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Pretty good numbers for Recruits - Breeding Success

Other good number(s) to track for recruits would be total NBA salaries and average NBA salaries. UNC isn't fairing as well there at this point.
 
NCAAUCoach said:
Other good number(s) to track for recruits would be total NBA salaries and average NBA salaries. UNC isn't fairing as well there at this point.
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Not sure that would be a great measure since some teams overspend to get players (Cleveland) and some may pay less than market value for players for various reasons (hometown discount, take a cut to win a ring, etc.)
 
That's what recruits are focusing on. That's a pretty good measure. If I'm a recruit I would LOVE for someone to overspend to get me. You can always take discounts to chase a ring later.
 
Wait until the NBA price themselves out as the NASCAR folks have done. No pricing worries then.
 
dadika13 said:
...but we can't sign a top 10 player. I seriously don't get it.
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You're not still buying what Roy is selling are you? That he "wants all those players too"?

I've been trying to tell y'all that while Roy always says he's recruiting the same OAD players that UK and duke are, he's not recruiting them in the same light. He may want to sign them like I want to be a millionaire. But neither of us are putting the necessary effort into it. Roy makes it known with his pitch and with the way he plays that if you come to UNC, there is a very little chance you become a OAD player. He honors seniority. He plays a style that isn't conducive to talent showing off quickly. He plays a deep bench. He likes coachable guys that will set aside their personal goals for the best interest of the team. Basically, if a kid or his parents ever make it known to Roy that they plan to only spend one year in college, then Roy just goes through the motions with their recruitment so it appeases the fan base.
 
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gunslingerdick said:
You're not still buying what Roy is selling are you? That he "wants all those players too"?

I've been trying to tell y'all that while Roy always says he's recruiting the same OAD players that UK and duke are, he's not recruiting them in the same light. He may want to sign them like I want to be a millionaire. But neither of us are putting the necessary effort into it. Roy makes it known with his pitch and with the way he plays that if you come to UNC, there is a very little chance you become a OAD player. He honors seniority. He plays a style that isn't conducive to talent showing off quickly. He plays a deep bench. He likes coachable guys that will set aside their personal goals for the best interest of the team. Basically, if a kid or his parents ever make it known to Roy that they plan to only spend one year in college, then Roy just goes through the motions with their recruitment so it appeases the fan base.
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You're making the common mistake of assuming when I say top 10 that I mean OAD. I don't.
 
dadika13 said:
You're making the common mistake of assuming when I say top 10 that I mean OAD. I don't.
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ok. My mistake. But I maintain my stance in regards to OAD players. And sadly, pretty much any top 10 guy is going to have the OAD mindset. But point taken.
 
Roy builds teams that are better late in the season. He plays a lot of guys and is loyal to upperclassmen.

Those are all traits that are admirable, but don't resonate with a mindset that top recruits have right now. They want immediate gradification and to get to the league.
 
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gunslingerdick said:
Basically, if a kid or his parents ever make it known to Roy that they plan to only spend one year in college, then Roy just goes through the motions with their recruitment so it appeases the fan base.
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100% disagree with you on this. You are basically saying that Roy is FOS when you say this is what he is doing. Roy sure as hell doesn't care about appeasing the fan base either. He has criticized them on multiple occasions. I agree with you about his pitch, but I think you are way off about this.
 
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tarheel0910 said:
100% disagree with you on this. You are basically saying that Roy is FOS when you say this is what he is doing. Roy sure as hell doesn't care about appeasing the fan base either. He has criticized them on multiple occasions. I agree with you about his pitch, but I think you are way off about this.
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Ok. That's fine. But look at how he goes after those guys. Remember the recruitment of John Wall? It may even be subconsciously. But the bottom line is that Roy didn't become a bad recruiter over night. Something else changed. That something else was the idea that any kid who played at the Peach Jam was going pro after one year. Roy ain't fu*king around with that kind of shit. He's got a team to coach.
 
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NCAAUCoach said:
Other good number(s) to track for recruits would be total NBA salaries and average NBA salaries. UNC isn't fairing as well there at this point.
Click to expand...

Barnes is on a max deal.

Danny Green would command more money but wanted to stay in San Antonio. Still makes over $10 mill a year.

Ed David makes $7 mill a year.

Wayne Ellington makes $5 mill a year.

Brandon Wright makes $5 mill a year.

Old man Vince still pulling in over $4 mill a year.

Henson makes $3 mill per year.

Several other vets getting still getting checks like Zeller and Felton.

Not sure how the total stacks up to other teams but I bet we're at least in the top few programs.
 
gunslingerdick said:
Remember the recruitment of John Wall?
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Remember the recruitment of Kevin Knox, Brandon Ingram, etc?

gunslingerdick said:
But the bottom line is that Roy didn't become a bad recruiter over night. Something else changed. That something else was the idea that any kid who played at the Peach Jam was going pro after one year. Roy ain't fu*king around with that kind of shit. He's got a team to coach
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That's the part that I agree with. He hasn't changed his approach to match that of the OAD era. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, that's just the way it is. Saying he hasn't changed his approach and saying he just doesn't care are two different things.
 
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bfowler991 said:
Barnes is on a max deal.

Danny Green would command more money but wanted to stay in San Antonio. Still makes over $10 mill a year.

Ed David makes $7 mill a year.

Wayne Ellington makes $5 mill a year.

Brandon Wright makes $5 mill a year.

Old man Vince still pulling in over $4 mill a year.

Henson makes $3 mill per year.

Several other vets getting still getting checks like Zeller and Felton.

Not sure how the total stacks up to other teams but I bet we're at least in the top few programs.
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http://www.spotrac.com/nba/college/ per this site UNC is 4th this year so you are correct sir.
 
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gunslingerdick said:
Ok. That's fine. But look at how he goes after those guys. Remember the recruitment of John Wall? It may even be subconsciously. But the bottom line is that Roy didn't become a bad recruiter over night. Something else changed. That something else was the idea that any kid who played at the Peach Jam was going pro after one year. Roy ain't fu*king around with that kind of shit. He's got a team to coach.
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What changed was the "JUNK". Ask Brandon Ingram
 
For a team that doesn't really need OADs to win, Roy sure make a conscious effort to keep recruiting those same guys.
 
tarheel0910 said:
Remember the recruitment of Kevin Knox, Brandon Ingram, etc?


That's the part that I agree with. He hasn't changed his approach to match that of the OAD era. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, that's just the way it is. Saying he hasn't changed his approach and saying he just doesn't care are two different things.
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Ingram and Knox prove my point. Roy wouldn't cave to the OAD mentality and made it known. In other words, he would have been happy to have both of those guys...as long as they never gave any inkling they were leaving after one year.

To your second point, if Roy cared don't you think he'd change his approach?
 
dadika13 said:
We've shared the quote like 80 times on here...Ingram said if it wasn't for the NCAA stuff he would have committed to us early.
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This is a hearsay quote as much as the "he was already going to Dook" theory is.

Neither have produced an actual quote from him, closest was the incoherent video of him rambling about us getting our NOA.
 
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dadika13 said:
We've shared the quote like 80 times on here...Ingram said if it wasn't for the NCAA stuff he would have committed to us early.
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BINGO!!!!!!!! And it became a trend to go elsewhere. Much like the trend for a OAD to go to Puke and Kentucky.
 
dadika13 said:
We've shared the quote like 80 times on here...Ingram said if it wasn't for the NCAA stuff he would have committed to us early.
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And Bill Clinton didn't have sexual relations with Monica Lewinsky. I shared that quote a lot back in the day too.
 
gunslingerdick said:
Ingram and Knox prove my point. Roy wouldn't cave to the OAD mentality and made it known. In other words, he would have been happy to have both of those guys...as long as they never gave any inkling they were leaving after one year.

To your second point, if Roy cared don't you think he'd change his approach?
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This is a very big reach. How does that explain the countless other OAD players we've pursued to the very end and missed on?
 
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RoseHeel said:
This is a hearsay quote as much as the "he was already going to Dook" theory is.

Neither have produced an actual quote from him, closest was the incoherent video of him rambling about us getting our NOA.
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Asked Monday if he would have committed to UNC had it not faced such uncertainty because of the NCAA investigation, Ingram said, “I think I would have.”

Clear as freaking day from the NO.
 
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gunslingerdick said:
Ingram and Knox prove my point. Roy wouldn't cave to the OAD mentality and made it known. In other words, he would have been happy to have both of those guys...as long as they never gave any inkling they were leaving after one year.
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Disagree, he would have been happy to have them regardless. They both gave an "inkling" they were gone after one year, but he recruited them hard till the very end. They don't prove your point at all.

gunslingerdick said:
To your second point, if Roy cared don't you think he'd change his approach?
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I was referring to your specific statement about recruiting them just because that's what the fans want. He doesn't care about the fans opinions. As far as your larger point, the fact that he hasn't changed is proof that he does care. What I mean by that is he cares enough about how the program has been run in the past more than him caring about what role the recruit wants.
 
tarheel0910 said:
Disagree, he would have been happy to have them regardless. That's why he recruited them hard till the very end. They don't prove your point at all.


I was referring to your specific statement about recruiting them just because that's what the fans want. He doesn't care about the fans opinions. As far as your larger point, the fact that he hasn't changed is proof that he does care. What I mean by that is he cares enough about how the program has been run in the past more than him caring about what role the recruit wants.
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Ok. I don't care anymore. I'll believe what I believe and you'll believe what you believe. Are we going to keep disagreeing with each other?
 
gunslingerdick said:
Like I said, Roy is happy to have them all...provided it's on his terms.
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And his terms are "as long as they never gave any inkling they were leaving after one year."?

I'm pretty sure that a HOF coach like Roy had more than an inkling of an idea that guys like Julius Randle, Jaylen Brown, Noah Vonleh, Jayson Tatum, Malik Monk, and countless others.

We're STILL recruiting Zion Williamson and Romeo Langford in 2018.
 
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RoseHeel said:
And his terms are "as long as they never gave any inkling they were leaving after one year."?

I'm pretty sure that a HOF coach like Roy had more than an inkling of an idea that guys like Julius Randle, Jaylen Brown, Noah Vonleh, Jayson Tatum, Malik Monk, and countless others.

We're STILL recruiting Zion Williamson and Romeo Langford in 2018.
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There are levels to interest. Everything is not so black and white. Think of it like dating. There are some women that I might ask to get a coffee. Then there are some women I might ask to get a drink after work. Then there are some I might ask to go out to dinner and a music show. Then there are some that I would plan a weekend getaway with. Roy's having coffee with guys like Zion and Romeo unless they indicate in some way (not verbally necessarily) that they are worthy of a longer date. If Roy gets the feeling that either guy could be more of a long term commitment type, he may plan a weekend getaway and put on his best face. Meanwhile, there are some guys that Roy skips the coffee and drinks stage with and goes straight to the dinner with because he knows he has a future with them. But with many of these guys, when he's having coffee with them, he sees things he doesn't particularly care for. Now, he may not remove them from speed dial because we all do the late night booty call thing, but he's not exactly sending them roses at work either.
 
gunslingerdick said:
You're not still buying what Roy is selling are you? That he "wants all those players too"?

I've been trying to tell y'all that while Roy always says he's recruiting the same OAD players that UK and duke are, he's not recruiting them in the same light. He may want to sign them like I want to be a millionaire. But neither of us are putting the necessary effort into it. Roy makes it known with his pitch and with the way he plays that if you come to UNC, there is a very little chance you become a OAD player. He honors seniority. He plays a style that isn't conducive to talent showing off quickly. He plays a deep bench. He likes coachable guys that will set aside their personal goals for the best interest of the team. Basically, if a kid or his parents ever make it known to Roy that they plan to only spend one year in college, then Roy just goes through the motions with their recruitment so it appeases the fan base.
Click to expand...

Roy for sure wants them. it has been stated that with Knox he actually pushed the O&D agenda more than ever. Roy will welcome O&D and if you are the best player, you will play, lots of minutes. He isn't gonna sacrifice team for person though, and that is the "problem" if there is one.

As long as we keep guys in the program for 2-4 years, have them develop we should be fine. Yes there may be a drop off year once in a while, but more times than not we will still be good with a shot at a natty every 2-3 years.

I doubt it's what Roy wants necessarily, but he will make it work.
 
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