Great win and a great thread will NOT be destroyed by a few malcontents.
Stats and stuff (dook game 2)...
- Thread starter gary-7
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i don't think it's a conspiracy but i've seen enough crap to say that i wouldn't rule it out.
if you've watched the garbage dook has gotten away with the last 20 years i think the argument for conspiracy is stronger than the argument for incompetence.
if you've watched the garbage dook has gotten away with the last 20 years i think the argument for conspiracy is stronger than the argument for incompetence.
How does someone fall to the floor by getting hit on the hand
Dook took 35 FTs to our 17 (after deleting the 4 we shot due to INTENTIONAL fouls). More than double. Different whistles on opposite ends of the court all game long. And we still beat those turds by 7. SUCK IT, Dook!
Two of the worst we get stuck with on a regular basis.
And I already told you my feelings on Stephens
Eh, there were some tough calls but conspiracy talk is silly. Some of you folks need to watch other college teams play basketball as well. Justin fouled Allen on that three but he flopped to sell it for sure. It was a foul though.
Allen drew a number of fouls he didn't deserve. That isn't uncommon for him. He doesn't take a bunch of abuse like some of these silly Duke fans believe. He creates contact and is pretty clever about it so sometimes gets the calls and sometimes does not. Against us last night he did.
It didn't matter. Berry and Hicks made sure of it.
Allen drew a number of fouls he didn't deserve. That isn't uncommon for him. He doesn't take a bunch of abuse like some of these silly Duke fans believe. He creates contact and is pretty clever about it so sometimes gets the calls and sometimes does not. Against us last night he did.
It didn't matter. Berry and Hicks made sure of it.
Look, the LOM teaches his guys to sell fouls and they're very adept at doing it. I've come to expect it from his players. Reddick and Sub Zero were adept at using the leg whip to draw fouls on jumpers. Their players were flopping at the slightest contact as far back as Wojo. Now Allen has added the head snap to their repertoire, along with the occasional tripping and elbow to the chin.
That dook is allowed to get away with that bush league crap is the fault of the refs. We can't expect any better from the LOM but we certainly have a right to expect more from referees.
That dook is allowed to get away with that bush league crap is the fault of the refs. We can't expect any better from the LOM but we certainly have a right to expect more from referees.
Just rewatched evaluating the zebras, rewinding, etc., and it was every bit as bad as I thought it was in real time. In fact, the only surprise was that Jones was even worse than Nestor (no wonder MJ was letting him have it
).Also confirmed that Groover called a very solid game... only missed two and both were understandable. In fact, he is the one who made the two very good calls on Tatum (grabbing Theo's arm on a FT block-out and shooting JJ that elbow on a late drive). and honestly that fits what I've seen from him mostly.
One other observation watching with sound --- I generally like Bilas, but he still is capable of going full dookie at times when he calls this rivalry game. His trying to excuse Allen's elbow was farcicle, for just one example. But hey, he's been on our side vs the NCAA so I'll give him a pass
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I think Bilas is one of the best. But he is a dook alumnus and he can't help but show his bias when we play them. I agree that he took that bias to a farcical level when he tried to justify Allen's elbow to Brandon's chin. But all in all, he's excellent. And as you said, he's been critical of the NCAA's improper investigation methods and it's a rare dookie bird that will sing that tune.
Yes - Bilas is very good overall - I like him quite a bit and I think he is as objective as can be expected, even calling a Duke UNC game. By objective as can be expected, I mean, not perfect, but as good as you can expect for someone with such an obvious emotional investment in one team vs. the other.
Imagine if an ex-Heel player or coach announced the game. Its not intentional, but just almost impossible for the guy's alma mater preference and passion not to bleed in and bias the announcing a bit.
Which is almost to say maybe its not a great idea to have alumni from one of the teams call the game. But that would exclude Bilas from a lot of games, and he is really good at it. And, he gives the Heels collectively and their players individually tons of credit / props even during the Heels / Duke game. In fact, I'd venture to say he had more good to say about Hicks/JJ/JB than about the Duke top players in that game. His defense of the Trip's elbow was about all that was suspect.... and asking for the block call when three guys went down and there was no call (where there likely should've been some call - I agree).
If you didn't have Bilas call the game, you'd end up with incompetent clowns like Boris Dork (Doris Burke - who is an embarrassment to sports announcement) or Dick Vitale.... or remember the Mike Patrick days?
IMO Bilas-Shulman is as good as it gets. I like both of them working together a lot. True pros, not overly emotional or biased, knowledgeable, funny / witty, don't have an agenda or axe to grind against certain teams or players, they fight against / ridicule stupid wrong clichés, don't rely on the same old schtick game after game - easy to listen to.
Plus they call out the sham that is the NCAA and their "concern for the student athlete" (AKA generators of the almighty $). I like that.
Imagine if an ex-Heel player or coach announced the game. Its not intentional, but just almost impossible for the guy's alma mater preference and passion not to bleed in and bias the announcing a bit.
Which is almost to say maybe its not a great idea to have alumni from one of the teams call the game. But that would exclude Bilas from a lot of games, and he is really good at it. And, he gives the Heels collectively and their players individually tons of credit / props even during the Heels / Duke game. In fact, I'd venture to say he had more good to say about Hicks/JJ/JB than about the Duke top players in that game. His defense of the Trip's elbow was about all that was suspect.... and asking for the block call when three guys went down and there was no call (where there likely should've been some call - I agree).
If you didn't have Bilas call the game, you'd end up with incompetent clowns like Boris Dork (Doris Burke - who is an embarrassment to sports announcement) or Dick Vitale.... or remember the Mike Patrick days?
IMO Bilas-Shulman is as good as it gets. I like both of them working together a lot. True pros, not overly emotional or biased, knowledgeable, funny / witty, don't have an agenda or axe to grind against certain teams or players, they fight against / ridicule stupid wrong clichés, don't rely on the same old schtick game after game - easy to listen to.
Plus they call out the sham that is the NCAA and their "concern for the student athlete" (AKA generators of the almighty $). I like that.
1. Groover is the least experienced of the group, and the least biased. I noticed he has done a few of our games this year.
2. Jay showed his true dook colors Saturday night.
Yes, you get what you get with an alum calling these games for sure, and yeah, Bilas is generally good and certainly beats much of the alternative (can you imagine Dakich calling that game? Yikes!
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Yeah, I think Bilas is pretty much the best ESPN has to offer, wrong team affiliation aside. I think he has good takes on many aspects of the game.
How does someone fall to the floor by getting hit on the hand
duke is very well taught to sell the foul, that is not news, we have seen that for many many many years. I actually do not fault them for that either, it is only smart to do all you can to sell something as a foul, add a little mustard to the hot dog if you will.
Now I am not a fan of the offensive player initialing the contact and the defensive player getting the whistle, the jumping in to a defender is classic duke and they get away with that constantly to this day. Justin did nothing to make tripster fall to the court, he barely got his hand but trippy sold it by falling. I would have loved to have seen BRob crumble to the court holding his jaw and lay on the court for a couple minutes needing assistance to the side lines and being led stumbling to the locker room only to emerge a few minutes later ready to roll. Selling it that strong may have gotten Tripster tossed for that fore arm shiver he delivered, would have loved to have seen him tossed for that.
I think Bilas is clearly one of the best available these days. I have no real problem with almost all of his comments. I did think he jumped the shark a little even trying to defend Jack the Tripper, but still not a bad %.
The day is coming soon where they will enforce the rules on the books! The flopping is a technical foul and peeps have had their fill of puke's non-manly antics!
The day is coming soon where they will enforce the rules on the books! The flopping is a technical foul and peeps have had their fill of puke's non-manly antics!
The Kick-Out, Head Snap, Tripping Up, Flopping, Back Shoving, foul line holding, ALL needs to be shown to these sorry zebras.
I'm thinking about making some more GIFs
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Just rewatched evaluating the zebras, rewinding, etc., and it was every bit as bad as I thought it was in real time. In fact, the only surprise was that Jones was even worse than Nestor (no wonder MJ was letting him have it
Also confirmed that Groover called a very solid game... only missed two and both were understandable. In fact, he is the one who made the two very good calls on Tatum (grabbing Theo's arm on a FT block-out and shooting JJ that elbow on a late drive). and honestly that fits what I've seen from him mostly.
One other observation watching with sound --- I generally like Bilas, but he still is capable of going full dookie at times when he calls this rivalry game. His trying to excuse Allen's elbow was farcicle, for just one example. But hey, he's been on our side vs the NCAA so I'll give him a pass
Is Jones the bald-headed guy? If so, he has killed us every game I have seen this season. Dude sucks bad.
bilas is outstanding, the best in college sports.
if you think otherwise then you're foolish or just hate because that's all you know how to do.
if you think otherwise then you're foolish or just hate because that's all you know how to do.
Agree... a couple of moments of weakness in the biggest rivalry game of the year shouldn't taint his insight, wit and honesty.
I also like Laphonso Ellis, not as polished as Bilas, but he oozes a love of the game with every call.
I don't believe anyone ITT is hating on Bilas, and in fact, pretty much everyone here has been complimentary of him in general. Commenting on his understandable human bias that comes out at times in a rivalry game-call is neither "foolish" nor is it "hate"... unless of course you're just trying to stir something up.
If not Bilas then who?: Dakich, Vitale, Patrick, Burke, Gminski, Elmore, Gottlieb, pukie V's partner OB whoever that is!
I will even take J Williams and Seth is getting more and more palatable as he gets farther from coaching.
I will even take J Williams and Seth is getting more and more palatable as he gets farther from coaching.
Speaking of Elmore, he used to be pretty good but has sort of turned into a crank in recent years.
As for other local ACC guys, I always thought Dan Bonner was decent, and even Gminski. Among the newer guys Cory Alexander is solid, and I liked what I've heard from Jason Capel.
Amazing contribution as always. How many people in this thread said Bilas is good or the best? Constructive criticism is ok, is it not?
Bottom line the good guys won and that is all I need to know and want to remember
Completely agree with everything you said. And I'll also add Big Brad to the guys I like to listen to.
As long as Doris Burke is not calling our game I am fine with pretty much who ever is calling it. Bilas is the best in the biz at this point, I actually have begun to enjoy Jay Williams a lot. Not a huge Greenburg fan but I will take him any day over Doris Burke, her voice is like nails on a chaulk board to me..
Big Brad was on an ESPN spot and he said he cannot watch the dook-UNC games and his best friend is a dookie and they text back and forth but he is too nervous to watch. He said he will flip it on for 30 seconds or so , but when dook gets a couple of buckets in a row he turns it back off because he feels he is jinxing the team. He says his son watches and keeps him posted. I am glad to say that I by choice have no close friends who are dookies . I consider it a serious character flaw.
Yep. I love the fonz too. Great voice and enthusiasm. Makes me think he should be a DJ spinning old jazz records.
58, that is hilarious, but understandable for Brad. Its good insight into how seriously these current and former players take it.....much more than most fans.
Like Brad - Dook is the one game I just have a hard time watching real time (live). It is just too stressful and I think somehow the Heels will do better if I'm not watching them But its only for Dook games. So I'll admit it - the Dook program is "in my head" but only during game time. They are just such a different, better team when they play us. I always feel like Dook's plays their best 2 games of the year when they play us.
Forgot about Bonner, Alexander, and Big Brad! I can't believe I left Brad out though, but he does pretty much stick to NASCAR. Bonner occasionally gets on my nerves, but I do like Corey and I love Brad. Also love Jones and Montross!
On a side note: Is it me or does Jones Angell (or one of the guys on the podcast) sound exactly like E. Montross?
On a side note: Is it me or does Jones Angell (or one of the guys on the podcast) sound exactly like E. Montross?
Yeah, watch his no-calling handy work here:
100%, no-brainer Charge. Hicks beats him to the spot before Jackson leaves the floor, both feet outside the arc and no lateral movement before contact. And look who's the baseline official who swallows his whistle. Fortunately we got the rebound.
Or this one from later:
Jefferson cleans out not one but two guys with a blatant back shove. C'mon Les, big guys don't go flying past you like that without a lot of help.
A couple of GIFs for my friend @mikeirbyusa
We survived these boners and more this time, but how many times have shenanigans like these bitten in the ass over the years vs the dookies?
And BTW: Bilas called both of these wrong.
Yeah, watch his no-calling handy work here:
100%, no-brainer Charge. Hicks beats him to the spot before Jackson leaves the floor, both feet outside the arc and no lateral movement before contact. And look who's the baseline official who swallows his whistle. Fortunately we got the rebound.
Or this one from later:
Jefferson cleans out not one but two guys with a blatant back shove. C'mon Les, big guys don't go flying past you like that without a lot of help.
A couple of GIFs for my friend @mikeirbyusa
We survived these boners and more this time, but how many times have shenanigans like these bitten in the ass over the years vs the dookies?
And BTW: Bilas called both of these wrong.
These were 2 that had me screaming at the TV. To make matters worse, refs called a charge on Berry earlier that should have been Jefferson's 4th foul instead. Amile was never squared up and his right foot was still sliding when contact occurred. Hicks was 100% squared up and both feet set. No call.
Additionally, our guys were hammered repeatedly in 2 earlier loose ball scrums. Result of both? NO fouls called, tie-up called for dook ball. But later, on dooks end, JB gets knocked aside from behind in another loose ball scrum, Still No call, but then when JB makes contact SUDDENLY, for the first time all game, we ARE calling fouls in loose ball melees. Those guys sucked terribly, and Jones was the worst offender.
Yeah, watch his no-calling handy work here:
100%, no-brainer Charge. Hicks beats him to the spot before Jackson leaves the floor, both feet outside the arc and no lateral movement before contact. And look who's the baseline official who swallows his whistle. Fortunately we got the rebound.
Or this one from later:
Jefferson cleans out not one but two guys with a blatant back shove. C'mon Les, big guys don't go flying past you like that without a lot of help.
A couple of GIFs for my friend @mikeirbyusa
We survived these boners and more this time, but how many times have shenanigans like these bitten in the ass over the years vs the dookies?
And BTW: Bilas called both of these wrong.
I like the GIF work - helps make sure everyone is on the same page talking about the calls we saw. Both of those are pretty bad no-calls indeed.
I'm so old I thought GIF was peanut butter!
But I like the little video clip things!
But I like the little video clip things!
Look just as bad/worse in these as what I remembered. The disparity was a dern joke!
