NCAA investigation?

[dadika13]

Many colleges have paper classes. Who cares?

Classes were just too easy. And guess what. Many colleges have easy classes.

Apparently the NCAA cares.

The big deal was that we are being accused of giving athletes preferential treatment. We self-reported it happening in women's bball and men's soccer but Wainstein did say 15 men's bball players were directed toward these classes and were given "recommended grades". This is a clear NCAA violation guys.

The question is how/who was advising this treatment.

 

[uncfan in ky]

The only way it could be a NCAA violation is if those classes were offerred ONLY to athletes or if coaching staffs steered their players to those classes. Neither happened in Men's basketball or football. No matter how easy the classes may have been, the difficulty of the classes or what was expected from the class work is not within the NCAA's authority. We can talk for days, weeks, months and years on should it be but the fact is as I write this and absolutely when those questionable classes were going on they were not in the NCAA's realm of authority.

It doesn't matter how much you or anyone else feels those classes should not have been offerred, the fact of the matter is the NCAA can and could never have had any authority unless the athletes were proven to have been steered to those classes by the coaching staff or the AD and that has not been even hinted as happening in men's Basketball or football, now womens basketball may have an issue.

BRAVO!!!! Well said !!!!

 

[dadika13]

It's my understanding that taking the class is not a NCAA violation. Where athletes can & will get into trouble is if "special" favors were made to get them into a class.

This is the problem that is still out there. We've yet to prove that we didn't steer them to those classes or that the special favors only happened in women's bball and men's soccer.

 

[heels05champs]

I'm sure some athletes were steered to these "paper" classes. The question is, who steered them and/or can it be proven that they were steered.

 

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

"Steered" is a fairly ambiguous word. There's a difference between "Hey, those AFAM classes seem easy, everyone gets good grades in those. You need to pick your grades up, why not enroll in one of those?" and "Hey we've got a guy/lady on the inside in the AFAM department and you won't need to do diddly and you'll still pass, although non-athletes will still need to do work to pass - enroll in AFAM 203 and you'll be sitting on easy street "

If it's the former - no violations at all; if the latter - there's been a violation. More importantly - all that matters is what can be proven. It's obvious the former happens at every major program in the country. I'd say the latter happens at a good amount of big time programs in the country as well, and could have happened at UNC (only time will tell) - but again, all that matters is if its proven to have happened.

 

[gary-7]

This is the problem that is still out there. We've yet to prove that we didn't steer them to those classes or that the special favors only happened in women's bball and men's soccer.

huh?

 

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

This is the problem that is still out there. We've yet to prove that we didn't steer them to those classes or that the special favors only happened in women's bball and men's soccer.

I would imagine the burden of proof should be on the NCAA, no?

 

[uncfan in ky]

In a interview this year Buddy Hield said he only has 1 online class this year & it's so easy he gets to the gym at 9:30 to shoot around. One of his teammates said he only had one also but he's lazy & plays PlayStation all morning instead....but Carolina is the one that gets criticized by the media.

 

[uncfan in ky]

Example # 1 http://m.newsok.com/article/5476909

Example # 2 http://theledgesports.com/2016/02/09/oklahoma-guard-buddy-hield-had-an-interesting-night/

 

[dadika13]

huh?

What's your question? Do you disagree that it matters about who is telling the players to take these classes? Do you disagree that we have to prove this didn't happen like we've admitted it happened in soccer and women's ball?

 

[dadika13]

I would imagine the burden of proof should be on the NCAA, no?

I honestly don't know. I'd assume so.

 

[gary-7]

What's your question? Do you disagree that it matters about who is telling the players to take these classes? Do you disagree that we have to prove this didn't happen like we've admitted it happened in soccer and women's ball?

1. We don't have to prove anything. 2. What happened in those other sports didn't happen in men's basketball.

 

[94tarheel]

What's your question? Do you disagree that it matters about who is telling the players to take these classes? Do you disagree that we have to prove this didn't happen like we've admitted it happened in soccer and women's ball?

Who? Have you guys forgot what being in college is like? Word of mouth. Students share information on test, professors, courses, etc. Back when I was at Carolina, everyone who took Econ knew to avoid Ward. I knew what course to take, what professor to get and when to take it (during the summer vs during the fall or spring semester). Other than the women's bball issue and men's soccer, it all come down to word of mouth among the students themselves.

 

[UNC71-00]

Which seems to me as a perfect example of LOIC.

Lack of Institutional control over what?

The NCAA is not responsible for determining the validity/degree of difficulty of classes open to the entire student body which are published in the course catalog.

 

[UNC71-00]

"Steered" is a fairly ambiguous word. There's a difference between "Hey, those AFAM classes seem easy, everyone gets good grades in those. You need to pick your grades up, why not enroll in one of those?" and "Hey we've got a guy/lady on the inside in the AFAM department and you won't need to do diddly and you'll still pass, although non-athletes will still need to do work to pass - enroll in AFAM 203 and you'll be sitting on easy street "

If it's the former - no violations at all; if the latter - there's been a violation. More importantly - all that matters is what can be proven. It's obvious the former happens at every major program in the country. I'd say the latter happens at a good amount of big time programs in the country as well, and could have happened at UNC (only time will tell) - but again, all that matters is if its proven to have happened.

Exactly. Everyone has seen by now the Stanford sheet from the academic advisors directing athletes to easy classes. Is this steering and if so, how is it any different than what Carolina did?

(And if you havent seen it, google it)

 

[heels05champs]

Lack of Institutional control over what?

The NCAA is not responsible for determining the validity/degree of difficulty of classes open to the entire student body which are published in the course catalog.

LOIC is fairly vague which is why they can use it in this situation. If you're trying to apply logic with what the ncaa can or will do then you'll be badly disappointed.

 

[jah420]

Buckle up gents, cause everyone and their mother are going to be talking about this as we lead up to this weekend as well as every minute we are still in the hunt for a national title.

 

[dgheel57]

Sorry timing for NCAA to release this statement,they could've waited until after the title game. I'm beginning to believe they did this on purpose to distract our team and take away the glory if this team wins it all.

 

[strummingram]

Sorry timing for NCAA to release this statement,they could've waited until after the title game. I'm beginning to believe they did this on purpose to distract our team and take away the glory if this team wins it all.

That's a helluva way to thank us for the higher viewership and merchandise and ticket sales. Talk about biting the hand that feeds you!

 

[RoseHeel]

I think we need some of you all out there arguing this case for us....

I realize some of you may have more information than the masses, but this whole idea of "every other sport mentioned other than men's basketball is guilty" simply does not add up. Especially considering our school's biggest sport and pride is with Men's Basketball. On top of that, it's a very grimy way to go by simply throwing a less popular sporting venue under the bus.

"Men's Basketball" was directly mentioned 20 times in the NOA. And reading some specific quotes like:

"Email from Boxill to Huffstetler. This includes, but is not limited to, Boxill providing an assignment for the men's basketball student-athlete enrolled in her course."

"This allowed individuals within ASPSA to use these courses through special arrangements to maintain the eligibility of academically at-risk student-athletes, particularly in the sports of football, men's basketball and women's basketball."

Doesn't make sense as to how this doesn't involve them?

On top of that, no one has acknowledged the Elephant in the room!: The fact that we delayed our ruling for some self-reported information about Men's Soccer, which wasn't even involved in the first place, and Women's Basketball. Really?! You're telling me our $10+ Million dollar high profile investigation managed to somehow miss these keys of information that were so important, they needed to be reported almost 90 days down the line. Right before our response was due? Right before our potential Championship season??? So many coincidences just falling into place. This just makes us look worse. For an institution that prides itself on doing everything right, that's simply not right.

I honestly don't care whether what we did was "ethical" or not at this point. Mainly because even if every t was crossed and i was dotted, our rival fanbases will continue to push for sanctions and slander our academic program, even those most of the people throwing stones probably wouldn't have made it through a program at their own favorite team's academic institution. At the end of the day, all that matters is what the NCAA is going to do.

That being said, if we have any plans to returning the prestige of our program, this needs to come to an end! Whether that involves sanctions to any of our programs or not. And I just can't see how you think we get off scot-free.

 

[ChiShankCity]

LOIC is fairly vague which is why they can use it in this situation. If you're trying to apply logic with what the ncaa can or will do then you'll be badly disappointed.

Yea, this seems like LOIC to me. I don't recall four year investigations generally going well for schools. For nothing to happen to the men's basketball team is probably wishful thinking IMO.

The NCAA is not within its jurisdiction to do a lot of things that it does.

 

[keysersosay#1]

So the NCAA can evaluate and rule on an academic department that it has NO legal right or authority to do???
Can you give me an example of when they did this before and to what University?? Also point out where in their charter they CAN do this??

 

[mikeirbyusa]

smh

To many of you are buying the "Kane Storyline". Bunch of crap.

 

[UNC71-00]

Yea, this seems like LOIC to me. I don't recall four year investigations generally going well for schools. For nothing to happen to the men's basketball team is probably wishful thinking IMO.

The NCAA is not within its jurisdiction to do a lot of things that it does.

The NCAA has not been investigating for 4 years.

Some of you need to understand facts before posting.

 

[trig81]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

[Scoops Heels]

It's amazing our team is going to the final four and hopefully coming home with a natty and this thread is at the top of our board!! Folks at DI and RR are loving this! SMH! I am beginning to think some posters from our fan base want us to get hammered!!!

 

[mikeirbyusa]

It's amazing our team is going to the final four and hopefully coming home with a natty and this thread is at the top of our board!! Folks at DI and RR are loving this! SMH! I am beginning to think some posters from our fan base want us to get hammered!!!

AMEN! And it is very sad that "one of our own" started this.

 

[uncfan in ky]

It's amazing our team is going to the final four and hopefully coming home with a natty and this thread is at the top of our board!! Folks at DI and RR are loving this! SMH! I am beginning to think some posters from our fan base want us to get hammered!!!

I don't really have a problem with it being discussed here. There are some fans that really don't know the "truth".
Let DI & RR enjoy this thread because they're not going to be happy when the NCAA does nothing.

 

[toophly1124]

Not that it will make people change their thoughts but Roy just said AGAIN on Mike n Mike that nothing is going to happen to men's basketball ..not that I think he would come out and say something if he did know men's Bball was going to get hit but he seems pretty damn hellbent that men's bball is OK

 

[DSouthr]

This is the problem that is still out there. We've yet to prove that we didn't steer them to those classes or that the special favors only happened in women's bball and men's soccer.

America right, this is America I still live in? No, we have not proved that any of the men's basketball or football staffs did not steer their players to these classes, nope we sure have not done that. HOWEVER, proof that men's basketball or football coaches did steer their players to those classes does not exists either.

Last I heard the burden of proof was on the accuser and not the accused, has that changed?

 

[uncfan in ky]

This week has to be tiresome on Roy. Here he is on the grandest stage with one of his favorite teams & he has to answer questions about this crap.
I wouldn't blame him one bit if he made it a stipulation that no questions about this or no interview.

 

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

The NCAA is not within its jurisdiction to do a lot of things that it does.

This unfortunately is true. However, as an alum of the University (not as a fan of the bball team) I would not want the University to take sanctions outside the scope of the NCAA jurisdiction laying down. If whatever the NCAA rules on is within the scope of their jurisdiction... I would recommend the school accept their punishment and deal with it like adults. Alternatively if it's beyond the scope of their jurisdiction - not that I'm some whale of a donor - but I would write a letter to the University saying that if they wanted another dime from me in donations at any point in the rest of my life, that they better sue the $#!+ out of the NCAA - it would be unnecessary/self-deprecating to bend over and take that.

 

[dadika13]

AMEN! And it is very sad that "one of our own" started this.

You're referring to McCants right? Because he started this, not a poster on a message board.

 

[keysersosay#1]

Look, those of us who know and understand the FACTS here are NOT gonna let the "media narrative" interfere with the incredible journey this team and we as fans have been on and will continue to be on hopefully thru the weekend and onto Monday night.

There is PLENTY of BS ,lies ,intentional misinformation from all the usual suspects that I refuse to acknowledge.

The "fans" of all those rival school can have all the fun they want ,they have had loads of it the last five years at our expense.

The BEST revenge is cutting down the nets Monday night. Let's focus as a fan base on the game Saturday night, a huge s step towards that ultimate goal. Nobody, repeat NOBODY, is gonna ruin this for me, no matter how hard they may try.

GO HEELS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[mikeirbyusa]

You're referring to McCants right? Because he started this, not a poster on a message board.

No, I'm talking about one of our own posters bringing this up NOW on our way to the FINAL 4. Wouldn't expect anything else from outsiders but our own should have plenty to talk about besides bringing this up. jmhho

 

[Scoops Heels]

Amen Mike!!! I would love to see this thread deleted!!! Lets all be positive and get behind our team and coaches!!!!

 

[Archer2]

No problem with the thread, just wish it had been started a couple of weeks later. The timing of the statement by Emmert isn't coincidental. The NCAA really doesn't like seeing UNC and Syracuse in the final four. All talk should be about the final four, not the investigation.

I just hope it isn't a distraction for our team and staff. As stated above, Roy should refuse to answer questions regarding the investigation.

 

[Spaceytoyz]

Delete it and do not allow until after the season, I have heard this enough and have not heard anything new to add to it in a long time..

 

[NENCHeel]

For then last time....there were NO allegations of violations in re: the MBB or FB teams in the last NOA. We sent it back with annotations because some allegations against other sports needed additional data.

Roy JUST TOLD Mike and Mike there were NO allegations against his program so it's a non-issue as far as they are concerned.

If people want to walk around pretending they are up to date and have insights , let them. I don't have time to waste on damned fools.

 

[gosburn]

Sorry timing for NCAA to release this statement,they could've waited until after the title game. I'm beginning to believe they did this on purpose to distract our team and take away the glory if this team wins it all.

I'm sorry I missed the statement. Would you link or reply with the website so I can read the statement. This has been hard to follow