Prayers for All Affected @ Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School
- Thread starter BillyL
- Start date
Th
The rest of the world is filled with homicidal maniacs, eh?
ETA...take Chicago, Washington DC and Detroit out of the mix and the US plummets.
The rest of the world is filled with homicidal maniacs, eh?
ETA...take Chicago, Washington DC and Detroit out of the mix and the US plummets.
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Some thoughtful and valid questions here. I'm not going to try to answer them because I've got stuff to do today. But, this is comparable in many ways to problems in my industry (healthcare). We complain about having the highest per capita healthcare spending in the world with the worst outcomes among industrialized nations. On the other hand, if you want to drink 5 liters of Mountain Dew and smoke 3 packs of cigarettes every day you can, because 'Merica. There are consequences to living in a country that places a premium on individual freedoms, often to the detriment of the public good or even common sense. These mass shootings are just another undesirable product of that culture.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/opin...hool-shootings-already-year-column/343100002/
18 SCHOOL SHOOTINGS SINCE JAN. 1, 2018. Everytown for Gun Safety says this is the 18th school shooting in 2018 -- which includes shootings where guns were fired accidentally and no one was injured, suicides, and those near campus grounds. Three were in Texas. including one where a teen at Italy High School shot and wounded a girl over a breakup. There have been more than 300 school shootings since 2013. That's an average of one per week.
So does anyone have a prob with an 18 year old with a history of mental illness and violence being able to legally purchase a weapon designed specefically to facilitate killing multiple persons at close range? I do. If the 2nd amendments does indeed protect this then the ****ing amendment is wrong and needs to be changed. If gun laws allow this then the laws need to be changed. To think otherwise makes me think someone is more interested in favoring some bull shit partisan agenda over common sense and the welfare of the people.
Are you talking about this specific case or in general. If you're talking about in general then it's not as simple as yes/no. It's a much more nuanced answer.
The government already listens to your phone calls. And it does save lives. I'm certainly not for domestic spying on citizens, but its definitely already happening whether you like it or not.
Gun laws are nothing like the government spying on telecommunications. But setting that aside, we regulate almost everything in our lives more than we regulate guns in this country. The idea that this is going to lead us down some slippery slope of government regulation is a bad joke.
Why is that relevant? Most murders are committed within racial boundaries. We've all heard your arguments against diversity, and they're not very good.
No it isn't. An 18 year old can't buy a beer, regardless of his psychological/criminal track record, and shouldn't be able to buy a gun either.
Right. So since the government is overreaching as it is, might as well just open it all up. That makes sense.
Ask a veternarian if it's harder to control a room full of dogs or a room full of dogs and cats.
Let me rephrase. I'm uncomfortable just slapping a label on a group of people and then taking away their constitutional rights. Each case should be treated different. Especially given the statistics behind who actual kills people. Given all of that, among other reasons, I think that makes it more nuanced.
Not sure what your point is here. It's an irrelevant comparison and, to use one of your favorite phrases, a straw man argument.
Actually both. And sometimes we overthink things based on nuances. Seems to me we protect an interpretation of the 2nd amend to the point of erring to the side of caution as if god himself will strike us dead should we dare blunder into the constitutional blasphemy of mistakingly denying someone a gun who should have the right to one. Fuk the nuances. Imo the general public shouldnt have access to military style weaponry period but i know the penis impaired repub god nuts wont go for that and i begrudgingly admit the constitution doesnt either. But the fact remains that it is perfectly legal, as evidenced by this case, for an 18 yr old with a history of violence and mental illness and a social media presence of threats, to purchase a weapon designed for one purpose- to kill a shit load of people. Not for hunting, not for self defense, but solely to massacre human beings. That is just WRONG. Bump stocks, pistol grip long rifles, hi capacity mags, make it ALL illegal to posess and sell. Noone under 21 buys a gun either. Mental health and criminal background checks. And if u give a kid a gun or are negligent in its storage or u allow anyone to illegally obtain one then you’re legally resp for what he does with it.
@heelmanwilm and btw, an example of how f’d up the gun laws are, that same 18 year old that can legally purchase a semiautomatic rifle, has to wait three more years to buy handgun.
perhaps you’re being sarcastic, so if you are, now show me a picture of your bullshit then you will have nailed it.
Ok, there is a lot I want to respond to, but I'm on my phone and don't want to type out a long post. For now I'd like to ask you one question. If the stats showed that mentally ill people were more likely to be a victim of gun violence as opposed to causing it, would you still be ok with singling them out?
Cats and dogs are different species with an obvious predator/prey relationship. Human beings with different skin tones are not different species, despite what you may believe.
We don't let 18 year olds buy alcohol because they generally aren't mature enough to drink in a responsible manner.
If they aren't mature enough to buy beer why let them buy a gun? You can take a child hunting or to the range for all I care, but they don't need to be able to purchase a gun. If we can't group together everyone under 18, then why have any age restriction at all? Telling a 12 year old he can't buy a gun is "slapping a label on him and taking away his constitutional rights."
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If you can convince the 300 million people in the US of that, I'll get on board.
Not sure what you’re gettin at. I dont want mentally ill people to have guns. At least not guns designed to inflict mass casualties. I know thats a broad brush and i’m not qualified to say what “mentally ill” is. But this guy should def have fallen into the category.
The FBI failed to act on a tip given by a friend of this killer . . . the tip came in on January 5th of this year.
I am now sadder than I was the day before yesterday.
Dammitol.
I am now sadder than I was the day before yesterday.
Dammitol.
There is a precendent for denying constitutional rights when it infringes on public safety. I have the const right to travel where i like. But i cant cruise through a disaster area under curfew. I have the right to free speech but i cant scream fire in a theatre. I think u can make the case that mentally ill people shouldnt own firearms. Seems like all the recent shooters have been prescribed psychotropic drugs. I know the theatre guy and gay bar guy had. And the sandy hook shooter. I know its a slippery slope but tbh i dont care anymore. And i think public opinionnis turning as well. On this and gun control in general.
They were shown social media posts and provided specefic info on his guns. Nothing. What a shit show. Heads should roll.
The FBI has been pretty busy, no? Between Russia and college basketball, you can’t expect them to take on something as trivial as preventing a mass shooting.
What im getting at is people who are not mentality ill are more likely to kill people. Why should they get to keep their gun since they are the more dangerous group?
People are screaming louder for their investigations into specifically Russia but also NCAA than they are for them to stop these shootings. Sad really.
They are?
The totally-sane, well-adjusted individual is more likely to kill innocent people than those who hear voices and have a cheese-less cracker?
I realize there are exceptions. But, I'm probably more concerned about the person who talks to the walls and wears two different shoes.
a buddy/neighbor of mine...hope you can open.
Agreed. Once we all figure out that our guys are just as corrupt as yours guys then it makes it easier to avoid allowing them to use our emotions and passions for what we believe in against us.
I’m a conservative and have no problems banning certain type of firearms but do I think that will solve anything. Nope. The hippa privacy laws surrounding mental illness make this problem extremely difficult to prevent.
That's awful. Can't believe you're neighbors with a dook fan.
Yeah your boys are to busy following trump. You said it. You feel better now? What a great and upstanding FBI we have.
It appears he did have a lot of hate in his heart . .
From the article linked:
Nikolas Cruz, the 19-year-old who confessed to the school shooting at a Florida high school this week, reportedly expressed racist and violent views in a private (Instagram) chat group.
"I hate jews, ni**ers, immigrants,” Cruz reportedly wrote in the group, which he had named “Murica (American flag emoji) (eagle emoji) great.”
In the span of hundreds of messages, Cruz openly discussed killing people and specifically referred to killing Mexicans, Jews, gay people and black people, according to CNN. "Shoot them in the back of head,” he reportedly wrote in reference to gay people. He also espoused a disdain for white women, particularly if they were in interracial relationships.
One member of the group chat told CNN that Cruz “seemed nice but also had some mental issues." "All (I know) is that he likes guns and really hates liberals,” the member said.
http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-brief...rly-expressed-violent-racist-views-in-private
From the article linked:
Nikolas Cruz, the 19-year-old who confessed to the school shooting at a Florida high school this week, reportedly expressed racist and violent views in a private (Instagram) chat group.
"I hate jews, ni**ers, immigrants,” Cruz reportedly wrote in the group, which he had named “Murica (American flag emoji) (eagle emoji) great.”
In the span of hundreds of messages, Cruz openly discussed killing people and specifically referred to killing Mexicans, Jews, gay people and black people, according to CNN. "Shoot them in the back of head,” he reportedly wrote in reference to gay people. He also espoused a disdain for white women, particularly if they were in interracial relationships.
One member of the group chat told CNN that Cruz “seemed nice but also had some mental issues." "All (I know) is that he likes guns and really hates liberals,” the member said.
http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-brief...rly-expressed-violent-racist-views-in-private
Are you actually dumb enough to believe that investigation had anything to do with them mishandling this case?
