Sitting during National Anthem on 911
- Thread starter Louigi
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All anyone needs to understand is love and God but most don't and just rely on memorizing bible verses without actually comprehending what loving one another means.
That is a great example of what "American" has come to mean- "DO what I want or I'll fvck you up!"
I believe that a fundamental problem, or lack of progress from all of the discussions, protests, etc. is that "the issue they are sitting down for" or protesting for / against, is not clearly defined at all, and the action they seek for justice / reconciliation is not stated or defined either. So how would we know what issue specifically needs addressed, and how will we know it is addressed? (so CK can stand back up - whew!)
There absolutely is racism (by blacks and whites) in the US. It absolutely is worse - racism against blacks vs. racism against whites. I absolutely DON'T condone or trivialize racism against any group, ever. I am not sure racism has gotten worse, though, in the last few months or years. If race relations have become worse recently, I believe the evidence exists (via several comments and actions) to park a share of the responsibility for that occurrence at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.
Back on point - are CK and his copycats protesting police brutality? Are they against cops in general? Do they believe there is systemic racism rampant in American police forces? If that is their issue, then CK should man up and say it clearly, and also state what actions he wants to occur, to achieve what he defines as justice.
The little that CK did say on the issue was quite vague and incoherent, and fact-free. By fact-free, I mean:
the people CK lamented "getting set free with pay" were tried in a multi-racial court of their peers, and were found not guilty
factual, non-biased, non-politicized studies (many years and 10's of thousands of cases) show.....
.....on average, persons of color commit a higher percentage of violent crimes (armed robbery, gun / knife violence, rape), than whites......
but, whites are more likely to be shot than blacks, per crime committed by these two groups.
In other words, this broad systemic racism / bias just doesn't exist in American police forces. I can send a link to factual studies on this issue if wanted. Google Heather McDonald - War on Cops.
Moreover, a black person is something like 10-20X more likely to be killed by another black civilian, than by any police officer (black or white). Look at cities like Chicago, Baltimore where there are several black-on-black homicides every week.
Shouldn't CK be kneeling or protesting for more justice and peace and personal responsibility, community, family, and fighting against gangs, in these cities instead? That troubling, growing, out of control issue is clearly a much larger issue than the police brutality instances.
I sort of look at it the other way. If the issue really means that much to you, and isn't a publicity stunt... then why would you let a mere broken leg deter you from your beliefs?
Sooo, he should welcome and be glad when his teammate breaks his leg for not standing for something he feels is not acting as it should toward issues he feels are important? I guess civil disobedience isn't acceptable. You'd prefer violence.
I'd like some clarification as to what exactly they are upset about. But, someone publicly threatening to break a person's leg for not going along with some nationalistic ritual seems pretty simplistic to me. If that attitude is what's considered "American", count me out.
Exactly. as I posted above, I believe a lot of people have been confusing, mixing, etc. what it is they are protesting or standing for or against. I'm pretty sure nobody is protesting the US military, or the flag, or the concept of America, but then CK should man up and name exactly who / what he is protesting. Cops? white cops? (the fallacy of) rampant systemic police racism and brutality by white cops against blacks
I never said be glad about it. Just if you feel that strongly about something, a broken leg shouldn't be enough to deter you. Civil disobedience is definitely preferable to violence.
Imaginary genders? Sounds like you're far from up to speed.
I never said anything was a "no-no." You can pray anywhere you want, anytime you want as far as I'm concerned. But as a society, we will be far better off once we progress to the point where people are openly laughed at for praying. Watching people take pride in their delusion is almost always good for a laugh.
I actually somewhat agree with this. I think "Tebowing" and thanking God in post game conferences, and things of that nature are stupid (even though I do believe in a higher power).
As for the imaginary genders - I think I'll be Feboy today. It's when I think I'm a female from 7AM-1PM, Male from 1PM-6PM, and then a unique combination of the two from 6PM onwards. Please don't expect me to be the same tomorrow though, that'd be a microagression on your part.
I'll bite. So if the individual in your ridiculous straw man hypothetical wants to pee in the ladies room between 7am and 1pm what exactly is the harm in that?
Not everyone is terrified of things that are different than them. But obviously you spend a lot more time thinking about dudes in fishnets than I do.
I deleted my poast because I thought better of having any discourse with your dumb ass. But since you beat me to it...
I'm not at all "terrified" of oddballs. It's just funny what you view as "acceptable" and "unacceptable". Or more appropriately, what you view as something to heckle versus something that should be protected from heckling. having faith in a religion that helps guide you through life and gives people hope is something to make fun of. But a dude that likes dressing up in women's clothes and claims that he's a woman even though he's biologically a man is something we all should steer clear from making fun of? Weird.
#liberallogic
I don't have a problem with it at all. Just pointing out how ridiculous some of the newly minted classifications can be.
But since we've sidetracked this thread...
I thought the bill stated that if you have had the sexual reassignment surgery, then you are "legally" the new gender. Is that not the case? Buck and Sarina appear to have had that done.
**disclaimer - I don't think Buck and Sarina are real people.
But since we've sidetracked this thread...
Yes - these are the examples that show that the law, as currently written, is stupid. I don't believe it was ever the intention of anyone to force these people into the bathrooms that are opposite of how they appear. Maybe I'm wrong, in which case, the people who think that are morons.
I believe it was more the intention to prevent people who didn't fall into this category, from just being able to waltz into whichever bathroom they chose - which is the policy that was recommended by the current administration.
ETA: If the caveat to the law that GSD mentioned above is true - then f*ck everyone who uses these people as posterboys (posterpeople? poster-its?..... Post-Its?). If true, they're using people who it doesn't apply to in order to further confuse the whole issue - which is the problem with these types of issues.
I responded. I said that I didn't think the Iraqi's cared much about the Stars and Bars. I doubt many of them have even heard of the Confederacy.
Laughed at for praying? Why? Are you laughed at for not praying? I don't think I understand this but why not the day when everyone can do their own thing, follow their own beliefs or non-beliefs and no one bats an eye nor do they mind what anyone else is doing? When we think others HAVE to believe as we do that's when problems arise. I personally think people who take selfies have screws loose but I'd never take that right away from them or thier belief that taking them is a good thing.
Yes. Why should I be laughed at for not talking to my imaginary friend? Dont put faith on the same level as logic, it never works out. Of course people who take selfies are dumb. Which is why you should make fun of them. That's how we phase the stupidity out...
I never said anyone should be prevented from praying. But yeah we're better off making fun of it so we can make the social progress necessary to weed out this nonsense.
I never said you should steer clear of making fun of them. In fact I responded with a gay joke in case you didn't catch that. Making fun of someone on an internet forum and actually infringing upon someone's basic human rights are two completely different things.
I'm well aware of the fact that religion is just wish thinking. Believing that a bronze age myth about a hippie rabbi getting nailed to a tree will grant you eternal life is a delusion that borders on schizotypal. Saying that delusion gives you hope or it guides you through life doesn't change anything at all. I could say that my belief that Elvis is still alive gives my life purpose, and direction. I'd still sound like an idiot for believing that Elvis is alive
I guess all the victims of 9/11 were just "collateral damage" in the Islamic war against the west...
You really are a tribalistic little bugger aren't ya?
Okay then..... I'm laughing at you now. Is that better? LOL. I'm not sure making fun of anything will phase it out but we both can discuss this later when our souls have evolved to the next phase of their existence
Okay then..... I'm laughing at you now. Is that better? LOL. I'm not sure making fun of anything will phase it out but we both can discuss this later when our souls have evolved to the next phase of their existence
Lol somebody should lay off the LSD
Reading your post is always goof for a laugh if it was not so sick and demented,
You can't prove there isn't a God any better than anyone can prove that there is one...
Logic fail. You can't disprove the existence of a magical teapot orbiting Jupiter at just the right angle so that we can't see it. Doesn't mean there's any reason to believe that there is one. The burden to prove the existence of god is on you. You cannot prove any negative. By your logic it would be reasonable to believe in literally anything.
True. But there's no reason to believe in a magical teapot orbiting Jupiter. The question to you would be how did the first pieces of the universe get there, to produce the Big Bang? I'm not trying to prove anything to you one way or the other, because as I said it can't be done, but just want to see your explanation that will likely involve some form of "magic" that can't be reproduced/proven.
What about anything I've posted here would even remotely imply that I believe in any form of magic? I thought I was perfectly clear about the fact that I'm a secular materialist.
First of all, my theories about the origins of the universe are irrelevant. From a scientific standpoint its impossible for us to do anything more than theorize right now. Which is another reason why its completely ridiculous when someone comes along claiming that a bronze age book had the whole thing figured out. I can tell you for sure who didn't know a damn thing about the metaphysical nature of the universe, the people responsible for writing the bible. In Revelations it says that the stars will fall out of the sky and land on Earth. You couldn't possibly write such a thing unless you were completely ignorant of astrophysics.
You ask for my explanation as if me not providing an answer to a question that cannot be answered is evidence for your argument. In reality the fact that we have no idea means that we should probably disregard the guy who claims to know the answer. At least until there's some actual evidence.
There is no possibly way for us to even understand what could have happened prior to singularity (the moment where the entire universe and all of its energy was condensed to smaller than an atom). The laws of nature that govern the universe we exist in didn't even apply. My guess would be that our understanding of time and space is flawed. Instead of being linear, its actually circular. So the universe explodes (big bang) then expands until it collapses back upon itself and condenses all the way back to singularity. Then repeat. Infinitely.
It doesn't matter what the physical model for the universe is. Any of them work without a god.
Yes this is what I was getting at. Which is why I find it hard to discount any possibilities.
Your guess of a circular time continuum is interesting, and I appreciate the response as it drove me to look into the theory, but it's equally impossible to prove.
Again, by that logic its pretty much equally reasonable to discount the magic teapot. Saying that you can't discount any possibility isn't a good reason to believe in any particular one of them. But you also can reasonably infer than any possibility that has been presented to us as a fact, was done so with insufficient evidence.
Yeah, I don't think any of them are real people, at least not 'real' in how it is portrayed. I don't think the body building person is real in any way whatsoever. That just looks like bad photoshop.
There are really no facts that are pertinent enough to matter when it comes to faith in a higher power. I mean, it is a belief system. It is based on faith. If it wasn't, then everyone would believe in it.
I happen to believe in it for personal reasons and things I've seen and experienced. However, there is no way I would ever try and argue it is anything other than a faith based system. I also enjoy the discussion about alternatives. Heck, I used to subscribe to 'Discovery' magazine and may have been the only subscriber that came close to believing in God.
Anyway, my question for those who don't believe in a higher power is pretty simple (and one I discuss with my various atheist friends from time to time). Why do you care about God so much? For people who don't believe in a higher power, they seem to be obsessed with that higher power they don't believe in. I never have been able to make sense of it.
Here's a better answer to that question than I could ever hope to give. About :30 in some guy asks Hitch basically the exact same question.
See, I can empathize with his comments there. He's talking about RELIGION being a poison. I can actually agree with that in a sense. Organized religion is always an exclusive club institution. It forces and insists that an understanding of anything greater than ourselves MUST take place through THEIR filter. To me, that is a horrible trick to play on people. Even if it might be slightly well-intentioned, it's not serving our best interests as a species. I believe the ancient religions have served their purpose and are slowly dying-out.
Now, that does not mean, or even imply, that I am not certain that there is more for me to understand and know about my existence, and all of our existence. And, that "more to understand" is what I refer to as GOD. I fervently pray, meditate, focus inward to find my way outward, and do many of the things that religious people might do on a personal level to "commune with God."
Even the term "God" evokes a religious context almost instantly. And, that will make people who reject religions bristle and then a disconnect occurs between those who need the religion and those who don't. Organized religions are institutions that are self-perpetuating and have self-preservation mechanisms in-place to make sure they survive. The religions have almost become a BARRIER between the people in the religion and God. In some ways, I can even see religions as being the Satan-incarnate that they fear and claim to offer refuge from. The religions (especially Christianity) created this "Devil" entity in order to control people and to get people to follow them. They are human inventions. But, GOD itself is still very real. God is EVERYTHING that ever was and is and ever will be. In some ways, religions do tap-in to certain aspects that can help us to decipher and understand "that from which we came." but, I also believe that religions are now becoming very obsolete. I truly believe that everyone believes in God. It's not a matter of "if" they believe, it is a matter of "HOW" they believe. For people like atheists, they don't believe in this monotheistic Superhuman Parental Figure that floats in the clouds. And, a great many people in religions are, directly and indirectly, following this kind of God-image. It's a residual effect of a time that wasn't too long ago, actually. Look at how God is depicted on the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel. That was how God was understood and perceived. That was only 500 years ago! And, not until probably 200 years ago, was that image ever challenged or questioned much by people in any civilized society.
God is all of us, and everything. We are life and life goes on and on. Some people need the religion to make sense of it. Some people don't. No one is right or wrong about it, just different. The contrasts are also part of God's "creation!" There is perfection in EVERYTHING, if you look hard enough.
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You'll see. Our souls are not our brains. I don't believe in a burning hell but I believe we have souls that will always exist.Lol somebody should lay off the LSD
