unc fb grad rate 14th in acc
- Thread starter heelmanwilm
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That announcement isn't coming out until after TX fires strong. They are going to announce the hiring of Miles as head coach and Strong as assistant coach on the same day.
I care literally zero about this. They're at UNC to play football.
A few years back, there was a report on the low grad rates of Texas football players. Most Texas fans responded this way: we know that most players could never have gotten admitted to the university without playing football. Therefore, the more that football players graduate beyond maybe 50-60%, the more we know there have been lowered standards for them after they enroll. And it is after they enroll that lowered standards for them can hurt the university academically.
I thought then, and still think, that such is a wise understanding.
Well, I certainly care if they graduate or not. Most football and basketball players are taking easier classes than most of our students. They also have access to tutors anytime they desire. I can't understand those that say they couldn't care less if they graduate. May as well not make them take any classes at all and just pay them to play football, abandoning any concept of the student athlete. Is that what you would like to see happen? Because before that happens, I'd rather see college sports disappear entirely, except at the intramural level.
I get that and i'm with u to a certain extent. My only concern is that the staff must feel the same as well and i'm not sure how i feel about that.
I'd be really interested to hear how other UNC fans feel about this. Seems to me the tail(athletics money) is already waggin' the dog(the university) at many universities.
They should be able to major in football or whatever their sport is, if they desire, and learn about things useful to them like handling your finances and stuff like that.Well, I certainly care if they graduate or not. Most football and basketball players are taking easier classes than most of our students. They also have access to tutors anytime they desire. I can't understand those that say they couldn't care less if they graduate. May as well not make them take any classes at all and just pay them to play football, abandoning any concept of the student athlete. Is that what you would like to see happen? Because before that happens, I'd rather see college sports disappear entirely, except at the intramural level.
Please keep in mind that UNC is at a huge, huge disadvantage compared to schools like Moo, ECU, FSU, etc etc. A lot of these guys point blank WOULD NOT GET INTO CAROLINA if not for their athletic ability. It's an inherently unfair playing field for college sports for UNC, UVA, Michigan, Stanford, and Duke to compete in the same level (FBS) as Memphis, Texas Tech, USF, Tennessee, and Ole Miss.
No slight intended to those universities whatseover; their academic profile is simply vastly different than that of UNC.
Therefore, no I don't care if they graduate or not because most of them are just choosing the easiest major they can find to stay eligible (as they should if they have NFL aspirations)
That's the important question. As long as the guys are doing the necessary course work while they're football players at UNC we don't have a problem. If they decide to not show up for the spring semester after their senior year, or leave early for the NFL that's not the fault of the football program.
I've kind of mentioned something like this before. Colleges need to get with the times and realize that professional sports is now a specialized business. There should be a course of study specific to it just like there is for doctors and lawyers. A professional Sports major needs to be created that would include classes such as financial planning, journalism, public speaking, sports medicine, etc. Something like this would not just help them with a career in being a player, but it would help if they wanted to be an agent, journalist, on air analyst or front office employee. I think a lot of these guys would be extremely interested in this and if they are interested they will put more effort into their classwork.
I agree that the graduation rate appears to be unsatisfactorily low. However, what are the metrics they are using. Up until 5 or 6 years ago the metric was behind ridiculous and considered all players over a 4 year period even those who transferred. Obviously transfers wouldn't have graduated from the school thus skewing the number. Not saying that is the case here but we need to quantify what we are looking at.
I don't believe the average student is graduating in 4 years now. If I am not mistaken, the trend, of students graduating in 5 years instead of 4, was taking place 10 to 20 years ago. Additionally, isn't college what you make of it, regardless of whether a student is an athlete, frat/soro or just a plan student. I person can go and make decisions that delays their matriculation from UNC. Student athletes who have professional desires are more than likely not completing their degree until they see fit to do so; their choice. Just like it is Biff's choice to party for the next 4 to 5 years and not march on time. Personal accountability seems to be something this society has completely forgotten.
Exactly. If the football team is full of a bunch of pre-med majors and graduates at a 50% clip with an average GPA of 2.0, are we all of a sudden happier if they all switch to basketweaving majors and graduate at a 90% clip with an average GPA of 3.8?
I hope they figure out a way to level the playing field, but it seems like a tall task. Either schools with strong academics will be at a disadvantage, or if they scrap the "student-athlete" term (which we all know is a farce already for a lot of them), and start paying them, then the schools with the biggest athletic department funding would get all the best players and it would essentially just be a junior pro league.
I wonder what factors into the numbers. Are they factoring in players that leave the program to transfer to another school? Players that leave as juniors for the pros?
ACC Football Graduation Success Rates for 2015 - 2016. This is for the cohort year of 2009 and reflects the rate of scholarship freshman football players entering ACC schools from 2006 to 2009 who graduated within six years.
Duke 94
WFU 91
BC 90
VT 89
Miami 86
Clemson 84
Syracuse 80
GT 78
FSU 77
Virginia 77
Pitt 71
moo 70
Louisville 69
UNC 59
***Graduation Success Rate and the Academic Success Rate account for the academic outcomes of student-athletes who transfer from one institution to another.
http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/research/graduation-success-rate
Duke 94
WFU 91
BC 90
VT 89
Miami 86
Clemson 84
Syracuse 80
GT 78
FSU 77
Virginia 77
Pitt 71
moo 70
Louisville 69
UNC 59
***Graduation Success Rate and the Academic Success Rate account for the academic outcomes of student-athletes who transfer from one institution to another.
http://www.ncaa.org/about/resources/research/graduation-success-rate
Again...........2006 to 2009. Has nothing to do with Fedora.
I also fail to see how it's "sad" ?
I also fail to see how it's "sad" ?
If our program was so good that every single player left after their junior year and that graduation number was 0 I'd be perfectly fine with it.
Well I know of at least 3 players who originally enrolled during that time period but were later disassociated from the football program. Haven't looked but I'm guessing none of them graduated. That certainly doesn't help the numbers.
Based on the years they used and without knowing the full methodology, I'm going to guess we got killed by players leaving for the NFL, getting kicked off the team due to the NCAA, or transferring/otherwise leaving the team and school.
And as others have said, so what? These guys were recruited to play football. In a perfect world they would all graduate with 4.0s and be exemplary representatives of our university, but that's not reality. Other than giving rivals fans something to crow about it this is pretty irrelevant.
And as others have said, so what? These guys were recruited to play football. In a perfect world they would all graduate with 4.0s and be exemplary representatives of our university, but that's not reality. Other than giving rivals fans something to crow about it this is pretty irrelevant.
Well, I certainly care if they graduate or not. Most football and basketball players are taking easier classes than most of our students. They also have access to tutors anytime they desire. I can't understand those that say they couldn't care less if they graduate. May as well not make them take any classes at all and just pay them to play football, abandoning any concept of the student athlete. Is that what you would like to see happen? Because before that happens, I'd rather see college sports disappear entirely, except at the intramural level.
Not sure of the source where that came from or what years it is using as a sample size, as this image is about as vague as it comes- but I can promise you with 100% certainty that Duke basketball absolutely does not, in anyway shape or form, have a 100% Graduation Success Rate [Rate].
Not only did their basketball team have a 100% GSR during the time that graphic was posted, they have had a 100% GSR for all scholarship freshmen who entered since 2004. This includes all freshman classes up to 2009. The data for 2010 or later incoming freshman is not available as it is not yet fully scoped (6 year max requirement) by the GSR.
Have to admit that I'm surprised that some of you seemingly couldn't care less about our poor graduation rate, as long as we're successful on the field. Suffice it to say I couldn't disagree more. The university's sports programs should always be secondary to the education process, always.
I can't even pretend to care, to be honest with you. And I say that as an alumnus.
All that being said, this thread and the hand-wringing is much ado about nothing because these numbers are from the Butch Davis era. It's no secret that BD and staff were bringing in kids who were talented but were terrible fits for UNC. Fedora has significantly improved the caliber of men he's recruited to UNC -- something he doesn't get enough credit for, IMO
It's all water under the bridge at this point. These stats have nothing to do with the current state of the program and where it's going. I've no doubt it's going to be better. Also, no use in pretending that a lot of these scholarship football players came primarily because of the education. Just as the school did not bring them on board primarily for academic reasons.
Go to bed earlier, man!
But yes, I'm sure it has. And even if it hasn't, I don't care. The quality and caliber of men Fedora has brought in has definitely improved since the Davis era, and that's what I care about.
Once again...what's the source? 2004-2009 is an incredibly small sample size. Jah Okafor, Justice Winslow, and Tyus Jones have not graduated yet. To my knowledge neither has Jabari Parker. And to my understanding, Justice has no plan of returning to campus. Guess- based on your "graphic", that is an anomaly.
From the University's perspective - absolutely. From the fans' perspective - I don't think that needs to be the case.
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