Jane Doe laws protect sexual violence victims from having their identities disclosed in cases like these. If the allegations are real, which I have no idea of, there are prosecuters in Durham that have recourse, and I doubt they give a damn about how many points Sheed scored.
Looks like we have a Duke scandal on our hands.........
- Thread starter HuntingtonHeel
- Start date
I tuned-in tot he pre-game show on ESPN and I was surprised at how much coverage this story had on that show! This thing is much bigger than I thought.
^ Especially since the two girls involved BOTH told several people about the traumatic event at the Duke Retreat (official name unknown at present)... I think that there are many, many people who know both of these girls names at this point in time. Additionally, Mike should NOT have waited until the 1,000th win before taking any real action concerning this incident in my opinion. People form their opinions about the school in Durham for many various reasons. The way this has been handled sure makes it all appear to have the workings of a cover-up being involved, again in my humble opinion. Time will tell if this will completely blow up (or not). Either way this has been botched and butchered (in my opinion). Just to be clear I strongly believe that the two girls involved are the real victims concerning this issue..
The thought that keeps going through my head is: where are the parents of the girls that
were, allegedly, sexually assaulted?? I have posted elsewhere, that I and my wife would
be jumping up and down until we got action from the Durham police, Durham DA's office,
dook's chancellor, etc. I know we can't know what is going on behind the scenes, but
if someone is not taking action to get to the bottom of this, it is a shame for the two
girls that were involved. Their lives have already been affected whether what they have
told is true or not. They need counseling and other help to get past this. I don't see
how they can continue classes at dook. They are victims and whether the allegations
are true or not, this will follow them for a long time. As a parent of a teenage girl, this
is a harsh reminder of what can happen when your daughter grows up. This is the real
world and bad things can happen. If the girls made up the story, then they must
suffer consequences. If however, the story is true, Suliamon, coach k, asst. coaches,
and others that knew about possible problems and failed to report it, must suffer
consequences and they should be harsh.
were, allegedly, sexually assaulted?? I have posted elsewhere, that I and my wife would
be jumping up and down until we got action from the Durham police, Durham DA's office,
dook's chancellor, etc. I know we can't know what is going on behind the scenes, but
if someone is not taking action to get to the bottom of this, it is a shame for the two
girls that were involved. Their lives have already been affected whether what they have
told is true or not. They need counseling and other help to get past this. I don't see
how they can continue classes at dook. They are victims and whether the allegations
are true or not, this will follow them for a long time. As a parent of a teenage girl, this
is a harsh reminder of what can happen when your daughter grows up. This is the real
world and bad things can happen. If the girls made up the story, then they must
suffer consequences. If however, the story is true, Suliamon, coach k, asst. coaches,
and others that knew about possible problems and failed to report it, must suffer
consequences and they should be harsh.
Money and power can make real situations disappear at any time.
Hopefully that wont happen in this case.[/B]
Hopefully that wont happen in this case.[/B]
Where are the parents? The better question is, "Who are the parents?" This will answer a good deal of the why they haven't done anything about it that is visible to us. First, we don't know when they even told their parents or if they did at all before this came out. Many cultures believe that rape carries a stigma that attaches to the victim. Many people that have been raped do not come out for fear that their loved ones would not be able to forgive them for being "spoiled". Many others don';t come out because they are afraid there will be reprisals because of the difference in relative power. This is obvious and everyone should know this by now. Standard operating procedure for defense lawyers is to discredit the victim in these cases and some don't want to relive the incident while the powers that be make them out to be whores or idiots! To even ask why they did not make an official report as a basis for doubt is naive at best and criminally insensitive at worst!
Ratty is the master at the cover-up and benefits from puke's private status to perpetuate his control of all information. Secret elevator with a code to enter office anyone? Sulkymon has been a cancer from the first day he arrived so what happened this year that didn't happen earlier? The scandal was on the verge of breaking is the only explanation that fits the facts to me. puke and ratty will get their usual pass unless a DA is courageous and the girls fight the good fight. (assuming the allegations are true), but puke should have done something of substance before now if they are being lead by a real "Leader of Men!" I hope justice is done in this case and I take no joy in the suffering of these young women or in the derailment of Sulaimon's career.
Heels are Family!
Ratty is the master at the cover-up and benefits from puke's private status to perpetuate his control of all information. Secret elevator with a code to enter office anyone? Sulkymon has been a cancer from the first day he arrived so what happened this year that didn't happen earlier? The scandal was on the verge of breaking is the only explanation that fits the facts to me. puke and ratty will get their usual pass unless a DA is courageous and the girls fight the good fight. (assuming the allegations are true), but puke should have done something of substance before now if they are being lead by a real "Leader of Men!" I hope justice is done in this case and I take no joy in the suffering of these young women or in the derailment of Sulaimon's career.
Heels are Family!
So wait now, you skew what I said and then admit to actually understanding what I said and then ask ME to have some perspective?
For absolute clarity, don't you dare EVER suggest that I take rape as anything less than a very serious matter. My words were concerning your own duke fans attempt to defend K's actions as being proper.
Thought some would enjoy this article by Duke apologist John Feinstein. Funny how the guy felt the need to write a blog entry about why he isn't apologizing for Duke and Coach K, instead of actually investigating.
Feinstein..LOL
Feinstein..LOL
This guy Feinstein, who I have listened to for YEARS and YEARS here in DC, IS an absolute dook apologist and toady for K
He was deathly silent about Lance Thomas and the $70k jewelry scam and now is telling us all to go away and be quiet.
This is a guy who will write a book about paint drying yet has never had the time to really dig and investigate the potential corruption at dook
It is really not a surprise at all that he refuses to look into the Don's potential cover ups over the years...... he is a good soldier for the dark side.
He was deathly silent about Lance Thomas and the $70k jewelry scam and now is telling us all to go away and be quiet.
This is a guy who will write a book about paint drying yet has never had the time to really dig and investigate the potential corruption at dook
It is really not a surprise at all that he refuses to look into the Don's potential cover ups over the years...... he is a good soldier for the dark side.
Oh, if John Feinstein says that Coach krysexski knew nothing about the rapes because
he has daughters, well by dingy I believe it. Case closed, end of story. I was talking
with a lawyer today and he said that he wonders if this is just the tip of the iceberg
for Suliamon and dook. It would not surprise me if other "victims" come forward and if
the coaching staff sat on more "rumors".
he has daughters, well by dingy I believe it. Case closed, end of story. I was talking
with a lawyer today and he said that he wonders if this is just the tip of the iceberg
for Suliamon and dook. It would not surprise me if other "victims" come forward and if
the coaching staff sat on more "rumors".
What about Duke's claim that it is "prohibited by law" from disclosing information to the public about the Sulaimon investigation? The relevant law is the Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act, better known as FERPA. FERPA, which President Gerald Ford signed into law in 1974, was intended to prevent universities from sharing students' educational records-which generally include disciplinary matters-without students' consent. Over the years, many commentators have asserted that universities routinely abuse FERPA. Namely, critics say, universities "hide behind FERPA," to avoid compliance with media requests that might otherwise embarrass athletes, coaches and school officials.
----Michael McCann, [/B] a Massachusetts attorney and the founding director of the Sports and Entertainment Law Institute at the University of New Hampshire School of Law[/B][/I]
[/B]
This post was edited on 3/4 7:39 PM by PolkCountyBullGator
----Michael McCann, [/B] a Massachusetts attorney and the founding director of the Sports and Entertainment Law Institute at the University of New Hampshire School of Law[/B][/I]
[/B]
This post was edited on 3/4 7:39 PM by PolkCountyBullGator
Duke's reticence to discuss the matter has led some commentators to wonder if the university might be hiding information. It could seem disingenuous for Duke to claim that it can't discuss allegations against Sulaimon when five weeks ago Krzyzewski publicly highlighted rationales for Sulaimon's dismissal from the team.
---Michael McCann, Massachusetts attorney and the founding director of the Sports and Entertainment Law Institute at the University of New Hampshire School of Law. [/I]
---Michael McCann, Massachusetts attorney and the founding director of the Sports and Entertainment Law Institute at the University of New Hampshire School of Law. [/I]
The problem in this article is that Fienstien spends a lot of time explaining why he has not ask what was going on and yet says K did absolutely right because he has daughters? Total and complete nonsense, no one is suggesting, especially me, that the guy shoiuld have been kicked off that team at knowing of the first "allegation" but you find out what the one making the allegation has to say, you suspend if the allegation smells anything nearing real, and as the most powerful person on that duke campus you insure 100% that this case is forwarded to the local police for a complete total investigation. You don't tell someone to look in to things and a month or so later decide that because nothiong has been done that nothing must have happened. You follow up, you make darn sure everything was done, you find out exactly what the story is, you don't risk becoming the next JoPa.
Of course none of that happened, yet K has 3 daughters, a accused rapist was still allowed to play yet Fienstien didn't think it was a big enough problem to ask whats up, if he even knew. he did exactly what JoPa did, to his ever lasting dis-credit, he valued his program over the safety of women at that campus and yes if any of Ks 3 daughters were around the kid he valued the reputation of his program over his own daughters safety. K may be a great basketball coach but just like JoPa, he is a very flawed man with priorities that are in very much the wrong direction.
What I have just stated does not hinge on guilt or innocense of Saluimon, it doesn't because an extreme allegation was made and a player with such allegations made toward him 100% has to be suspended until a full investigation is done and the matter must 100% of the time be turned over to police. This isn't about the NCAA or their book of rules, this is a criminal matter, this is a very bad criminal matter and can not be excused, pushed to the side, explained away, and really it can't even be tolerated.
This is my point as well. And also that they were sure that the UNC coaches ( football or basketball) had to know OR should have known everything their players were doing 24/7.
But of course, this is different. But they can't help it. They're dook fans. It's just their nature.
Interesting article from the dook newspaper two years ago!! One year
suspension for rape??? Is this in addition to criminal sentences??
Are the Durham Police and/or DA's office allowed on campus??
If one year suspension from school is the only penalty for
rape on dook's campus, I am shocked it doesn't happen
more often. Maybe I am reading this wrong.
dook protects rapists
suspension for rape??? Is this in addition to criminal sentences??
Are the Durham Police and/or DA's office allowed on campus??
If one year suspension from school is the only penalty for
rape on dook's campus, I am shocked it doesn't happen
more often. Maybe I am reading this wrong.
dook protects rapists
Nice of you to post excerpts from that Sports Illustrated article with the accompanying context. Here, let me add the most relevant part of the article that you chose to omit:
"While Duke's refusal to elaborate on allegations against Sulaimon may be unpopular, the university's approach to media disclosure appears to be the correct one under the law."
And before you start complaining that I'm singling you out, let me assure you I am.
Yes but MEDIA DISCLOSURE is one thing, disclosure to law enforcement when a serious crime like rape has been alledged is a very different matter. You can not hide behind FERPA when the allegation of major crime is involved, you don't go to the media, you go to the police.
From the article:
"It is unclear if the Duke Campus Police became aware of the allegations and conducted any investigation."
None of us knows whether the allegations were properly reported, so conjecture that assumes the worst case scenario makes us exactly what we hate about our own detractors. Sadly, this point seems to be lost on many people.
"It is unclear if the Duke Campus Police became aware of the allegations and conducted any investigation."
None of us knows whether the allegations were properly reported, so conjecture that assumes the worst case scenario makes us exactly what we hate about our own detractors. Sadly, this point seems to be lost on many people.
Duke holds all the cards UNLESS the victims opt to pursue the matter, which does not seem to be their inclination. Until that time duke has no obligation to say anything to anyone. I doubt k knew for a fact that a sexual assault occurred and without that standard being met he did not have to act. The process is probably the way it is so that the athletics officials are kept in the dark as much as possible until the administration officials are certain one way or the other (or as in this case the victims do not want to push it).
It is somewhat incredulous that in cases such as assault that duke does not automatically refer the matter to police. As a parent I would be outraged if my child were victim of violent crime and a school felt they were qualified to investigate the matter.
It is somewhat incredulous that in cases such as assault that duke does not automatically refer the matter to police. As a parent I would be outraged if my child were victim of violent crime and a school felt they were qualified to investigate the matter.
From The Article:
Duke AD: Coach K followed protocol for Rasheed Sulaimon allegations
by SI Wire
http://www.si.com/college-basketbal...sulaimon-allegations-mike-krzyzewski#comments
sexual misconduct policy references these responsibilities by establishing an expectation that Duke employees who become aware of possible sexual assault notify the Office of Student Conduct. Duke students are also "encouraged" to report. White's statement pledges that the athletic department has fully complied with the sexual misconduct policy. "Any allegation of student misconduct that is brought to the attention of our staff and coaches," White writes, "is immediately referred to the Office of Student Conduct in Student Affairs." White adds, "the athletics department does not investigate or adjudicate matters of student conduct, and cooperates completely in the process." Whether White's assurance of compliance by the athletic department holds up remains to be seen
Duke AD: Coach K followed protocol for Rasheed Sulaimon allegations
by SI Wire
http://www.si.com/college-basketbal...sulaimon-allegations-mike-krzyzewski#comments
sexual misconduct policy references these responsibilities by establishing an expectation that Duke employees who become aware of possible sexual assault notify the Office of Student Conduct. Duke students are also "encouraged" to report. White's statement pledges that the athletic department has fully complied with the sexual misconduct policy. "Any allegation of student misconduct that is brought to the attention of our staff and coaches," White writes, "is immediately referred to the Office of Student Conduct in Student Affairs." White adds, "the athletics department does not investigate or adjudicate matters of student conduct, and cooperates completely in the process." Whether White's assurance of compliance by the athletic department holds up remains to be seen
You want a cookie? Or how about a pat on the back?
Say what's on your mind, or completely ignore anything I write.
Either way works for me.
[/B]
Also from the article:
"Any allegation of student misconduct that is brought to the attention of our staff and coaches," White writes, "is immediately referred to the Office of Student Conduct in Student Affairs." White adds, "the athletics department does not investigate or adjudicate matters of student conduct, and cooperates completely in the process."
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So the key question that I have concerning this rather bold statement is that since neither of the two girls probably went to campus authorities to file a formal complaint, nor did they feel comfortable confronting anyone tied to the athletic regime, did Duke do nothing at all concerning the specific allegations? Rather, is White actually implying that since no formal complaint has been filed then Duke athletics (including Coaches) has NOT done anything at all with regard to the two girls allegations at the school sponsored retreat? Because if this is the case, and it seems to me to be a real possibility, then Duke has NOT complied at all with either Title IX nor the Duke sexual misconduct policy regarding proceedure, (all) in my opinion. One thing is certain. Duke is doing everything EXCEPT STATING that they have investigated ANY and ALL sexual misconduct allegations, or POSSIBLE allegations in the past 24 months. At least if Duke has stated such, I certainly fail to see it, in ANY official statements that I have seen or read...
This post was edited on 3/5 11:13 PM by ChapelHeeled
This post was edited on 3/5 11:15 PM by ChapelHeeled
"Any allegation of student misconduct that is brought to the attention of our staff and coaches," White writes, "is immediately referred to the Office of Student Conduct in Student Affairs." White adds, "the athletics department does not investigate or adjudicate matters of student conduct, and cooperates completely in the process."
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So the key question that I have concerning this rather bold statement is that since neither of the two girls probably went to campus authorities to file a formal complaint, nor did they feel comfortable confronting anyone tied to the athletic regime, did Duke do nothing at all concerning the specific allegations? Rather, is White actually implying that since no formal complaint has been filed then Duke athletics (including Coaches) has NOT done anything at all with regard to the two girls allegations at the school sponsored retreat? Because if this is the case, and it seems to me to be a real possibility, then Duke has NOT complied at all with either Title IX nor the Duke sexual misconduct policy regarding proceedure, (all) in my opinion. One thing is certain. Duke is doing everything EXCEPT STATING that they have investigated ANY and ALL sexual misconduct allegations, or POSSIBLE allegations in the past 24 months. At least if Duke has stated such, I certainly fail to see it, in ANY official statements that I have seen or read...
This post was edited on 3/5 11:13 PM by ChapelHeeled
This post was edited on 3/5 11:15 PM by ChapelHeeled
With a precious granddaughter a Senior at Gardner Webb all I can think about is these young ladies and their families. HATE to think of what I would want to do.
See my comment above. We simply don't know, so conjecture is pointless and potentially harmful.
Genuine question for the posters here. Why do you care about this? Is it because you know Sulaimon or either of the young women personally? Doubtful. Is it because it affects a rival of UNC? Probably.
According to sources close to the women, neither reported the incident because they feared backlash from the Duke fanbase. Think about that for a minute. Is a game played for our entertainment more important than their physical and emotional well-being? Of course not, or at least it shouldn't be, yet here were are. How does that happen?
I dislike the dookies as much as the next Tar Heel. But the complusive need to demonize Duke's program, its coaches, and/or its players -- especially in the face of such a serious matter -- does nothing but empower the very culture that prevented the women from reporting the assaults in the first place. How many pages does this thread need to have before we realize we're all part of the problem?
It would be nice if people would just let it go and let the events play themselves out. I doubt that'll happen, so this will be my last post on the topic. I do think it's tragic, though, that just a few weeks after his passing, Dean Smith's lesson about simply doing the right thing is apparently lost on so many of his admirers.
Good points!
Seems as though the Duke Administration might ought to look at redoing the sexual misconduct policy if they are NOT going to follow what is currently written....Very vague response thus far in regards to any possible victims!
Would be interesting to know what's going on behind the scenes?
And for me, it's just hard to believe that Suliamon's bad behavior on the team is why he is the FIRST EVER played dimissed from the basketball team since K's been there?
Man O' Man....his bad behavior problems must have been legendary at Dook for him to be kicked off the team, but still remain in school at Dook?
This post was edited on 3/21 7:05 AM by mikeirbyusa
*slow clap*
Everyone in this thread, read this post 3 times before posting again in this thread. Have some effing class for goodness sake. Girls may have been sexually assaulted, and all y'all can do is act like giddy children that Duke basketball might get some sort of penalty for this.
Y'all have spent decades annoying the crap out of everyone (including me) talking about how Carolina and Carolina fans have class and do it the right way. Practice what you preach, and do so, right now.
*leaves thread, never to return*
This post was edited on 3/6 11:05 AM by TarHeelNation11
^It would be nice if people would just let it go and let the events play themselves out. I doubt that'll happen, so this will be my last post on the topic.
-----------------------------------------------
^ Since Duke is a private institution I think you know that unless outside people, and news and media outlets, KEEP digging into this then NOTHING will be done about this current situation (imo). That is because at the current time If Duke did all that it was supposed to do then no amount of digging into this matter will cause Duke any harm as far as I am concerned (imo). Truth will eventually triumph. The possibility that rapes did occur seems to certainly be VERY REAL to me! Personally, I still have many question that have either not been addressed and/or that have not been answered. Chief among those questions is whether or not Duke made ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN that all female students on campus were SAFE during the approximately TEN months that passed before Rasheed was thrown off (dismissed) from the Basketball Program, if indeed athletic officials knew of the two girls claims in March of 2014? MY second question is whether or not ALL FEMALE (and all) students were made aware of the allegations that had been alleged at the Common-Ground retreat? It simply stands to reason (to me) that if one of the goals of this gathering of students is for the students to become more aware of themselves and/or others, then nothing less than a full reporting of the accounts given would be considered acceptable outcomes for ALL students involved and/or ALL students who may have needed to know. Finally, if two different females gave two similar accounts that occured a considerable time-frame apart, then would Duke having done something about the first reporting have prevented the second account from ever happening? Again, it also seems that if the accounts are not true then Duke would want that information to also come to light for very obvious reasons...
This post was edited on 3/6 11:00 PM by ChapelHeeled
This post was edited on 3/21 7:08 AM by mikeirbyusa
-----------------------------------------------
^ Since Duke is a private institution I think you know that unless outside people, and news and media outlets, KEEP digging into this then NOTHING will be done about this current situation (imo). That is because at the current time If Duke did all that it was supposed to do then no amount of digging into this matter will cause Duke any harm as far as I am concerned (imo). Truth will eventually triumph. The possibility that rapes did occur seems to certainly be VERY REAL to me! Personally, I still have many question that have either not been addressed and/or that have not been answered. Chief among those questions is whether or not Duke made ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN that all female students on campus were SAFE during the approximately TEN months that passed before Rasheed was thrown off (dismissed) from the Basketball Program, if indeed athletic officials knew of the two girls claims in March of 2014? MY second question is whether or not ALL FEMALE (and all) students were made aware of the allegations that had been alleged at the Common-Ground retreat? It simply stands to reason (to me) that if one of the goals of this gathering of students is for the students to become more aware of themselves and/or others, then nothing less than a full reporting of the accounts given would be considered acceptable outcomes for ALL students involved and/or ALL students who may have needed to know. Finally, if two different females gave two similar accounts that occured a considerable time-frame apart, then would Duke having done something about the first reporting have prevented the second account from ever happening? Again, it also seems that if the accounts are not true then Duke would want that information to also come to light for very obvious reasons...
This post was edited on 3/6 11:00 PM by ChapelHeeled
This post was edited on 3/21 7:08 AM by mikeirbyusa
