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Serious question, the question no one wants to ask?

DSouthr

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Would this team be better if both Caleb and RJ left after this coming season? That would likely see Cadeau reclass to 23, no idea if Bacot would stray or leave but unless his draft spot really amps up (it should) he may not have a NBA choice to make. So I am asking, if our back court next season were to be Trimble, Cadeau, Wilcher, and Dunn (kind of sounds like a Law firm, LOL), 2 freshmen, a soph, and a Jr, would this be a better team? Keep in mind, that means you lose 2 guys that were 3yr starters that would have become seniors if they stay and both are extremely talented.

Think I will let some others speak to this rather than answer it myself for a while.
 
I don't think anyone is really shying away from this team is better without Caleb Love. No offense to the kid and I'm thankful for what he did last in March last year, but you just don't win with players like that consistently. You especially can't win big if your most talented player is the most flawed player in the country.

Additionally... There are a lot of people on this board who think Dunn is a really good 2-way player in the making. There are a lot of people on this board who think Trimble is a really good 2-way player in the making. I'm skeptical, but if that's the case, we will 100% be better. Caleb and RJ need to score to impact the game. They're scorers and that's kind of it.

I like RJ more than most. He's more steady than Caleb. But I won't lose a second of sleep if RJ Davis isn't here next year. There are a ton of RJ Davis' walking around that you can get. There are fewer Caleb Love talents walking around, but there's probably no coach in the country that can truly get it all out of Caleb. But in reality, you can find a bunch of high school dudes who shoot 40% from the field and 30% from 3 and drive you crazy every game. lol.

The reality with this core is they're not all that good. If you simulated this core's season a million times throughout their career, they would be like 7-10 seeds for the majority of it. Who cares if they leave then? Let the next group show if they have it or not.

Haven't RJ and Caleb basically shown you who they're going to be on most nights through three years? Sure, I know what they're good is. But another year doesn't guarantee you'll see their good all the time. It just guarantees they'll be around another year.
 
Would this team be better if both Caleb and RJ left after this coming season? That would likely see Cadeau reclass to 23, no idea if Bacot would stray or leave but unless his draft spot really amps up (it should) he may not have a NBA choice to make. So I am asking, if our back court next season were to be Trimble, Cadeau, Wilcher, and Dunn (kind of sounds like a Law firm, LOL), 2 freshmen, a soph, and a Jr, would this be a better team? Keep in mind, that means you lose 2 guys that were 3yr starters that would have become seniors if they stay and both are extremely talented.

Think I will let some others speak to this rather than answer it myself for a while.
The Pitt game showed us what kind of team we would have this year without Caleb. - since he was sort of MIA. For as much as we bitch about his lack of consistency, Caleb is still the guy who can rescue games for us, if he gets it going.

Wilcher will be that guy next year, but he's a freshman.

RJ is not a problem. Why would anyone want him to leave?

Would PT and starting position become a problem if Cadeau reclassifies? That leaves 80 minutes to divvy up among RJ, Seth, Dunn, Wilcher and Cadeau. So someone (or 2) will be pretty unhappy.

Cadeau may be the true PG people are saying we need, but he would only be a freshman. Plus, if he's going to be good as a distributor, he'll need people to distribute to. Who are they? Sure, we have some guys who might be good targets for a pass-first PG, but have any of them proven themselves yet?
 
I'm not shying away that we are much better with Caleb then without him in any manner with this roster, and last years. He is a very flawed key player to have, but when he defers or is out with fouls for long stretches last years team was not even competitive. He is the straw that stirs the drink as Reggie Jackson would say.

He is the only player who can create. Last year early he would defer when off, we were getting blown out with the onus on the rest of the roster to create. The Baylor game, Manek gets ejected as well, but with Caleb on the bench after fouling out it was ugly. Meanwhile, down the stretch of the regular season and starting with the 1st half of game 1 in the Marquette, toss up game by the way, and throughout to the Championship game he was terrific! Dominated and opened up so much for the others to play to thier strengths.

Next year may bring Cadeau which would give the roster a different makeup. He is a creater, with a point guard mentality. Caleb is much like Mando a tweener who have very limited interest from the NBA. Not sure if another year of NIL might make more sense for them next year. Then again, the earlier they go, the more time they have to get experience in the capacity for their role that they could fill with the big boys while playing in the G league, which has been very successful in boosting those type players to become league ready.

Maybe, playing with a pure point guard would free Caleb's game up with less responsibility as he and RJ are very similar in their game. If Cadeau comes and Caleb and RJ stay I think that would really hurt Wilcher, Trimble, and Dunn.
 
While I do think we need RJ, this team would absolutely be much better without Caleb. Some people will never understand that what Caleb did last season was great but that was last season. His play this season has been awful. Now, I personally believe that one of Hubert's selling points to Cadeau was he wants him to reclassify to 2023. I think Hubert wants Ian Jackson and Cadeau to reclassify which would force a few of these non-NBA players on this roster to transfer.
 
I would prefer to see Caleb leave after this season. Whether they'd be better or not I don't know, but I do know that they would be much easier to watch! The product on the court this year is almost unwatchable!
 
I do not care how good on paper freshman guards looked in high school u cannot ever trade that for experience at the college level. Caleb Love regardless how u perceive him presently is the only Carolina player that has even a remote chance of playing in the NBA. Maybe I am missing something but prior to the last game wasn’t Love the leading scorer in the ACC…

Dsouthr I know from all the time you have been here u post with logic and a basketball knowledge that few can match here so I am sure saying that u will agree with me that unknown freshmen products regardless of that untapped talent and possibilities WILL NEVER BE MORE IMPORTANT than players with big game experience who have been there and done that…
 
This team is bad because Nance is not a difference maker. As many have said, Nance is a decent player on any bad team. But he is not UNC starting material and would only get about 10mpg at most on any top team in the country. I said it before, if we still had Brady this team would still be undefeated. He opened up the offense so much and gave everyone else the confidence to shoot as well. We need someone to step up and take the 4 spot and we don’t have that guy. And Hubert wouldn’t try it anyways, even if we did.
 
Regarding Bacot and the NBA draft .. slim to none. Those MEN in the NBA in the middle will hurt his feelings if not more. He has no handle and nothing resembling any type of offensive game that translates to pro ball (period). Good college player, like T-50, but simply checks up short for pro potential.

Regarding Caleb leaving, we would surely be better off. I have no problems with RJ but he, nor anyone else can be an effective point guard when your offensive gameplan is for everyone run to a corner and wait. Won't matter who plays pg if there is no movement and poor spacing. #coachingthing
 
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This team is bad because Nance is not a difference maker. As many have said, Nance is a decent player on any bad team. But he is not UNC starting material and would only get about 10mpg at most on any top team in the country. I said it before, if we still had Brady this team would still be undefeated. He opened up the offense so much and gave everyone else the confidence to shoot as well. We need someone to step up and take the 4 spot and we don’t have that guy. And Hubert wouldn’t try it anyways, even if we did.
Is it Nance, or is it the coaching?

I think Nance can be better than we've seen. We've seen some flashes, but he also often looks lost. I think that's coaching. Figure out how to use him better.

I get it. We have several guys with promise who are under-performing. If you can't "fix" all of them at once, who do you focus on most?

It looks like Bacot may be back in gear. Who should be next?
 
It looks like Bacot may be back in gear. Who should be next?
Bacot is a 1 dimensional player .. hard to have a great inside game without something resembling an outside game. hubcaps offensive strategy needs to some introspection. Physician heal thyself stuff.
 
I do not care how good on paper freshman guards looked in high school u cannot ever trade that for experience at the college level. Caleb Love regardless how u perceive him presently is the only Carolina player that has even a remote chance of playing in the NBA. Maybe I am missing something but prior to the last game wasn’t Love the leading scorer in the ACC…

Dsouthr I know from all the time you have been here u post with logic and a basketball knowledge that few can match here so I am sure saying that u will agree with me that unknown freshmen products regardless of that untapped talent and possibilities WILL NEVER BE MORE IMPORTANT than players with big game experience who have been there and done that…
LOL, yeah ID, you pretty much nailed my thinking! If I have said it once I have said it a thousand times, talent is great but EXPERIENCED TALENT trumps everything else. You don't trade 2 guys that have been 3yr starters for you who will be seniors for you, for a couple freshmen. The exception I will make to that is for a big time big man because the most important college players, the game changers are the big time talented big men.

This staff has to figure out how to manage the players we have else you will see the incoming freshmen wasted. Hubert, hate to say it but he and this staff are doing a poor job managing this group. When Caleb begins playing in a funk you pull him, you get him refocused on the bench, you don't leave him out there to dig the hole deeper? Caleb is a great player folks, he just loses focus at times and it effects him for an extended period and when that happens the team suffers. Caleb plays on emotion, when things are going good for him his emotion is easy to see but when things are not going great for him that to is easy to see. Problem is his emotions take a 180 degree swing out of the blue, with no warning, both up and down. When bad Caleb shows up you have to get him off the floor ASAP, when good Caleb shows up you need to feed him the ball, it is kinda just that easy.

Hubert has to STOP with this nonsense of let me try this offensive attack or that one and frame your game plans around the players you have. Coach to the strengths of the players you have, not for future recruiting but for todays players you have, put them in positions to win. That 4 game win streak was a thing we should have built on, instead they regressed back to what they were doing that wasn't working, they were allowed to do that. It kind of says that maybe Hubert does not know what to do, that is a concern because the UNC basketball head coach is supposed to be experienced enough that he knows what to do. USE YOUR BENCH, not just to get your younger guys some experience but to TEACH your starters what is and what is not acceptable.

And ID, while I do appreciate the kind words I don't consider myself to see things differently than most posters here, I just have a big mouth and love to talk about what I see and I don't mind pushing things I believe strongly in. But thank you my friend, it does mean a lot!
 
I do not care how good on paper freshman guards looked in high school u cannot ever trade that for experience at the college level. Caleb Love regardless how u perceive him presently is the only Carolina player that has even a remote chance of playing in the NBA. Maybe I am missing something but prior to the last game wasn’t Love the leading scorer in the ACC…

Dsouthr I know from all the time you have been here u post with logic and a basketball knowledge that few can match here so I am sure saying that u will agree with me that unknown freshmen products regardless of that untapped talent and possibilities WILL NEVER BE MORE IMPORTANT than players with big game experience who have been there and done that…
If RJ Davis was the height of Love, he would have already been drafted in the 1st.
 
If RJ Davis was the height of Love, he would have already been drafted in the 1st.
That reminds me of the old saying about ifs "if my aunt had testicles she would be my uncle".

I do agree that RJ has the create and alpha dog mentality like Caleb, but his size limits him on what he can actually create. They are the only 2 who can make plays at this point on the roster offensively though 1 on 1 when needed. They have similar strengths and weaknesses though, which makes it difficult to max out opportunities for each.
 
That reminds me of the old saying about ifs "if my aunt had testicles she would be my uncle".

I do agree that RJ has the create and alpha dog mentality like Caleb, but his size limits him on what he can actually create. They are the only 2 who can make plays at this point on the roster offensively though 1 on 1 when needed. They have similar strengths and weaknesses though, which makes it difficult to max out opportunities for each.
I haven’t heard that in years. Lol
 
I'm surprised at how many people want Caleb back next season. Not meant as an attack, just surprised.
 
Get rid of Caleb Love? This team is better without him? Wanting him to leave after this year?




This is some sort of a Joke Right? You people can't be serious.
 
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I think the real question is a two-parter

1) Will this team make the Big Dance
2) Can they get hot at the right time again

Right now I’d say probably and doubtful
 
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I think the real question is a two-parter

1) Will this team make the Big Dance
2) Can they get hot at the right time again

Right now I’d say probably and doubtful
They probably make the dance but they’re going to get a poor seed which could result in a first weekend loss. I would say we are looking at another 8 or 9 type seed which is extremely disappointing.
 
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I'm surprised at how many people want Caleb back next season. Not meant as an attack, just surprised.
Agreed. I expect him to leave, but maybe we should be asking "what if he returns?"

Right now we have to put up with his "occasionality" for at least 2 reasons:

1. When he's on, he's a star.

2. Who else do we have?

Next year we'll have Wilcher. If he's as good as we all think, Caleb would still start, but if he isn't engaged and helping the team, he can be benched. Sure, he can be benched this year, too, but then we have the team that lost to Pitt.

On the one hand his return could be great for the team because between Caleb and Wilcher we theoretically have 40 minutes of SG star power.

On the other hand, that could just worsen the chemistry.

As a few of us have said, we've seen what this team looks like without Caleb. It's the team that lost to Pitt. So it makes no sense to want Caleb to leave. But if Caleb can't get consistent or get his head straight or whatever it is, he's going to lose PT next year.
 
Does our basketball program have sports psychologists to work with players like Caleb? Help him find a more constructive way to deal with frustration or bad calls or missed shots. I don't know what those more constructive way might be, but there has to be something better than pouting or going MIA or forcing bad shots.
 
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UNC's issue is not a player/talent one. It is a lack of a complete offensive system and that's whats playing out game after game. No one expected us to be in this same position today as one year ago. We had everyone back, experience, bench players, a plug and play transfer, and complete familiarity in the "system". This offense is too simplistic, does not systematically integrate players opposite the ball, and is easily team defended. Carolina always win the battle of most difficult shots attempted (poor offensive execution).

The idea of this new offense is, it puts UNC back in the living rooms of elite HS players. Ok, that works but that is only viable for a couple years(Mack Brown has seen you have to win with that talent or the pipeline becomes a trickle, and suddenly an about-face in the portal game big time). An idea is not a functioning system. Hubert's offense has been guided and conditioned to the highlight feats of Caleb. I think Trimble and RJ can be an extremely successful combination but not in this style of alternating primary ball handler/two man basketball. If Caleb is not engaged going forward, we aren't going far. Its all in the lack of system.
 
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Agreed. I expect him to leave, but maybe we should be asking "what if he returns?"

Right now we have to put up with his "occasionality" for at least 2 reasons:

1. When he's on, he's a star.

2. Who else do we have?

Next year we'll have Wilcher. If he's as good as we all think, Caleb would still start, but if he isn't engaged and helping the team, he can be benched. Sure, he can be benched this year, too, but then we have the team that lost to Pitt.

On the one hand his return could be great for the team because between Caleb and Wilcher we theoretically have 40 minutes of SG star power.

On the other hand, that could just worsen the chemistry.

As a few of us have said, we've seen what this team looks like without Caleb. It's the team that lost to Pitt. So it makes no sense to want Caleb to leave. But if Caleb can't get consistent or get his head straight or whatever it is, he's going to lose PT next year.
You keep referring to our lost to Pitt and Caleb’s performance. You do know he was on the floor for 35 minutes right? Which means he took those minutes and used them. Which means he was a part of that loss. Which means we were that bad with him, not without him.
I’m not saying get rid of Caleb but you can’t say look at the Pitt game and that’s what we would be without him. Yes he sucked it up, but he used a full game of playing time, that someone else could have used, Or others plural.
I have no idea who could be better off the bench but when he’s not engaged and pouting, he’s useless. It’s happened way too many times. I’d rather lose with kids busting their butt and sucking it up, than one kid with all the talent in the world with a bad attitude!!!
 
So let's summarize this thread from the serious ball heads over on Raider:

1. Caleb needs to go, obviously.
2. RJ is too small to be good.
3. We are bad because Nance isn't good.
4. Hubert and the staff suck.
5. We have no offensive system.
6. Caleb needs a psychologist.
7. Bacot is a one dimensional player.

Aside from all that, how was the play, Mrs. Lincoln?

You guys are funny.
 
Would this team be better if both Caleb and RJ left after this coming season? That would likely see Cadeau reclass to 23, no idea if Bacot would stray or leave but unless his draft spot really amps up (it should) he may not have a NBA choice to make. So I am asking, if our back court next season were to be Trimble, Cadeau, Wilcher, and Dunn (kind of sounds like a Law firm, LOL), 2 freshmen, a soph, and a Jr, would this be a better team? Keep in mind, that means you lose 2 guys that were 3yr starters that would have become seniors if they stay and both are extremely talented.

Think I will let some others speak to this rather than answer it myself for a while.
D, I'll just comment with a disclaimer.

One one hand (as you likely know) ANYTHING that would get Cadeau on campus is ok with me. I am long past sick and tired of being stuck in Point Guard Purgatory.

With that said, I am more concerned with maximizing what we have NOW for THIS season. I just posted an OP to that effect, and IF we do that and this season revitalizes itself, then I suspect the personnel stuff for the future will take care of itself --- and in a positive way.
 
UNC's issue is not a player/talent one. It is a lack of a complete offensive system and that's whats playing out game after game. No one expected us to be in this same position today as one year ago. We had everyone back, experience, bench players, a plug and play transfer, and complete familiarity in the "system". This offense is too simplistic, does not systematically integrate players opposite the ball, and is easily team defended. Carolina always win the battle of most difficult shots attempted (poor offensive execution).

The idea of this new offense is, it puts UNC back in the living rooms of elite HS players. Ok, that works but that is only viable for a couple years(Mack Brown has seen you have to win with that talent or the pipeline becomes a trickle, and suddenly an about-face in the portal game big time). An idea is not a functioning system. Hubert's offense has been guided and conditioned to the highlight feats of Caleb. I think Trimble and RJ can be an extremely successful combination but not in this style of alternating primary ball handler/two man basketball. If Caleb is not engaged going forward, we aren't going far. Its all in the lack of system.
I agree and especially agree with "I think Trimble and RJ can be an extremely successful combination but not in this style of alternating primary ball handler/two man basketball. If Caleb is not engaged going forward, we aren't going far. Its all in the lack of system."

I think what you are saying is that if you have 2 PGs on the floor together then you really don't have a PG. I don't often see 2 QBs on the football field playing together. Now I don't care who the PG is, you simply have to have that guy that sets it all up, that gets everyone on the same page. I honestly feel that guy on this current team is Trimble but it is not often he is put in that situation, it is either RJ or Caleb that run the point when Trimble comes in. You need a game manager, the definition of a manager is one who gets things done thru other people. By definition neither RJ nor Caleb are game managers, they can't be if their primary instinct is their own scoring
D, I'll just comment with a disclaimer.

One one hand (as you likely know) ANYTHING that would get Cadeau on campus is ok with me. I am long past sick and tired of being stuck in Point Guard Purgatory.

With that said, I am more concerned with maximizing what we have NOW for THIS season. I just posted an OP to that effect, and IF we do that and this season revitalizes itself, then I suspect the personnel stuff for the future will take care of itself --- and in a positive way.
As you know, I just do not agree on Cadeau as a 23 guy, I like him for 24. Talents like Trimble and Wilcher simply have to play, they have to be out on the court and frankly while I didn't like 20mins for a guy that has been out for a month, I do feel Dunn has earned PT. I as well STRONGLY believe that BOTH Caleb and RJ need to sit more in BOTH halves, especially Caleb. The message has to be sent that you can not jump off in to your 1on1 nonsense, it has cost us games we should not have lost and the ONLY way to stop it is to bring them to the bench when it starts. If it were me, when I pulled Caleb from the game he would 100% of the time take a seat next to Jeff Lebo, no one else sits next to lebo but Caleb if Caleb is not in the game. There simply has to be accountability for poor play, you do not scream your lungs out at a player that is not working hard defensively, you put someone else in that is willing to work hard (if a big man is not playing well, he goes to the bench and sits next to Sean Maye every time he comes out, I would have Washington sit next to Sean Maye all game if our bigs are playing well). You don't let a kid throw up 30 shots unless he is blazing hot for that game.

Look gary, you and I may not ever agree much on Trimble but you know enough about this game to agree with me that Trimble is the best back court guard defender we have on this team and I think it is by a rather large margin. So Burton, Pitt's 2 guard, 6'4" listed weight 200lbs but looks bigger, absolutely torched Caleb, owned him all game, Dunn didn't do much with him either. Caleb is not going to be ever confused with being a great defender, IMO Caleb is our worst guard defender, his real value is the ability to score more than he allows the other team to score, clearly he didn't do that vs Pitt. People always look at Caleb based on his offense, folks should look long and hard at the "defense" he plays because it is near Kerwin Walton level. So why did Caleb play over 30mins vs Pitt, Dunn coming off a month away due to injury get 20mins and our best guard defender got all of 5mins? WE stop Burton we win by 20 easy...

To max the potential for this current team, first that Iron 5 mindset instilled in them from last season has got to go away, this team not only has a nice bench but it has a bench of players that deserve to play. We should be the team with strong legs to end each half but very little bench is coming in the second half? We should be using those fresher legs to pressure the other teams ball handlers the length of the court, make their ball handlers work for everything they get. Switch from token to pressing to trapping, keep them off balance and tire those legs out. Turn defense in to offense for easy scores, they will not rotate as strong on those tired legs, they will start grabbing and reaching rather than moving their feet that is when they pick up foul calls. It all starts by using the deep bench of talent you have so that your team is NOT the tired team.

Even a guy like McKoy, when was the last time he played, put him in with the mission to go out and play as physical as he can, don't worry about picking up fouls, you just go out looking for a fight and don't worry how the refs call the game, would do the same with Shaver if he were available. Know how ya stop a guy like Burton, you teach him there is going to be a price you pay for driving the lane, you do not have to teach him to many times before he figures it out.

On the offensive end, outside of the Caleb/RJ 1on1 battles, I do NOT like the way we are using Nance. We all realize, Nance is not Manek, they are 2 VERY different types of players, we are trying to fit Nance in to a Manek role, I have no idea why? While Nance can hit the occasional trey I don't want him spending the majority of the trip on the offensive end camped out 40' from the basket. manek scored well from the outside because he had a really quick trigger, Nance has a slow trigger, his real value is using his length in the mid range, he is really good at that but more important is that when he is in the mid range he is involved with the offense, camped 45' from the basket to often he is not involved at all. I would go to a high low with nance up top and Bacot working the short corners or posting up in a passing lane for nance, like Brice Johnson playing Syracuse. Nance can hit that mid range but he is as well a really good passer if he has a solid passing lane. He can set the high pick and slide up for the trey at times as Bacot posts up for the driver to have the option to slip to Bacot, kick back to nance, or kick over to Love or finish if he has the lane.

This nonsense of initiating our offense with Bacot well up above the foul line and nance camped out 40' from the basket makes no sense, your only options are away from the basket, east west and it needs to be north south. I love a healthy Leaky's defense but clearly he isn't 100% right now (ankle sprain), he has got burned in our last couple games, a Leaky that can not move his feet to defend has to go to the bench, bring in Puff, bring in Nickel don't care which but bring in at least a guy that will score if he can't defend. Same with Caleb, if he is not in the right head space and isn't scoring he is a liability, get him off the floor and put someone else in, I don't care if it is Creighton lebo you bring in (well I do but you know what I mean).
 
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To max the potential for this current team, first that Iron 5 mindset instilled in them from last season has got to go away, this team not only has a nice bench but it has a bench of players that deserve to play. We should be the team with strong legs to end each half but very little bench is coming in the second half? We should be using
Look brother, I'll address the big point of contention as to what you just said: This is one case in which we CANNOT afford to defer to experience.

if --and I say IF --- Cadeau comes next season (which depends mostly on Love's status, as I understand it), you give him the ball... period. Hubert CANNOT afford to repeat Roy's blunder of not starting your best PG --- Kendall, Joel --- because he's a Frosh. The thing with Joel (fortunately) only delayed our first FF with him by a season, but with Kendall, next thing ya know he gets hurt on the way to one, and poof!... he's out the door. So, given that we don't even know how long Cadeau will even be here, you GIVE HIM THE BALL from day-one.
 
Look brother, I'll address the big point of contention as to what you just said: This is one case in which we CANNOT afford to defer to experience.

if --and I say IF --- Cadeau comes next season (which depends mostly on Love's status, as I understand it), you give him the ball... period. Hubert CANNOT afford to repeat Roy's blunder of not starting your best PG --- Kendall, Joel --- because he's a Frosh. The thing with Joel (fortunately) only delayed our first FF with him by a season, but with Kendall, next thing ya know he gets hurt on the way to one, and poof!... he's out the door. So, given that we don't even know how long Cadeau will even be here, you GIVE HIM THE BALL from day-one.
That is my rub right now gary, you may not like Trimble as a PG, I hate having to use a freshman PG, but it comes down to we have Seth and RJ as the closest thing to a PG we have on Roster, Caleb is not a PG, it is almost like asking Kenny Williams to run the point to have Caleb at the point, in fact Kenny may have done a better job of it, heck Leaky was better as a point than Caleb has been. That isn't a diss toward Caleb, there is a ton of things in this life I may want to do but do not have the ability to pull off.

I love that Seth is a pass first guy that is not looking for his own scoring as his primary thought. I believe he is the best ball handler we have right now, I think he can see the court much better than any guard we have, he is by far the most athletic guard we have, and until Leaky recovers from that ankle, Seth is the best defender on this team by a wide margin. He is a freshman, like all freshmen he has to learn what he can and can not do at this level, he does need to put in a LOT of work on his jump shooting because it is ugly right now. But the kid is a willing passer that does not take a lot of the risky chances we see to much from our starting back court.

I honestly do not know that a freshman Cadeau is better than a soph Trimble, I would be very surprised if a freshman Cadeau is better than a Jr version of Trimble. Kid is a fantastic talent, solid passer and solid ball handles. I would love to see Cadeau and Trimble in our back court together defending the other teams guards, who is driving past those 2, I know, the guy that just turned the ball over! LOL

Gary, you talk a lot about the lack of UNC breaks both primary and secondary and in doing so that is the hammer you hold over RJ, Caleb, and to a lesser extent Seth. Thing is Hubert lead us away from the UNC breaking game last season, the team struggled with it and going Iron 5 Hubert just ended it, not that we were breaking before Ant and Garcia went away. But we are still not wide open Carolina breaking and it is as if we forgot where the big men are supposed to run for the secondary. That is coaching, that is just not making our Carolina breaking an absolute core principle of our offense, else we would not find ourselves in nearly as much half court offense as we do.
 
Look brother, I'll address the big point of contention as to what you just said: This is one case in which we CANNOT afford to defer to experience.

if --and I say IF --- Cadeau comes next season (which depends mostly on Love's status, as I understand it), you give him the ball... period. Hubert CANNOT afford to repeat Roy's blunder of not starting your best PG --- Kendall, Joel --- because he's a Frosh. The thing with Joel (fortunately) only delayed our first FF with him by a season, but with Kendall, next thing ya know he gets hurt on the way to one, and poof!... he's out the door. So, given that we don't even know how long Cadeau will even be here, you GIVE HIM THE BALL from day-one.
Which past PGs would you compare Cadeau with?

I've watched a couple of YouTube videos and while he certainly looks good, I'm not knowledgeable enough to say for sure that he'll be a much better PG than RJ or Seth against college level competition - whether shooting, delivering the ball into a congested post on a team with bad spacing, or floor generalship.

I could use some help on what I'm supposed to be seeing. Thanks.
 
Which past PGs would you compare Cadeau with?

I've watched a couple of YouTube videos and while he certainly looks good, I'm not knowledgeable enough to say for sure that he'll be a much better PG than RJ or Seth against college level competition - whether shooting, delivering the ball into a congested post on a team with bad spacing, or floor generalship.

I could use some help on what I'm supposed to be seeing. Thanks.
Well, first it ain't even close as to Cadeau vs our current roster. I rarely say this, but he is better RIGHT NOW as a (technically) HS Soph than any of our college "PGs", and if he had been in our preseason camp instead of Link Academy's, he'd be the best PG on our roster now by a mile.

Generally, I can watch a kid go up and down the floor 2 or 3 times and tell if he's a PG or not. And usually not many more times to tell if he's any good. To simplify it, the first thing to concentrate on is not invividual skills as much as DOES HE CONTROL THE FLOOR? --- spacing, moving his teammates and the defense, able to create passing angles --- and then, is he special at it?

As for comparisons, I don't see a 1-to-1, but I see an excellent amalgam of traits --- Berry as a floor-general, some Lawson explosiveness, Marshall vision...
 
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Which past PGs would you compare Cadeau with?

I've watched a couple of YouTube videos and while he certainly looks good, I'm not knowledgeable enough to say for sure that he'll be a much better PG than RJ or Seth against college level competition - whether shooting, delivering the ball into a congested post on a team with bad spacing, or floor generalship.

I could use some help on what I'm supposed to be seeing. Thanks.
I am not gary but will give you my opinion, I see him as a young Jason Kidd. As for the things I think will translate to the college game, the ball handles are there and he has the tricks, changes his pace so that he can explode thru an opening, I think he can shoot well as a freshman and I think he will defend well for a freshman, he should be able to stay in front of most guards, I think he is physical enough to fight thru a lot of the screens, would suggest that other than Seth he would be the second best defender we would have, more so than RJ and much better than Caleb as a defender.

His experience with not only playing for a high power program like Link but playing for the Sweeds should have him more seasoned than the typical kid from high school.
 
I honestly do not know that a freshman Cadeau is better than a soph Trimble, I would be very surprised if a freshman Cadeau is better than a Jr version of Trimble. Kid is a fantastic talent, solid passer and solid ball handles. I would love to see Cadeau and Trimble in our back court together defending the other teams guards, who is driving past those 2, I know, the guy that just turned the ball over! LOL
First, yes, the Secondary is about coachng it and executing it, and thankfullly we have restored the KEY component, which is the Big sprinting to the block. Now we need to commit to that as a default for the entire game.

As for the PG thing, look, I have said that I love that Seth tries hard to do the things you coach your PG to do, but let's keep it real, D --- he has to perform these tasks by rote, as opposed to instinct.

Keeping it even realer, I told WWJD above about how I scout PG prospects, and as such I like to watch them first in game footage (NOT ihighlights) and I'd rather not know who they are ahead of time. In Seth's case, when I heard we were looking I found some team game footage and as usual didn't look up his number. I can honestly tell you I watched a good 5 minutes of his team's game footage and I still couldn't have told you who their PG was --- because well... they didn't really have one.

I eventually recognized Seth by his resemblence to JP and his athleticism certainly stood out, but... the kid is a talented Combo --- hell, maybe the most direct comparison to Dexter Strickland I've seen. That's not a bad thing at all --- he's just not a Carolina PG.
 
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First, yes, the Secondary is about coachng it and executing it, and thankfullly we have restored the KEY component, which is the Big sprinting to the block. Now we need to commit to that as a default for the entire game.
Your comment reminds me of another question I've been wondering about.

Is Hubert too scared of losing to try to train up a team that might lose now but be a winning team later?

On the one hand, last year we got good after doing some losing, so maybe that isn't an issue.

On the other hand, if we need to commit to bigs sprinting to the block every time, that might not work until they "get it." So if Hubert is scared of losing, maybe he won't actually be willing to commit to it.

We had a similar conversation earlier about giving the bench more PT. Partly to get them better, partly to give RJ and Caleb (in particular) some rest so they won't run out of gas at the end of the game. And, yes, some guys are getting more PT. But it still looks like Iron Man ball in the 2nd half. So we aren't really getting the full benefit. And that looks very much like Hubert isn't willing to commit to it.
 
As for comparisons, I don't see a 1-to-1, but I see an excellent amalgam of traits --- Berry as a floor-general, some Lawson explosiveness, Marshall vision...
In that case, can we have 2 Cadeaus, please?

Basketball would be so much easier if cloning were legal.
 
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Your comment reminds me of another question I've been wondering about.

Is Hubert too scared of losing to try to train up a team that might lose now but be a winning team later?

On the one hand, last year we got good after doing some losing, so maybe that isn't an issue.

On the other hand, if we need to commit to bigs sprinting to the block every time, that might not work until they "get it." So if Hubert is scared of losing, maybe he won't actually be willing to commit to it.

We had a similar conversation earlier about giving the bench more PT. Partly to get them better, partly to give RJ and Caleb (in particular) some rest so they won't run out of gas at the end of the game. And, yes, some guys are getting more PT. But it still looks like Iron Man ball in the 2nd half. So we aren't really getting the full benefit. And that looks very much like Hubert isn't willing to commit to it.
Unfortunately, the Unfortunate Offensive Experiment ate up the window for that. Now it's time to commit to transition-based basketball, come hell or high water. It';s quite doable and the only way we're gonna get this turned in the right direction.
 
With all due respect to everyone's opinion, I'll add mine.

1. We have not seen what this team would look like without Caleb. If Caleb did not play 35 minutes others would have filled those minutes as productively if not more.
Min FG 3Pt FT Reb PF A TO BLK Stl Pts +/-
Love,Caleb*353-91-30-02211017
Dunn,D'Marco 202-4 1-3 0-011 2 1 015
Trimble only played 5 min. with no real stats.

Redistribute Love's 35 minutes to Dunn, Trimble, Johnson, and Nickel and I would bet heavily that there would be more than 7 points, 2 rebounds, and better than 33% FG. There would be better defense (NO DOUBT), teamwork, and EFFORT (NO DOUBT).

2. I have watched Carolina basketball religiously since Charlie Scott. NEVER have I seen a UNC player carry themselves in competition like Love did in the Pittsburg game. Love was overtly disengaged from the game at best and apathetic at worst.

3. There was a post that said Coach Davis had better decide if he wants to be a coach or a buddy (something like that anyway). I ABSOLUTELY agree. Who here thinks Dean Smith would remotely tolerate Love's game? Jacking up shots from half court with 20 seconds left on the shot clock? NO WAY! Love would not see the court again without a change of behavior.

4. The impressionable freshman class is watching this closely. They are sitting on the bench watching Love play hero ball ALL game EVERY game. This situation has far bigger implications than this year.
 
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