Mack names 1st team QB

[WoadBlue]

I surprised none of you have beaten me to this.

It is Sam Howell, who is, the staff learned late last night, the great-grandson of the late and much lamented Thurston Howell III.

 

[tarheel0910]

I surprised none of you have beaten me to this.

It is Sam Howell, who is, the staff learned late last night, the great-grandson of the late and much lamented Thurston Howell III.

I'm interested to know if there is a clear #2. Mack's already said he's going to play multiple QBs. Howell could be supplanted if the other guy plays well and Howell plays like a true freshman normally does.

 

[uncboy10]

I just hope this has nothing to do with who recruited Howell vs who recruited the other guys.

 

[KOOL123]

Sounds like Sam has been better...Play your best players...

 

[tarheel0910]

I just hope this has nothing to do with who recruited Howell vs who recruited the other guys.

I don't think Mack would make it just about that, but it might be something he used for a tiebreaker. I've got faith in him going with the right guy for game one though. He really wants to get this program back to where it was when he left. The only way to do that is play the best players.

 

[uncboy10]

I don't think Mack would make it just about that, but it might be something he used for a tiebreaker. I've got faith in him going with the right guy for game one though. He really wants to get this program back to where it was when he left. The only way to do that is play the best players.

I wouldn't think so either, but its a common bias you see when there's a new staff. I'm sure the right guy will play his way into the starting role anyways

 

[WoadBlue]

I wouldn't think so either, but its a common bias you see when there's a new staff. I'm sure the right guy will play his way into the starting role anyways

That kind of thing has happened many times in many places. I assume that Mack is experienced enough and wise enough not to make such a mistake.

 

[WoadBlue]

I'm interested to know if there is a clear #2. Mack's already said he's going to play multiple QBs. Howell could be supplanted if the other guy plays well and Howell plays like a true freshman normally does.

It seems to me that there is a barely pickable #1, and that because all 3 show great promise.

I expect to see all 3 play this year, even if none of them gets injured.

 

[2k15]

It is very, very uncommon to thrust a freshman QB into a situation like this, especially when you have two other options who are experienced, and are reportedly playing neck and neck with your true freshman. You should always ease a freshman QB into the college game as much as possible - it doesn't matter how highly they are ranked. If there is other experienced talent that can play, you should at least start that player in Game 1, and ease your true freshman into the experience.

Look at what Clemson did with Trevor Lawrence last year. Game 1, against an FCS opponent, they started their experienced QB over Lawrence, and have Lawrence limited playing time, which increased as the season went on. By halfway through the season, Swinney decided that Lawrence had fully settled in to college, and thus decided to start him. We are talking about a heisman level talent, but even he needed to be eased into the college game, simply because it's the right thing to do. Even if your true freshman QB is the best player in practice, you don't want inexperience to cost you games early in the season.

To me, this is a little alarming for UNC. I would much rather start Cade Fortin, who has the most experience, and let him at least play a drive or two, before I decide to put in a true freshman QB, especially in a game as big as this one. What UNC is deciding to do puts all the pressure on his shoulders, and he's never even experienced what being on a college field is even like. I would be concerned that this means the other QB's are really struggling, and Mack is worried that if he starts them over Howell, USC could take advantage early over some sloppy quarterback play.

 

[2k15]

I'll also add that perhaps the reasoning for Howell starting has to do with pure talent and stamina. When you run a fast pace, air raid style offense like Phil Longo runs, it is absolutely imperative that you have a quarterback with a strong, accurate, consistent arm. You will be throwing the ball a lot downfield, and if you do that with average, relatively inconsistent quarterbacks, that's where the air raid style of offense just goes to shit.

Sam Howell maybe an inexperienced quarterback, but Mack Brown made a comment that Fortin and Ruder are simply too inconsistent with their throws, and that in itself is detrimental to the air raid offense. The arm talent and consistency is the most important attribute in a QB under this style of offense. Your success completely hinges on the QB's ability to make those big throws, not simply manage the team.

But it also is why there is now a ton of pressure on Sam Howell. As I said in my last post, it simply is just a difficult, kind of unfair position to put a true freshman QB in. Howell will definitely give it his all, but it is just a huge risk to put any true freshman QB into a starter role in game 1, where the entire success of the offense hinges on his ability to consistently make big, accurate throws. It is a ton to ask of any true freshman in that circumstance. Especially in a game as big as this one. USC is definitely in the top 5 hardest teams UNC plays this year, possibly top 3. It is a big ask to expect him to play lights out under these circumstances and command an offense.

 

[Archer2]

Relax buddy. You start the guy who gives you the best chance of winning, period. Forrtin and Ruder appeared in 5 games I believe, and threw a total of 70 passes, so it’s not like they have much more experience. If Howell can’t handle it, so be it.

But if he’s been playing the most consistently, he deserves a shot. It’s just a game.

 

[2k15]

Relax buddy. You start the guy who gives you the best chance of winning, period. Forrtin and Ruder appeared in 5 games I believe, and threw a total of 70 passes, so it’s not like they have much more experience. If Howell can’t handle it, so be it.

But if he’s been playing the most consistently, he deserves a shot. It’s just a game.

Respectfully, that's the attitude that doesn't make recruits and fans inspired about a football program. Yes, it's a game, but if you are a program who really really cares about winning and finding success, you conduct your team and make decisions like it's more than that.

Sam Howell has never seen the field in a collegiate game. And I don't mean in the sense that he's never lined up to take a snap - I mean he's never been physically present at a single game, on the sideline, in his career. He has no idea what type of stage or feeling that is like compared to the measly, low attendance high school games he's played prior to now. When someone who is used to playing on pop warner fields all of the sudden steps into an NFL stadium with thousands of people watching him, and he's expected to take the first snap and lead his team to victory against hands down the best defense he has ever lined up against in his life by a mile, there is a significantly good chance that he does not perform well. At least your other 2 QB's have been on the team for a while, and they are now used to going into big stadiums with thousands of people, and feel acclimated to that environment if they were to play. Sam Howell has no point of reference for what existing on a stage like that is even like. Even if he handles his nerves well, it is such an insurmountable hurdle to feel comfortable to the point where you can lead an offense. And not only that, you can not afford to play with hesitation or worry. As mentioned before, if you are playing by far the best, fastest, largest defense you have ever lined up against in your life, it is imperative that you are thinking clearly, making quick, good decisions, and not letting the heat of the moment affect your fundamentals or accuracy. It is so hard for a true freshman to start and do that in game 1. That's the reason you hardly ever see a true freshman QB start game 1. It just doesn't happen.

 

[TarHeelMark]

Relax buddy. You start the guy who gives you the best chance of winning, period. Forrtin and Ruder appeared in 5 games I believe, and threw a total of 70 passes, so it’s not like they have much more experience. If Howell can’t handle it, so be it.

But if he’s been playing the most consistently, he deserves a shot. It’s just a game.

Exactly. Fortin and Ruder didn't play ALL that much last year, so it's not like a true freshman is getting the start over upperclassmen.

I trust Mack. I think he knows what he's doing.

 

[blazers]

2k15, Howell is the rookie, not Mack, not Longo, nor Darrell Moody, Woods or any of the other experienced HOF and natty-level heads in that room.

Your points about easing in a rookie are sound, but this means to me that Sam Howell is looking too good not start. (Or qb injuries are actually limiting the progress of the O which is a scary alternative).

 

[Archer2]

Respectfully, that's the attitude that doesn't make recruits and fans inspired about a football program. Yes, it's a game, but if you are a program who really really cares about winning and finding success, you conduct your team and make decisions like it's more than that.
.

“As mentioned before, if you are playing by far the best, fastest, largest defense you have ever lined up against in your life, it is imperative that you are thinking clearly, making quick, good decisions, and not letting the heat of the moment affect your fundamentals or accuracy. It is so hard for a true freshman to start and do that in game 1.”



Then you should be thrilled that Howell appears to have earned the nod to start against your team. If he leads us to victory, you’ll have to eat a lot of crow.

 

[Roady]

Howell is going to be a very good QB....

More than just having experience...it is how quickly you can process what is happening on the field, find the open man, hit the pass envelope accurately.

FSU scouting liked Howell for those attributes.

 

[Raising Heel]

Worth noting that Mack hasn't named Howell the starter for the opener.

Also worth noting that the same guy who wanted to tell us all about our own team is now telling a National Champion, Hall of Fame coach how to coach.

 

[uncboy10]

There’s plenty of time for QB1 to change. Howell is being given his chance to prove that he can handle the pressure of being the man. But the competition is always ongoing.

 

[blazers]

Worth noting that Mack hasn't named Howell the starter for the opener.

Also worth noting that the same guy who wanted to tell us all about our own team is now telling a National Champion, Hall of Fame coach how to coach.

Yep, he's probably going to quote Athlon's as his src for frosh qb matters.

 

[lerario]

Reading between all the tea leaves, it sounds like health is a big factor here. Both Ruder and Fortin have been banged up some and missed reps while Howell has not. I still expect two guys to play against SCar, and depending on injuries and performance all 3 may see action through the first few games.

 

[lerario]

It is very, very uncommon to thrust a freshman QB into a situation like this, especially when you have two other options who are experienced, and are reportedly playing neck and neck with your true freshman. You should always ease a freshman QB into the college game as much as possible - it doesn't matter how highly they are ranked. If there is other experienced talent that can play, you should at least start that player in Game 1, and ease your true freshman into the experience.

Look at what Clemson did with Trevor Lawrence last year. Game 1, against an FCS opponent, they started their experienced QB over Lawrence, and have Lawrence limited playing time, which increased as the season went on. By halfway through the season, Swinney decided that Lawrence had fully settled in to college, and thus decided to start him. We are talking about a heisman level talent, but even he needed to be eased into the college game, simply because it's the right thing to do. Even if your true freshman QB is the best player in practice, you don't want inexperience to cost you games early in the season.

To me, this is a little alarming for UNC. I would much rather start Cade Fortin, who has the most experience, and let him at least play a drive or two, before I decide to put in a true freshman QB, especially in a game as big as this one. What UNC is deciding to do puts all the pressure on his shoulders, and he's never even experienced what being on a college field is even like. I would be concerned that this means the other QB's are really struggling, and Mack is worried that if he starts them over Howell, USC could take advantage early over some sloppy quarterback play.

Research has shown that length of posts on message boards is inversely correlated with intelligence.

For proof of this let’s take your comparison to Clemson last year. Kelly Bryant was a senior coming off a full year as the starter having led them to the playoff. UNC has two RS freshmen back that have combined to play less than two full games.

 

[lerario]

Respectfully, that's the attitude that doesn't make recruits and fans inspired about a football program. Yes, it's a game, but if you are a program who really really cares about winning and finding success, you conduct your team and make decisions like it's more than that.

Sam Howell has never seen the field in a collegiate game. And I don't mean in the sense that he's never lined up to take a snap - I mean he's never been physically present at a single game, on the sideline, in his career. He has no idea what type of stage or feeling that is like compared to the measly, low attendance high school games he's played prior to now. When someone who is used to playing on pop warner fields all of the sudden steps into an NFL stadium with thousands of people watching him, and he's expected to take the first snap and lead his team to victory against hands down the best defense he has ever lined up against in his life by a mile, there is a significantly good chance that he does not perform well. At least your other 2 QB's have been on the team for a while, and they are now used to going into big stadiums with thousands of people, and feel acclimated to that environment if they were to play. Sam Howell has no point of reference for what existing on a stage like that is even like. Even if he handles his nerves well, it is such an insurmountable hurdle to feel comfortable to the point where you can lead an offense. And not only that, you can not afford to play with hesitation or worry. As mentioned before, if you are playing by far the best, fastest, largest defense you have ever lined up against in your life, it is imperative that you are thinking clearly, making quick, good decisions, and not letting the heat of the moment affect your fundamentals or accuracy. It is so hard for a true freshman to start and do that in game 1. That's the reason you hardly ever see a true freshman QB start game 1. It just doesn't happen.

You are the guy that thinks his 9 yr old’s little league games are life and death and threatens to beat the 16 yr old umpires ass over his strike zone.

 

[Archer2]

Mack wants to win every game his team plays. Never doubt that. As such, everything he does is aimed toward achieving that result. So for whatever reasons, he will start the guy that he thinks will give us the best chance. He knows his players better than any UNC fan does, and certainly far better than any USC fan could.

Agreed @2k15?

 

[gteeitup]

Worth noting that Mack hasn't named Howell the starter for the opener.

Also worth noting that the same guy who wanted to tell us all about our own team is now telling a National Champion, Hall of Fame coach how to coach.

speaking of note worthy, you should see that bobo ass “u of sc” logo around town here in columbia...total garbage, and I have degrees from here...it’s embarrassing that a university still has trouble identifying itself.

 

[2k15]

“As mentioned before, if you are playing by far the best, fastest, largest defense you have ever lined up against in your life, it is imperative that you are thinking clearly, making quick, good decisions, and not letting the heat of the moment affect your fundamentals or accuracy. It is so hard for a true freshman to start and do that in game 1.”



Then you should be thrilled that Howell appears to have earned the nod to start against your team. If he leads us to victory, you’ll have to eat a lot of crow.

I've been watching a lot of Howell's tape from last season. What I see is a guy who has the arm, measurements, speed, and potential accuracy to be a future NFL quarterback. His movement on the ground is phenomenal too. What I don't see from him, however, is an ability to make quick reads or decisions, and a tendency to stare down one receiver instead of running through all of his reads. While Howell looks like he can be coached into something really special, right now, his eye discipline from his 2018 tape is horrendous. He telegraphs every throw way before he attempts it.

I know you are all going to step in and say "oh look, this guy is acting like he knows how to evaluate a QB and he knows better than Mack Brown". No, that isn't what I'm saying. I think Brown is starting Howell because he is the only player on your roster with the natural ability to make big, accurate throws that can't be taught. On top of that, he knows how to take off and run when a play breaks down on him. He is simply the only option for UNC that can make the type of throws consistently in Phil Longo's style of offense.

Worth noting that Mack hasn't named Howell the starter for the opener.

Also worth noting that the same guy who wanted to tell us all about our own team is now telling a National Champion, Hall of Fame coach how to coach.

I don't think Brown is wrong for naming Howell the 1st string QB, it makes sense completely. I am just trying to communicate that while Howell is really naturally talented- the only QB on your roster with true NFL arm talent, he still needs a lot of coaching and a lot more experience to elevate his decision making, mental quickness, and eye discipline, especially on the college level.

 

[2k15]

Also, I don't mean this in a smack talk way - but if Sam Howell is phenomenal in game 1 and leads your team to a victory over USC, the amount of crow I will be eating is infinite. I cannot imagine a world where Howell elevates his decision making and eye discipline so much from last year, that he is able to be really successful against a college level defense in game 1. After watching his tape, he is a great QB in the making, but he is way too young, inexperienced, and not coached enough for me to imagine him having a great performance in game 1. I can see moderate at best. Great, no.

 

[BarbqBill]

I surprised none of you have beaten me to this.

It is Sam Howell, who is, the staff learned late last night, the great-grandson of the late and much lamented Thurston Howell III.

Certainly have to go with Mack's decision. He watches all the guys every day and we don't. Sam must haver a boatload of skills to be placed in this situation. Hope he really shines.

 

[ticket2ride04]

I've been watching a lot of Howell's tape from last season. What I see is a guy who has the arm, measurements, speed, and potential accuracy to be a future NFL quarterback. His movement on the ground is phenomenal too. What I don't see from him, however, is an ability to make quick reads or decisions, and a tendency to stare down one receiver instead of running through all of his reads. While Howell looks like he can be coached into something really special, right now, his eye discipline from his 2018 tape is horrendous. He telegraphs every throw way before he attempts it.

I know you are all going to step in and say "oh look, this guy is acting like he knows how to evaluate a QB and he knows better than Mack Brown". No, that isn't what I'm saying. I think Brown is starting Howell because he is the only player on your roster with the natural ability to make big, accurate throws that can't be taught. On top of that, he knows how to take off and run when a play breaks down on him. He is simply the only option for UNC that can make the type of throws consistently in Phil Longo's style of offense.



I don't think Brown is wrong for naming Howell the 1st string QB, it makes sense completely. I am just trying to communicate that while Howell is really naturally talented- the only QB on your roster with true NFL arm talent, he still needs a lot of coaching and a lot more experience to elevate his decision making, mental quickness, and eye discipline, especially on the college level.

You gleaned this all from HS YouTube videos?

 

[2k15]

You gleaned this all from HS YouTube videos?

It's not my fault you don't understand how to watch tape. Tape always tells the facts and tendencies about any given player.

 

[ticket2ride04]

It's not my fault you don't understand how to watch tape. Tape always tells the facts and tendencies about any given player.

You have access to his All-22 tape? Surely such an astute scout as yourself wouldn’t try to glean anything from High School mixtapes.

 

[lerario]

It's not my fault you don't understand how to watch tape. Tape always tells the facts and tendencies about any given player.

Pro Tip: neither do you.

 

[2k15]

You have access to his All-22 tape? Surely such an astute scout as yourself wouldn’t try to glean anything from High School mixtapes.

What's wrong with watching high school tape from a few months ago? It's the same player making the same mistakes.

Pro Tip: neither do you.

Yes I do. I grew up in a family of QB's and know how to watch film on QB's. Plus, it's not that hard to see how bad Howell's eye discipline is. It's bad on every play. He can't help but stare down wide receivers. He is not good at reading defenses.

 

[KOOL123]

I thought Carolina was playing South Carolina...Did they drop the game and we are now playing USC...

 

[2k15]

I thought Carolina was playing South Carolina...Did they drop the game and we are now playing USC...

BAZINGA! Did you come up with that one yourself?

 

[TarHeelMark]

Heels need to go ahead and forfeit the game to save themselves the absolute embarrassment. They obviously have no chance in hell at beating this mighty collection of nfl all pros.

 

[ticket2ride04]

What's wrong with watching high school tape from a few months ago? It's the same player making the same mistakes.



Yes I do. I grew up in a family of QB's and know how to watch film on QB's. Plus, it's not that hard to see how bad Howell's eye discipline is. It's bad on every play. He can't help but stare down wide receivers. He is not good at reading defenses.

This guy loves his Hut Hut

 

[Raising Heel]

This guy loves his Hut Hut

 

[Archer2]

What's wrong with watching high school tape from a few months ago? It's the same player making the same mistakes.



Yes I do. I grew up in a family of QB's and know how to watch film on QB's. Plus, it's not that hard to see how bad Howell's eye discipline is. It's bad on every play. He can't help but stare down wide receivers. He is not good at reading defenses.

We get your position. Starting a true freshman is a recipe for disaster, especially against a very good defense like yours. You also believe Howell’s eye discipline is bad, he stares down his receivers vs going through his progressions. Thus, he has little chance of leading us to a victory.

WE GET IT!

What do you expect us to say?

 

[Raising Heel]

What do you expect us to say?

North Carolina: Nothing good about them. Everything is hopeless. Can barely tie their own cleats.

South Carolina: Nothing bad about them. Man-gods among mortals. Rejoice in their existence.

 

[tarheel0910]

Heels need to go ahead and forfeit the game to save themselves the absolute embarrassment. They obviously have no chance in hell at beating this mighty collection of nfl all pros.

FEAR THE CHICKENS!!