Well, well dook...

[morgousky]

I would caution everyone from celebrating their demise. It's still only January and we know that K is going to come back at some point. Always happy when they lose, but there's too much talent on this team for them to bow out mid season. I suspect they'll rebound once K comes back. They're biggest holes are lack of a true PG, K being out, and not being able to gel on either side of the ball.

But if it's one thing I've learned over the years, it's unwise to underestimate them. Even now when they appear to be at their worst. By the time we play them I think it'll be a different story.

I really really don't think so.

Coach K lost to Virginia Tech, and struggled with teams like Tennessee State. They were trending downward and having turmoil when he left. I think Coach K noticed the writing on the wall and bailed. I don't even think a Duke fan could, with a straight face, say if they were undefeated he'd have taken back surgery yet. It's not an emergency, and he could have done it in the offseason. He's hoping if it does go south, all will be blamed on his absence. On top of that, he just so happens to already know the NCAA will not count losses against him.

One thing about Roy, and Cal, and I'd even say Self, they would never abandon their team. I truly believe K would. He's more concerned with his legacy and image than his players and he's proved it time and time again. If he really cared about his players, Allen would be in the NBA right now.

However I agree no one should underestimate them. They've got some talent, just not as talented as most people thought. At the same time, this isn't your typical "they could return" Duke team. This isn't the normal Duke system. They are running UK 2.0......and when you depend on that system, you can't miss on the recruiting trail, and they missed. Bolden won't turn into a junior Battier, and Allen is no Christian Laettner; they don't even have a high IQ senior shooting guard to play point like Scheyer(?). It's not happening this time.

 

[Archer2]

Of course d00k has waaaaaay to much talent to just fold like a house of cards. Of course they will get better when the LOM comes back. In other news, rain is wet.

Good reading on DI, love this post:

"They should be ran, until half the team has lower leg injuries!"

 

[imajericho]

I think Duke is one 20-0 run against Miami from having lost the last 5 ganes.

 

[Archer2]

BTW, d00k sure could use Derryck Thornton right about now. Remember, the PG who transferred to USC this spring because he thought Jackson would move ahead of him in the rotation? Jackson, who ranks 6th on his team in APG at 1.6, right behind Tatum. A lack of a true PG is their biggest issue, there's little cohesiveness. Doesn't help that Tayum is auditioning for NBA scouts, or that their defense is porous. Hate it for 'em.

 

[heelbent]

Love dook lost.

Hate moo won.

Frickin' useless meteor...

Oh well, maybe the silver lining is Gottfreid lasts at least one more year.

 

[Archer2]

Some doozies fron the DD. Poor Grayson, he's the victim in all this. How surprising.

bridgeburner wrote: "You can tell G.A. spirit is broken. He's playing to perception not having fun. Yes brought most of it on his self, still sad to see. Dude is miserable out there. His spirit is broke. He had a stupid tripping incident and he listened to all the social media and talking heads."

DurhamSon wrote: " Grayson is dealing with chronic injuries. It's beyond ******* obvious, some of you guys are really ignorant if you don't understand that. He probably won't be anywhere close to healthy the rest of the season.
Yup. He looks hurt. Also find it hilarious that people are saying he's just like Tatum. This is the same dude that has put it all on the line for this program. Tatum looks like a dude trying to audition for the NBA night in night out."

"I disagree. Right now its just a real toxic environment for Allen and I can't imagine he is enjoying himself at all. Not to mention, as far as ACC refs are concerned its open season on Allen and they aren't calling ****. Who on the team has GA's back? Who would take out the next guy that tries to get away with another smack or elbow?"

"Allen is a great player in a terrible situation, and while a lot of it is his own doing, its gone disproportionately the other way."

"Yup. I agree he brought on the massive booing and jeers he gets from opposing fans. He brought that one on himself. The extreme over the top media reaction, getting screwed by the refs and half of his own fan base turning their back on him, he didn't bring any of that on himself.

The dude tripped people 3 times, he didn't beat his gf, he didn't get a DUI and hurt someone in an accident. He tripped 3 guys that weren't even moving quickly. He didn't punch dudes in the balls, he didn't under cut multiple guys going up for a dunk on a fast break, you know an actual dirty basketball move that could actually really hurt someone. He did not bring any of this reaction onto himself.

Let's be honest if he wasn't a white kid at Duke, the attention wouldn't have been nearly as big as what we have seen."

 

[DSouthr]

And in all seriousness, as for the Rat's impact, and many will scoff, but do NOT underestimate the impact of K's ref intimidation. It's the single biggest thing they don't have when the Rat is not on he sidelines.

gary, I have said so many times that K on the side lines is worth 8-10pts a game for the dukies. Yeah in part it is working the refs but the larger part of it is his players just seem willing to run thru brick walls for him. But Capel is not that advantage and right now that is a huge factor because there are real chemistry problems on that team.

Not having a true PG is a huge problem, Allen seems to believe this is his team, Tatum seems to think that he is the man, Giles is a shadow of the players he was or may one day again be, and neither Bolden nor Jackson are living up to the hype. A lot of this is their prized freshmen other than Jackson have all had injuries and just didn't get that start to the season where you get to play thru your mistakes against teams you are supposed to drill by 50. K schedules early season cup cakes for this reason, to build killer instinct in his players, to get his frosh bursting with confidence and has that carry over when the competition increases in ACC play. But that was not able to happen this season, that killer instinct is missing because it was not found when it usually is.

Now those players look over and K is not there, they see a Capel that frankly, does not know what to do and the effect is they get "happy feet" when things get tight.

The flaw in the construction of this duke team is the lack of a true PG but we have seen K over come this before by using a 2 guard (Sheyer) but he was able to get that guy to have the pass first facilitate mindset rather than feel like he was a score first type of guy. That is not happening with the tripster and it is becoming a fight between Tatum and Tripster to see who can "save" the game. Ball goes to Tatum, everyone else put your rebounding hat on because scouts are watching and I have to show off my NBA game.

What we see is this team is not doing what you see K teams usually do this time of the season, work smoothly like a well oiled machine, it is a machine with parts working against each other to the extent that the fly wheel is about to break itself totally apart. IDK if it can be fixed in time to save this season for them, pretty sure we will get their best game because that always happen when our teams meet but the hole they are in now may be so deep that even beating us is not enough. Best case at this point is they do not get the easy path in NCAA seeding, worst case and could actually happen is they could miss the dance completely.

 

[Archer2]

I can't see any way that d00k fails to make the NCAAT, they're simply waaaaaaay too talented. And Krazywhiskey will be back before long. They will right the ship. I think it will be hard for them to win the regular season because I think they would have to win 10 of 11 down the stretch in order to have a chance. I think the best UNC fans can hope for is that they get a 3 or 4 seed and face a tougher NCAAT road.

 

[acarter0277]

You know this is all setting up for Kennard and Allen to hit EVERYTHING they throw up against the Heels

 

[Tom79]

acarter, in a way I hope you are right, but if we match up tight, I want to see slower 6'5" and 6'6" guards driving on Joel, Nate, Kenny, Theo et al cause IMO our guards would see some charging fouls called...otherwise we need tight man out beyond the perimeter.

 

[Tom79]

I can't see any way that d00k fails to make the NCAAT, they're simply waaaaaaay too talented. And Krazywhiskey will be back before long. They will right the ship. I think it will be hard for them to win the regular season because I think they would have to win 10 of 11 down the stretch in order to have a chance. I think the best UNC fans can hope for is that they get a 3 or 4 seed and face a tougher NCAAT road.

Arch, not sure about the rudderless ship. There are the usual reports that things are not all they seem over in the derm dump. One coach on meds and another couple in over their heads.

 

[JakeSarna]

It's a theory many on here voiced, albeit in not-so-gentle terms.
Whilst I don't like making fun of anyone's health issues, the timing is beginning to look fishy.

Yeah and the timing was just perfect, coach kkk stayed to coach that Georgia tech game, and then left just before BC to let Capel get a win like dook was still great bit then face FSU and then Louisville. And Miami is always a team that can upset teams. But nobody thought they could ever lose to State. And now dook will face a pretty decent team in wake forest (but they should easily win that). But then they face ND and will lose. And my guess is that K will be back right before the Pittsburgh game or right after, just in time to face UNC @Cameron.

K will deff want to be back for UNC game. And he's gonna try and make himself look like the savoir of dooks season. But I would not be surprised either if k starts having recurring back pain after surgery and decides to sit out the rest of the season. I'm not so sure he wants to tarnish his coaching 'legacy' and his lack of ability to get this team with 10 five-star recruits (9 MCD-AA) to actually play good and come together as a team.

One thing shoechefski has over capel is his control over refs. I find it incredible that once the rat isn't on bench coaching, there aren't a couple dozen calls going against dooks opponents. I really hope Knox sees all this and realizes that allot of this year's players will be back next year and he should really think twice about going to such a toxic environment. The downside is, FSU might be appealing to him the most now.

 

[heelbent]

Some doozies fron the DD. Poor Grayson, he's the victim in all this. How surprising.

bridgeburner wrote: "You can tell G.A. spirit is broken. He's playing to perception not having fun. Yes brought most of it on his self, still sad to see. Dude is miserable out there. His spirit is broke. He had a stupid tripping incident and he listened to all the social media and talking heads."

DurhamSon wrote: " Grayson is dealing with chronic injuries. It's beyond ******* obvious, some of you guys are really ignorant if you don't understand that. He probably won't be anywhere close to healthy the rest of the season.
Yup. He looks hurt. Also find it hilarious that people are saying he's just like Tatum. This is the same dude that has put it all on the line for this program. Tatum looks like a dude trying to audition for the NBA night in night out."

"I disagree. Right now its just a real toxic environment for Allen and I can't imagine he is enjoying himself at all. Not to mention, as far as ACC refs are concerned its open season on Allen and they aren't calling ****. Who on the team has GA's back? Who would take out the next guy that tries to get away with another smack or elbow?"

"Allen is a great player in a terrible situation, and while a lot of it is his own doing, its gone disproportionately the other way."

"Yup. I agree he brought on the massive booing and jeers he gets from opposing fans. He brought that one on himself. The extreme over the top media reaction, getting screwed by the refs and half of his own fan base turning their back on him, he didn't bring any of that on himself.

The dude tripped people 3 times, he didn't beat his gf, he didn't get a DUI and hurt someone in an accident. He tripped 3 guys that weren't even moving quickly. He didn't punch dudes in the balls, he didn't under cut multiple guys going up for a dunk on a fast break, you know an actual dirty basketball move that could actually really hurt someone. He did not bring any of this reaction onto himself.

Let's be honest if he wasn't a white kid at Duke, the attention wouldn't have been nearly as big as what we have seen."

Grayson Allen still playing college ball is an insult to the game. The dook sycophants are the only ones that won't admit it. He's a pouty, cheating little POS that deserves a sharp elbow to the teeth.

 

[Archer2]

Don't care if some want to give him a pass on this. It is obvious the State player was simply trying to get past Allen and he reacted inappropriatelty because he was pissed. He was a jerk once again.Someone is going to knock him out and he will deserve it.

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/01/grayson-allen-tangled-nc-state-duke-bench-trip-college-basketball

 

[heelmanwilm]

The next poll could see dook gone and unc-w ranked for the first time in program history.

 

[Steat]

I doubt Duke will miss the Dance. They will make it as 5-6 seed and may win a game of two. I could go

BTW, d00k sure could use Derryck Thornton right about now. Remember, the PG who transferred to USC this spring because he thought Jackson would move ahead of him in the rotation? Jackson, who ranks 6th on his team in APG at 1.6, right behind Tatum. A lack of a true PG is their biggest issue, there's little cohesiveness. Doesn't help that Tayum is auditioning for NBA scouts, or that their defense is porous. Hate it for 'em.

Arch, your hit it on the nose about Thornton. I just hope that don't get Duval fro next season. Otherwise, they will have similar problems next year. You just absolutely have to have a good point guard. K-Rat's plan was to convince Trip to come back and it backfired. They will make the Dance and probably will be put in the same region with Gonzaga as a #1 seed.

 

[Steat]

Don't care if some want to give him a pass on this. It is obvious the State player was simply trying to get past Allen and he reacted inappropriatelty because he was pissed. He was a jerk once again.Someone is going to knock him out and he will deserve it.

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2017/01/grayson-allen-tangled-nc-state-duke-bench-trip-college-basketball

 

[Archer2]

Arch, your hit it on the nose about Thornton. I just hope that don't get Duval fro next season. Otherwise, they will have similar problems next year. You just absolutely have to have a good point guard. K-Rat's plan was to convince Trip to come back and it backfired. They will make the Dance and probably will be put in the same region with Gonzaga as a #1 seed.

Amen.

 

[gary-7]

You know this is all setting up for Kennard and Allen to hit EVERYTHING they throw up against the Heels

Sad but true. And right now that's their formula for staying in games.

 

[notashelbyfan]

I went over to their site to read last night and it total melt down over there.

 

[smooth as butter]

Not having a true point guard is hurting them. Lol

 

[Coach325]

You guys have pretty much covered it all at this point but this season has been a mess. This team makes me want to bang my head against a wall. I don't have time to list all our problems right now, but @gary-7's 4 things is very good summary.

- we have no PG so there is no flow on offense......just a bunch of one on one.
- defense is absolutely horrible
- Greyson has hurt us this year with his play & his antics.
- Tatum takes bad shots
- no team chemistry at this point
- Giles is clearly no where close to his old self
- even our good free throw shooters (Allen, Kennard, and Tatum) are missing them lately
- not having Coach K cost us last night


I could go on, but it's too depressing. I don't blame you guys for rubbing it in......this team is one of the most "talented" teams I can remember so to say this season has been a disappointment so far would be an understatement. So many story lines this year from Greyson's tripping, K's surgery, freshmen injuries, Amile's injury.........as Duke fan, it has truly been frustrating. We still have time to get things together, but honestly I'm not sure they will. I think we have good players, but just not a good team. You can blame K, Capel, the OAD's, Greyson or whatever, but for some reason this team just doesn't click.

We really need to get it together to ensure we play in the NCAA tournament. This is the gamble of the OAD philosophy. Okafor, Jones, and Winslow clicked and they won it all. This group seems to either "not get it" or not completely bought in......can't determine which.

 

[dgheel57]

I vastly overrated them being without a point guard. I thought this was going to be a thing where someone like Jon Scheyer moved positions pretty flawlessly.

I probably bought into Giles too, when in reality, he might be another 2 years away before he's completely 100% and puts all his injuries behind him.

I thought they were going to roll through the season pretty easy if they were healthy. Though I think health is a big factor in their struggles, it clearly isn't all of it. They've had a lot of distractions (many self inflicted) as well.

Right now, you can make a reasonable argument that they're not a top 25 team. They're a mess and they're in pretty much unchartered waters.

Will be interesting how their players react to this kind of atmosphere.

Pretty typical of you considering the experience we had returning.ACC is not as weak as you thought it would be eh?Looks like by now,all that paper tiger BS would sink in to some people,just because so called experts claim Dook is the best team,they still have to prove it,so far they haven't.

 

[Archer2]

From DI. Sounds like Show is not happy.

Showenuff said: ↑
"This team pulls together and beats UNC this year and all you doom and gloomers will be on here wacking your pee pees."

Concerning Grayson:

Catdance said:
"Don't want to upset anyone, but ever considered steroids? It would explain a lot, considering the rage he displays at times."

After all the shite they've posted about UNC on that site in the last few years, I have to say I'm enjoying their misery.

 

[Steat]

From DI. Sounds like Show is not happy.

Showenuff said: ↑
"This team pulls together and beats UNC this year and all you doom and gloomers will be on here wacking your pee pees."

Concerning Grayson:

Catdance said:
"Don't want to upset anyone, but ever considered steroids? It would explain a lot, considering the rage he displays at times."

After all the shite they've posted about UNC on that site in the last few years, I have to say I'm enjoying their misery.

Arch, I love you man but if possible please consider not posting their quotes on our board. Showenuff is a nutcase and has not been the same since his annual ACC Tournament gathering in his little cow pasture town was cancelled due to lack of attendance. I don't know who is worse, him or the salad man.

 

[gunslingerdick]

Count me as one that is not ready to bury duke. Like another poaster stated, K will be back. And he'll certainly be able to better than Capel. I'm not sure it will be in time to get that team to hitting their stride by NCAA tourney time, but they'll have to be reckoned with. I too am enjoying their struggles, but if the light comes on, on talent alone, they'll be a problem.

 

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

Showenuff said: ↑
"This team pulls together and beats UNC this year and all you doom and gloomers will be on here wacking your pee pees."

Ok, so DI has some guys that refuse to acknowledge a struggling team and call the rest of the people there "doom and gloomers" when they voice legit concerns about the team.

Looks like we're not that different after all.

 

[gunslingerdick]

Ok, so DI has some guys that refuse to acknowledge a struggling team and call the rest of the people there "doom and gloomers" when they voice legit concerns about the team.

Looks like we're not that different after all.

Furthermore, there are poasters over there crying about the OAD recruiting system and how they wish K would go back to focusing on more long term recruits. So we're the exact same, but different.

 

[JuleZ '02 HEEL]

Looks like we're not that different after all.

So we're the exact same, but different.

 

[BillyL]

dOOk always seemed to me to play well when Jefferson was constantly in the line-up . . might be that when his game is back to full speed, that they'll be a much better team. No doubt that they are missing Thornton . .

Way too much talent over there in Kennard, Allen and Jones to think they won't be playing better in the next few. Allen is a headcase at the moment, can that be fixed in a few games/weeks . . ?

 

[SKYBLUEWITCHEESE]

Anything is possible, but the dookie are going to have to get it together to get 10+ wins in conference.

They still go to Wake, ND, UVA, play us twice. Still have FSU at home. Pretty sure they go to Miami too.

They have to go to Wake huh? The horror.

 

[mikeirbyusa]

Allen is a headcase at the moment, can that be fixed in a few games/weeks/months/years . . ?

fify

 

[heels05champs]

Regardless of their struggles, we better freakin guard the perimeter and not help down so much on the driver or they'll light us up from 3.

 

[mikeirbyusa]

Regardless of their struggles, we better freakin guard the perimeter and not help down so much on the driver or they'll light us up from 3.

Tatum ain't passing out to NOBODY!

 

[Archer2]

Arch, I love you man but if possible please consider not posting their quotes on our board. Showenuff is a nutcase and has not been the same since his annual ACC Tournament gathering in his little cow pasture town was cancelled due to lack of attendance. I don't know who is worse, him or the salad man.

Okay, I'll bite. Who's the salad man?

Count me as one that is not ready to bury duke. Like another poaster stated, K will be back. And he'll certainly be able to better than Capel. I'm not sure it will be in time to get that team to hitting their stride by NCAA tourney time, but they'll have to be reckoned with. I too am enjoying their struggles, but if the light comes on, on talent alone, they'll be a problem.

Oh, I agree. There's still too much season left and the LOM will return before long. And they are immensely talented. So I will be surprised if they don't get their act together when he returns. As I said before, a 4-5 seed is about as much as we can realistically expect.

 

[BillyL]

Okay, I'll bite. Who's the salad man?

Skysdad = Salad boy.

 

[Steat]

Okay, I'll bite. Who's the salad man?
Oh, I agree. There's still too much season left and the LOM will return before long. And they are immensely talented. So I will be surprised if they don't get their act together when he returns. As I said before, a 4-5 seed is about as much as we can realistically expect.

Skysdad is the salad man. I'm still rolling in laughter about the post someone on their board made a few years ago.

 

[Archer2]

Skysdad = Salad boy.

Should have known.

 

[gary-7]

Tatum ain't passing out to NOBODY!

Honestly, Mikey, what struck me hardest watching that game was Tatum drove like 4 times and ended up on the floor trying to bait a foul call --- didn't get hit on any of them, mind you ---- just tying to bait a call, and doing that mess likely helped cause at least a couple of the misses. So as a result State ends up with 5-on-4 advantages while Tatum is laying on a photographer, and a couple of those were at crucial times down the stretch.

Thing is they've been pulling that offensive flop junk for years, but it's different when they don't get their usual calls. One wonders what would've happened had the Rat been there bludgeoning the zebras all night.

 

[shun1]

!!!!!!!!!!!! SMILE !!!!!!!!!!!!