POLL: Should We Go to the NIT?

[WoadBlue]

Never back away from competition. That is what quitters do.

 

[DaveChapelle]

In this era, retooling the roster is far more important than playing in the NIT. It was absolutely the right decision to bypass the NIT 2 years ago and focus on roster reconstruction, and the end result was a team that won the ACC and got a #1 seed in the NCAA tournament.

Every day that we waste in the NIT is a day our staff could be recruiting a stud center or a stud shooting guard. What exactly is the NIT providing? More playing time for guys who won't even be in a UNC jersey next year? A chance for Lubin or Tyson to earn more scholarship offers once they enter the portal? A chance to better team chemistry when 75% of the roster won't be back next year?

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

In this era, retooling the roster is far more important than playing in the NIT. It was absolutely the right decision to bypass the NIT 2 years ago and focus on roster reconstruction, and the end result was a team that won the ACC and got a #1 seed in the NCAA tournament.

Every day that we waste in the NIT is a day our staff could be recruiting a stud center or a stud shooting guard. What exactly is the NIT providing? More playing time for guys who won't even be in a UNC jersey next year? A chance for Lubin or Tyson to earn more scholarship offers once they enter the portal? A chance to better team chemistry when 75% of the roster won't be back next year?

With logic like that, we should stop playing right now and focus on roster reconstruction.

 

[GoNtheDistance]

With logic like that, we should stop playing right now and focus on roster reconstruction.

I don't always agree with Dave but he's right. This isn't the days of old where postseason tourneys like this were used for development. Sadly, it's better to go ahead and get active in free agency.

 

[DSouthr]

I won't care much either way. I know everyone will link back to John Henson benefiting from playing in the NIT. First off, I don't think anyone on this roster is a Henson-type player where he was a true unicorn who took an entire season to figure out he was a 4. People here were comparing him to Kevin Durant coming into college. It turned out he was more of a true 4.

This team doesn't have a John Henson who is that raw and that talented. I don't correlate that at all to Jalen Washington. At Jalen Washington's peak, we're probably talking about a borderline starting 4/5 on a really good team who already has a stud 4/5 with him. I don't think it will do much either way for Jalen Washington.

Also, it's not as if that NIT run propelled anything. It may have helped Henson. But it really freaking helped bringing in Harrison Barnes and then starting Kendall Marshall saved the season. None of those 2 things had anything to do with playing in the NIT the season prior. It's a nice story and it sounds good when you look back, but I don't think it makes much logical sense.

And I maintain that if Cadeau, Drake, Jalen, Lubin, and Seth are all back next season and Cadeau/Seth/Drake/Washington are all starting, then this team is going to have major issues next season too. They need to upgrade in skill, size, and talent across the board. Playing in the NIT this season isn't going to suddenly make Cadeau 6'3", Trimble 6'6" or turn Washington into a stronger player.

To do any connecting the dots to next season based on any tournament (NCAA included) is something we do as a public with no proof that it actually leads to anything definitive. Hell, James Michael McAdoo had a great NCAA Tournament as a freshman. He was basically the same player as a sophomore, he just played more minutes.

I enjoy watching UNC play basketball so if they decide to play, I will root for them and enjoy (or try to this season, lol) watching them play. If they don't, oh well.

Did you consider Henson to be a "Henson like player" before that NIT? If you did then you were one of the very few in this country that did. I and a couple others here did think Henson would be a much better fit at the 4 and said so often. But he way surpassed even what I thought he could be in that NIT, he showed a different level of toughness in that tourney that made all the difference.

IF this UNC team ends up in the NIL, I would hope it would be treated differently than our looking to win a tourney. I would rather it be used more as a prep for next season. We know RJ, JWit, Claude, and Ian are not going to be back next season so limit their minutes. I would want to see James Brown get extended minutes, Drake exclusively at the 3 and not the 4, Seth some PG minutes. Couple guys on blue steel, Hawkins and Mayo have some game, would not mind being able to see what they could do with 10 or so minutes. More prep for next season than we must win this tourney.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

I don't always agree with Dave but he's right. This isn't the days of old where postseason tourneys like this were used for development. Sadly, it's better to go ahead and get active in free agency.

Maybe I'm missing something. Can't we pursue replacement while still playing? Maybe not a full court press on players but surely we can still be aggressive.

Plus not playing has its costs, too. Literally, in the sense of lost revenue. But also promoting the brand before more eyeballs. And, even though you downplay it, it can also help to prepare for next season. Especially if you play the returning players more.

Another thing that can be learned by playing in the NIT - especially if you do emphasize the play of those likely to return - is whether those who could return actually fit. You might think the coaches already know that, but if you've been emphasizing Ian all year, or yanking Elliot on his second foul every game, maybe you don't really know how the returning squad will play together next season. Why not use the NIT to find out?

 

[DSouthr]

I don't always agree with Dave but he's right. This isn't the days of old where postseason tourneys like this were used for development. Sadly, it's better to go ahead and get active in free agency.

It could be used for development, I don't see why it couldn't be?

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Did you consider Henson to be a "Henson like player" before that NIT? If you did then you were one of the very few in this country that did. I and a couple others here did think Henson would be a much better fit at the 4 and said so often. But he way surpassed even what I thought he could be in that NIT, he showed a different level of toughness in that tourney that made all the difference.

IF this UNC team ends up in the NIL, I would hope it would be treated differently than our looking to win a tourney. I would rather it be used more as a prep for next season. We know RJ, JWit, Claude, and Ian are not going to be back next season so limit their minutes. I would want to see James Brown get extended minutes, Drake exclusively at the 3 and not the 4, Seth some PG minutes. Couple guys on blue steel, Hawkins and Mayo have some game, would not mind being able to see what they could do with 10 or so minutes. More prep for next season than we must win this tourney.

Excellent points.

 

[DSouthr]

Uhhhh, ok?

First off, not every post in the history of "if so and so starts we will suck" has been wrong. It hasn't been wrong this season for the several board members who predicted a disappointing season if they didn't upgrade at the 5. And there have been several other accurate predictions when it came to lesser-quality players. Brandon Huffman wasn't a starting-caliber player at UNC. There were plenty of people who said PJ Hairston should start over Desmond Hubert and they were right. And even though that isn't an exact example, it's probably safe to assume those posters thought UNC would suck if Desmond Hubert continued to start. Let's not make this out to be UNC has never had less than-ideal basketball talent. They've had more good years than bad years for sure though.

And I think I can speak for the majority of Hubert skeptics (myself included). We want Hubert to work out. It would be the easiest way to make everyone happy. It would make the true believers of the Family happy and it would make fans who care more about the basketball product happy too. Of course, that's what fans would love in a perfect world. The fear is what if that isn't the case? Then what? I don't think any UNC fan likes the results of this season so far regardless if you're pro or against Hubert being the longterm solution at UNC.

You do whatever you feel is best for you. You have every right to do that. But let's see where UNC is at right now. Before a win at a bad Syracuse team, UNC just 5-of-7 where they were utterly uncompetitive at their biggest rival and at Clemson. The 2 wins came on a fairly fortunate home win to Boston College, one of the worst teams of the P5 teams and Pitt in a 50/50 game that went UNC's way. Where are you expecting the positivity to come from? Positivity usually comes from winning and winning against good teams. This team's last win over an NCAA Tournament team came over a month ago.

Very odd to call out "negative fans" when the program hasn't done much positive stuff on the court for a while now.

Wait wait wait, what? LOL

First, your first paragraph is to say that some times folks are right and some times folks are wrong? Glad ya got that off your chest, wonder how many folks didn't already know that? Paragraph 2 got me, only reason I replied,

Paragraph 2 got me, only reason I replied, "And I think I can speak for the majority of Hubert skeptics (myself included). We want Hubert to work out" ? You really think the majority of Hubert skeptics really want Hubert to be successful? Dude, they want him GONE, as in GONE YESTERDAY! They don't want him successful, they want him GONE! They may have at one time wanted him to be successful, today they just want him gone above anything else.

 

[DaveChapelle]

With logic like that, we should stop playing right now and focus on roster reconstruction.

What an absolutely ridiculous statement.

 

[NathanFielder]

Did you consider Henson to be a "Henson like player" before that NIT? If you did then you were one of the very few in this country that did. I and a couple others here did think Henson would be a much better fit at the 4 and said so often. But he way surpassed even what I thought he could be in that NIT, he showed a different level of toughness in that tourney that made all the difference.

IF this UNC team ends up in the NIL, I would hope it would be treated differently than our looking to win a tourney. I would rather it be used more as a prep for next season. We know RJ, JWit, Claude, and Ian are not going to be back next season so limit their minutes. I would want to see James Brown get extended minutes, Drake exclusively at the 3 and not the 4, Seth some PG minutes. Couple guys on blue steel, Hawkins and Mayo have some game, would not mind being able to see what they could do with 10 or so minutes. More prep for next season than we must win this tourney.

I don’t really buy that any tournament is a springboard for the following season. And I believe in that less in today’s free agency era of college basketball.

Fans try to connect that a lot in pro sports. A team finishes the regular season strongly and it will mean something the following season. I don’t think it means much either way.

The prep for next season will come down to who is added vs who is subtracted IMO. It won’t come down to playing in the NIT.

The 2011 team had the season they have because they had a much more upgraded roster helped with top recruits and Tyler Zeller being healthy.

 

[NathanFielder]

Wait wait wait, what? LOL

First, your first paragraph is to say that some times folks are right and some times folks are wrong? Glad ya got that off your chest, wonder how many folks didn't already know that? Paragraph 2 got me, only reason I replied,

Paragraph 2 got me, only reason I replied, "And I think I can speak for the majority of Hubert skeptics (myself included). We want Hubert to work out" ? You really think the majority of Hubert skeptics really want Hubert to be successful? Dude, they want him GONE, as in GONE YESTERDAY! They don't want him successful, they want him GONE! They may have at one time wanted him to be successful, today they just want him gone above anything else.

I absolutely believe that the Hubert skeptics want him to be as successful as Roy or Dean. I think they want him gone because they don’t think he’s going to be at UNC. There’s a difference in that.

And they probably feel that if he isn’t the right coach, it’s better to cut ties yesterday than it will be to give him X number of years with Y amount of resources. And I agree with that logic.

I mean, if I proposed to every Hubert skeptic that over the next 10 seasons he makes the NCAA Tournament 9 or 10 times. Wins the ACC reg season 6 times, makes 3 Final Fours and wins 1 National Championship would they fire him today? Probably. They just can’t see that future or anywhere near that success with him.

 

[GoNtheDistance]

It could be used for development, I don't see why it couldn't be?

you are assuming all the players elect to return, and we invite all back. I don’t see a scenario where we take a competitive roster to the NIT for various reasons.

 

[JimmyinVA]

you are assuming all the players elect to return, and we invite all back. I don’t see a scenario where we take a competitive roster to the NIT for various reasons.

i'm not interested in post season games where the players don't care enough to attend. that includes both major sports.

 

[RP12]

The NIT is the equivalent of a bottom third bowl game. Neither should exist in the current environment.

 

[TVJ]

You mean no one wants to be able to proclaim, "We're number 69!"? 😊

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

"And I think I can speak for the majority of Hubert skeptics (myself included). We want Hubert to work out" ? You really think the majority of Hubert skeptics really want Hubert to be successful? Dude, they want him GONE, as in GONE YESTERDAY! They don't want him successful, they want him GONE! They may have at one time wanted him to be successful, today they just want him gone above anything else.

Apparently @NathanFielder wasn't speaking for you. But he was speaking for me. I have serious doubts whether Hubert is the guy. But I'll be delighted if he is.

Are you saying that you just want Hubert gone? Not successful?

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

you are assuming all the players elect to return, and we invite all back. I don’t see a scenario where we take a competitive roster to the NIT for various reasons.

You may be right (about not being competitive in the NIT) but why prejudge it and why avoid it just because we may not be competitive? What are we afraid of?

Here are some relevant steps toward the NIT decision:

1. Will Hubert be inviting anyone to leave?

Unless Hubert has plans to play a different system, it seems obvious that Cade isn't part of UNC's future. Anyone else?

Since we lose JWit and Claude, Hubert may not have to make room up front. Or will he? We'll have Wilson, JWash, Lubin, Brown and High (I assume). That's 5 guys. JWash and Lubin have started and have had some good games. But will they ever be Carolina-caliber starters? We just don't know. Similarly, Caleb looks ready to go, but he's a freshman and even some really good frosh aren't ready out of the gate.

Bottom line: We definitely need to add at least 1 solid frontline starter. Maybe 2. Do we need to make room for them? Conversely, if we do bring in 1 or 2 frontline starters, do we lose anyone to lack of PT?

If Wilson is going to play 25+ at the 4 and Portal Guy is going to play 25+ in the post, how much does that leave for the other 4 guys to split up?

PT concerns up front notwithstanding, I'm thinking Cade may be the only player Hubert would encourage leave, and I'm guessing Cade arrived at that point long ago without any nudge.

2. Which other players are thinking about returning (or leaving)?

While I don't see Hubert asking any of the other guys to leave, we do need to ask them their intentions. A few may not be happy. A few may need to know whether the next iteration of the UNC system is more likely to start them or bring them off the bench and how they will be used. A few may not like the coaching staff and may be thinking about greener pastures for better fit or playing time.

In this regard, the NIT could be valuable. If Hubert starts guys who are probably coming back and shows them how they fit, some may be happier to stick around, while others may confirm that they should move on. Either way, that's useful.

3. How does NIL factor in?

Specifically, how much are we going to pay to keep guys like JWash, Lubin, High and Brown? They might want to stay, but will they if we empty the coffers for a top center and a top power forward - not to mention keeping guys like Elliot, Seth and Drake happy?

4. What if we are good in the NIT?

Could happen. We start next year's players. Sure we bring in RJ and Ian and JWit whenever needed, but we emphasize the returning players

Elliot
Seth
Drake
JWash
Lubin

I'd like to see that team play most of the minutes.