Except for the past 18 months we are losing every recruitment we've been in for the 5-stars that fit the Felton, May, McCants, Hansbrough, Lawson, Ellington, Berry, Jackson, Hicks, Bacot mold.
2025 recruiting....
- Thread starter Ozheelfan
- Start date
Every one of these players: May, Felton, McCants, Hansbrough, Lawson, Ellington, Berry, Jackson, Hicks, Meeks, Bacot, RJ would command bidding wars if they were high school seniors today.
Carolina can get in the game or get left behind. It’s their choice.
Carolina can get in the game or get left behind. It’s their choice.
May, Felton, McCants, Lawson, Ellington, Hansbrough, and Jackson were all ranked in the top 10 of their respective classes. They would be receiving massive NIL offers in the current era. They absolutely could have been one-and-done if they wanted to.
These attempts to rewrite history to make excuses for the current recruiting struggles are just sad.
Pretty much every jersey hanging in the Dean Dome rafters is a high ranked recruit who would be subject to a bidding war if they were a current high school senior.
These attempts to rewrite history to make excuses for the current recruiting struggles are just sad.
Pretty much every jersey hanging in the Dean Dome rafters is a high ranked recruit who would be subject to a bidding war if they were a current high school senior.
People who haven’t taken a second mortgage out on their house to give to UNC for NIL aren’t doing enough. Don’t expect others to pony up all that money. You do it if it’s so important to you.
It’s clearly not my money and I’ve said that before. They can do as they see fit, but we need to learn to live with sub par classes if the program isn’t going to ramp up NIL efforts. We’re just trying to discuss the reality of today’s culture and unfortunately this is reality. You might want to seriously consider unfollowing college basketball if this climate offends you.
I bought a couple NIL boxes. That should get me a Paxton Wojick for a few games...🤪
Winning a Natty in basketball will not be about how much you can pay a OAD, it will be about what you can pay to retain your player another year, and what you will pay an experienced transfer.
Someone mentioned the Hans, Felton, McCants we had. Besides Hans non of these guys as "freshmen" where worth big money!
With current transfer rules. Felton, McCants, and that crew would have transferred after freshmen year (They all wanted out if you recall).
Someone mentioned the Hans, Felton, McCants we had. Besides Hans non of these guys as "freshmen" where worth big money!
With current transfer rules. Felton, McCants, and that crew would have transferred after freshmen year (They all wanted out if you recall).
Good points. And I think you’re on to something here… I don’t believe in big money for freshmen but I’d be more comfortable with UNC forking out for established players, either as returning or transferring in.
Now we are getting somewhere! I would never trade flash for substance! I couldn't care one whit less about how many stars a player has...I am way more concerned with his embracing our Family culture; being willing to work toward development; and becoming a true unit that is greater than the sum of its parts! The formula for winning isn't really that hard to figure out IMO!
Thank God UNC and especially Hubs have already got it down! UNC will never bow to pressure and compromise the Carolina Way! (and as long as this is true, I will be one of their staunchest fans!)
Thank God UNC and especially Hubs have already got it down! UNC will never bow to pressure and compromise the Carolina Way! (and as long as this is true, I will be one of their staunchest fans!)
Hey 57 I like it, and what would be wrong with contracts with conditions. Heck yeah we’ll give you 5 mil but you’d better deliver such and such. If it’s all about winning and paying them to do it, then schools should hold kids accountable too. Or just make it flat out performance based.
Want to make 8mil? Win your college a chip. Oh you got put out in the first round? Here’s a scholarship and free shoes. lol PUT THIS CRAP SHOW IN THIER LAPS.
I believe athletes should make money on NIL, but I prefer winning games rather than saying we got this guy to come one year.
I think it's really hard to compare apples to apples with this.
Today, is it realistic that you can get Ed Davis and Tyler Zeller like talents to be ok with coming off the bench as freshmen? I'm not all that sure. Even the rookies that were 5* and didn't play like Isiah Hicks... I'm not sure if that's all that relatable today. Maybe playing for UNC still means that much, but I have my doubts.
The other thing that needs to be considered is the NBA rookie wage scale. In 2006, the #1 overall pick was making less than $4M/year on their rookie deal. The last pick in the 1st round was making less than $800K/year on their rookie deal.
The 2004-25 rookie NBA wage scale has the #1 pick making $11M/year and the last pick in the 1st round is making just over $2M/year. And yes, that far exceeds inflation and far exceeds the purchasing power if you convert 2006 money to 2024. There is much more value in NBA contracts today and that obviously becomes even more significant if the NBA players are able to get second longterm contracts.
It's really hard to compare Roy's days to today.
For Hubert, it will come down to a few pretty easy things. If he's a good evaluator of talent and a good developer of talent, then he will have more margin for error for the type of player he can bring in. He can be more stubborn for lack of a better word. If he isn't, then he will need to pay for more talented players.
This sounds great on a motivational pamphlet and is probably true to a degree. But you need a baseline of talent if you want to accomplish something in major competitive sports. Also, getting a bunch of 5* recruits isn't "flash" whenever it happens. I would rather get class after class of 5* recruits and take my chances that their talent will result in substance. Sometimes it flops but I'm guessing if UNC ever got a recruiting class of all 3* players, it wouldn't look too good either.
And when's the last UNC team where it was a "sum of its parts?" The 2017 team was the least talented of the post 2000 title teams and they still had major talent up and down the roster. They had an NBA 1st round pick come off the bench. The 2009 and 2005 teams were absolutely loaded. Then their 2 elite 8 teams literally had 5 1st round picks in their starting lineup at one time.
Certainly those teams developed and they got older together. But those teams were absolutely stacked. And in UNC's post-2000 history, it has required a lot of talent to be in the Final Four/National Championship picture.
For me, a big part of the "Carolina Way" is getting big time talent.
You mean like Rob Dillingham, Reed Sheppard, and Aaron Bradshaw were doing for Kentucky a few months ago?
Or like Kon Knueppel and Isaiah Evans will be doing for the dookies in November?
Mullins will decide between UNC, Uconn and Indiana
The Carolina Way has not one thing to do with big time talent! This shows you have absolutely no understanding of what the Family really means! The Carolina Way deals with a way of carrying oneself and treating others. It is an ethos requiring one to be the best one can be as a person! The great news is when you focus on being the best person you can be, this includes things like work ethic, team first, caring for team mates; putting the name on the front before the name on the back, coachability, character, grit, etc and these things often translate to success on AND off the court!
Secondly, "Greater than the sum of its parts" also means one can't simply play video game logic and say put these great talents on the floor and voila wins come! Sometimes peeps have to sublimate their games. Sometimes they have to play positions that might not be optimal; sometimes they have to do the dirty work and allow others to shine; sometimes I have to be a pass first PG not the scoring phenom I was in HS. We have to stop with the shallow perusal of peeps' statements and actually think about the substance!
Thirdly, trying to put together a team full of 5*s is certainly looking for Flash! And I never said anything about fielding a team full of 3*s. Yeah our successful teams had talent BUT they also had glue guys/vets that participated and provided that edge in practice or stepped up when needed!
UNC builds teams with intent; puke throws talent together and hopes for the best!
Secondly, "Greater than the sum of its parts" also means one can't simply play video game logic and say put these great talents on the floor and voila wins come! Sometimes peeps have to sublimate their games. Sometimes they have to play positions that might not be optimal; sometimes they have to do the dirty work and allow others to shine; sometimes I have to be a pass first PG not the scoring phenom I was in HS. We have to stop with the shallow perusal of peeps' statements and actually think about the substance!
Thirdly, trying to put together a team full of 5*s is certainly looking for Flash! And I never said anything about fielding a team full of 3*s. Yeah our successful teams had talent BUT they also had glue guys/vets that participated and provided that edge in practice or stepped up when needed!
UNC builds teams with intent; puke throws talent together and hopes for the best!
Concentrating on "potential" 2nd round draft picks in the transfer portal with NIL money is something we might want to consider. It makes financial sense for those guys to take NIL money, and UNC gets more exposure than a development league.
UNC is one of the top Journalism schools in America, UNC like Colorado football needs to start letting internet be a way of attracting talent. Not fan of CU football, but I can name all there receivers and DBs because of how they internally cover themselves. Recruits look at that stuff.
If UNC wants the top recruits again, we need to make UNC basketball cool again. We already have "Carolina Blue" going for us. I am not a marketing major, but UNC basketball could use a remodel to appeal to this generation.
Or we can keep developing our guys and winning games with older players.
UNC is one of the top Journalism schools in America, UNC like Colorado football needs to start letting internet be a way of attracting talent. Not fan of CU football, but I can name all there receivers and DBs because of how they internally cover themselves. Recruits look at that stuff.
If UNC wants the top recruits again, we need to make UNC basketball cool again. We already have "Carolina Blue" going for us. I am not a marketing major, but UNC basketball could use a remodel to appeal to this generation.
Or we can keep developing our guys and winning games with older players.
I hope I'm wrong, but he sure seems like an Indiana boy to me.
I hate to be so pessimistic but this one seems like a bronze medal. Hope I'm wrong!
You make some good points. So why do I feel like I wrote and essay on "the sky is blue" and you responded "you're wrong, the grass is green"?
I stand by my claim that the sky is blue.
He'll decide between IU (heavy favorite) and UConn. UNC will be a hat on the table.
Dixon is getting crystall ball predictions to UNC. He anounces Friday
Why didn't he just keep the other two contenders hats on the table?
1 crystal ball so far (from a Maryland site contributor.)
1 Futurecast prediction flipped from Pitt to UNC by a Rivals contributor. The guy who had put in a Futurecast for Pitt a couple hours before Dixon started his UNC visit, which seemed like very odd timing for a prediction.
If Kendall Marshall spent his youth focusing on shooting instead of passing, you'd get Derek Dixon. There is something so similar about the way Dixon brings the ball up court, the pace he plays with, and how there are rarely any fancy or wasted dribbles. It's just that Kendall was always looking to pass, while Derek is always looking to fire off his jumpshot.
Also, Dixon has consistently shot over 40% from 3 everywhere he's played. If that continues in college he should have a greenlight whenever he's on the court.
Also, Dixon has consistently shot over 40% from 3 everywhere he's played. If that continues in college he should have a greenlight whenever he's on the court.
Done deal. The bigger NIL deal wins.
True. The point was not about not bidding, but rather not breaking the bank for a dybanista-type player who’d only be on campus for a year…. All the listed players were multi-year players due to their lack of immediate NBA appeal.
Some of those players absolutely could have been one-and-done. I distinctly remember Hansbrough being projected in the late lottery after his freshman year.
Very true. And thank heavens they weren’t.
The point still remains, OAD players rarely lead teams to championships.
Off the top of my head I can only name Anthony Davis and Carmelo Anthony in the last 25 years (there may be more but that’s all I can recall)
The dook 2015 squad led by Okafor, Jones, Winslow...
But many other teams have made the Final Four with multiple one-and-done players. And still more, including UNC in 2005 and 2017, had one-and-done players contribute to championships.
I think what UNC has been doing, filling the roster with both highly ranked 5 stars and lesser ranked 4 stars, has been the best recipe for success. The big problem is for the past 18 months we've been missing on the highly ranked recruits that have anchored all our great teams.
But it's about making millions to those that reap the benefits and it has been for quite a long while. If the cash is flowing in from the product the bottom line is what matters to the buisness. Chips are nice, don't get it twisted though, it's been a billion dollar industry, and that bottom line rules for them.
The incredible growth of the NBA popularity globally has been a cash boon, the workers/talent get 48%. Price of poker has went up. Ante up or play the smaller tables.
Yep, after I posted I looked it up and saw Tyus Jones was MOP in 2015.
That only gives 3 in 25 years that have been led by OAD players.
For sure, some champions have had contributions from OAD players including UNC in 2005 (Williams) and 2017 (Bradley) but not leading contributions, and certainly not enough to warrant a $4m price tag.... at least in my opinion.
If AJ Dybansta is paid $4m and leads whichever team he joins to a championship, then I'd say that's a sound investment.... if he goes to BYU and they win a conference championship, well, does it pay off? And what if their results are not even a conference championship?
Hell, I would hate to have been the booster who contributed to the under-the-table payment for Ben Simmons at LSU.... that was a terrible investment! And what about the Memphis booster who funded James Wiseman's all-too-brief college career? Anthony Edwards won a whole bunch of accolades for Georgia but barely moved the needle for them in his one year and left no legacy of excellence since.
Personally, I want Hubert to bring in players who'll benefit the UNC program the most and that probably means being willing to pay more for experienced talent from the portal than unproven talent.
I think that is a naive take. Huge talent has been a foundation. The way they have treated it is admirable, I love it, but without the talent it is not the same. UNC came to prominence under McGuire and the NYC pipeline, which was not slightly hidden that you are playing for "Uncle Frank" after the backroom conversation. We have had rosters of 5 stars when they were not free to leave. We chose more than recruited. The Carolina Way was how they were treated, but it started with the elite talent.
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Business for unc? Them, unc? Those that reap the benefits? Unc? I think it can be all of those if that’s who you meant, and still incorporate some tip for tap. Maybe I just misunderstood
With a couple of exceptions those are the guys I was talking about when I said Roy got some top players who needed to develop. They were NBA-bound, but not NBA-ready yet, and knew it. They chose to develop under Roy instead of being fast-tracked - don't let the door hit ya style - by Cal or K.
It's a legit question to ask, though, whether we could come up with enough NIL to sign even half of those guys today.
My post was not directed at you, but more to people like Dave who whine constantly that “we’re” not ponying up enough NIL money to buy 5* players. I understand the “reality” of college sports today, I just don’t have to like it. And I’ve pretty much unfollowed all college sports. Haven’t watched a single UNC basketball or football game in the last two years. In the past I hardly missed one. I used to post very regularly but don’t anymore, just occasionally when some jerk like Dave strikes a nerve. I assure you one thing, no more sweating which recruits we do/don’t sign or game results(even d00k) for this UNC fan of over 60 years. It was a helluva ride while it lasted.
Sure enough Arch? No basketball game of UNCs for last two years? Man I’m starting to understand though. I definitely don’t sweat the recruiting anymore. Bigger fish to fry and things I can make a difference in. Not quite to the not watching stage in basketball but I don’t watch football anymore. And that’s saying a lot living in Alabama amongst all the roll tide and war eagle going on.
Not one thing in my post even hinted that we don't want talented players! That would be patently ridiculous to believe we can compete without talent. The Carolina Way is a direct response to the Uncle Frank Days when there were things that didn't live up to our current ethos! We want the most talented players in the land BUT we should never have to compromise our ethical standards to get them! To be clear: I want every 5* player that fits a position of need to suit up for UNC......IF they fit the threshold of character, work ethic; and team first attitude. I also want us to have players who are willing to develop their talents while at UNC and help provide continuity and leadership!
The Carolina Way is an ethical standard; recruiting talent should be one of the top priorities for our coaches! They work together but are not the same!
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