So according to you, someone saying "kill that person because he is a heathen" is just the same is someone saying "that person died because he was a heathen".
Do I understand you correctly?
Orlando Night Club Shooting
- Thread starter UNC '92
- Start date
So according to you, someone saying "kill that person because he is a heathen" is just the same is someone saying "that person died because he was a heathen".
Do I understand you correctly?
We aren't talking about the GOP. Well, we weren't until you brought it up.
Just go away for your own sake. This is over your head.
Just the same? No... BUT THEY ARE SIMILAR! Which is what I said 2 pages ago. I hope one day you sober-up and see how stupid you look here.
Really? You think those things are similar?
You are right that one of us look stupid, though. But I imagine that the feeling is so familiar that it goes unrealized.
C'mon, strum. Celebrating death is despicable, but in no way comparable to actually advocating murder.
so when was the last time a Christian killed 49 homosexuals? I'll wait for your hopefully less pathetic response or one from strum or his cheerleader "chick".Yeah and so do christians...
Why do you even try with strum and boy they are so far out there that only shock therapy would help. strum tries to preach his love and peace B.S. but he can't even sustain the shat himself. I don't even know what to say about boy...just pathetic.
Im not sure how we would feel, but if some of us acted in a terrorist manner towards Blank Country I would expect Blank Country to kill us all without a second thought.
You've got to stop living in fear man.
So before someone tries to skew and twist my words to fit their agenda, let me just say I think the westboro baptist church is despicable (although many already know I'm not a huge fan of organized religions in the first place).
I'm just wondering why it's ok to crap on WBC, but if someone points out something 100 times more crazy for the Muslim religion - they're being ridiculous?
I'm just wondering why it's ok to crap on WBC, but if someone points out something 100 times more crazy for the Muslim religion - they're being ridiculous?
I never said I was without ANY fear. Far from it, actually.You've got to stop living in fear man.
Christianity has supported, encouraged, financed, and defended acts of violence in the past every bit as horrific as at the pulse. Thats a fact. Wanna talk about the church's role in the holocaust? How about slavery? The genocide of the american indian? Ever heard of manifest destiny? The spanish inquisition? The crusades? Salem witch trials? McCarthyism? The KKK? How about "lone wolf" christian inspired murderers? Timothy mcveigh? Eric rudolph? Now i say this as a christian myself. And yes i acknowledge that in all these examples there were factions of the church opposed to these atrocities. But thats also true of islam isnt it?. Its also True that such acts in the name of christianity are mainly in the far past whereas muslim acts are just now catching up. But make no mistake about it. Christians have ZERO right to pass judgement on islam or any religion for commiting atrocities in the name of religion. Its denial of historical fact and hypocrisy.
It mighta been uncboy that brought WBC into the discussion, not sure how that was relavent at all. And then you equated hate speech (which is wrong in its own right) to mass killing? Is this bizarro world?
Somebody said something about muslims and their view of homosexuals. I simply responded with that to point out that christians aren't exactly known for their tolerance of the LGBT community either. Not an attempt to equate signs to shooting people at all.
I definitely see a strong similarity, or at least a parallel, in a man murdering people because they're homosexual and the people who celebrate the murder he committed because they were homosexual.
Do you not see a parallel with the 9/11 hijackers and the people in the Middle East dancing and rejoicing because it happened?
Holding signs and shooting people are not "equal." But, both the sign holder and the murderer have the same disdain toward homosexuals.
Agreed. But some people apparently can't separate attitudes from actions.
Did you not notice the winking emoji at the end of my post? Just joking around with you some. You should be able to pick up on the OOTB humor by now. It's ok to laugh, especially after the last few pages of this thread.
Homicidal homophobe used to hang at Orlando gay hotspot, some regulars recall
http://www.cjad.com/WorldCP/Article.aspx?id=517501
ORLANDO, United States — Omar Mateen was more than just a homicidal, jihadist-inspired homophobe when he shot his way through an Orlando nightclub early Sunday morning, according to a couple of the establishment regulars.
He was also a repeat visitor.
A drag-dancing married couple described seeing Mateen as many as a dozen times at the gay-friendly nightclub where he'd later embark on the single worst gun massacre in modern American history.
Ty Smith and Chris Callen recalled the eventual killer being escorted drunk from the Pulse bar on multiple occasions, including one incident where he pointed a knife at a friend.
Both professed shock at seeing his face on TV: "It's the same guy," said Callen, who performs under the name Kristina McLaughlin. "He's been going to this bar for at least three years."
They expressed incredulity at the story being told by Mateen's father in the wake of the shooting, that the gunman had once been scandalized during a visit to Miami by the sight of men kissing each other.
They say Mateen saw plenty of men kiss — and far closer to home than Miami.
"That's bullcrap, right there. No offence. That's straight-up crap. He's been around us," Smith said Monday in an interview at the GLBT Community Center of Central Florida.
"Some of those people did a little more than (kiss) outside the bar.... He was partying with the people who supposedly drove him to do this?"
Smith said the sometimes-visitor would show up with a buddy and let loose in a way he couldn't when he was closer to the family home in Port St. Lucie: "(He'd get) really, really drunk... He couldn't drink when he was at home — around his wife, or family. His father was really strict... He used to bitch about it."
Neither Smith nor Callen would speculate on the sex life of the man who called police from inside the club early Sunday to profess his allegiance to a Middle East militant leader as he gunned down at least 49 people in cold blood.
But they expressed doubt over the version conveyed by Mateen's Afghan-born father.
The Daily Beast also reported Monday that the gunman frequently lunched at a diner where the waiter was an openly gay high-school classmate and drag queen. That classmate, Samuel King, said Mateen was friendly; voiced no issues with gays; and might even have gone to see a drag show once or twice.
In separate interviews, both Callen and Smith described one incident that unnerved them.
They said they decided to keep their distance from Mateen after he exploded in anger at a joke told by one of their friends, possibly about religion: "He ended up pulling a knife," Callen said.
"He said if he ever messed with him again, you know how it'll turn out."
Now they're grappling with the shock of losing close friends. Pulse was like a second home to the couple after they moved from Indiana, and found new acceptance in Florida's more socially liberal climate.
Like several people interviewed Monday, they took exception to media descriptions of Pulse as a gay bar. Yes, they said, it has a predominantly gay clientele, but it catered to everyone.
Callen said he wished he had a place like that when he was an 18-year-old in Indiana. The place was so tolerant they even let him perform when he moved here four years ago and was far from ready for prime time.
"I was a hot mess," he said.
"And I grew to the queen that I am today... Straight people would come in. Couples. They would get up there and dance. They'd get birthday shots," he said.
"(It's a) place where you could come out. Just be you. To love who you are... That's what Pulse taught us."
The weekend's violent acts are spurring other signs of rapprochement between the city's communities.
A sign outside Orlando's LGBT centre warns that people should expect a security search of their bags upon entering. But visitors Monday overwhelmingly had acts of kindness on their mind.
Officials there said the loading area was filled with supplies people had dropped off, such as bottled water for families awaiting news about their loved ones.
One organizer said 200 people had responded to calls for grief counsellors. So many showed up that they had to create a database to keep track.
Rob Domenico said straight and gay people were lining up for hours to donate blood, in spite of U.S. restrictions on blood donations from men who have had sex with a man in the previous year.
"It's a tragedy," Domenico said.
"But it's wonderful to see a real community come together. Gay, straight... It's just a wonderful thing."
http://www.cjad.com/WorldCP/Article.aspx?id=517501
ORLANDO, United States — Omar Mateen was more than just a homicidal, jihadist-inspired homophobe when he shot his way through an Orlando nightclub early Sunday morning, according to a couple of the establishment regulars.
He was also a repeat visitor.
A drag-dancing married couple described seeing Mateen as many as a dozen times at the gay-friendly nightclub where he'd later embark on the single worst gun massacre in modern American history.
Ty Smith and Chris Callen recalled the eventual killer being escorted drunk from the Pulse bar on multiple occasions, including one incident where he pointed a knife at a friend.
Both professed shock at seeing his face on TV: "It's the same guy," said Callen, who performs under the name Kristina McLaughlin. "He's been going to this bar for at least three years."
They expressed incredulity at the story being told by Mateen's father in the wake of the shooting, that the gunman had once been scandalized during a visit to Miami by the sight of men kissing each other.
They say Mateen saw plenty of men kiss — and far closer to home than Miami.
"That's bullcrap, right there. No offence. That's straight-up crap. He's been around us," Smith said Monday in an interview at the GLBT Community Center of Central Florida.
"Some of those people did a little more than (kiss) outside the bar.... He was partying with the people who supposedly drove him to do this?"
Smith said the sometimes-visitor would show up with a buddy and let loose in a way he couldn't when he was closer to the family home in Port St. Lucie: "(He'd get) really, really drunk... He couldn't drink when he was at home — around his wife, or family. His father was really strict... He used to bitch about it."
Neither Smith nor Callen would speculate on the sex life of the man who called police from inside the club early Sunday to profess his allegiance to a Middle East militant leader as he gunned down at least 49 people in cold blood.
But they expressed doubt over the version conveyed by Mateen's Afghan-born father.
The Daily Beast also reported Monday that the gunman frequently lunched at a diner where the waiter was an openly gay high-school classmate and drag queen. That classmate, Samuel King, said Mateen was friendly; voiced no issues with gays; and might even have gone to see a drag show once or twice.
In separate interviews, both Callen and Smith described one incident that unnerved them.
They said they decided to keep their distance from Mateen after he exploded in anger at a joke told by one of their friends, possibly about religion: "He ended up pulling a knife," Callen said.
"He said if he ever messed with him again, you know how it'll turn out."
Now they're grappling with the shock of losing close friends. Pulse was like a second home to the couple after they moved from Indiana, and found new acceptance in Florida's more socially liberal climate.
Like several people interviewed Monday, they took exception to media descriptions of Pulse as a gay bar. Yes, they said, it has a predominantly gay clientele, but it catered to everyone.
Callen said he wished he had a place like that when he was an 18-year-old in Indiana. The place was so tolerant they even let him perform when he moved here four years ago and was far from ready for prime time.
"I was a hot mess," he said.
"And I grew to the queen that I am today... Straight people would come in. Couples. They would get up there and dance. They'd get birthday shots," he said.
"(It's a) place where you could come out. Just be you. To love who you are... That's what Pulse taught us."
The weekend's violent acts are spurring other signs of rapprochement between the city's communities.
A sign outside Orlando's LGBT centre warns that people should expect a security search of their bags upon entering. But visitors Monday overwhelmingly had acts of kindness on their mind.
Officials there said the loading area was filled with supplies people had dropped off, such as bottled water for families awaiting news about their loved ones.
One organizer said 200 people had responded to calls for grief counsellors. So many showed up that they had to create a database to keep track.
Rob Domenico said straight and gay people were lining up for hours to donate blood, in spite of U.S. restrictions on blood donations from men who have had sex with a man in the previous year.
"It's a tragedy," Domenico said.
"But it's wonderful to see a real community come together. Gay, straight... It's just a wonderful thing."
Several Orlando Chik-fil-A locations opened on a Sunday to make free food for folks waiting in line to donate blood.
I love the way you conveniently ignore the Muslim prohibition of homosexuality, as if he just randomly hate gays, but NOT because he's a Muslim, and Muslims hate gays.
Willful ignorance.
There are many Christian groups/churches that openly embrace homosexuals as well as women in the pulpit. I challenge you to name me just ONE muslim group that does. Name me even one muslim group that treats women as 1st class citizens.
yes strum and the media are the ones to assign the order of his hatred.
That bunch is a despicable group. They are about as far as you can get from being "Christian" or "Baptist" for that matter. To judge all Christians by them is very narrow minded.
Love the sinner but hate the sin is what Christ Followers need to adhere to. Why is that so hard to understand? And that applies to ALL sin not just a select few.
You forfeit all credibility when you blame Christianity for the Crusades. They were a defensive action after centuries of Muslim slaughter. They were the only thing that prevented the Muslims from overrunning all of Europe.
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Amen. This is what is taught and most people completely miss the point.
It debunks his argument if he does that.
Uhhhhhh are y'all serious? Or are you just willfully being ignorant for the sake of defending your argument (whatever it is?)
There are plenty of people I don't like (not even talking strictly adhering to ethnicity / orientation / or any other label), who make decisions I don't agree with, but I'm polite to everyone I encounter and I'm always civil. But by your logic, I'm just as bad as someone who commits mass murder because I have "the same disdain"? Ooooookay then.
Everyone hates certain people. That's just human nature. 99% of people don't do anything with that hatred though except possibly choose not to be friends with certain people. They don't shoot up people they don't like. Only truly evil, unhelpable people do that.
apaprarently he was allowing african americans leave saying "i've got no problems with you"...he was on at least two gay dating apps, and he frequented the club, always cordial according to patrons.
I completely agree and we just do the same with other religions, like Muslims... not ALL Muslims are terrorists, just the radical Islamist/ISIS are. The KKK claims they do things because "God said so" but they don't represent all Christians either. Labeling is a HUGE problem. We label everything and everyone now and it is just making mountains of problems that we are eventually not going to be able to climb and get over.
I think another problems is that "Love the sinner but hate the sin" gets taken the wrong way too because people tend to harp continuously over the sins and fail to remember the love part. If you don't like someone's sin, fine, but you keep it to yourself and you pray for them. The perpetual "judging" and calling out everyone's sins is the ONE thing that turns people away from God.
Live as you want to live, don't harm others, pray if you want to, set the example you want to see in the world and carry on. We are too busy getting in everyone's business, being way too vocal with our opinions and it is creating a world of chaos.
Here's the difference: when evil people commit atrocities today in the name of Christianity, tons of religious leaders come out and condemn the attacks and say it doesn't represent Christianity or Christians. Muslim leaders do not do the same. The ONLY person you could even claim represent the "Muslim world" I've seen condemn the Orlando attack is the prime minister of Pakistan. And he's not really a Muslim leader, he's just a leader in a country with a lot of Muslims.
Also, come on, KKK? It's 2016. Find me an article about the last time the KKK committed a heinous hate crime.
Agree. They are as Christian as boy is. They are not even a church, but a family of nuts claiming the name of Baptist.
You're correct, I am not aware of any heinous crimes, but they still exist and claim God and the Bible wants all races separate and that white is supreme, which is ridiculous but whatever, you can't fix stupid anyway.
I have seen PLENTY of Muslims though come out this week and speak out against the violence. I am not sure if any were leaders in their church or not.
Lol. Uhh.....no. If you're genuinely interested do some research. The historical record is quite different than the christian spin. This link is just a taste.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhineland_massacres
So what? There is no crime in hating someone and wishing them dead. It is indeed a crime to make someone dead. I think that's a pretty elementary concept.
The fact that boy and strum are bringing Christian behavior into is exactly what the problem is - muslim apologist perpetuating the myth that "Christians do it too" and not holding radical islamists accountable. It's also a deflection tactic so they don't have to say, "yep, those muslims are batshit crazy and problem for our country." We don't want to hurt anyone's feelings.
But I've come to expect it from those two.
