season.
Next year's roster looks to be the most talented and athletic it has been in years and with a few holes to fill in the portal, should be a legitimate threat to win an NCAAT.
For any of this to happen though, a legitimate rim protector must be in play. I love the potential of Zayden High as a 4/5 big and JWith has another year of eligibility, but there is not a difference making 4/5 on the roster yet in 2024-25.
Hubert will need to shoot for the moon, and Beisner will need to earn his keep too this off-season. We can't let a Sr Ingram, and all those athletic guards/ wings be hung out to dry with am incomplete roster.
Needs for next season:
#1Elite Big Man,
#2 knockdown shooter!

 

[DSouthr]

Don't think the switching helps us with box outs on the defensive end. That is another negative to doing it constantly. I think mixing up when to switch would really help make us less predictable. Mixing up defenses seems like a good way to maybe get a team out of rhythm. I would try to put a stop to switching any not on ball screens. Fight through those. If Bacot is guarding a guard and he shoots, then an opposing center is getting boxed out by a small guard. Not a rosy picture.

UK wanted it more in my opinion. They were flying around, getting on the floor first for loose balls. Getting out to an early lead really boosted their confidence and that allowed them to play very free. They just had the energy tonight and that was just enough to get it done

Darn good post!!!

 

[imajericho]

Idk where this optimism on Washington is coming from. He's tall and can shoot, which is a great combo, but he can't defend even at the college level. To be honest I'm worried about him ever starting at UNC. Even if he put on muscle to rebound better, he is too slow to defend anybody.

I said this on the video someone posted of him in the off-season. The surgery has made him too slow now. He gets burned over and over defensively and has no real burst to do more than use height to shoot over someone.

 

[DSouthr]

Idk where this optimism on Washington is coming from. He's tall and can shoot, which is a great combo, but he can't defend even at the college level. To be honest I'm worried about him ever starting at UNC. Even if he put on muscle to rebound better, he is too slow to defend anybody.

Not gonna try to speak for anyone else, but as for why I want Jalen to start at the 4, I will be glad to explain and I already have to a large extent so I will try not to replicate what I have already said, just add to that. Get ready cause this will take me a few words...LOL

Everybody now days wants a stretch 4, poll this board for example, how many UNC fans want us to have a really productive stretch 4? Most will come back and say they do and many of those will as well inform me that we have just that in Ingram. Strip everything else away (don't factor in any other player on this team) and ask yourself 1 simple question, would you prefer Ingram to play against other 3s or other 4s? Ingram is at his best when he has a double barrel approach on the offensive end, where he can pop out for a catch and shoot jumper, many times from trey land or he backs his guy down to either pass over him or score over him. He is 6'7" and weights in around 220-225, that is not big for a power forward but it is for a wing 3. His best games have been him going against either wings or slimmer 4s both scoring as well as rebounding. He needs a extra second to get his jumper off on a catch and shoot but he takes clean shots that give him the space he needs to get his shot off cleanly. That is a guy I want at the 3, kid played a lot of PG last season for Haas? But to have Ingram at the 3 the only choices for the 4 are Withers, Jalen, and High. Withers has so far been a walking cheap foul or TO due to really poor decisions with the ball.

Jalen is not really strong in this switch everything defense we seem to have evolved in to, does not appear his team mates are either but we do love to point out that Jalen is not a great defender? But what you can not dispute because you have seen it if you watched our games, Jalen is a very solid jump shooter! He hits a strong % from close in, from mid range, and yes from trey (we call that a 3 level jump shooter). Now I don't know how YOU define a stretch 4 but I believe a stretch 4 has to be a 3 level shooter, no other definition makes any sense to me. Jalen has shown you that this season, what other front court guy not named Ingram has other than Jalen?

Ok, so I am going to make you a coach right now and your team is playing UNC, we have Jalen in with Bacot, Jalen steps out of the paint, you gonna have a defender follow Jalen or leave him in the paint to double Bacot? If you had to chose, would you follow Withers out or keep doubling Bacot? I am keeping a defender on Jalen because I watched film, I know Jalen can hit the mid range or treys, he has shown it multiple times but Withers would have to prove it. Oh, so Jalen lessens the doubles that Bacot gets, at least those from the power forwards and they surely are not going to leave Ingram all alone for wide open jumpers? Best you can do is try to move Bacot as far away from the basket as you can and drop a guard down to try to strip the ball when Bacot does his favorite spin in to the paint (Bacot is not great at passing back to the open guy left open when his defender went to double Bacot guy). Jalen and Ingram in gives Bacot room to operate and take a big man defender that loves to grab rebounds out of rebounding position. A for real stretch 4 and a really big wing that can both jump shoot at 3 levels and that is some how not what UNC fans are screaming for?

You want rebounds, didn't Roy Williams show you how to own the boards? Didn't he show you that having more front court length than the other team leads to owning the boards, didn't he show us all that more than 1 guy crashing the offensive boards consistently lead to UNC owning the board stats, especially offensive rebounds? Do you think that MAYBE along with Bacot that a guy with a 7'5" reach would be a help out there? Think maybe a big wing like Ingram would really help out on the boards as well?

And as for defense, you know, the favorite shade constantly thrown at Jalen, think maybe guards actually staying in front of their man and not have all this chinese fire drill of switching going on might help, maybe as in not having Jalen or any other big man consistently have to guard wings and back court guards 40ft from the basket may help? No, Jalen is going to struggle to stay with a 6'6" ball handling wing, news flash, so will any other big man, how many wings does Zack Edey pick up 40' from the basket? There is nothing a guard loves any more than getting a center switched to defending him 40' from the basket and we actually invite that? How about not putting Jalen in that position, hey, what about not putting Bacot in that position either? But no, folks harp on Jalen's defense when it was a guard that allowed the smaller ball handler to be Jalen's guy to defend? Maybe I missed it but I don't recall for example John Henson having to step outside much to defend smaller guys yet we expect Jalen to???

 

[imajericho]

He hits a strong % from close in, from mid range, and yes from trey (we call that a 3 level jump shooter)

Is he? 27% career shooter from 3.

75% this year. 0% last year.

Both on 4 attempts total. Relatively completely uncovered for all 8 attempts as well.

 

[DSouthr]

I said this on the video someone posted of him in the off-season. The surgery has made him too slow now. He gets burned over and over defensively and has no real burst to do more than use height to shoot over someone.

LOLOLOL

Dude, have you watched our guards play? LOL Now ya want to talk a lack of defending, watch our guards not named Seth, it is really bad. It is so bad that we are now using a junk defense as our primary defense because our guards are not staying in front of their primary assignment, especially late shot clock. You know how you keep a guy from driving you late in the shot clock, you get to the spot before he does, it ain't rocket science. You DO NOT SWITCH UNLESS YOU ARE FORCED TO other wise you create confusion in your own players. Oh, you want guys to block out so we can maybe get a rebound and yet those guys are not real sure who there defender is much less where LOL.

 

[DSouthr]

Is he? 27% career shooter from 3.

75% this year. 0% last year.

Both on 4 attempts total. Relatively completely uncovered for all 8 attempts as well.

Oh no, for so many reasons you don't get to down grade him, lowering his stats by including last season, that is not fair to the kid or this discussion. Kid is playing what 7-8mins a game and you point to his low shot numbers? Excuse me but isn't the fact that he is taking clean open looks and dropping them with what looks like a really solid stoke, last I heard that was a great thing, when did taking and making really good clean shots become a problem? Would you prefer he have more Caleb Love like numbers and has a if it is leather it is a good shot approach?

Do you realize that Jalen is making 70% of his shots per the stats on this site, Bacot is at 52%, Seth is 53% and those are the guys closest to Jalen. By comparison Withers is shooting 39% over all and 14% from 3.