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Our team last season...

gary-7

gary-7

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...at the same stage would have made complete mincemeat out of any of those teams that played last night. Yeah, I realize it's thiis season but after watching those games color me not impressed about what we're up against at the national level.

Also...
- a couple of days ago I glanced at dook's roster and my first thought was there's no way that bunch would be able to guard anybody, so it came as no surprise they played all Zone.

- I was very underwhelmed by MSU's Zone Offense. Other than attacking the baseline they did a lousy job.

- Duval still can't shoot a lick

- uk is a mess --- lot's of raw talent but not a 2-Guard in the whole bunch... and as a team they can't shoot a lick.

- KU would've blown uk out if they had any depth at all... and if Azubuike is their only Big they are in trouble inside.
 
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gary-7 said:
...at the same stage would have made complete mincemeat out of any of those teams that played last night. Yeah, I realize it's thiis season but after watching those games color me not impressed about what we're up against at the national level.

Also...
- a couple of days ago I glanced at dook's roster and my first thought was there's no way that bunch would be able to guard anybody, so it came as no surprise they played all Zone.

- I was very underwhelmed by MSU's Zone Offense. Other than attacking the baseline they did a lousy job.

- Duval still can't shoot a lick

- uk is a mess --- lot's of raw talent but not a 2-Guard in the whole bunch... and as a team they can't shoot a lick.

- KU would've blown uk out if they had any depth at all... and if Azubuike is their only Big they are in trouble inside.
Click to expand...

Actually I believe that KU would have blown out UK if Devonte Graham had been shooting anywhere like his normal self. He was just off last night as most of his shots (and misses) were taken without a hand in his face.
As it were KU was pretty fortunate to win this one adn UK was even more fortunate that they were not really blown out.
I think KU will live and die by the three ball this year.

Glenn
 
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Two points:

I think Duke played zone because they knew that MSU would struggle against zone...which they did. We'd all be applauding Roy if he did this.

Duval can't shoot...but man...he's crafty as shit.
 
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gary-7 said:
...at the same stage would have made complete mincemeat out of any of those teams that played last night. Yeah, I realize it's thiis season but after watching those games color me not impressed about what we're up against at the national level.

Also...
- a couple of days ago I glanced at dook's roster and my first thought was there's no way that bunch would be able to guard anybody, so it came as no surprise they played all Zone.

- I was very underwhelmed by MSU's Zone Offense. Other than attacking the baseline they did a lousy job.

- Duval still can't shoot a lick

- uk is a mess --- lot's of raw talent but not a 2-Guard in the whole bunch... and as a team they can't shoot a lick.

- KU would've blown uk out if they had any depth at all... and if Azubuike is their only Big they are in trouble inside.
Click to expand...

One thing to remember about Duke is that they became a different team after Bagley left the game. He's the real difference maker for them, and his absence is what kept MSU in the game. Allen had a great night, but I don't think he does that against better defense.

Kansas didn't look as good as I thought, but I guess that can be expected in the first big game of the season. I didn't really have any expectations for Kentucky considering how young they are at all positions. They could look totally different by the end of the season.
 
KU was the class of the group last night. Tough team. UK and Dook are young.
 
Kansas was missing Preston who is a 5-star. With him, they beat Kentucky by 10 or more.

It's early, but on the surface Duke had a better team last year with Kennard and Tatum. The Heels had a better team last year.

I see Duke playing a lot of zone this year. They will be tough on the boards due to their height. Their high number of offensive rebounds last night should concern us. Reminds me of the year they won the Chamionsip with Zoubek kicking those offensive rebounds back to their shooters. The key to beating Duke this year is stopping Grayson Allen and keeping Duval from driving the lane. Force Duval to beat you from the outside.
 
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If Bagley improves a great deal over the season, this hurts to say, they will be VERY hard to stop come March.:(
 
Kanasas should have blown Kentucky out. Graham, Newman & Vick shot a combined (11-41) from the field and (4-16) from 3. That wont be the norm. If they get Billy Preston back they could be a really good team though they'll still depend a lot on 3s.

Kentucky doesnt have a shooter and I doubt they get much better by the time March rolls around. They have so much length they should out rebound everyone they play, but were tied in rebounding by a WAY undersized team??

Duke is definitely a better team with Bagley, but there's no one who can check Berry. He'll eat them alive. Even with how good Bagley is to beat Duke you have to stop GA. When we play them this year I want Kenny mostly guarding him and no matter what do not help off of him.

The way Izzo told his guys to back down with a lot of time still left was pathetic.
 
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I
WhitePhantoms said:
Kanasas should have blown Kentucky out. Graham, Newman & Vick shot a combined (11-41) from the field and (4-16) from 3. That wont be the norm. If they get Billy Preston back they could be a really good team though they'll still depend a lot on 3s.

Kentucky doesnt have a shooter and I doubt they get much better by the time March rolls around. They have so much length they should out rebound everyone they play, but were tied in rebounding by a WAY undersized team??

Duke is definitely a better team with Bagley, but there's no one who can check Berry. He'll eat them alive. Even with how good Bagley is to beat Duke you have to stop GA. When we play them this year I want Kenny mostly guarding him and no matter what do not help off of him.

The way Izzo told his guys to back down with a lot of time still left was pathetic.
Click to expand...
I believe Kenny will be up in Tripper's grille, but yeah, JB can have a field day dissecting that Zone.
 
I disagree completely. Our team last year was good. But we wouldn't have made mincemeat of any of the teams I saw last night.

duke - is super legit and y'all better start preparing yourselves for them to be in the FF barring any kind of injury or chemistry issues. Duval can't shoot - I agree. But he really didn't need to. He played a great second half. He can penetrate almost at will and he's sneaky on the defensive end. Allen is poised for a big year - frontrunner for POY. Bagley is an absolute monster and better than any recent freshman phenom duke has had - or certainly more versatile than any recent freshman they've had. And then Carter is a man - a throwback load on the block and on the glass. Sprinkle in some Trent shooting and they are certainly a favorite for the title.

MSU - typical MSU: hard-nosed, tough, gritty, deep, etc. One superstar in Bridges (although I don't trust him with the game on the line) and a very good coach (although I think he's slightly overrated by the masses). But every year you know what you're gonna get from them. They'll be there in the end.

KU - we didn't see the best KU last night because Preston didn't play and Graham was off. But they're good. They're good every year. But frankly, off all the teams I saw last night, they'd be my first pick to not show up in March.

UK - super athletic, long, fast, and just getting to know each other. SKJ looked pretty good on the boards in his limited time but UK isn't real deep and they don't have much outside shooting. But if they improve at a reasonable rate throughout the year, they will be very good by the end of the year. Very good. And they don't even have one of their 5 stars playing yet.

I do think our team last year would probably beat the teams I saw last night because of the experience factor but it wouldn't have been a cake walk.
 
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gary-7 said:
...at the same stage would have made complete mincemeat out of any of those teams that played last night. Yeah, I realize it's thiis season but after watching those games color me not impressed about what we're up against at the national level.

Also...
- a couple of days ago I glanced at dook's roster and my first thought was there's no way that bunch would be able to guard anybody, so it came as no surprise they played all Zone.

- I was very underwhelmed by MSU's Zone Offense. Other than attacking the baseline they did a lousy job.

- Duval still can't shoot a lick

- uk is a mess --- lot's of raw talent but not a 2-Guard in the whole bunch... and as a team they can't shoot a lick.

- KU would've blown uk out if they had any depth at all... and if Azubuike is their only Big they are in trouble inside.
Click to expand...
The dook, Michigan State Game was pure streetball. I felt the same that if this is the top tier then a perimeter shooting team will be able to break them down with ease. They also played erratic defense. If you pump faked guys were flying the friendly skies and getting out of position. I think Wichita St. is scarier then anything I saw last night.
 
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Well, I would not call any of them chop liver, it is very early and I have not yet seen any team looking really sharp, including ours.

Duke has the makings of a really tuff out, they don't shoot free throws real well and outside of Tripster and Trent do not jump shoot real well but they are very long. Their x-factor IMO will be Bolden, if he can become that next front court guy off the bench with quality minutes it plays in to our area of weakness (front court).

Ky, really long but no consistent outside shooting, not nearly as potent as they were last season but that length will give them a likely shot at the SEC crown but I don't see them marching real deep in to March.

Kansas, without Preston who himself is not exactly a banger front court guy, they are really small. Azerbuke is OK but he isn't nearly the guy to lead them. Was not really impressed with their back court, I like oiurs much more.

MSU, hey, maybe ya may wan to at least try to guard Tripster, he kinda made yall look hapless.

Really, kinda sad this tourney was played this early because none of the teams looked sharp, disappointing if you really wanted to see some good basketball.
 
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Heels5150 said:
The dook, Michigan State Game was pure streetball. I felt the same that if this is the top tier then a perimeter shooting team will be able to break them down with ease. They also played erratic defense. If you pump faked guys were flying the friendly skies and getting out of position. I think Wichita St. is scarier then anything I saw last night.
Click to expand...

Surprised me and I think most everyone else that duke came out and stayed in a zone? All that length and guys that can move yet they went to a zone and stayed there?
 
gunslingerdick said:
I disagree completely. Our team last year was good. But we wouldn't have made mincemeat of any of the teams I saw last night.

duke - is super legit and y'all better start preparing yourselves for them to be in the FF barring any kind of injury or chemistry issues. Duval can't shoot - I agree. But he really didn't need to. He played a great second half. He can penetrate almost at will and he's sneaky on the defensive end. Allen is poised for a big year - frontrunner for POY. Bagley is an absolute monster and better than any recent freshman phenom duke has had - or certainly more versatile than any recent freshman they've had. And then Carter is a man - a throwback load on the block and on the glass. Sprinkle in some Trent shooting and they are certainly a favorite for the title.

MSU - typical MSU: hard-nosed, tough, gritty, deep, etc. One superstar in Bridges (although I don't trust him with the game on the line) and a very good coach (although I think he's slightly overrated by the masses). But every year you know what you're gonna get from them. They'll be there in the end.

KU - we didn't see the best KU last night because Preston didn't play and Graham was off. But they're good. They're good every year. But frankly, off all the teams I saw last night, they'd be my first pick to not show up in March.

UK - super athletic, long, fast, and just getting to know each other. SKJ looked pretty good on the boards in his limited time but UK isn't real deep and they don't have much outside shooting. But if they improve at a reasonable rate throughout the year, they will be very good by the end of the year. Very good. And they don't even have one of their 5 stars playing yet.

I do think our team last year would probably beat the teams I saw last night because of the experience factor but it wouldn't have been a cake walk.
Click to expand...
MSU is a tough matchup because of their physical style, but c'mon man. It would be Maui all over again.
 
I watched the game without the sound on, so I missed any commentary, but just watching the game, I thought dook looked scary good and scary big ... and that was without Bagley on the floor! I expect them to be in the final four. I also expect their season to be vacated at some point.
 
This current UNC team is a bad team to zone. Can put 4-5 3 point threats out on the court at same time. As long as this group passes the ball and focuses on movement.
 
Put me in the group that wasn't impressed by any of the teams last night.

UK - Down year. They aren't winning the SEC.

KU - Their ceiling is last year's KU team. I think that's unlikely though.

MSU - Looked awful and Bridges seemed very overrated. Can't shoot and turned the ball over a ton.

Duke - Reminded me of 2016 the way their offense was completely reliant on Grayson. Defend grayson, rebound the ball, very beatable.
 
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ProfessorOwl said:
Duke - Reminded me of 2016 the way their offense was completely reliant on Grayson. Defend grayson, rebound the ball, very beatable.
Click to expand...

"Defend Grayson and rebound the ball" are easier said than done. Say what you want about Allen, but the dude can play. If he's hot, he's virtually unguardable. Plus, with Duval breaking down defenses, opponents will have to collapse or Duval will simply make layup after layup. When they collapse, it's an open 3 for Allen. I guess you can tell your defense that whoever is guarding Allen never leaves him, but then your bring Trent's man off of him (better option, I agree) or one of the bigs to rotate off their man and that leaves a big like Bagley or Carter an easy finish.

And oh yeah, the best freshman in the country didn't play but 5 or so minutes in that game last night. You're kidding yourself if you can't recognize that duke has a loaded team and will be making serious noise in the NCAA tournament. What I'm hoping for is some kind of chemistry issues to develop and wreck the team.
 
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gunslingerdick said:
"Defend Grayson and rebound the ball" are easier said than done. Say what you want about Allen, but the dude can play. If he's hot, he's virtually unguardable. Plus, with Duval breaking down defenses, opponents will have to collapse or Duval will simply make layup after layup. When they collapse, it's an open 3 for Allen. I guess you can tell your defense that whoever is guarding Allen never leaves him, but then your bring Trent's man off of him (better option, I agree) or one of the bigs to rotate off their man and that leaves a big like Bagley or Carter an easy finish.

And oh yeah, the best freshman in the country didn't play but 5 or so minutes in that game last night. You're kidding yourself if you can't recognize that duke has a loaded team and will be making serious noise in the NCAA tournament. What I'm hoping for is some kind of chemistry issues to develop and wreck the team.
Click to expand...

Exactly. I can't fairly judge Duke based on last night because Bagley missed most of the game. I do think we have guys like Theo and Kenny who can guard Allen better than the MSU guys did last night. And if the young bigs develop, maybe they can at least contain Duke's front line.
 
MWHeels said:
Exactly. I can't fairly judge Duke based on last night because Bagley missed most of the game. I do think we have guys like Theo and Kenny who can guard Allen better than the MSU guys did last night. And if the young bigs develop, maybe they can at least contain Duke's front line.
Click to expand...

I'm not sold on either of those. Theo and Kenny are good defenders, sure. But honestly, I think we just have to hope that Allen isn't in rhythm when we play them. And as far as our bigs containing theirs...I have no idea who we put on Bagley.
 
The Heels have been known to beat Duke in years where no one thought they could. Hopefully that happens again this year.
 
ProfessorOwl said:
Put me in the group that wasn't impressed by any of the teams last night.

UK - Down year. They aren't winning the SEC.

KU - Their ceiling is last year's KU team. I think that's unlikely though.

MSU - Looked awful and Bridges seemed very overrated. Can't shoot and turned the ball over a ton.

Duke - Reminded me of 2016 the way their offense was completely reliant on Grayson. Defend grayson, rebound the ball, very beatable.
Click to expand...
Honestly, that wasn't Izzo's best coaching performance. Either they haven't worked on Zone-O or he let it get away.
Bridges is a terrific player but him mostly standing around the perimeter jacking up contested 3s makes him pretty one-dimensional.
 
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gary-7 said:
I

I believe Kenny will be up in Tripper's grille, but yeah, JB can have a field day dissecting that Zone.
Click to expand...

I was hoping to see Theo have that pleasure :) .. but I suppose it would depend on who's on the floor at the time.
 
gary-7 said:
Bridges is a terrific player but him mostly standing around the perimeter jacking up contested 3s makes him pretty one-dimensional.
Click to expand...

Honestly, why was he just standing outside? He is a perfect guy to run the baseline and flash to the high post against a 2/3 zone and they just didn't utilize him at all. Very odd.
 
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I was disappointed by what I saw from Bridges. He was really quiet until late in the second half.
 
Didn't watch ether game because, frankly, I could give three shiites about dook, KU or UK. Nothing any of them does at this point matters in the least because every team, us included, is still figuring things out. With that said, I have no doubt that dook looked like a lock for the FF. I can't tell you how many times I have been here and heard the same thing at this point about them. They will impress me IF they get to the FF this season. That is a long way from now and I am not worried about them or our chances to beat them.

Same with KU and UK. Heck, we lost to some no-name wannabes early on and came back with a vengeance after people wrote us off. Likewise, we have looked like we were a shoe-in for a championship in November only to flame out, so anything can happen.

Just purely speculating here, but my guess is K has this dook team firing pretty good right now. Let's see if they maintain it. Trippy McWhiplash is one or two foe faceplants from being sent packing for good. Let him go against someone who gets into his head or shuts him down defensively and see if he doesn't do something stupid. Or let some 5 star who believed K's crap about PT realize he is nothing more than a seat warmer for some "kneel and bobber" in K's lineup and then start getting a little disgruntled. Then we can see how things go for them.

Sorry, but as good a coach as K is, he has royally screwed over a lot of kids the last 10 or so years and also let that bunch of floor slappers get away with far too much not to have some of that come back on him. Hell, when even dESPN starts laughing at some of his crap, you know the shine has worn off. IF he can manage to keep Trippy McWhiplash on a leash AND pacify the bench warmers WHEN he shortens his lineup, then perhaps he will see the FF. Until then, I will have to respectfully wait and see. before I believe any of the dook hype.

Give me this UNC team coming off a National Championship year any day of the week and twice on Sunday over dook, UK or KU. I sure as hell wouldn't bet against them.
 
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Barring injuries sook is going to be very good. With Bagley they owend the rebounding margin. Will be a tough out this yr
 
gunslingerdick said:
"Defend Grayson and rebound the ball" are easier said than done. Say what you want about Allen, but the dude can play. If he's hot, he's virtually unguardable. Plus, with Duval breaking down defenses, opponents will have to collapse or Duval will simply make layup after layup. When they collapse, it's an open 3 for Allen. I guess you can tell your defense that whoever is guarding Allen never leaves him, but then your bring Trent's man off of him (better option, I agree) or one of the bigs to rotate off their man and that leaves a big like Bagley or Carter an easy finish.

And oh yeah, the best freshman in the country didn't play but 5 or so minutes in that game last night. You're kidding yourself if you can't recognize that duke has a loaded team and will be making serious noise in the NCAA tournament. What I'm hoping for is some kind of chemistry issues to develop and wreck the team.
Click to expand...

I'm responding to what I saw last night. Maybe Bagley is the best freshman since Davis and they go undefeated. I didn't see that last night, because the guy barely played.
 
Littlejon said:
Or let some 5 star who believed K's crap about PT realize he is nothing more than a seat warmer for some "kneel and bobber" in K's lineup and then start getting a little disgruntled. Then we can see how things go for them.
.
Click to expand...

I don't "hope" for injuries to any teams. If it happens, it happens and I won't cry for dook either. But aside from injuries, this is something I can hope for and as I alluded to earlier in this thread (or maybe a different thread), this is a possibility. It has seemed to be common with duke in their transformation to being a hired gun program. Bagley might sit a game or two so K can throw Boldin a bone and placate him while Bagley is out. But that's our best bet. Word on the street is that Boldin didn't even want to come back after last year and someone talked him into it. Hopefully, he gets buried on the bench when Bagley returns and then gets all pissy and starts disrupting things. That or Vanilla Whip gets to tripping people again or giving titty twisters or the other bizarre stuff that duke players engage in. Here's to hoping.
 
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gary-7 said:
...at the same stage would have made complete mincemeat out of any of those teams that played last night. Yeah, I realize it's thiis season but after watching those games color me not impressed about what we're up against at the national level.

Also...
- a couple of days ago I glanced at dook's roster and my first thought was there's no way that bunch would be able to guard anybody, so it came as no surprise they played all Zone.

- I was very underwhelmed by MSU's Zone Offense. Other than attacking the baseline they did a lousy job.

- Duval still can't shoot a lick

- uk is a mess --- lot's of raw talent but not a 2-Guard in the whole bunch... and as a team they can't shoot a lick.

- KU would've blown uk out if they had any depth at all... and if Azubuike is their only Big they are in trouble inside.
Click to expand...

Let's be realistic. Last year Duke beat us twice and they a 10x better this season. I love the Heels as much as anyone but this is really reaching.
 
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