The Sterling Brown situation and how it derails everything we talk about in the Santa Fe thread

[TarHeelNation11]

Not gonna link it because I'm too lazy, but I'm sure most of y'all know the situation with the Milwaukee Bucks player Sterling Brown and how police tazed him for......... an incident resulting from a parking ticket incident.

I just want to make a couple points on this:

1). Everyone says the South is the most racist. Yet here we have a SECOND situation in, what, 3 years, where Milwaukee police as well as Milwaukee white folks have totally overreacted to a situation involving a black Milwaukee Bucks basketball player. Remember the situation where John Henson was reported by a "good" samaritan for trying to "rob" a jewelry store (lol).

2). With the 24/7 news spin, this kind of shit is what sooooo badly hurts everything we were/are talking about in the last page of the Santa Fe thread in terms of not only trusting police officers to guard schools, but also the part of our discussion that evolved into trying to solve gang violence / gun violence in cities such as Chicago.

This kind of shit -- police being too quick to use violent force -- undermines everything and hurts not only law enforcement, but it also hurts America's trust in law enforcement, it hurts blacks' trust in law enforcement, and it heightens racial tension. Is it often exaggerated due to 24/7 news slant? Yes. 100% yes. But this specific Sterling Brown situation is an example of where SOME cops are just hopelessly idiotic and tone deaf.

We need to raise the pay dramatically for LEO and let capitalism do its thing and increase the pedigree of applicants. Higher pay, higher standards, less abuse of power.

Because having society not want to respect law enforcement is NOT the way to go. That is a pathway to chaos. Law enforcement needs to be respected and listened to, but at the same time, they gotta stop doing irresponsible shit and then trying to cover it up or wiggle their way out of punishment.

 

[tarheel0910]

Not gonna link it because I'm too lazy, but I'm sure most of y'all know the situation with the Milwaukee Bucks player Sterling Brown and how police tazed him for......... an incident resulting from a parking ticket incident.

I just want to make a couple points on this:

1). Everyone says the South is the most racist. Yet here we have a SECOND situation in, what, 3 years, where Milwaukee police as well as Milwaukee white folks have totally overreacted to a situation involving a black Milwaukee Bucks basketball player. Remember the situation where John Henson was reported by a "good" samaritan for trying to "rob" a jewelry store (lol).

2). With the 24/7 news spin, this kind of shit is what sooooo badly hurts everything we were/are talking about in the last page of the Santa Fe thread in terms of not only trusting police officers to guard schools, but also the part of our discussion that evolved into trying to solve gang violence / gun violence in cities such as Chicago.

This kind of shit -- police being too quick to use violent force -- undermines everything and hurts not only law enforcement, but it also hurts America's trust in law enforcement, it hurts blacks' trust in law enforcement, and it heightens racial tension. Is it often exaggerated due to 24/7 news slant? Yes. 100% yes. But this specific Sterling Brown situation is an example of where SOME cops are just hopelessly idiotic and tone deaf.

We need to raise the pay dramatically for LEO and let capitalism do its thing and increase the pedigree of applicants. Higher pay, higher standards, less abuse of power.

Because having society not want to respect law enforcement is NOT the way to go. That is a pathway to chaos. Law enforcement needs to be respected and listened to, but at the same time, they gotta stop doing irresponsible shit and then trying to cover it up or wiggle their way out of punishment.

tl;dr

 

[TarHeelNation11]

tl;dr

Short version: Cops suck. The media making everything racial sucks. Milwaukee sucks. You suck.

 

[tarheel0910]

Short version: Cops suck. The media making everything racial sucks. Milwaukee sucks. You suck.

I read it. I don't know anything about the situation, so I just thought I'd point out your wannabe Dave post.

 

[dadika13]

tl;dr

I'm sure if he said something you agree with that wouldn't have been your response.

 

[tarheel0910]

I'm sure if he said something you agree with that wouldn't have been your response.

Not really. The tl;dr is a running joke here. I haven't read up on what happened, so I can't really say if I agree or disagree with what he's saying. Someone having a different opinion from me has never stopped me from posting though. Not sure why you would think that.

 

[Raising Heel]

tl;dr poast ahead.

I just watched the video after hearing about the incident for the first time yesterday. A few observations.

For starters, he double-parked his car across two handicap spaces. In other words, he had broken the law. The officer on the scene asked him several times to back up and he refused to move. The officer also asked him multiple times for his name, and he kept responding "It's on the license" that the officer had in his hands instead of simply answering the question.

I point all this out for a reason. It seems like every time an incident like this makes the news, the trouble begins with someone who is in violation of the law (speeding, broken tail light, etc.). The cops are simply doing their job of upholding the law, at least at the outset. The other common occurrence across most of these incidents is that the person repeatedly disobeys a direct order(s) from a law enforcement officer.

I expect my dogs to obey me. I know what my reaction is when they don't. Those of you with children probably experience the same thing. Frustration, anger, maybe violence. Now imagine you're dealing with a grown adult who has the capacity to possibly harm or kill you. People -- including the cops -- lose their cool in situations like that and it's not hard to understand why.

Don't get me wrong. There are a lot of power-hungry dickhole cops out there. I had a run-in with one a few weeks ago, in fact. My point is that these situations typically escalate because people start acting defiant or even belligerent towards law enforcement. If you feel like an officer is exceeding his authority, there are much better ways to deal with it than to challenge them IMO. That doesn't excuse police brutality, but again, it's easy to understand how situations can escalate so easily.

With each new story, it feels like there's a growing undercurrent of people who assume that cops are going to abuse their authority and they are therefore obligated to defy the police. This is a cousin to the entitlement mentality that lets people believe that rules are for other people, not them.

 

[coolwaterunc]

There are two poasts in this thread I didn't read. Wanna guess which two?

 

[tarheel0910]

There are two poasts in this thread I didn't read. Wanna guess which two?

I'm sure if they said something you agree with that wouldn't have been your response

 

[TarHeelNation11]

Don't get me wrong. There are a lot of power-hungry dickhole cops out there. I had a run-in with one a few weeks ago, in fact. My point is that these situations typically escalate because people start acting defiant or even belligerent towards law enforcement. If you feel like an officer is exceeding his authority, there are much better ways to deal with it than to challenge them.

With each new story, it feels like there's a growing undercurrent of people who assume that cops are going to abuse their authority and they are therefore obligated to defy the police. This is a cousin to the entitlement mentality that lets people believe that rules are for other people, not them.

This is the crux of what I was trying to get at, but I think I failed. You've got so many people now who refuse to respect law enforcement officers that this kind of shit keeps happening. It's a problem at both ends. A FEW (read: 0.01% of all police) have abused their power in a gross way, the media has taken those very, very few occurrences and put them on 24/7 news and interwoven it with racist/racial accusatory spin, and thus it makes people not want to respect LEO and I like the way you put it "...people who assume that cops are going to abuse their authority and they are therefore obligated to defy the police." So in essence, you've got a mass amount of people who refuse to obey/respect law enforcement, and you on the other end of the spectrum, you have a very minuscule number of LEOs (but still > 0) who abuse power and I guess give credence to the folks who are determined to never obey law enforcement.

I'm more and more convinced that the 24/7 news cycle combined with how every news outlet is slanted one way or the other is absolutely destroying our country.

I do think we should look at if tasers and stun guns should even be used in the field, but that's a separate issue and I'll admit it stems from the fact that I have a mortal fear of heart attacks and I feel like if I was ever tazed, it would send me straight to my death lol.

 

[tarheel0910]

There are two poasts in this thread I didn't read. Wanna guess which two?

Want to edit that to three?

 

[tarheel0910]

I do think we should look at if tasers and stun guns should even be used in the field, but that's a separate issue and I'll admit it stems from the fact that I have a mortal fear of heart attacks and I feel like if I was ever tazed, it would send me straight to my death lol.

I've never been hit with a taser, but I would assume that's better than being shot in the head.

 

[TarHeelNation11]

The other problem is... and sorry... I'm just gonna call it like I see it, Black America will not ever fight fair on this issue. Ever. The collective mind has already been made up that Sterling Brown is the victim. Even though he broke the law and initiated the whole thing, and yes maybe the police eventually overreacted, it's automatically accepted that SB is 100% the victim and the police are 100% in the wrong. Nevermind the fact that the vast majority of the time one of these incidents happens, the non-LEO has broken the law to begin the whole thing and then exacerbates it by being belligerent. This isn't the case every single time, obviously, but it's the case most of the time. And nevermind that a lot of the incidences where folks get shot by cops.... that dude is usually already a criminal. Not always. But a lot of the time.

From race baiters like Jemele Hill all the way to seemingly intelligent, educated blacks like Giovanni Bernard, the collective minds have already been made up that SB is the victim here and all cops are evil and this incident is just perpetuating the cycle.

This highlights a broader issue in U.S. society that far too few people are willing to use an UNBIASED viewpoint when looking at issues. Too many liberals refuse to even consider conservative's viewpoints; too many conservatives refuse to even consider liberal viewpoints. Too many blacks refuse to consider other viewpoints. Too many whites refuse to consider other viewpoints. Etc, etc, etc, etc. Few people are brave enough to think about issues for themselves and come to their OWN conclusion -- not their dad's conclusion, not their race's popular conclusion, not their political party's conclusion, not their preacher's conclusion... their OWN conclusion.

Groupthink is killing this country.

 

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

There are two poasts in this thread I didn't read. Wanna guess which two?

I assumed it was both of THN's poasts, because you blocked him after he was dissing the Braves in the Braves thread.

 

[Raising Heel]

I do think we should look at if tasers and stun guns should even be used in the field....

This is what I don't understand. Instead of using physical force or God forbid a gun, why don't more police officers just taze people who refuse to comply? It would prevent most of these situations from getting out of hand.

 

[gunslingerdick]

tl;dr poast ahead.

I just watched the video after hearing about the incident for the first time yesterday. A few observations.

For starters, he double-parked his car across two handicap spaces. In other words, he had broken the law. The officer on the scene asked him several times to back up and he refused to move. The officer also asked him multiple times for his name, and he kept responding "It's on the license" that the officer had in his hands instead of simply answering the question.

I point all this out for a reason. It seems like every time an incident like this makes the news, the trouble begins with someone who is in violation of the law (speeding, broken tail light, etc.). The cops are simply doing their job of upholding the law, at least at the outset. The other common occurrence across most of these incidents is that the person repeatedly disobeys a direct order(s) from a law enforcement officer.

I expect my dogs to obey me. I know what my reaction is when they don't. Those of you with children probably experience the same thing. Frustration, anger, maybe violence. Now imagine you're dealing with a grown adult who has the capacity to possibly harm or kill you. People -- including the cops -- lose their cool in situations like that and it's not hard to understand why.

Don't get me wrong. There are a lot of power-hungry dickhole cops out there. I had a run-in with one a few weeks ago, in fact. My point is that these situations typically escalate because people start acting defiant or even belligerent towards law enforcement. If you feel like an officer is exceeding his authority, there are much better ways to deal with it than to challenge them IMO. That doesn't excuse police brutality, but again, it's easy to understand how situations can escalate so easily.

With each new story, it feels like there's a growing undercurrent of people who assume that cops are going to abuse their authority and they are therefore obligated to defy the police. This is a cousin to the entitlement mentality that lets people believe that rules are for other people, not them.

 

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

With each new story, it feels like there's a growing undercurrent of people who assume that cops are going to abuse their authority and they are therefore obligated to defy the police.

Solid poast, but figured I'd just weigh in on this part. I'm someone who assumes that cops are going to abuse their authority if given the chance. However, I don't feel obligated to openly defy them as a result. Mainly, because I'm smart enough to realize that it wouldn't end well for me, and in essence, I would "lose". If there were a pretty good chance that I would "win", I'm sure I'd do it.

I get more enjoyment than I should out of tagging cops on Waze. It's my way of discretely giving them a GFY, and hoping that their little speed trap stake-out bears no fruit.

 

[Raising Heel]

I'm smart enough to realize that it wouldn't end well for me....

Thanks for adding this part that I forgot to mention. When has anyone ever defied the police and had it turn out well? (I'm talking about everyday folks in real life, so no movie or TV gifs please.) All you're going to do is piss them off and get your ass beat. There's a cynical part of me that thinks that's exactly what some of these folks are after, though. The opportunity to be a victim and get a handsome payout. It's the new lottery.

Cop pulls you over for no license plate? Mouth off to him, refuse to obey orders, and let him kick your ass! You and your family will never have to work another day in your life!!!

 

[heelbent]

You and your family will never have to work another day in your life!!!

I realize it was 100 years ago, but that's not how it worked out for a young me. All I got out of it was the arse whoopin' and a month's worth of extra duty. The 1st Sgt screaming in my face for 10 minutes was just the cherry on top.

 

[Raising Heel]

I realize it was 100 years ago, but that's not how it worked out for a young me. All I got out of it was the arse whoopin' and a month's worth of extra duty. The 1st Sgt screaming in my face for 10 minutes was just the cherry on top.

You must've forgotten to tell them you were "living your truth."

 

[heelbent]

You must've forgotten to tell them you were "living your truth."

Oh I lived the truth, alright. The little "slapjack" they used to carry is absolutely the truth when it's whacking you upside the head.

 

[gunslingerdick]

I get more enjoyment than I should out of tagging cops on Waze. It's my way of discretely giving them a GFY, and hoping that their little speed trap stake-out bears no fruit.

I used to do the flicking lights thing when I rode by a cop and because I thought I was helping people coming in the opposite direction. But I stopped. Why? Because if people are speeding, they need to be caught and get a ticket. I'd rather them get a ticket than to hit my kid that's out riding his bike. That goes for me too. I'm still going to speed but I'll never argue with a cop for giving me a ticket. If I was driving too fast and I'm caught, then I should face consequences.

Your helping people avoid tickets is potentially aiding in them running over a kid because they were speeding. Or worse, I would assume drunk drivers watch that Waze thing (forgive me, I've never used that but I think I know what it is). What if you found out that you helped a drunk driver get away from a hit and run?

 

[gunslingerdick]

There's a cynical part of me that thinks that's exactly what some of these folks are after, though. The opportunity to be a victim and get a handsome payout. It's the new lottery.

Cop pulls you over for no license plate? Mouth off to him, refuse to obey orders, and let him kick your ass! You and your family will never have to work another day in your life!!!

Truer words have never been written.

 

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

Your helping people avoid tickets is potentially aiding in them running over a kid because they were speeding.

I don't generally speed going through neighborhoods. It's also rare that a cop will have a speed trap set up in a neighborhood. It's even rarer that I would tag that cop into Waze.

I'm referring to the highway. I feel like people can easily safely operate a vehicle at higher speeds than the posted 55mph, or whatever it is (just as they can easily unsafely operate a vehicle at speeds well below that number). If some kid is riding his bike down I-95 and gets clipped, that's sort of just Darwinism taking over.

Also - I'm not sure how I can be enabling any of this. There's no way to alert people to say "Hey - there's no cops here, speed to your heart's content!" There's only the way to alert them that a cop is indeed there, and that they should slow down. So if anything, my alerts only encourage people to slow down, not speed up and endanger.

Or worse, I would assume drunk drivers watch that Waze thing (forgive me, I've never used that but I think I know what it is). What if you found out that you helped a drunk driver get away from a hit and run?

Ya, I don't think you're quite getting how it works. You can simply tag a cop in if you see them somewhere. I don't know how me saying "hey, I saw a cop here" can help someone getting away from the scene of a hit and run.

 

[dadika13]

Man, you guys sound like Ed Norton in American History X defending the cops against Rodney King.

 

[tarheel0910]

Man, you guys sound like Ed Norton in American History X defending the cops against Rodney King.

That's a great movie. I thought Norton did a great job.

(This is @heelz2345's opportunity to jump into the thread.)

 

[dadika13]

That's a great movie. I thought Norton did a great job.

(This is @heelz2345's opportunity to jump into the thread.)

Love it.

My only gripe - in no world will I ever believe Ed Norton is dunking.

 

[tarheel0910]

Love it.

My only gripe - in no world will I ever believe Ed Norton is dunking.

Why you hating on the white boys? Don't forget about Luke. Nobody thought he could dunk either.

 

[dadika13]

Why you hating on the white boys? Don't forget about Luke. Nobody thought he could dunk either.

Luke can dunk?!?!

For real though, when I saw Platek dunk last year I was legitimately shocked that he could...gary, on the other hand, needed a new pair of underwear after it.

 

[heelz2345]

In the book Basketball and Other Things, there is a chapter that is a draft of fictional characters and Ed Norton in that movie was a late first round pick

 

[Heels Noir]

Also keep in mind Brown refused to take his hands out of his pockets. It's understandable why officers want to see a suspect's hands so they know he's not about to pull a knife or gun on them. That act of defiance is what initiated the takedown.

Smart cops just doing their job. It's too bad the mayor and police chief are throwing them under the bus.

 

[dadika13]

In the book Basketball and Other Things, there is a chapter that is a draft of fictional characters and Ed Norton in that movie was a late first round pick

I love this topic. Mays and Barnwell did a podcast on top fictional football players and it was fantastic (give me Julius Campbell as my #1 overall, need that edge rusher).

Norton being a late first is ridiculous. Do Penny and Shaq in Blue Chips count because they are real players? Same with Ray Allen in He Got Game. MJ in Space Jam is the obvious #1 if he counts. Billy Ho in White Men Can't Jump is up there. Omar Epps in Love and Basketball was an All-American. I could keep going.

 

[tarheel0910]

I love this topic. Mays and Barnwell did a podcast on top fictional football players and it was fantastic (give me Julius Campbell as my #1 overall, need that edge rusher).

Norton being a late first is ridiculous. Do Penny and Shaq in Blue Chips count because they are real players? Same with Ray Allen in He Got Game. MJ in Space Jam is the obvious #1 if he counts. Billy Ho in White Men Can't Jump is up there. Omar Epps in Love and Basketball was an All-American. I could keep going.

Don't forget about Ollie.

 

[ticket2ride04]

I’m one who beats the drum for higher standards/pay for police because we have way too many idiots out there. I’m also one who has higher expectations of police than regular citizens because they are sworn to Serve and Protecr so I jump all over them for making bad moves and resent that they protect their own when clearly in the wrong.

That said, Brown is an idiot. Double parked in a handicap spot, refusal to move it, refusal to cooperate, and not taking your hands out of your pocket and he’s lucky he only got tazed

 

[heelz2345]

I love this topic. Mays and Barnwell did a podcast on top fictional football players and it was fantastic (give me Julius Campbell as my #1 overall, need that edge rusher).

Norton being a late first is ridiculous. Do Penny and Shaq in Blue Chips count because they are real players? Same with Ray Allen in He Got Game. MJ in Space Jam is the obvious #1 if he counts. Billy Ho in White Men Can't Jump is up there. Omar Epps in Love and Basketball was an All-American. I could keep going.

The rules were if a real basketball player was portraying a fictional character, they were eligible, so Shaq and Penny went 2 & 3 respectively, but a real player playing themselves was not eligible, so MJ in Space Jam was absent, but Lola Bunny went 8th. Jesus Shuttlesworth (Ray Allen) went 10th. Billy from White Men Can’t Jump went 5, and his partner in crime Sidney went 6. Omar’s Love and Basketball character was 22. Ed Norton’s character was the 30th pick, so he was actually the last choice of the round. He was 3 picks behind Air Bud.

 

[tarheel0910]

The rules were if a real basketball player was portraying a fictional character, they were eligible, so Shaq and Penny went 2 & 3 respectively, but a real player playing themselves was not eligible, so MJ in Space Jam was absent, but Lola Bunny went 8th. Jesus Shuttlesworth (Ray Allen) went 10th. Billy from White Men Can’t Jump went 5, and his partner in crime Sidney went 6. Omar’s Love and Basketball character was 22. Ed Norton’s character was the 30th pick, so he was actually the last choice of the round. He was 3 picks behind Air Bud.

Well, who went first?

 

[dadika13]

Well, who went first?

Yeah - if Shaq in Blue Chips goes #2 and MJ is ineligible, I'm dying to know who went 1.

 

[dadika13]

Oh and Lola Bunny, who had legit one good play against the Monstars, going above Jesus Shuttlesworth is a crime. Like Sam Bowie over MJ level crime.

 

[tarheel0910]

Oh and Lola Bunny, who had legit one good play against the Monstars, going above Jesus Shuttlesworth is a crime. Like Sam Bowie over MJ level crime.

I guess they thought Lola was just too hot to pass on.

 

[heelz2345]

Well, who went first?

First is an obscure sort of pick actually; it was Brendan Fraser’s character from Bedazzled. I’ll quote the write-up the book had

“No. 1 Pick: Elliot Richards, Bedazzled. Height: 7’6” Weight: Approximately 290 pounds. Position: Center. Most Memorable On-Court Moment: Dunking it from well beyond the three-point line.

The undeniable, impossible-to-pass-up, absolutely-has-to-get-chosen, guaranteed-Hall-of-Famer-and-potentially-greatest-of-all-time first pick. His stat line from the game they show him playing in Bedazzled is so absurd that it feels like too much even for a fake player: 104 points, 45 rebounds, 32 assists, 37 steals, and 28 blocks. He dunked it from the three-point line. He shot 40-footers like they were 5-footers and he shot 30-footers without even looking at the rim. He sweat a lot, and he was exceptionally dumb, and he had a teeny tiny penis, but no matter. Championships abound.”

There was a footnote relating to a part toward the end that I felt obliged to share.

“The plot of Bedazzled is a guy makes a deal with the devil (played by Elizabeth Hurley) where he trades his soul for seven wishes, one of which he uses to become an NBA megastar version of himself. Every wish she grants him ends up having some terrible thing attached to it, though, and so when she turned him into an NBA All-Star, she also gave him a super small penis. He immediately traded away his stardom and fortune to get back into his normal body and his normal penis. Men are dumb.”