ADVERTISEMENT

Next HC

I think its pretty sweet that Roy managed to beat K to the punch in retiring. I mean its just a matter of time now before he leaves Hansbrough Gymnasium, right? I honestly wouldn't be surprised at all if he's not there next season. Second thought, that rat will probably try to squeeze out 1 more year to not look like a copycat.

Just having fun with Coach K y'all! Much respect to the the two legends, they both did their dag'on thang! :)
K is not going out after missing the NCAA Tournament for the first time in forever. His ego is too big to allow that.
 
That's a fair call. It would simply take me, personally, seeing some serious results-- probably in short order-- to have any confidence in Hubert Davis.

That’s it right there. Nobody should really be that confident because he’s unproven. Theres just no need to take that kind of chance when most coaches would be chomping at the bit for a chance at this job.
 
  • Like
Reactions: tarheel0910
first 2 years as a head coach...

Coach K: 31-24

Coach Cal: 27-32

Dean Smith: 23-15

Bill Self: 16-38

Jay Wright: 19-36

yes lets pile on Jerry Stackhouse though for not setting the world on fire at f***ing Vanderbilt his first 2 years. Laughable
And those other guys weren't trying to rebuild from a crap team during a pandemic, either.

Stack took over a team that went 9-23 and was 0-18 in the SEC.

My only question is why was a guy with his rep unable to recruit better?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Kadyn930
What about Hubert as interim HC, with the clear understanding that the job is his if he does well?

Is something like that an option?

If we can't shake loose one of the star coaches right away, that would seem like a good option. If Hubert pans out, we have our coach. If not, some of the other guys being mentioned have a year to sort out their feeling and affairs when the call comes again.

Nor do I think that's unfair to Hubert. It's his job to lose. Sure, that's pressure, but he knows exactly what he has to do.

That sends an odd message. You are either in or out. It’s a bad message to recruits too, so ultimately it’s unfair to Hubert to give him a real chance.
 
Last edited:
I give Stack (and all coaches) somewhat of a pass during COVID. It’s been so atypical.

I think Stack deserves a shot in the NBA actually. It’s not a reflection of coaching, but whether he’s better suited for the NBA or college. I think a great college coach is different than an NBA guy.
 
K is not going out after missing the NCAA Tournament for the first time in forever. His ego is too big to allow that.
Then again, I didn't think Roy would jump ship before getting that ship back on course.

If he was determined to go, he could have transitioned to an emeritus coach over the next year while letting Hubert run the show. Help get some top players from the portal. Get the next season off to a good start. Then ease back.

I really didn't like the way he handled this. Then again, I probably wouldn't have handled it any better. He obviously wasn't a happy camper the last 2 years. How much more should he be asked to give?
 
I give Stack (and all coaches) somewhat of a pass during COVID. It’s been so atypical.

I think Stack deserves a shot in the NBA actually. It’s not a reflection of coaching, but whether he’s better suited for the NBA or college. I think a great college coach is different than an NBA guy.
I hear that a lot. And, since I never watch the NBA, I'll have to take your word for it and believe it's at least possible. It's definitely the case in football, so why not basketball. That's actually some of my reservations about the Brad Stevens talk. He had a few good runs at Butler and... I dunno what he's done at Boston. And, even if were great with the Celtics, that doesn't mean he's going to be great at UNC. He's not a high-risk hire, but I'd much rather have a proven COLLEGE basketball coach than a pro basketball coach.
 
  • Like
Reactions: NCAAUCoach
Then again, I didn't think Roy would jump ship before getting that ship back on course.

If he was determined to go, he could have transitioned to an emeritus coach over the next year while letting Hubert run the show. Help get some top players from the portal. Get the next season off to a good start. Then ease back.

I really didn't like the way he handled this. Then again, I probably wouldn't have handled it any better. He obviously wasn't a happy camper the last 2 years. How much more should he be asked to give?
It's a tough call, no matter where or when. And, with this Covid crap, and the transfer option this year, and now the NIL thing coming... if you're old school, you'd better get while the getting is good. It's only going to be harder for you. K fancies himself as someone who can adapt and change. He fancies himself as the one who creates the changes!

Roy Williams is much more humble than K could ever hope to be.
 
K is not going out after missing the NCAA Tournament for the first time in forever. His ego is too big to allow that.

Hmmm I didn't think about that...and plus he's got a boat load of incoming talent heading that way. Another move he may consider is to upgrade his home wifi and try coaching from the house; by doing so he should be able to add an additional 6weeks to his career i'm guessing.

lol pls make me stop strummingram, pls make me stop sir! lmao!
 
Few's last 5 teams vs Roy's last 5 teams, it's a toss up if they play 10 games under pressure ... and the Zags would have dominated us the last 2 seasons. i agree that Gonzaga is in a weak conference, but he has still recruited and developed NBA caliber talent. IMO there would be zero drop in recruiting if Few takes over - and besides, it's no secret that Coach Rob does most of the recruiting anyway.

Does Kessler stay if Few gets the job? Everything I read is Gonzaga is the favorite for him.
 
OK, so right off the top, STOP with the race discussion and if you need to discuss it take it to the off topic section of this site.

Now, the problem with Stackhouse is looking like the problem with Matt, yet Matt (Hubert as well) actually is better qualified for our job than Stackhouse is. Matt was a long time Kansas assistant, was involved in recruiting, and did have a season of head coaching on his resume. The problem was in his only season of coaching a college program he alienated many at ND, NO ONE was upset when they learned he left for the UNC job, he was to much of a loose cannon. Well in his short stint at Vandy, Stackhouse has managed to piss off that fan base, he is considered by many there to be a loose cannon. Sorry, I went thru the Matt years, have no fond memories of that and do not want to see that repeated now because there is no Roy Williams that can come in and correct all those mistakes. How many years of recruiting high school players against other D-1 programs does Stackhouse have, not as much as Hubert has or Matt had.

Now I don't think Hubert would be a loose cannon, he has dealt with media far to long to not understand the value of taking great care with his own words. While he has not been a head coach he has been more and more involved in the recruiting side, in fact he was maybe Roy's lead recruiter over the last few years making the initial scouting as well as initial contacts to set things up for Roy to get a feel for who he needed to spend more of his time on. Recall over the last few years, when Roy went in home, most of the time it was with Hubert there with him, that is pretty darn good prep for him to learn.

Matt went to ND for his 1 season of coaching prior to taking our job, that ND team he went to was pretty darn loaded, not sure that 1 season of having a team loaded with talent and experience really proved him more than had he not had that 1 season. BOTH Dean and Roy suggested Matt was not ready for a gig like ours, Baddour didn't listen and he should have. I think we may at times place to much stock in a guy having been a head coach, while I do think it is important, I think more important is how well that coach understands the sport and the players that play it, how does he handle pressure, how would you run our program. I don't think you will find another candidate for our job that our current players like or respect any more than Hubert and I do think that is important.

Have said it before, will say it again, if Hubert is the pick (and I am not advocating nor do I know that he is, only that he could be after the dust settles, for the record if he is the pick I will not be nearly as upset as many seem to be), I would LOVE to see Phil step up one more time to help guide his transition and this program thru the un-certain times we now find ourselves in. I like Steve, Steve was Roy's right hand man, his sounding board, in some ways his Gut. But Phil beside Hubert would instantly unit the fan base and take away any concerns and I don't think Steve is the guy to do that. I would take that combination over Mark Few or Brad Stevens, or anyone else that will be talked to, without Phil involved beside Hubert, Hubert is maybe my 6th choice.

Watching that game last night, could not help but be very impressed with how that Gonzaga team executed, that was good stuff, it was like watching UNC when we have it all clicking, really impressive. WE struggle to get guys able to throw a simple pass without a TO and contrast that to that amazing footwork Timmie showed off last night, or the execution by that freshman PG, or the clutch play of Kispert, or all of those Zags that played. It was surgical, would love to see us play like that consistently.

I still see Wes as the smart pick, maybe not the flashy pick, wonder what his staff would look like?
 
Can you find the stats on Wes' overall record and winning percentages? Those would be helpful no matter what conference you coach in, if you have talent that is below or just equal to the mean overall in a conference, it will give you an idea of coaching acumen.

I do not hide the fact that I would like to see Wes as the next coach, but will support whoever is chosen.
He is 185-135, I think 57.8%. He has done much better the past 5 years then his 1st 5 though.
 
Does Kessler stay if Few gets the job? Everything I read is Gonzaga is the favorite for him.

It would be really hard for the kid to come back at this point, he has been branded not only as impertinent but is now branded as being a catalyst for Roy deciding to hang them up, that is a pretty tall hill for him to over come. Our chances with Holmgren on the other hand would explode upward.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheGLOV and Sk1310
I haven’t read every post, but you keep pushing Stackhouse as the clear answer. I have no problem with home town homerism, but you didn’t say that until well into a 14 page thread.

The college and pro game are different. Stack has had a lot of success in the pro game, but so far that hasn’t translated into college. I don’t care about the NBA, I care about UNC basketball. I want Stevens (college success, don’t follow the Celtics), Few (obvious) or Wes (averaged 25 wins the last 5 years and is as much like Roy is there is).

I prefer Wes because he’s more likely to keep a UNC family staff.

Yeah, I think either Wes or Hubert would have a staff very former player orientated however, looking at Wes's current staff he does not have UNC players on his bench. Roy had the ability to bring his staff with him and did, Matt played hard ball and got his staff brought in, would the be the case as well with Wes? Could that be a deal breaker, only if Wes has lost his mind...LOL
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheGLOV
All 3 in house candidates would be somewhat of a "leap of faith", but so was Dean Smith. Remember he was hung in effigy on campus after losing and many wanted to run him out as quick as possible when he began his career at UNC.

I think the Fews, Donovan's, Steven's all are long shots to try to gain interest from them, so if it comes from the "in house" candidates they all will be under a microscope early, and the pitchforks might not be far behind if it starts off rocky.
 
Can you find the stats on Wes' overall record and winning percentages?
He is 185-135, I think 57.8%. He has done much better the past 5 years then his 1st 5 though.
For the last 5 seasons, UNCG is 125 - 43 (74%). They finished 1st three times, along with a 2nd place and a 3rd place finish in the SoCon.

And in the 4 years that post-season was played, Wes has taken the Spartans to the NCAA twice, and NIT twice. They weren't able to pull an upset but gave Gonzaga all they could handle in 2018, and were in the game with FSU this year until the last 5 minutes or so.
 
All 3 in house candidates would be somewhat of a "leap of faith", but so was Dean Smith. Remember he was hung in effigy on campus after losing and many wanted to run him out as quick as possible when he began his career at UNC.

I think the Fews, Donovan's, Steven's all are long shots to try to gain interest from them, so if it comes from the "in house" candidates they all will be under a microscope early, and the pitchforks might not be far behind if it starts off rocky.

Well, to be fair, yes Dean nor Roy had any head coaching experience before taking over major D-1 programs but that was a far different time. I seriously doubt, had the internet been then what it is now, Dean would have never been retained long enough to become the Mt Rushmore coach he became, I would suggest much the same applies to K at duke as well.

Geez, we had fans this season posting they wanted Roy to leave, that is how crazy things have become... college sports is changing, PEOPLE in general are changing, having patience has gone from a virtue to an unforgivable sin...
 
OK, so right off the top, STOP with the race discussion and if you need to discuss it take it to the off topic section of this site.

Now, the problem with Stackhouse is looking like the problem with Matt, yet Matt (Hubert as well) actually is better qualified for our job than Stackhouse is. Matt was a long time Kansas assistant, was involved in recruiting, and did have a season of head coaching on his resume. The problem was in his only season of coaching a college program he alienated many at ND, NO ONE was upset when they learned he left for the UNC job, he was to much of a loose cannon. Well in his short stint at Vandy, Stackhouse has managed to piss off that fan base, he is considered by many there to be a loose cannon. Sorry, I went thru the Matt years, have no fond memories of that and do not want to see that repeated now because there is no Roy Williams that can come in and correct all those mistakes. How many years of recruiting high school players against other D-1 programs does Stackhouse have, not as much as Hubert has or Matt had.

Thats your opinion and is not backed by anything other than your opinion. There’s a difference between experienced and qualified.

look at some of the players on the Raptors G-League team in 2017 when Stack was the coach that ended up being major contributors on their NBA championship team in 2019. Fred Van Vleet and Pascal Siakam to name a couple. That’s clear evidence of a coach that can develop talent. Undrafted players that became all nba level and max contract level players after playing for you. Someone already mentioned Scottie Pippen Jr that was an unheralded 3 star that averaged 20 points a game this year as a sophomore. Also the idea of a former NBA all star that used to have his own AAU program and also has a resume of developing NBA talent struggling to recruit at UNC is laughable, especially in the state of NC where there is enough talent to field a final four team just off in state recruits
 
  • Like
Reactions: KinstonNC
Yeah, I think either Wes or Hubert would have a staff very former player orientated however, looking at Wes's current staff he does not have UNC players on his bench. Roy had the ability to bring his staff with him and did, Matt played hard ball and got his staff brought in, would the be the case as well with Wes? Could that be a deal breaker, only if Wes has lost his mind...LOL
Jackie Manuel was on staff with him for awhile.
 
I haven’t read every post, but you keep pushing Stackhouse as the clear answer. I have no problem with home town homerism, but you didn’t say that until well into a 14 page thread.

The college and pro game are different. Stack has had a lot of success in the pro game, but so far that hasn’t translated into college. I don’t care about the NBA, I care about UNC basketball. I want Stevens (college success, don’t follow the Celtics), Few (obvious) or Wes (averaged 25 wins the last 5 years and is as much like Roy is there is).

I prefer Wes because he’s more likely to keep a UNC family staff.
I agree 1000%
 
For the last 5 seasons, UNCG is 125 - 43 (74%). They finished 1st three times, along with a 2nd place and a 3rd place finish in the SoCon.

And in the 4 years that post-season was played, Wes has taken the Spartans to the NCAA twice, and NIT twice. They weren't able to pull an upset but gave Gonzaga all they could handle in 2018, and were in the game with FSU this year until the last 5 minutes or so.
The point you are making is that you can only judge a coach by where he is coaching. Essentially, you can't look at a guy who takes over, say, Dartmouth as a loser because he has not made the NCAA tournament after 4 years. Dartmouth is historically bad Ivy League basketball, the Ivy is always a 1 bid league.

Nobody is going to make UNCG a threat to tower over the bottom half of the ACC or be ranked 3 years in a row. It is UNCG in the SoCon. Winning that league and going to the NCAA and getting into the NIT are best you can do, save for a very rare run in a tournament.

What Wes Miller has done there is a truly excellent job. With very few resources, he has overcome every obstacle to UNCG being top dog in the SoCon.

And while that makes him a better candidate to replace Roy than Davis, or Stackhouse or Frederick (who is a considerably more experienced assistant than Davis), it does not mean he is the best that UNC can get.
 
That sends an odd message. You are either in or out. It’s a bad message to recruits too, so ultimately it’s unfair to Hubert to give him a real chance.
I think it's a pretty clear message.

Here are the keys. Do well and you get to keep them.

They could even define what "do well" means in terms of W-L and other measures.

Everyone under consideration has some sort of head coaching track record except Hubert. This lets him amass that record. Better - for him and maybe for UNC - than just ruling him out right away.
 
OK, so right off the top, STOP with the race discussion and if you need to discuss it take it to the off topic section of this site.

Now, the problem with Stackhouse is looking like the problem with Matt, yet Matt (Hubert as well) actually is better qualified for our job than Stackhouse is. Matt was a long time Kansas assistant, was involved in recruiting, and did have a season of head coaching on his resume. The problem was in his only season of coaching a college program he alienated many at ND, NO ONE was upset when they learned he left for the UNC job, he was to much of a loose cannon. Well in his short stint at Vandy, Stackhouse has managed to piss off that fan base, he is considered by many there to be a loose cannon. Sorry, I went thru the Matt years, have no fond memories of that and do not want to see that repeated now because there is no Roy Williams that can come in and correct all those mistakes. How many years of recruiting high school players against other D-1 programs does Stackhouse have, not as much as Hubert has or Matt had.

Now I don't think Hubert would be a loose cannon, he has dealt with media far to long to not understand the value of taking great care with his own words. While he has not been a head coach he has been more and more involved in the recruiting side, in fact he was maybe Roy's lead recruiter over the last few years making the initial scouting as well as initial contacts to set things up for Roy to get a feel for who he needed to spend more of his time on. Recall over the last few years, when Roy went in home, most of the time it was with Hubert there with him, that is pretty darn good prep for him to learn.

Matt went to ND for his 1 season of coaching prior to taking our job, that ND team he went to was pretty darn loaded, not sure that 1 season of having a team loaded with talent and experience really proved him more than had he not had that 1 season. BOTH Dean and Roy suggested Matt was not ready for a gig like ours, Baddour didn't listen and he should have. I think we may at times place to much stock in a guy having been a head coach, while I do think it is important, I think more important is how well that coach understands the sport and the players that play it, how does he handle pressure, how would you run our program. I don't think you will find another candidate for our job that our current players like or respect any more than Hubert and I do think that is important.

Have said it before, will say it again, if Hubert is the pick (and I am not advocating nor do I know that he is, only that he could be after the dust settles, for the record if he is the pick I will not be nearly as upset as many seem to be), I would LOVE to see Phil step up one more time to help guide his transition and this program thru the un-certain times we now find ourselves in. I like Steve, Steve was Roy's right hand man, his sounding board, in some ways his Gut. But Phil beside Hubert would instantly unit the fan base and take away any concerns and I don't think Steve is the guy to do that. I would take that combination over Mark Few or Brad Stevens, or anyone else that will be talked to, without Phil involved beside Hubert, Hubert is maybe my 6th choice.

Watching that game last night, could not help but be very impressed with how that Gonzaga team executed, that was good stuff, it was like watching UNC when we have it all clicking, really impressive. WE struggle to get guys able to throw a simple pass without a TO and contrast that to that amazing footwork Timmie showed off last night, or the execution by that freshman PG, or the clutch play of Kispert, or all of those Zags that played. It was surgical, would love to see us play like that consistently.

I still see Wes as the smart pick, maybe not the flashy pick, wonder what his staff would look like?


Thanks brother. I agree 100% that we should stop with the race discussions on this board; however, I disagree with you about Stackhouse. To the best of my knowledge Matt nor Hurbert or Wes have or had AAU ties like JS. Now, does that guarantee to help with our recruiting challenges? That reminds to be seen, but logic says it does.

IMO, bridging the gap with other generational talent has been an area of concern for UNC for quite sometime now. Stack checks that box. To keep this short I copied the below data from another poster that also lean to Stack's rather impressive resume:

Copied from another poster:
-Former player
-NBA all star
-Grew up in NC
-has a multitude of AAU connections
-G League Coach of the year and league champion (you can scoff but reality is he coached in a league of players playing for money)

Although it wasn't the case at Vandy all of the above achievements should translate very well with the type of talent level that UNC should scoop up.

He very well may not git the gig, but he does check many of the boxes, at lease from what I can see. Just my OP.
 
  • Like
Reactions: OldSchoo01
This is UNC.

I don't think even the schools that are perennially mediocre would operate on that kind of "hope for the best" idea.
Hard to see Hubert getting the nod any other way. That is, if you assume some of the proven coaches who are being discussed will be interested.

Frankly, it's hard to see anyone from the family getting the nod. Who have I forgotten?

Hubert Davis - no record
Wes Miller - slow start but good recent record at UNC-G
Jerry Stackhouse - poor record at Vanderbilt
Jerod Haase - mediocre record at Stanford
King Rice - mediocre record at Monmouth
Buzz Peterson - poor record at UNC-W
Jeff Lebo - poor record at East Carolina
CB McGrath - failed at UNC-W

Decent arguments have been made for Hubert, Wes and Stack by others. But they are only decent arguments. Nothing about any of them screams they are great candidates.

Several names outside the family look a lot better. And I'm not even counting the Few/Stevens/Wright group that seem highly unlikely to leave where they are.
 
I think it's a pretty clear message.

Here are the keys. Do well and you get to keep them.

They could even define what "do well" means in terms of W-L and other measures.

Everyone under consideration has some sort of head coaching track record except Hubert. This lets him amass that record. Better - for him and maybe for UNC - than just ruling him out right away.
That should be great for recruiting. Come play for UNC. Your coach might be here next year, but probably not.
 
  • Haha
Reactions: dadika13
It is amazing that in the last 25 years UNC has not produced a coach that is obviously qualified for this job.
 
Don't think UNC needs a father figure for a coach, We actually need a head coach that is a head coach.

Did you hear Roy's comments on why decided to retire. He said his coaching was not getting through to the players. You can be tough as hell, but some kids don't respond to that type of stuff in this day and age. Roy does not use text and that's not good in this day and age. He is terrible with social media.
 
It is amazing that in the last 25 years UNC has not produced a coach that is obviously qualified for this job.
Why is that amazing? Do you assume that excellent players often make excellent coaches? Did Dean Smith star at KU or ride the end of the bench? Did Roy get 25 major college scholarship offers or walk on to the JV team? Did Rat-Face have a shot at making the NBA? How long was Bob Knight's NBA career?

Who was the bigger college basketball star of this year's National Championship Game, Mark Few or Scott Drew? Mick Cronin grew up in Cincinnati: did he play for Cincinnati or Xavier or Ohio State?

It's not just basketball. Name the greatest baseball managers, and then see how many of them were top level MLB players.

Football? Nick Saban was nothing as a player at then hapless Kent St. Bill Belichick played football and lacrosse at Wesleyan U and was better as lacrosse.

It is beyond naive to assume that the UNC basketball program can produce enough former players who can become great coaches who can keep the program at the top of the sport.
 
-Former player - Lot of difference between being a player and a coach, in fact, UNC history, our 2 legendary coaches, were akin to blue steel when they played.

-NBA all star - I assume you agree, Dean and Roy were not just great coaches but legendary, both HOF coaches. I forget what NBA teams they played for, please remind me?

-Grew up in NC - So did I, does that qualify me for UNC head coach, doubt it...

-has a multitude of AAU connections - Yeah, we all have friends that maybe are not the cream of the crop, hope he showers after he visits with that den of thieves. AAU is a scummy universe full of back room deal makers, handlers, and street agents.

-G League Coach of the year and league champion (you can scoff but reality is he coached in a league of players playing for money) - That would be great if our position was that of head coach of a G-League team but it isn't. Coaching the pro game is much different than what a college coach does.
 
Why would Few want the pressure? He was dressed out last night. Just think about what he would face with the comp in the ACC as well as the fan base.
Because the greats thrive in competition and have the desire to face it. He can stay at Gonzaga and break all kinds of records beating up on that weak ass conference, or he can come run with the bigs dogs.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bleeduncblue
Did you hear Roy's comments on why decided to retire. He said his coaching was not getting through to the players. You can be tough as hell, but some kids don't respond to that type of stuff in this day and age. Roy does not use text and that's not good in this day and age. He is terrible with social media.
I wonder how many parents now days are trying to figure out how to get thru to their kids and not able to figure it out? Lot of parents now days are paying huge sums of money for their kids to attend college and discover that what they are actually learning goes in direct opposition to what the parents believe? Imagine the challenge of a coach pulling kids in from such diverse back grounds and trying to figure out how to get thru to them.

Yet listen to past senior night speeches from players and see how many of them see Roy as a father figure, Roy and Dean before him took that very same path, I would say it worked out well for them. I don't know that the mindsets of the kids is the most difficult challenge but todays parents that believe their child is the next larry Bird, now that is a ever growing problem.
 
Because the greats thrive in competition and have the desire to face it. He can stay at Gonzaga and break all kinds of records beating up on that weak ass conference, or he can come run with the bigs dogs.
Break records? The WCC is Gonzaga and the others. BYU is decent on occasion. There will always be a footnote to Mark Few that will say "coached in a very weak conference." Even winning it all this season will have that disclaimer.

ETA- It's not as hard to be undefeated when you play Saint Mary, Loyola, Pepperdine, and Pacific most of the time.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: bleeduncblue
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT