Who would you start against Clemson
- Thread starter Goheels83
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Puff should start in place of Nance. All starters should get more rest especially in the 2nd half, and especially considering we need max effort on defense to get everything else rolling.
I would bet it will be the same 5 as the last game
I'd start RJ, Caleb, Leaky, Nance, and Bacot.
Who cares who starts? The better adjustments will be how/when we use our bench and what rotations are working in that particular game.
Who cares who starts? The better adjustments will be how/when we use our bench and what rotations are working in that particular game.
The starters maybe? If the exact same lineup starts, I don't expect any of the adjustments you mentioned.
I just poasted something around this on OOTB...HD's inability to make in game adjustments is maddening. So I do agree with you, but at the same time, I'm not rolling out Trimble, Dunn, Puff, Nickel, and Jalen and expecting to beat anyone.
This is mine too, but I agree with @dadika13 that who starts is not nearly as important as the in game adjustments and who finishes the game.
Why did it take the end of a 20 point game to see the offense for defense substitution that Dean was famous for utilizing?
Why couldn't Leaky and Trimble be used in this manner with Nickel and Davis/Love all season?
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I'm not really expecting to beat anyone regardless of lineup.
It doesn't matter. We're playing at home, where we only lose to Pittsburgh.
Meanwhile Clemson is slipping - losing to BC on the road and Miami at home.
This should be a cake walk.
I'm just glad we aren't playing down there.
OTOH, I haven't seen any evidence that Hubert knows how to whip our guys up after several disappointing losses.
It used to be that any time we lost, I felt sorry for whoever we faced next. Not so much any more.
Meanwhile Clemson is slipping - losing to BC on the road and Miami at home.
This should be a cake walk.
I'm just glad we aren't playing down there.
OTOH, I haven't seen any evidence that Hubert knows how to whip our guys up after several disappointing losses.
It used to be that any time we lost, I felt sorry for whoever we faced next. Not so much any more.
I like this lineup too especially with Nickel who does not think about shooting because he always looks to shoot when he gets the 🏀 in his hands.
The normal five will start because Coach Davis like Coach Smith, Coach Gut and Coach Williams believes in the fact that upperclassmen have paid their dues and deserve to start and play big minutes. There have of course been exceptions to that philosophy but for 60 years it has pretty much prevailed….
I haven't watched much of Clemson but my sense is that they are aggressive, quick and relentless on D. Exactly the kind of team that has gotten us flustered from time to time.
And that's usually a reasonable approach.
Probably still is, but I wouldn't mind seeing a bit of experimentation.
This is the lineup I have been wanting to see. I think there is some real potential here, I just wish this lineup had been given 5-10 mpg together since November.
Trimble pg Bacot (5) Washington (4) Nickel (3) Puff (2) .. let the prima donna nil's sit a spell and watch their stock go down .. but I'll bet hubcap tries the sos again .. imho this $hit show is and has pretty much always been a lack of team control coaching thing.
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We need major help. I’d go with Ford, Jordan, Kupchak, Hansbrough, and Worthy. I have others in mind coming off the bench, but we need major help.
Were there any teams that had the lack of hustle or chemistry problems these guys have? My guess is there were a few and those are the exceptions where the changes were made that you're talking about. That's probably the lesson Hubert should follow. Let them play unless they don't do what they should.
Well that’s bull crap then. He sure as heck doesn’t do anything else they did. Just
saying
I’m pulling for Hubert for sure. I just wish he would get back to some of his basketball roots. Great man, that I believe just needs some help on his bench.
I'm not suggesting that we go to a platoon system, but I'd like to see these guys come in as a unit
Seth
D'Marco
Dontrez
T-Nick
Jalen
Let them practice as a unit and learn plays for themselve as a unit.
Washington should start next year and several others on that list could (or may need to). And if they aren't good enough, we should find out now, so we can dive into the portal with specific aims.
Note: I didn't include Puff in that group because I think he should be getting good minutes with the regular unit. But he could be in this squad instead of Styles. Styles and McKoy seem the odd men out of this roster.
After the meeting they had after that unacceptable performance against Wake, I would start the starting 5 if they showed up and put out maximum effort in practice. During the game, I would then have a much quicker hook and pull out everyone who isn't playing high level team ball! For example, the second Nance misses a block out or Caleb drifts on O/D or RJ allows a straight line drive, they would sit next to me. If the replacement comes in and looks lost, I'd go deeper on the bench. Then the starter returns when his eyes look like a warrior again or the replacement loses focus!
More that I'm getting used to not winning.
I used to take losing pretty hard. Now it just seems normal.
Still seems strange to see NC State and Miami in the top 25 while we (and Duke) aren't.
Lunardi (updated this morning) has us among the play-in teams ("Last Four In"). My 43 game scenario is alive and well.
If Bacot stays healthy, Nance should not start another game this season, his PT should be exclusively to back up Bacot because that is what he is, a back up center. I don't care if we start Puff, Nickel, or Washington at the 4 (staring Leaky at the 4 would not draw his defending 4 out of the paint like I think could the other 3).
Me, I would start Puff at the 4 and Nickel at the 3 but not for the reason many may think. I want to start out the game with a good offensive group, I want to get points on the board early and I believe we can do that if we have scoring threats from all 5 positions on the floor. In our current starters the truth is we really only have 3 considered scorers that defenses have to really focus in on to stop, they tend to give Leaky and nance shot looks from the outside. So I want initial offensive end punch but I also want to see what player on the other team has the hot hand from the 3 or 4 spot, that is the guy I want Leaky to come in and shut down. I also want to see if RJ or Caleb are struggling to slow down their defensive assignment and I am going to go with either Dunn or Tremble to stop that guy. No matter if Seth comes in to replace Caleb, I want the ball in his hands on the offensive end. Why, because with the ball in his he forces the defense to commit to guarding him, off the ball the defense can dare him to shoot, on the ball they can't. I want Washington as the primary back up at the 4 because I think he can hit the mid range turnaround consistently and gives us nice length paired with either Nance or Bacot.
Me, I would start Puff at the 4 and Nickel at the 3 but not for the reason many may think. I want to start out the game with a good offensive group, I want to get points on the board early and I believe we can do that if we have scoring threats from all 5 positions on the floor. In our current starters the truth is we really only have 3 considered scorers that defenses have to really focus in on to stop, they tend to give Leaky and nance shot looks from the outside. So I want initial offensive end punch but I also want to see what player on the other team has the hot hand from the 3 or 4 spot, that is the guy I want Leaky to come in and shut down. I also want to see if RJ or Caleb are struggling to slow down their defensive assignment and I am going to go with either Dunn or Tremble to stop that guy. No matter if Seth comes in to replace Caleb, I want the ball in his hands on the offensive end. Why, because with the ball in his he forces the defense to commit to guarding him, off the ball the defense can dare him to shoot, on the ball they can't. I want Washington as the primary back up at the 4 because I think he can hit the mid range turnaround consistently and gives us nice length paired with either Nance or Bacot.
Our record over the last 4 years (2 each of Roy and Hubert) is 76-49 for 60.8%
Not even close to what we are used to.
Right about now, my starters would be those guys who play the hardest, all the time, and those guys who do what the coaches tell them. But which guys are those?
I'd rather lose with guys who are working their tails off and doing what the coaches feel is best than guys to take plays off and do whatever they want.
If I can't have the satisfaction of good wins, at least give me smart, hard fought games.
Not even close to what we are used to.
Right about now, my starters would be those guys who play the hardest, all the time, and those guys who do what the coaches tell them. But which guys are those?
I'd rather lose with guys who are working their tails off and doing what the coaches feel is best than guys to take plays off and do whatever they want.
If I can't have the satisfaction of good wins, at least give me smart, hard fought games.
I'm just not convinced of that. I think he's being badly used by our coaching staff.
That said, if they won't use him more effectively, then maybe you're right and someone else should get those minutes. But, let's face it, his replacements haven't exactly distinguished themselves either.
You replace him with Puff against Clemson? Why do you think Puff would succeed? I love his energy, but he's scoring 5 points less than Pete on a 100-possession basis. T-Nick might be better.
You want scoring? How about starting the guys with the top TS%?
59.1 - Armando
58.1 - D'Marco
58.0 - T-Nick
56.4 - Pete
55.3 - RJ
First guys off the bench
54.2 - Puff
52.6 - Jalen
51.2 - Seth
Hmm. That actually looks pretty good to me. You can always bring in Leaky (50.8) if you need defensive stops. And if we're struggling at the end of the game, give Caleb (48.6) a shot, since that's when he sometimes shines.
Seriously, how does a guy with TS% = 48.6 get to be a starter playing nearly every minute when we have 9 scholarship players with higher TS% ratings? I mean if he's a defensive ace and the rest of the team can score, that makes sense. That's the reason why Leaky starts. But Caleb is not a defensive ace. Some thought he would be when he came here, but it never happened.
59.1 - Armando
58.1 - D'Marco
58.0 - T-Nick
56.4 - Pete
55.3 - RJ
First guys off the bench
54.2 - Puff
52.6 - Jalen
51.2 - Seth
Hmm. That actually looks pretty good to me. You can always bring in Leaky (50.8) if you need defensive stops. And if we're struggling at the end of the game, give Caleb (48.6) a shot, since that's when he sometimes shines.
Seriously, how does a guy with TS% = 48.6 get to be a starter playing nearly every minute when we have 9 scholarship players with higher TS% ratings? I mean if he's a defensive ace and the rest of the team can score, that makes sense. That's the reason why Leaky starts. But Caleb is not a defensive ace. Some thought he would be when he came here, but it never happened.
I am on board with all of this.
I like pairing Davis with Trimble at times and Love with Dunn.
I like Nance and Washington playing together as a tandem when Bacot sits, unless the opposition has a really bad matchup at the 4 spot.
Dont see any change in the cards. When you run such rudimentary offensive sets the best chance for success lies in the most talented offensive players. Our opponents are feasting on the lack of sophistication on both sides of the ball. Carolina does not have NBA starters. Its a novel idea to mirror basic pro sets but Hubert is proving after 2 years of his instruction/training with talented, experienced players, it is not as simple as thinking it. The necessary training/teaching has not been installed. The more immediate problem Hubert has to address is what now that he convinced the guards not to hunt their shots in the first half vs WF and go inside to Bacot. The result was getting run out of the gym in the first 20 minutes. Bacot is the answer but can Hubert get it orchestrated now that this coach guided plan fell flat on its face at WF. I can see why the locker was shut for 45 minutes post game.
Dont think any Carolina fans really want to see a team of Trimble, Dunn, Nickel, Puff, and Washington attempting to execute Huberts offensive teachings. The talented, experienced group is punishment enough.
Dont think any Carolina fans really want to see a team of Trimble, Dunn, Nickel, Puff, and Washington attempting to execute Huberts offensive teachings. The talented, experienced group is punishment enough.
Dsouthr I like the way you think because I think putting five offensive minded players to start a game make opponents change their defensive philosophy because now instead of just worrying about Davis, Bacot and Love there are five players who are willing to shoot the ball 🏀 and not think twice about putting it up.
But as I mentioned before I do not think Coach Davis will consider starting under classmen over seniors in their Covid year of eligibility. Also no way will Trimble or Dunn will ever start over Love. Trimble refuses to shoot even when wide open and Dunn like Kerwin Walton last season will never drive and will Only SHOOT when wide open.
You're exactly right L&M, the starters are punishment enough. Speaking just for me I'd rather see a less experienced team that busted their ass with effort lose than an under performing group that just half ass's around thinking some other team owes them something. I appreciate EFFORT just as much, if not more than raw talent. And tbh the current starters don't really have that much talent. jmo
My answer would be, someone has to create especially deep in the clock. Mando shoots contested, but needs the rock late to do so. RJ's TS% falls off a cliff if he is that guy. The others even more.
Caleb needs to be better, but he is the get one up guy, and that matters fir TS%.
May be Love is the problem .. what's his shooting % and what's his defensive rating. He's a black hole that has not played much team ball this season.
Love has not been good, takes bad shots when not needed, agreed. TS% is relative to shots asked to take though.
RJ in the Baylor near collapse is an example. He came out a house on fire, huge, great TS. After Caleb fouled out and Manek lost his cool, RJ was the guy left to get one up late. His TS suffered greatly for that game in that role, but he was key for us holding on doing it though.
The TS% for those seldom asked to create guys, is not a good stat to guage out of that role in my opinion.
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And when he has sat, Virginia and Wake, the opponent went on big runs. We lack creators. We also lack a pure point to distribute to the non creators who can score when fed in optimal shot look situations.
THIS is the key comment. If there was NIL in 1998, Ed Cota shoukd have gotten residuals for some of the dimes he left for Jamison. Cota would drop it right in his wheelhouse countless times, as well as make Mahktar look offensively presentable.
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