Starting PG next year
- Thread starter pln2013
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Right now its up for grabs no need me taking the pole, any of those guys could be it through the course of the year..
A few months ago, I would’ve bet anything on Felton starting next year. After 21 games this year, I’m now thinking it’s a tossup. Roy will not tolerate halfbutt effort on the defensive end and that is what Felton gives currently. Seventh plays hard both ways but PG is not natural to him and it’s obvious. I’d give the slight advantage to Felton right now but it will be a battle and I won’t be shocked either way.
I think it has to be 7th right now.
The only thing Felton excels in right now is pushing the ball up quickly via the pass. However, roster limitations with agility and hands to catch the passes is even hurting that.
7th has far and away better defense. Better handles. Is faster. Has a better jumper.
Felton has better passing and awareness.
I can't see 7th not at least getting the first crack at it unless the injury has really set him back.
The only thing Felton excels in right now is pushing the ball up quickly via the pass. However, roster limitations with agility and hands to catch the passes is even hurting that.
7th has far and away better defense. Better handles. Is faster. Has a better jumper.
Felton has better passing and awareness.
I can't see 7th not at least getting the first crack at it unless the injury has really set him back.
Felton is a much better passer though, and I'd disagree that Seventh is a better shooter. He was hitting some mid-range pullups earlier, but Felton has shown much more range. I'd bet on Felton outshooting Seventh in most situations.
Can either of them drive and score? We haven't seen enough of that given their talent.
I don't think the numbers support Felton is a better shooter. I think you see the numbers from one Ohio State game and are being mislead.
imho it is felton and its not that close. he will look much better next year and 7th would remind me of drew if he started at pg.
Just not sure if you guys properly see just how bad Felton is on defense and just how good Seventh was on it.
Perhaps you're forgetting 7th was extremely shaky on defense as a freshman, and that got him pulled a few times as well. To his credit he had made considerable strides on that side of the ball before his injury this season. I would expect Jalek to do the same as a Soph.
Offensively and from the standpoint of PG instincts and upside there is really no comparison.
We are missing Seventh bad right now!
Outside of a few flashes of his natural ability, it appears the only thing that Jalek has consistently shown is a bit of a chippy attitude. I noticed when JB came back in for him in the VT game Jalek wouldn't even give JB a low 5 .. he actually acts like he doesn't really want to be there, and I would have never expected that from him or any other UNC player.
Here's what it looks like to me Roy when in his house and said "if you come to Carolina and work hard do what we ask you to do you will be the man" and all he heard was "if you come to Carolina you will be the man"
Forgetting the work hard and do what we ask you to do part!
Forgetting the work hard and do what we ask you to do part!
7th is nothing like drew not even comparable
Seventh's on/off defensive metrics were the best on the team last year, if memory serves. And he led or was 2nd in basically every position-appropriate defensive charting stat (deflections, turnovers forced, stop rate).
I'll double-check those numbers when I get home.
I'll double-check those numbers when I get home.
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Roy's not charting "metrics" when someone misses a help assignment or fails to funnel his man or gets caught out of position off the ball.
Felton.
I hope Seventh comes back strong but missing basically this entire season is going to be a setback that he couldn’t afford, particularly to give him any chance to play point.
I hope Seventh comes back strong but missing basically this entire season is going to be a setback that he couldn’t afford, particularly to give him any chance to play point.
Roy is definitely charting metrics. Deflections, floor burns, etc. And count of missed rotations is a metric, too.
Some numbers (all from Adrian Atkinson):
Team defensive efficiency, by PG:
1) Woods --- 90.4
2) Berry --- 99.3
3) Britt --- 104.7
Deflections / 40:
1) Woods --- 7.22
2) Britt --- 6.34
3) Berry --- 6.12
4) Pinson --- 5.01
5) Robinson --- 4.94
Turnovers Forced / 40:
1) Berry --- 3.46
2) Woods --- 3.35
3) Britt --- 3.30
4) Pinson --- 3.30
5) Williams --- 3.28
TS% against (guards & wings only):
1) Pinson --- 51.6%
2) Woods --- 51.7%
3) Berry --- 52.7%
4) Williams --- 55.3%
5) Robinson --- 55.7%
Stop %:
1) Meeks --- 64.0%
2) Woods --- 63.7%
3) Bradley --- 60.7%
4) Pinson --- 60.4%
5) Williams --- 60.2%
Someone else --- not Roy --- is charting deflections, floor burns, etc, sure, but post facto. . Roy doesn't look over to a manager or assistant and ask, "hey, how many deflections does 7th have tonight?" It's the coach's eyes that tell him during a game what is happening with a player on the floor. Fact is 7th had some real-time defensive struggles last season and it affected his PT. It's really that simple and no metrics are gonna change that.
To be clear, these numbers aren't definitive proof of anything. They don't account for opponent (and filtering by opponent would thin the sample), they don't account for teammates, and they don't account for missed rotations and such, as @gary-7 points out.
But they do support the idea that Seventh was an effective defender during his first year, even as he was playing like the worst player on the court on the other end. At minimum, team defense didn't take a hit with Seventh on the floor. In contrast, Felton has been an absolute disaster on defense (major driver of Berry's strong defensive on-off stats).
I think he likely already played too much for a medical redshirt. It specifically matters on % of games played and nothing else. How many has he played so far?
Your disclaimers are the strongest thing here, and I'm not saying that sarcastically at all. 7th's defensive performances were spotty at best last season when it counted and a variety of missed assignments contributed to his being pulled, sometimes as much as his misadventures you correcty alluded to on the offensive end. I think we both know Roy will pull someone for defensive lapses faster than offensive ones, and lack of effort will supersede either. 7th did well in the effort department (which honestly bought him some leeway), but that only went so far. He just got lost too many times.
Obviously Roy had a security blanket last season with Stilman sitting there, as well as being able to move Nate over if needed. But with that said, there were games that 7th never saw the floor in the second half. There was more to that than just offense.
Nate BTW was probably the most improved defender last season, after having been a liability earlier in his career. That improvement showed up in both metrics and the eye test. One caveat that the metrics don't cover is that when playing extended minutes guys could still find him and take him to the rack.
I digress --- let me focus on Jalek. I've criticized his defense as much as anyone here, but I don't think he's getting a fair shake overall as to his potential as a defender. To be sure, every time Roy yanks him I can see it coming. It's either an effort thing or just a big ol' lapse like inexplicably doubling a Big at the top of the key instead of picking up his man going to the basket (as happened vs GaTech), or the aforementioned slough off a shooter that led to his last pull last night. All that said I watch him like a hawk on D and there are possessions he is spot on. It's a matter of consistency of effort and focus --- mostly focus.
Jalek will never be a Joel Berry-level defender at Point, but he can be more than adequate with some confidence and improved focus, and he has the potential with his length and athletic ability to be a disruptor if he puts in the effort. Hell, I don't expect anybody to have as much dog in him as JB or his Uncle Ray, but he can be good.
Let's compare that with 7th. As I said above he had stepped up his defensive game this season --- and let's be honest, it's the only thing that even allowed to him to compete at all with Jalek for PT. But on the offensive end, bless his heart, 7th just doesn't have the stuff to be a starting Carolina PG. As I've posted before, Dexter Strickland by the time he's a senior is about the most we can ask, and that's no guarantee. If Jalek keeps his head right and puts in a good summer we'll see what that young man brings to the table. That's why some of us are saying he is literally the only viable choice if we want to compete at a high level next season.
Can you stop saying he struggled defensively without showing where he did? Seventh's problems were in turnovers. Not defensively. Until you can show defensive strugglers (which are not supported by the stats) then you are just saying it to say it.
I'm not saying it to say it. I saw it, as did Roy. There's nothing to show. It was what it was. Good grief.
pln I agree. It may not be on paper, but I'll guarantee its charted between his ears.
If Roy is having a manager or an assistant chart isn't that the same thing as Roy chart in it?
I mean the numbers don't really support anything here, the sample size is too small. Jalek has shot 34 three pointers, Seventh has shot 2.
I'm no shooting expert at all (if I was I'd be a better shooter when I play pickup!), but Seventh's lack of attempts at least indicate he is uncomfortable taking threes. Felton has been shooting fairly frequently, and often from a couple feet behind the line. I don't know how good Felton is at shooting exactly, but given his shooting received praise in high school and his willingness to pull the trigger from deep (which implies Roy approves of many of those shots)m that leads me to believe he is a better shooter.
Games Played 104
ScoringTotals
Points 1824
Points Per Game 17.5
FG Per Game 617
FG Attemps 1245
FG % 50
Three-PointersTotals
3pt Made 167
3pt Attempts 454
3pt FG Percentage 37
Two-PointersTotals
2pt Made 450
2pt Attempts 791
2pt FG Percentage 57
Free ThrowsTotals
FT Made 368
FT Attempts 481
FT Per Game 77
Rebs, Asst, Steals and TOsTotals
Offensive Rebounds 131
Defensive Rebounds 278
Rebounds 414
Rebounds Per Game 4.0
Assists 381
Assists Per Game 3.7
Steals 376
Steals Per Game 3.6
Turnovers 218
Blocks, Charges and FoulsTotals
Blocks 78
Blocks Per Game 0.8
Deflections 0
Charges Taken 3
Fouls 199
Technical Fouls 1
Games Played 86
ScoringTotals
Points 2006
Points Per Game 23.3
FG Per Game 709
FG Attemps 1426
FG % 50
Three-PointersTotals
3pt Made 234
3pt Attempts 617
3pt FG Percentage 38
Two-PointersTotals
2pt Made 475
2pt Attempts 809
2pt FG Percentage 59
Free ThrowsTotals
FT Made 341
FT Attempts 398
FT Per Game 86
Rebs, Asst, Steals and TOsTotals
Offensive Rebounds 135
Defensive Rebounds 311
Rebounds 446
Rebounds Per Game 5.2
Assists 440
Assists Per Game 5.1
Steals 237
Steals Per Game 2.8
Turnovers 262
Blocks, Charges and FoulsTotals
Blocks 35
Blocks Per Game 0.4
Deflections 58
Charges Taken 0
Fouls 48
Technical Fouls 2
Who is 7th and who is Jalek above? Does it really matter? Lol
ScoringTotals
Points 1824
Points Per Game 17.5
FG Per Game 617
FG Attemps 1245
FG % 50
Three-PointersTotals
3pt Made 167
3pt Attempts 454
3pt FG Percentage 37
Two-PointersTotals
2pt Made 450
2pt Attempts 791
2pt FG Percentage 57
Free ThrowsTotals
FT Made 368
FT Attempts 481
FT Per Game 77
Rebs, Asst, Steals and TOsTotals
Offensive Rebounds 131
Defensive Rebounds 278
Rebounds 414
Rebounds Per Game 4.0
Assists 381
Assists Per Game 3.7
Steals 376
Steals Per Game 3.6
Turnovers 218
Blocks, Charges and FoulsTotals
Blocks 78
Blocks Per Game 0.8
Deflections 0
Charges Taken 3
Fouls 199
Technical Fouls 1
Games Played 86
ScoringTotals
Points 2006
Points Per Game 23.3
FG Per Game 709
FG Attemps 1426
FG % 50
Three-PointersTotals
3pt Made 234
3pt Attempts 617
3pt FG Percentage 38
Two-PointersTotals
2pt Made 475
2pt Attempts 809
2pt FG Percentage 59
Free ThrowsTotals
FT Made 341
FT Attempts 398
FT Per Game 86
Rebs, Asst, Steals and TOsTotals
Offensive Rebounds 135
Defensive Rebounds 311
Rebounds 446
Rebounds Per Game 5.2
Assists 440
Assists Per Game 5.1
Steals 237
Steals Per Game 2.8
Turnovers 262
Blocks, Charges and FoulsTotals
Blocks 35
Blocks Per Game 0.4
Deflections 58
Charges Taken 0
Fouls 48
Technical Fouls 2
Who is 7th and who is Jalek above? Does it really matter? Lol
Do you want to talk about defense? Compared to what team? The entire team has problems on defense. How many wide open uncontested 3-point shots do UNC opponents get each game? Why is Virginia so good on defense? It's our style of play on defense.
It's Felton's job to lose next season. There are very few freshman point guards that have excelled at UNC.
It's Felton's job to lose next season. There are very few freshman point guards that have excelled at UNC.
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