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OOTB's Political Thread . ..

Despite pretty good qualifications and values, he is a stuttering old man, largely in place now because the GOP propped an f-up. The GOP could dominate politics in the early 2020's by pushing fwd decent candidates, but no.
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nothing like stepping in it right from the start.
 
He's an absolute do-nothing, lifelong politician. WTF are you talking about? Lol. And on top of that, he's an old, senile, mush-brained octogenarian who has no business being in charge of his household, let alone, our country.
And all you had to do was put forward ANY GOP candidate other than Trump.

Never-Trumpers, you call them RINOs, are what moved Biden past the goal-line. Sleep in the bed you made.

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Ballot Collection is and has been legal and secure in many states for eons. It is legit because of signature checking, ballot tracking, etc.

Fraud via ballot collection would entail a) forgery that isn't detected, b) ensuring someone requests a mailed ballot to their home then willingly gives it to a forger. Every election forgery IS detected and prosecuted, multiple ballots ARE detected and prosecuted too.

Security measures for absentee ballots, mail-in ballots, and ballots submitted via ballot collection are all the same. Further, there is no indication, evidence or proof that ballot collection, mail-in / absentee lend to more fraud, even in 2020.

Finally, since you keep talking about 2020, availability of more mail-in didn't drive voter turnout in 2020. A divisive, offensive candidate drove voter turnout.
The cesspool doesn’t have the balls to come and say why they want it harder for people to vote but people know.
 
Ballot Collection is and has been legal and secure in many states for eons. It is legit because of signature checking, ballot tracking, etc.

Fraud via ballot collection would entail a) forgery that isn't detected, b) ensuring someone requests a mailed ballot to their home then willingly gives it to a forger. Every election forgery IS detected and prosecuted, multiple ballots ARE detected and prosecuted too.

Security measures for absentee ballots, mail-in ballots, and ballots submitted via ballot collection are all the same. Further, there is no indication, evidence or proof that ballot collection, mail-in / absentee lend to more fraud, even in 2020.

Finally, since you keep talking about 2020, availability of more mail-in didn't drive voter turnout in 2020. A divisive, offensive candidate drove voter turnout.
why do you keep harping on fraud when I keep saying fraud is not my contention. You know damn well that the loosened Covid rules was a setup for collecting ballots that would not have otherwise been turned in. You can say all you want to that it was the opposition candidate that caused the record turnout, but you and I both know that had the election been conducted normally, no such turnout would have occurred even if a resurrected Adolf Hitler had been the opponent.
 
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and again, you put words in my mouth to make a a bullshit contention for the purpose of using that to dodge the fact that I showed you to be a lying POS. Any particular reason you don't want to address your losing 'fraud' bet? Why don't you clear that up for us?

I have never had much at all to say about absentee balloting where it is legitimately used by those who find it physically impossible to visit the polling place. I have no problem with legitimate absentee ballots. Ballot harvesting is not the legitimate use of absentee balloting.
This is another example of you pretending that your skewered opinion is the end-all and be-all of things. Example: the 2020 election was America's most secure election in history, and yet you want to bitch about particular elements of it that don't matter whatsoever.

You are simply a whiney pussy old fart who isn't happy unless you're bitching at the world.
 
The cesspool doesn’t have the balls to come and say why they want it harder for people to vote but people know.
Pretty much.

But also i think it is important that election security discussion and 2020 should NOT go hand-in-hand. They're unrelated.

If people that we should only have in-person voting with finger-print-based security because they want 0% fraud, that's fine, but don't make it about 2020, cuz 2020 was going to happen no matter what in-person vs mail-in rules were in place. (And since @bluetoe 'bates to 2000 mules he should know ballot collections rules didn't change at all in 2020. There was more mail-in, meaning there could've been an increase in ballot collection, but if it was enough to tip the scales it would've been caught).
 
The cesspool doesn’t have the balls to come and say why they want it harder for people to vote but people know.
OK, the hell with it, I'll go ahead and say it. It's because we want elections to be conducted fairly and honestly. I know you're opposed to that, but you'll just have to deal with it.

To begin with, 'harder' is hardly a reasonable way to describe measures to help eliminate the possibility of improper balloting. 'Fairer' is the word you should be using.
 
And all you had to do was put forward ANY GOP candidate other than Trump.

Never-Trumpers, you call them RINOs, are what moved Biden past the goal-line. Sleep in the bed you made.

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Literally ruining the country, putting undo financial stress on the majority of Americans and knocking us from the world's top spot seems like a reasonable "consequence" for supporting Trump.
 
This is another example of you pretending that your skewered opinion is the end-all and be-all of things. Example: the 2020 election was America's most secure election in history, and yet you want to bitch about particular elements of it that don't matter whatsoever.

You are simply a whiney pussy old fart who isn't happy unless you're bitching at the world.
lol what about that fraud thing, you lying, deflecting POS. Thanks for the opportunity to show ONCE AGAIN what a lying lowlife you are. LMAO.
 
why do you keep harping on fraud when I keep saying fraud is not my contention. You know damn well that the loosened Covid rules was a setup for collecting ballots that would not have otherwise been turned in. You can say all you want to that it was the opposition candidate that caused the record turnout, but you and I both know that had the election been conducted normally, no such turnout would have occurred even if a resurrected Adolf Hitler had been the opponent.
Regarding 2020 turnout, how many former non-voters voted via mail? Do you know? That's the key question in your entire dreamt-up premise. And of that group, how many did so via ballot collection instead of sticking into their local drop-box or mail-box? Not nearly enough to move the needle.

Lots of mail-in was simply by old people who typically voted in person but opted for safety. Like my parents and tons of out-of-shape people (most of america) and tons of elder folks.

Also regarding turn-out, how many die-hard repubs cast vote for Biden? A bunch. That same ire stirred former non-voters.
 
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This is another example of you pretending that your skewered opinion is the end-all and be-all of things. Example: the 2020 election was America's most secure election in history, and yet you want to bitch about particular elements of it that don't matter whatsoever.

You are simply a whiney pussy old fart who isn't happy unless you're bitching at the world.

I keep hearing this. And ever time I hear it, I wonder what kind of metrics they used to make that claim? I don't want a link to Huff Post, WaPo or NYT where someone just says it. Or they have quotes of someone saying it. I want to know the actual data that reveals this was the most secure election ever. And if that's the case, are those claiming such saying that our elections in the past were not secure? Does that mean that we had elected officials that shouldn't have been elected?
 
If this electoral reform gets pushed thru, and if this climate-related bill gets pushed thru I think it is time to recognize quite of a bit of BIPARTISAN legislation is coming from the Biden WH admin.
 
If this electoral reform gets pushed thru, and if this climate-related bill gets pushed thru I think it is time to recognize quite of a bit of BIPARTISAN legislation is coming from the Biden WH admin.

Slow down. When the GOP gets back in control, they'll squash all of this garbage and we'll hopefully get back on the right track.

Machin, even though he's caved late, at least drug his feet long enough that even if this shit gets passed, it won't have time to get off the ground before the GOP controlled Congress dials all of this lunacy back.
 
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I keep hearing this. And ever time I hear it, I wonder what kind of metrics they used to make that claim? I don't want a link to Huff Post, WaPo or NYT where someone just says it. Or they have quotes of someone saying it. I want to know the actual data that reveals this was the most secure election ever. And if that's the case, are those claiming such saying that our elections in the past were not secure? Does that mean that we had elected officials that shouldn't have been elected?
One fact is that more and more states (and of course precincts) have become paper-trail-oriented, meaning during audits you can do hand-recounts of actual paper to tally numbers. You know, like the audits in all the purple states which show Biden won because of massive turnout and lots of never-trumpers RINOs flipping to Dem for a day.
 
One fact is that more and more states (and of course precincts) have become paper-trail-oriented, meaning during audits you can do hand-recounts of actual paper to tally numbers. You know, like the audits in all the purple states which show Biden won because of massive turnout and lots of never-trumpers RINOs flipping to Dem for a day.

I keep hearing this. And ever time I hear it, I wonder what kind of metrics they used to make that claim? I don't want a link to Huff Post, WaPo or NYT where someone just says it. Or they have quotes of someone saying it. I want to know the actual data that reveals this was the most secure election ever. And if that's the case, are those claiming such saying that our elections in the past were not secure? Does that mean that we had elected officials that shouldn't have been elected?
 
^Paper-based means more secure because of better auditing.

Google paper-based, look at the public docs indicating the 2020 had more paper-based than prior. It's that easy.
 
Best thing about all this 2020 election-fraud ire is that repubs feel only dems would cheat.

Only dems would take advantage of things like ballot collection, despite the most recent mass-fraud ballot-collection happening on the R side, right here in NC.

Of all the 'dead voter' charges we've seen in the news, the perp is always a repub...
 
I keep hearing this. And ever time I hear it, I wonder what kind of metrics they used to make that claim? I don't want a link to Huff Post, WaPo or NYT where someone just says it. Or they have quotes of someone saying it. I want to know the actual data that reveals this was the most secure election ever. And if that's the case, are those claiming such saying that our elections in the past were not secure? Does that mean that we had elected officials that shouldn't have been elected?
I believe this quote pretty well sums up the answer to your question:
In the statement, election officials noted that though some states may do recounts, “All of the states with close results in the 2020 presidential race have paper records of each vote, allowing the ability to go back and count each ballot if necessary.” This beefs up the security of the vote and allows officials to correct and identify mistakes in the counting process.
Trump’s own officials say 2020 was America’s most secure election in history
 
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lol what about that fraud thing, you lying, deflecting POS. Thanks for the opportunity to show ONCE AGAIN what a lying lowlife you are. LMAO.
I believe you're the one who completely wigged out last night when it became apparent you could not produce the material to support your wild claims. Have fun in the loser's bracket.
 
This line of thinking and justification is called the legislative process. You elect people to support views on certain outcomes and they pass laws accordingly. Having a shitty "legal foundation" is exactly why Roe "deserved to be struck down." That's the judicial process. Ends never justify the means legally, that's legislating from the bench and was the problem with Roe in the beginning.

I am and have always been pro-choice, but Roe was faulty legal reasoning. The powers that be could have spent all that time, money, effort, etc. on legislating and codifying the concept of abortion, but didn't. Now, they want to scream about these very narrow exceptions that are happening. The Lifers would point out the thousands upon thousands of people who now are not dying via abortion. And you say that "red states go bananas in banning it without exceptions." One could argue that the abortion promoters had gone bananas without exception. Having the ability to have an abortion at any point up to birth and even having idiots like the former Va gov/pediatrician say things like allowing the baby to be born, set it aside and have a conversation were huge against those in favor or a more reasonable approach. If they had stopped with something like no abortions after 20 weeks except in medical emergencies, we are likely to be never having this discussion.

This is where I grant you a great deal of what you said.

Democrats had majorities at various points in Congress for years. Decades even. They didn't give a serious enough attempt to codify or legalize abortion. That's on them.

Furthermore, we are also of one mind when it comes to the dimensions of abortion itself. 20 weeks is the perfect cut off. I'd even be fine with 15. A huge portion of European countries limit the procedure at around the same time yet you'd be hard pressed for progressives in this country to talk about that. But New York last year passed a law guaranteeing abortions in the third trimester which didn't sit well with me and I'm sure many others. It's an example of how everything in this country has turned into a zero sum game. Everything must be pushed to the utmost extreme out of a misplaced sense of self righteousness.

But right now my primary concern are the red states who's policies will cause people to die or become gravely injured. We've already seen instances of this. And it's why Roe v Wade didn't deserve to be struck down in the manner in which it did.
 
I believe this quote pretty well sums up the answer to your question:
In the statement, election officials noted that though some states may do recounts, “All of the states with close results in the 2020 presidential race have paper records of each vote, allowing the ability to go back and count each ballot if necessary.” This beefs up the security of the vote and allows officials to correct and identify mistakes in the counting process.
Trump’s own officials say 2020 was America’s most secure election in history

Lol. Vox
 
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Regarding 2020 turnout, how many former non-voters voted via mail? Do you know? That's the key question in your entire dreamt-up premise. And of that group, how many did so via ballot collection instead of sticking into their local drop-box or mail-box? Not nearly enough to move the needle.

Lots of mail-in was simply by old people who typically voted in person but opted for safety. Like my parents and tons of out-of-shape people (most of america) and tons of elder folks.

Also regarding turn-out, how many die-hard repubs cast vote for Biden? A bunch. That same ire stirred former non-voters.
how many do you suppose had people come by and help them fill out a ballot and then drop that ballot off for them? That's right, there's no way of knowing. There is however, common sense and common sense tells me that no such turnout, in the midst of that scary Covid pandemic no less, would have occurred if proper voting had been in place. You contend what you want to contend, I'll know what I know. The highly unlikely turnout is not some dream I'm having...or will I wake up and find that Trump did actually win?
 
I believe you're the one who completely wigged out last night when it became apparent you could not produce the material to support your wild claims. Have fun in the loser's bracket.
I wigged out? That's what you need to say I did as part of your further deflection? I said you were a liar and that I wasn't going to play your game. That's because I knew you would step in it quicker than I could find an older post of mine. And you did and now you're doing exactly what I said you would do. And I'm loving every lying word you utter in trying to weasel out of being caught red-handed being a lying POS. It sure didn't take you long. LMAO.
 

“I think that the military thinks it’s not a good idea right now,” Biden recently said. “But I don’t know what the status of it is.”

I bet she could do a lot of good in Taiwan. She stay there for awhile. Or forever.
 
This is straight from FOX News. You can't argue with them. By the way, please share the included quote with bluetoe, eh?

This election cycle was the most secure ever, despite a surge in mail-invoting prompted by the coronavirus pandemic.
2020 election ‘most secure in American history,’ federal election security officials say

Yes, just what I was looking for - a quote. Even though I initially said I didn’t want a quote but wanted to look at the data that states undeniably this was the most secure election.
 
If I say you are a child molester who should be locked up does that make it so?
nothing you say makes anything so because you're just a liar, but my having said what I said makes what I said so. I suppose you're now going to challenge me to prove I said it, when I've said it in almost every post I've replied to you in. You are easily the most dishonest POS that's been on this board since I've been here. LMAO.
 
This is straight from FOX News. You can't argue with them. By the way, please share the included quote with bluetoe, eh?

This election cycle was the most secure ever, despite a surge in mail-in voting prompted by the coronavirus pandemic.
2020 election ‘most secure in American history,’ federal election security officials say
You have got to turn the dial away from FOX News.

Aren't Sesame Street and Fox News basically the same garbage?

FOX Fake News

I'm sure the folks at FOX News or whichever conservative news source you subscribe to are happy with themselves after easily convincing another sucker with their dishonest reporting.
 
This is straight from FOX News. You can't argue with them. By the way, please share the included quote with bluetoe, eh?

This election cycle was the most secure ever, despite a surge in mail-in voting prompted by the coronavirus pandemic.
2020 election ‘most secure in American history,’ federal election security officials say
and again you deflect from my contention. 'Secure' doesn't mean that improper ballot harvesting did not occur. You're a loser, sniff.
 
Yes, just what I was looking for - a quote. Even though I initially said I didn’t want a quote but wanted to look at the data that states undeniably this was the most secure election.
You don't seem to want to believe anyone who tells you anything you don't want to hear. Just like your boy Trump. Next time do your own research (if you can pull your head out of the sand long enough).

What's the matter, poopy, are you still bitter over the lost election? :p:p:p
 
You don't seem to want to believe anyone who tells you anything you don't want to hear. Just like your boy Trump. Next time do your own research (if you can pull your head out of the sand long enough).

What's the matter, poopy, are you still bitter over the lost election? :p:p:p
oh, you mean just like you won't admit anything you don't want to admit? I hear ya, sniff. What's the matter, sniff, bitter that your boy turns out to be less than a zero? LMAO.
 
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