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Every time a criticism of Trump is brought forward, Fox News spins up the Benghazi machine. Hannity even tried to bring up Bill Clinton when Roy Moore was accused of sexual abuse. That is not the same thing as discussing relevant causal factors of the previous administration. Hard to believe I would need to explain that to a grown man.

If you think talking about the state of the economy (for example) when a president takes office is the same thing as trying to bring up previous transgressions of other people as some kind of bullshit defense for the transgressions of the current president, then you're an idiot. A defense attorney wouldn't stand up in the middle of a murder case and say "What about Ted Bundy? What about Jeffrey Dammer?" Which is precisely the tactic being used by Fox News.

For example, job growth has been trending up at a record breaking clip for quite some time. So it is nonsensical to give the current president credit for that trend, because it predates his administration taking office.

That is not the same thing as saying, "Do you think Bill Clinton was a sexual predator" when someone accuses a republican of rape.

Do we really need to break this down any more?
The economy was improving under Obama, at an anemic pace. It had nowhere to go but up. But if you can't see that deregulation and confidence in Trump is what is driving the economy to grow at a much faster pace now than under Obama then you are truly delusional.
 
I listened to the radio interview. Maybe we are talking about two different interviews. The one I listened to put Roy nowhere near a spot.

CC
I thought Hannity handed him the shovel and he dug his own grave. How do you even prove what these women are claiming? And I'm not saying they are lying. My problem with the whole thing is they have waited 30+ years to come forward. Hell he's been in public service his whole life. Why now?
 
I thought Hannity handed him the shovel and he dug his own grave. How do you even prove what these women are claiming? And I'm not saying they are lying. My problem with the whole thing is they have waited 30+ years to come forward. Hell he's been in public service his whole life. Why now?
The first 3 didn’t just come forward. It’s been known for a while. The fourth was 14 and her family was scared of Moore given his platform. The piece only just came out because he just won the ticket. Post went down to do a story and this all came forward.

It’s nothing close to a hit piece
 
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The first 3 didn’t just come forward. It’s been known for a while. The fourth was 14 and her family was scared of Moore given his platform. The piece only just came out because he just won the ticket. Post went down to do a story and this all came forward.

It’s nothing close to a hit piece
If he's guilty "hang him high". I have no issues whether he be Rep or Dem. Where I do have issue is with folks, Dems and media, that worship Clinton and dismiss all he's done. I could care less what letter is in front of the name if they have abused women.
 
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30 years?
Well, my own mother waited 45 years to come forward with a sexual trauma that occurred. And, that was after the man who did it died. Sometimes the victim has a lot to deal with. Sometimes they don't deal with it at all. When you're so politically partisan that your instinct is to indirectly defend the perpetrator instead of the victim, then... well, then you should be ashamed of yourself, in my opinion.
 
Well, my own mother waited 45 years to come forward with a sexual trauma that occurred. And, that was after the man who did it died. Sometimes the victim has a lot to deal with. Sometimes they don't deal with it at all. When you're so politically partisan that your instinct is to indirectly defend the perpetrator instead of the victim, then... well, then you should be ashamed of yourself, in my opinion.
First I'm not ashamed nor am I indirectly defending the perpetrator. I am also not saying the guy is guilty or innocent. I hate Dook but if I remember correctly the lacrosse guys were falsely accused of sexual assault, so it happens. My youngest daughter was assaulted but she didn't wait decades to reveal it. Politics have nothing to do with it.
 
First I'm not ashamed nor am I indirectly defending the perpetrator. I am also not saying the guy is guilty or innocent. I hate Dook but if I remember correctly the lacrosse guys were falsely accused of sexual assault, so it happens. My youngest daughter was assaulted but she didn't wait decades to reveal it. Politics have nothing to do with it.
Politics have absolutely something to do with it. Politics is involved in virtually every aspect of our lives now, thanks to partisan disciples like yourself. You choose a side and there you stay for the rest of your life, and that creates a polarity.

Just because you don't understand why people who experience trauma are not able to expose it right away, doesn't mean that it's uncommon. Just because your daughter could, doesn't mean others can. If you lack empathy, that's your problem. Just because some people take decades to come forward, doesn't make the crime any less horrible nor the criminal any less accountable.
 
Politics have absolutely something to do with it. Politics is involved in virtually every aspect of our lives now, thanks to partisan disciples like yourself. You choose a side and there you stay for the rest of your life, and that creates a polarity.

Just because you don't understand why people who experience trauma are not able to expose it right away, doesn't mean that it's uncommon. Just because your daughter could, doesn't mean others can. If you lack empathy, that's your problem. Just because some people take decades to come forward, doesn't make the crime any less horrible nor the criminal any less accountable.
You are as crazy as most believe you are if you think that politics have something to do with sexual harassment. There are perps on both sides of the isle and falsely accused on both sides of the isle. I have no clue as to the politics of the Dook lacrosse team, but they were falsely accused. I wouldn't be surprised if the guy from Alabama did what they say he did but it's not for me to judge. It was said that MLK was a womanizer, JFK as well. Do you think any less of them? Bill O'Reilly, bet you despise his ass. I could care less about their politics but I will also not be the one to jump to conclusions either.
You are one holier than thou judgmental individual. I don't have to believe the same things that you do, nor do you have to believe the same as me and that's OK.
 
I thought Hannity handed him the shovel and he dug his own grave.

Isn't that what I basically said in my previous post?

How do you even prove what these women are claiming? And I'm not saying they are lying. My problem with the whole thing is they have waited 30+ years to come forward. Hell he's been in public service his whole life. Why now?

Well specific incidences will be hard to prove but it certainly looks like Roy liked to date teenage girls when he was in his early 30's. Not a crime but skeevy as hell.
I have no problem with them not coming forward so late since as I'm a guy, I can't even pretend to put myself in their place. I assume the whole #metoo thing is the reason they feel like they can now talk. Well, that and some reporter looking for dirt on Roy happened to ask them.

CC
 
You are as crazy as most believe you are if you think that politics have something to do with sexual harassment.
It is politicized when partisans defend the perpetrators by being suspect of the victims, because of the perpetrator's political affiliations (in your case, you think the guy's most likely innocent because she waited 30 years to come forward).

I have no clue as to the politics of the Dook lacrosse team, but they were falsely accused.
None of this has ANYTHING to do with the Duke Lacrosse team.

I wouldn't be surprised if the guy from Alabama did what they say he did but it's not for me to judge.
But, you've decided to include yourself in the discussion of whether he is guilty or not, or whether the victim is lying or not. Otherwise, you wouldn't be typing anything. And, as always, your motivation is politically-based.

It was said that MLK was a womanizer, JFK as well. Do you think any less of them? Bill O'Reilly, bet you despise his ass.
If women had come forward and said that those men abused, molested, or violated them, I would absolutely want to hear their story. In O'Reilly's case, I don't know because I don't pay much attention to him. He was fired, so apparently his employer thought he was guilty. I don't despise anyone.

You are one holier than thou judgmental individual. I don't have to believe the same things that you do, nor do you have to believe the same as me and that's OK.
If I seem holier-than-thou to you, that's not my intent. The only judgment I made was that you should be ashamed if you're allowing your perspective of this situation to be politically-influenced. If you're not doing that, then your conscience is clear, I would think. I said that "When you're so politically partisan that your instinct is to indirectly defend the perpetrator instead of the victim, then... well, then you should be ashamed of yourself, in my opinion." That implies an "If" factor. I hate that I used the word "should" so often. I'm trying to rid my vocabulary of that word.
 
It is politicized when partisans defend the perpetrators by being suspect of the victims, because of the perpetrator's political affiliations (in your case, you think the guy's most likely innocent because she waited 30 years to come forward).


None of this has ANYTHING to do with the Duke Lacrosse team.


But, you've decided to include yourself in the discussion of whether he is guilty or not, or whether the victim is lying or not. Otherwise, you wouldn't be typing anything. And, as always, your motivation is politically-based.


If women had come forward and said that those men abused, molested, or violated them, I would absolutely want to hear their story. In O'Reilly's case, I don't know because I don't pay much attention to him. He was fired, so apparently his employer thought he was guilty. I don't despise anyone.


If I seem holier-than-thou to you, that's not my intent. The only judgment I made was that you should be ashamed if you're allowing your perspective of this situation to be politically-influenced. If you're not doing that, then your conscience is clear, I would think. I said that "When you're so politically partisan that your instinct is to indirectly defend the perpetrator instead of the victim, then... well, then you should be ashamed of yourself, in my opinion." That implies an "If" factor. I hate that I used the word "should" so often. I'm trying to rid my vocabulary of that word.
I never said I assumed anything. One minute you say I assume he is innocent then the next you say I assume he's not, DAMNIT. Dude you absolutely analyze until you are paralyzed. You over analyze almost every topic that arises here. Sometimes there is no deeper meaning, it is what it is.
 
since as I'm a guy, I can't even pretend to put myself in their place.

I'm not gonna get involved in this whole debate, but comments like this irk me. Yes, as a guy you may be unable to actually experience what these certain people have experienced, but you should be able to come to some general conclusions about what you'd expect them to reasonably feel/do after the fact.
 
I'm not gonna get involved in this whole debate, but comments like this irk me. Yes, as a guy you may be unable to actually experience what these certain people have experienced, but you should be able to come to some general conclusions about what you'd expect them to reasonably feel/do after the fact.
That doesn't make any sense
 
It is politicized when partisans defend the perpetrators by being suspect of the victims, because of the perpetrator's political affiliations (in your case, you think the guy's most likely innocent because she waited 30 years to come forward).


None of this has ANYTHING to do with the Duke Lacrosse team.


But, you've decided to include yourself in the discussion of whether he is guilty or not, or whether the victim is lying or not. Otherwise, you wouldn't be typing anything. And, as always, your motivation is politically-based.


If women had come forward and said that those men abused, molested, or violated them, I would absolutely want to hear their story. In O'Reilly's case, I don't know because I don't pay much attention to him. He was fired, so apparently his employer thought he was guilty. I don't despise anyone.


If I seem holier-than-thou to you, that's not my intent. The only judgment I made was that you should be ashamed if you're allowing your perspective of this situation to be politically-influenced. If you're not doing that, then your conscience is clear, I would think. I said that "When you're so politically partisan that your instinct is to indirectly defend the perpetrator instead of the victim, then... well, then you should be ashamed of yourself, in my opinion." That implies an "If" factor. I hate that I used the word "should" so often. I'm trying to rid my vocabulary of that word.
It is politicized when partisans defend the perpetrators by being suspect of the victims, because of the perpetrator's political affiliations (in your case, you think the guy's most likely innocent because she waited 30 years tocome forward).

What ‘victims’? Only know of one alleged victim, not multiple. And that ‘victim’ is having her story unravel as we speak. She calls him Ray in the presser and any close inspection of the yearbook photo will reveal 2 different inks and handwriting.
 
You are as crazy as most believe you are if you think that politics have something to do with sexual harassment. There are perps on both sides of the isle and falsely accused on both sides of the isle. I have no clue as to the politics of the Dook lacrosse team, but they were falsely accused. I wouldn't be surprised if the guy from Alabama did what they say he did but it's not for me to judge. It was said that MLK was a womanizer, JFK as well. Do you think any less of them? Bill O'Reilly, bet you despise his ass. I could care less about their politics but I will also not be the one to jump to conclusions either.
You are one holier than thou judgmental individual. I don't have to believe the same things that you do, nor do you have to believe the same as me and that's OK.

Lol sleeping around with consenting adults and sexually assaulting teenage girls are two completely different things. I'd think the "protect the bathrooms" crowd would understand that.
 
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I believe that people of different lives can do a reasonable job understanding how others feel without needing to live the same life.
So what's a reasonable reaction for a 14 year old girl who was sexually molested by a prominent legal figure in rural Alabama in the 70's?
 
Lol sleeping around with consenting adults and sexually assaulting teenage girls are two completely different things. I'd think the "protect the bathrooms" crowd would understand that.
I figured you'd have a hard time grasping the point since you yourself are a teenager
 
Telling someone about it is one reasonable action. There are others as well.
Says someone who has never been raped by a much older man.

Telling someone would seem logical, yet there are many who fear coming forward for a variety of reasons. Shame, fear of blowback, disbelief, or severe depression. Getting raped has to be a trauma unlike many others.

How many alter boys never came forward despite years of abuse by priests?
 
Telling someone would seem logical, yet there are many who fear coming forward for a variety of reasons. Shame, fear of blowback, disbelief, or severe depression. Getting raped has to be a trauma unlike many others.

That's a reasonable response as well, for the reasons you stated. See, there you go - you just came up with another reasonable response without actually having been in that exact situation. So saying that you can't use intuition to put yourself in a situation you've never been in is selling yourself short.
 
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Says someone who has never been raped by a much older man.

Telling someone would seem logical, yet there are many who fear coming forward for a variety of reasons. Shame, fear of blowback, disbelief, or severe depression. Getting raped has to be a trauma unlike many others.

How many alter boys never came forward despite years of abuse by priests?
Not that it makes any difference but was the 14 yo raped?
 
That's a reasonable response as well, for the reasons you stated. See, there you go - you just came up with another reasonable response without actually having been in that exact situation. So saying that you can't use intuition to put yourself in a situation you've never been in is selling yourself short.
No. I commented on what has been an observed behavior in rape victims. I’m not expecting them to act or behave in any particular way. Each case is different.
 
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I'm not gonna get involved in this whole debate, but comments like this irk me. Yes, as a guy you may be unable to actually experience what these certain people have experienced, but you should be able to come to some general conclusions about what you'd expect them to reasonably feel/do after the fact.

Really? With such a personal thing like sexual assault? I don't believe that's the case.

CC
 
Prince Of Tides comes to mind. "Honey Don't" on the radio. And, the mother tells them all, afterward, "this never happened." 30-some years later, it all comes out.

Watch "The Keepers" for perspective on how long, and how frequently, adolescents keep sexual violations a secret.
 
Not that it makes any difference but was the 14 yo raped?
She remembers an unpaved driveway. She remembers going inside and him giving her alcohol on this visit or the next, and that at some point she told him she was 14. She says they sat and talked. She remembers that Moore told her she was pretty, put his arm around her and kissed her, and that she began to feel nervous and asked him to take her home, which she says he did.

The two met up one more time, Corfman said, and Moore again took her to his home:

She says that Moore drove her back to the same house after dark, and that before long she was lying on a blanket on the floor. She remembers Moore disappearing into another room and coming out with nothing on but “tight white” underwear.

She remembers that Moore kissed her, that he took off her pants and shirt, and that he touched her through her bra and underpants. She says that he guided her hand to his underwear and that she yanked her hand back.

“I wasn’t ready for that — I had never put my hand on a man’s penis, much less an erect one,” Corfman says.

She remembers thinking, “I don’t want to do this” and “I need to get out of here.” She says that she got dressed and asked Moore to take her home, and that he did.
 
She remembers an unpaved driveway. She remembers going inside and him giving her alcohol on this visit or the next, and that at some point she told him she was 14. She says they sat and talked. She remembers that Moore told her she was pretty, put his arm around her and kissed her, and that she began to feel nervous and asked him to take her home, which she says he did.

The two met up one more time, Corfman said, and Moore again took her to his home:

She says that Moore drove her back to the same house after dark, and that before long she was lying on a blanket on the floor. She remembers Moore disappearing into another room and coming out with nothing on but “tight white” underwear.

She remembers that Moore kissed her, that he took off her pants and shirt, and that he touched her through her bra and underpants. She says that he guided her hand to his underwear and that she yanked her hand back.

“I wasn’t ready for that — I had never put my hand on a man’s penis, much less an erect one,” Corfman says.

She remembers thinking, “I don’t want to do this” and “I need to get out of here.” She says that she got dressed and asked Moore to take her home, and that he did.
Thx, have not read her account of the story.
 
I loves me some Roy Moore . .



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