OOTB's Political Thread . ..

[pooponduke]

The change he represents means a worsening healthcare system not being fixed, environmental/climate problems worsening, the public education system worsening, an unfair tax system not being fixed, inflationary pressures (tariffs, crypto, cost of deportation, corporate tax cuts, etc).

Status quo isn't working for some, but America is a pretty awesome. I just want better education, better healthcare costs, safe environment, strong economy.

So, the government has all these problems with all the these things that fall under its control that just aren't working. And your answer is more government to "fix" them? I mean, cause the track record of the government fixing things is so legendary.

Let's just limit it to one topic to make it manageable. Wasn't Obamacare supposed to fix all those healthcare problems that existed before that takeover?

 

[Newoikkin]

Darn.

But hold on.... If I'm a waiter and I get my property buyer to tip me $249,999 after I serve him a meal, I can still use that, right? I mean I am a really good waiter, so big tips are normal.

Sounds like its worth a shot.

You're getting to be at a Noir level, so I'll type slowly for you to follow. As to the borders, I can't help you if you want to simply ignore the reality of what has been going on for the last three years. It should be slapping you in the face, hard. And it doesn't help your position to argue that the borders haven't been open on one side of your mouth and then argue that it's a good thing for the economy that it's happening from the other side.

It was never called the "Muslim ban" anywhere outside of the press or a D's mouth. In fact, the correctly referred to Travel Ban was entitled "Enhancing Vetting Capabilities and Processes for Detecting Attempted Entry into the United States by Terrorists or other Public-Safety Threats" in the actual EO. Trump issued a second travel ban from mainland China which fueled additional smearing that he was a racist. Such a conclusion ignored the idea that the ban applied to an area where a horrible virus came from and had spread there without their communist government letting the world know when it actually happened. That it was ineffective or at best slowed what ultimately happened is irrelevant, it was not a ban against Asians or Chinese people.

The thing that is becoming clear from your engagement and "contributions" with multiple posters this morning/afternoon is that virtually every issue on which you opine must first be viewed through a filter of race. Only then do you consider any "secondary" facts. Sadly, racism is still an issue in our society, but it is not always the only answer to everything. Attitudes such as yours do not help us become color blind. Or is that not the goal?

How is the border not filtered through race when the economic data of migrants effect is unimpeachable? Or when crime data shows migrants are far less likely to commit a crime than native born Americans?

Because blanket punishment over a microscopic minority isnt a great look. Remember kids, if one person acts out the entire class gets detention!

And as far as the “Muslim Ban”- heres a respected conservative think tank that disagrees with you.

https://www.cato.org/blog/dozen-times-trump-equated-travel-ban-muslim-ban

You think you fox news heads would at least engage with conservative intelligentsia every once in a while.

 

[Heels Noir]

Holy shit. I'm living rent free in another guy's head. You have company @Heels Noir .

But remember, you've been delegated to the outhouse. Which is where you belong.

 

[pooponduke]

MAGA is a bit of an extension of tea party, thru a strong-man authoritarian, rather than being just anti-Dem (or anti-Obama). The tea party grievances part will always be there. And it is easy for a populist message to reach people...

You know I love a good cartoon or joke as much as anybody. But, can you please tell me when he said "Trump is America's Hitler, an A-Hole, reprehensible, and his policies are immoral"?

 

[Newoikkin]

So, the government has all these problems with all the these things that fall under its control that just aren't working. And your answer is more government to "fix" them? I mean, cause the track record of the government fixing things is so legendary.

Let's just limit it to one topic to make it manageable. Wasn't Obamacare supposed to fix all those healthcare problems that existed before that takeover?

Its like you don’t remember you gutted Obamacares potency and what we were left with was a bastardized version after getting through the republicans.

You really need to read up what conditions looked like under lassiez faire economics.

Really the party of “government doesnt work and ill make damn sure of it!”

 

[Newoikkin]

You know I love a good cartoon or joke as much as anybody. But, can you please tell me when he said "Trump is America's Hitler, an A-Hole, reprehensible, and his policies are immoral"?

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/jd-vance-once-compared-trump-hitler-now-they-are-running-mates-2024-07-15/

KFILE: Ohio Sen. JD Vance once called Trump a ‘moral disaster,’ and possibly ‘America’s Hitler’ | CNN Politics

Donald Trump’s vice presidential pick Ohio Sen. JD Vance was once a fervent critic of the former president. In private messages, he wondered ahead of Trump’s election whether he was “America’s Hitler” and in 2017 said the then-president was a “moral disaster.” In public, he agreed Trump was a...

amp.cnn.com

So all of this was pre-2020

Or before Vance had political aspirations that depended on Trumps good graces.

A grown man doesnt go from calling someone America’s hitler to agreeing with him without a gigantic dose of self interest and lack of shame.

 

[bluetoe]

I can’t for the life of me understand why you or others think there’s no reasonable explanation for making people present id to attend a rally or that it’s hypocritical in light of their voter id stance. A candidate was nearly assassinated at a rally.

with you on this one. Anyone climbing up on a nearby roof with a rifle where a political gathering is taking place should be required to present an ID. No exceptions. It's actually reasonable to assume that someone bringing a rifle to such a rally wasn't even invited.

 

[heelmanwilm]

with you on this one. Anyone climbing up on a nearby roof with a rifle where a political gathering is taking place should be required to present an ID. No exceptions. It's actually reasonable to assume that someone bringing a rifle to such a rally wasn't even invited.

Well I’m not inviting him either

 

[blazers]

with you on this one. Anyone climbing up on a nearby roof with a rifle where a political gathering is taking place should be required to present an ID. No exceptions. It's actually reasonable to assume that someone bringing a rifle to such a rally wasn't even invited.

In some states open carry doesn't require a permit or id. SS guy hinted that gun laws in certain states make their job extra difficult.

 

[strummingram]

Two billionaires on X talking about firing workers... HEL-LO White House!

 

[nctransplant]

Replacing joe with kameltoe is like crapping your pants and then changing your shirt.

 

[bluetoe]

You realize republicans created the conditions for ISIS to exist right?

The amount of ignorance spewed from your side of this board is astounding. Trump really attracts the confident dumbass crowd.

funny how far into your bag of rationalizations you have to reach and how much reality you have to ignore, and the disingenuousness you have to have, in order to try to counter this 'ignorance' you speak of; all in a futile effort to explain away your party's huge failings..

But I'll play. You want to talk about creating conditions? Let's talk about Bill Clinton reducing our military and security budgets in order to balance the budget against the wishes of republicans who instead wanted to reduce entitlements; and the perps who took down the the twin towers actually learning to fly here, right here under his security-reduced nose. We can discuss that the plans for 9/11 were made while the dems in charge of us were sleeping peacefully. Let's talk about the opportunity he passed on to take out Osama bin Ladin by quibbling over legal technicalities that he chickened out over. Let's talk about him bombing to hell a pharma plant that made baby formula in a weak-ass response to a terrorist attack. THAT wouldn't have created a condition of revenge or anything, would it?

We can continue this right on down the timeline in either direction if you wish....and believe me, you'd be bringing a knife to a gunfight....but if you want to talk about creating conditions, we can stop right here with Bill Clinton's presidency where the ball got rolling with Bill Clinton's help. Terrorism directed against us fomented under Clinton's watch and continued to burgeon from there.

You can parse the details all you want to and argue about different groups under different presidents and all that sort of deflective bullshit, but the fact is that if you are talking about creating conditions, the dems own this one.

You're a joke, junior.

 

[Newoikkin]

funny how far into your bag of rationalizations you have to reach and how much reality you have to ignore, and the disingenuousness you have to have, in order to try to counter this 'ignorance' you speak of; all in a futile effort to explain away your party's huge failings..

But I'll play. You want to talk about creating conditions? Let's talk about Bill Clinton reducing our military and security budgets in order to balance the budget against the wishes of republicans who instead wanted to reduce entitlements; and the perps who took down the the twin towers actually learning to fly here, right here under his security-reduced nose. We can discuss that the plans for 9/11 were made while the dems in charge of us were sleeping peacefully. Let's talk about the opportunity he passed on to take out Osama bin Ladin by quibbling over legal technicalities that he chickened out over. Let's talk about him bombing to hell a pharma plant that made baby formula in a weak-ass response to a terrorist attack. THAT wouldn't have created a condition of revenge or anything, would it?

We can continue this right on down the timeline in either direction if you wish....and believe me, you'd be bringing a knife to a gunfight....but if you want to talk about creating conditions, we can stop right here with Bill Clinton's presidency where the ball got rolling with Bill Clinton's help. Terrorism directed against us fomented under Clinton's watch and continued to burgeon from there.

You can parse the details all you want to and argue about different groups under different presidents and all that sort of deflective bullshit, but the fact is that if you are talking about creating conditions, the dems own this one.

You're a joke, junior.

Bro, ISIS formed in Iraq (you know, separate war and justification) and youre talking about Afghanistan and youre calling me a joke?

Lol at least make it challenging. You brought a nerf gun to that knife fight idiot.

And I could teach you the history of the 80’s with the Afghan/Soviet war and how the Republican’s dropped the ball which set the entire thing in motion if you want to go that far.

 

[bluetoe]

In some states open carry doesn't require a permit or id. SS guy hinted that gun laws in certain states make their job extra difficult.

I don't mind you using my post for a soapbox to stand on, but could you at least try to understand what's being commented on and direct your remarks accordingly? And maybe then learn to recognize sarcasm?

 

[bluetoe]

Bro, ISIS formed in Iraq (you know, separate war and justification) and youre talking about Afghanistan and youre calling me a joke?

Lol at least make it challenging. You brought a nerf gun to that knife fight idiot.

And I could teach you the history of the 80’s with the Afghan/Soviet war and how the Republican’s dropped the ball which set the entire thing in motion if you want to go that far.

I'm ahead of you, dumbass. Can you read? Like I said, you can parse and deflect all you want to over our battle with terrorism with all the different groups involved, but if you are talking about creating conditions, you have to thank the dems for that.

 

[bluetoe]

Well I’m not inviting him either

liar. You probably gave him a ride to the rally.

 

[Newoikkin]

I'm ahead of you, dumbass. Can you read? Like I said, you can parse and deflect all you want to over our battle with terrorism with all the different groups involved, but if you are talking about creating conditions, you have to thank the dems for that.

Today I learned Clinton was in office in the 80’s when we armed the mujahideen then left the country to rot.

Today I learned Clinton was in office during 9/11

Today I learned Clinton called for the de baathification of Iraq which led to a fertile breeding ground for ISIS.

Tell me, how big of a presence was islamic extremism under Saddam?

 

[Newoikkin]

I'm ahead of you, dumbass. Can you read? Like I said, you can parse and deflect all you want to over our battle with terrorism with all the different groups involved, but if you are talking about creating conditions, you have to thank the dems for that.

And just to give you an idea of how Ronnie’s and Bush Sr’s beefed up military fared on terrorism:

In 1983, Hezbollah suicide bombers attacked the U.S. Embassy in Beirut, killing 63. Later that year, in October, a 12,000-pound bomb destroyed the Marine barracks in Beirut, killing 241 Americans--the most deadly terrorist strike against the United States until September 11. In March 1984, Islamic terrorists kidnapped, and eventually killed, a CIA officer. The following month, Hezbollah killed 18 American soldiers in an attack on a restaurant near an airbase in Spain. Two U.S. military personnel were killed by another truck bombing in Beirut in September 1984. Terrorists hijacked an airliner, TWA 847, in July 1985 and killed one American, Navy diver Robert Stethem, whose corpse was thrown out of the plane and onto the runway. In October came the Achille Lauro incident, in which Palestinian terrorists commandeered a cruise ship and executed Leon Klinghoffer, a wheelchair-bound American tourist. In December, Abu Nidal terrorists attacked travelers simultaneously at airports in Rome and Vienna. In March 1986, terrorists killed four Americans in Greece. In April, Libyans bombed a West Berlin disco, killing two American soldiers and injuring dozens more. The Libyan attack finally elicited a military response from Reagan, who sent U.S. bombers to attack Tripoli and Benghazi. Commenting on the years of passivity preceding the Libya bombing,

Reagan's biographer, Lou Cannon, observed, "For five years of his presidency, Reagan talked tough about terrorism but did virtually nothing in the way of retaliatory action to stop it."

 

[gunslingerdick]

Elon is hilarious.

 

[tarheel0910]

But they didn't have a unifying authoritarian with a populist message to channel their grievances thru. What happens if he dies is the question. I think the 40% of cult-followers will remain with him no matter how much he loses. @tarheel0910 thinks powerful people will understand losing sucks, but they already know he's a loser... they're just pandering to their own constituents who DON'T understand that he's a loser.

A two time loser is different, though.

 

[bluetoe]

And just to give you an idea of how Ronnie’s and Bush Sr’s beefed up military fared on terrorism:

In 1983, Hezbollah suicide bombers attacked the U.S. Embassy in Beirut, killing 63. Later that year, in October, a 12,000-pound bomb destroyed the Marine barracks in Beirut, killing 241 Americans--the most deadly terrorist strike against the United States until September 11. In March 1984, Islamic terrorists kidnapped, and eventually killed, a CIA officer. The following month, Hezbollah killed 18 American soldiers in an attack on a restaurant near an airbase in Spain. Two U.S. military personnel were killed by another truck bombing in Beirut in September 1984. Terrorists hijacked an airliner, TWA 847, in July 1985 and killed one American, Navy diver Robert Stethem, whose corpse was thrown out of the plane and onto the runway. In October came the Achille Lauro incident, in which Palestinian terrorists commandeered a cruise ship and executed Leon Klinghoffer, a wheelchair-bound American tourist. In December, Abu Nidal terrorists attacked travelers simultaneously at airports in Rome and Vienna. In March 1986, terrorists killed four Americans in Greece. In April, Libyans bombed a West Berlin disco, killing two American soldiers and injuring dozens more. The Libyan attack finally elicited a military response from Reagan, who sent U.S. bombers to attack Tripoli and Benghazi. Commenting on the years of passivity preceding the Libya bombing,

Reagan's biographer, Lou Cannon, observed, "For five years of his presidency, Reagan talked tough about terrorism but did virtually nothing in the way of retaliatory action to stop it."

created the conditions for. Created the conditions for. Your words. We are talking about creating the conditions for the terrorism in question. That's what you brought into question. You are talking about us being targeted and attacked and nothing else. Nothing you have said above even hints at creating those conditions.

Nice move of the goalposts.

 

[gunslingerdick]

A two time loser is different, though.

For the record, Biden was a 3 time loser.

 

[prlyles]

Yes. Because you say these things, they must be true!

Miss me with the climate catastrophe garbage. Who the f*ck cares if the polar caps melt in the year 3000? Ok, maybe you can care a little. But not at the cost of me living now.

Public ed has been corrupted and can’t be fixed. I mean, you know I think you’re a fool if you have your kids in public ed. lol at the thought of me sending my kids into that shit. It’s a shame the less fortunate can’t afford to get their own kids into better environments and into education that suits them better.

Do they have private schools in Trailer Parks now? Mr. indecently wealthily

 

[gunslingerdick]

Do they have private schools in Trailer Parks now? Mr. indecently wealthily

Not sure. But I know for a fact they don't have them in assisted living facilities so what's it to you?

 

[bluetoe]

Today I learned Clinton was in office in the 80’s when we armed the mujahideen then left the country to rot.

Today I learned Clinton was in office during 9/11

Today I learned Clinton called for the de baathification of Iraq which led to a fertile breeding ground for ISIS.

Tell me, how big of a presence was islamic extremism under Saddam?

Want to know who first armed the Mujahideen? Carter. Look it up. He was a democrat, BTW..

Can you read? I pointed out that the plan for 9/11 was formulated with Clinton in office, and I also pointed out that the perps learned to fly while in this country on visas in that same time.

The rest of your nonsense is off target and doesn't address the subject. Isis didn't form out of thin air. Isis certainly took advantage of conditions which allowed them to grow, some of which may have been created under a republican administration, but we are talking about the conditions allowing terrorism to begin and flourish. You can't pick and choose your spots and starting points in this discussion. Again, I was ahead of you on this yet you continue to try to move the goalposts.

Did Trump make ISIS flourish? Let's talk about that while we're at it.

lol, Is this the best you can do?

 

[prlyles]

It was never called the "Muslim ban" anywhere outside of the press or a D's mouth.

"Trump mentioned in a 2015 statement that he wanted “a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States"

 

[tarheel0910]

For the record, Biden was a 3 time loser.

I was referring to presidential elections. I'm not sure how you score this one since he didn't actually make it to the election. Maybe we add a new column and say he's 1-0-1. And yes I got the joke that you were making saying Trump won in 2020. And yes I know you're serious about that.

 

[Newoikkin]

Elon is hilarious.

View embedded media

Shouldnt you be worried about Trump lisping like a stroke victim during the entire thing

created the conditions for. Created the conditions for. Your words. We are talking about creating the conditions for the terrorism in question. That's what you brought into question. You are talking about us being targeted and attacked and nothing else. Nothing you have said above even hints at creating those conditions.

Nice move of the goalposts.

lol and still nothing on iraq right

 

[Newoikkin]

Want to know who first armed the Mujahideen? Carter. Look it up. He was a democrat, BTW..

Can you read? I pointed out that the plan for 9/11 was formulated with Clinton in office, and I also pointed out that the perps learned to fly while in this country on visas in that same time.

The rest of your nonsense is off target and doesn't address the subject. Isis didn't form out of thin air. Isis certainly took advantage of conditions which allowed them to grow, some of which may have been created under a republican administration, but we are talking about the conditions allowing terrorism to begin and flourish. You can't pick and choose your spots and starting points in this discussion. Again, I was ahead of you on this yet you continue to try to move the goalposts.

Did Trump make ISIS flourish? Let's talk about that while we're at it.

lol, Is this the best you can do?

Lol this is like hitting my head against a wall.

Imagine being this stupid and then claiming you won while not addressing Iraq

 

[gunslingerdick]

I was referring to presidential elections. I'm not sure how you score this one since he didn't actually make it to the election. Maybe we add a new column and say he's 1-0-1. And yes I got the joke that you were making saying Trump won in 2020. And yes I know you're serious about that.

Biden lost in 88, 08 and 20. Maybe you mean after getting the party nomination. I’d still like to point out that the loser couldn’t even get the nomination 3 times. Also might be a good time to point out how Kamala didn’t even make it to Iowa. “Less than 2% Kamala”. That’s a suggested nickname Trump should use for her. Has a nice ring to it.

 

[gunslingerdick]

Shouldnt you be worried about Trump lisping like a stroke victim during the entire thing

“IT’S A STUTTER!!! REEEeeeeeeeeeeee!”

 

[prlyles]

Biden lost in 88, 08 and 20. Maybe you mean after getting the party nomination. I’d still like to point out that the loser couldn’t even get the nomination 3 times. Also might be a good time to point out how Kamala didn’t even make it to Iowa. “Less than 2% Kamala”. That’s a suggested nickname Trump should use for her. Has a nice ring to it.

Yet somehow she is kicking Trump's ass? How can that be?

 

[bluetoe]

Bro, ISIS formed in Iraq (you know, separate war and justification) and youre talking about Afghanistan and youre calling me a joke?

Lol at least make it challenging. You brought a nerf gun to that knife fight idiot.

And I could teach you the history of the 80’s with the Afghan/Soviet war and how the Republican’s dropped the ball which set the entire thing in motion if you want to go that far.

the Afhan/Soviet war was of all things between the Afghans and the Soviets. The thrust of our involvement was against the Soviets. To that end we aided the Afghan fighters in defeating them. I'm not sure what further obligation we had. As a matter of fact, THAT wasn't an obligation. Could we have done more to help Afghanistan as a country? Of course we could have, just like we could have helped the rest of the world to our resources. It's crazy that some take our aid in successfully achieving something and then try to lay the blame for further developments on us because we didn't do even more. America-haters is what they are called. There's this organization called the U.N. that is supposed to look after these things. Who but the America-haters says we have to be the U.N.?

BTW, dumbass, I remind you again...you brought up the conditions for terrorist groups to form and operate. That is exactly what I'm now addressing and what you are avoiding being honest enough to acknowledge. THIS is what I initially brought up...

Trump takes out ISIS

• Defeated 100 percent of ISIS’ territorial caliphate in Iraq and Syria
• Freed nearly 8 million civilians from ISIS’ bloodthirsty control, and liberated Mosul, Raqqa, and the final ISIS foothold of Baghuz
• Killed the leader of ISIS, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, and eliminated the world’s top terrorist, Qasem Soleimani

 

[bluetoe]

Lol this is like hitting my head against a wall.

Imagine being this stupid and then claiming you won while not addressing Iraq

I'm addressing what you brought up, the conditions for terrorism to exist. You keep trying to isolate a portion of the story so you can pretend you haven't failed at making any point.

From your effort here, I'd say you maybe banged your head against the wall a few too many times.

 

[blazers]

So, the government has all these problems with all the these things that fall under its control that just aren't working. And your answer is more government to "fix" them? I mean, cause the track record of the government fixing things is so legendary.

Your answer to environment/climate is less governmental regulation?
Your answer to a more educated population is less governmental emphasis on public education?

I'm not for "more government" btw. The inflation threat from Trump involves government (tariffs, corp tax cuts, labor problems), you'd actually need massive gov expansion to pull off the deportation he proposes.

 

[blazers]

Let's just limit it to one topic to make it manageable. Wasn't Obamacare supposed to fix all those healthcare problems that existed before that takeover?

No, it wasn't suppose to fix ALL those healthcare problems. The main intention was to make insurance more accessible, to make affordable coverage attainable (especially preventive, and it has done that). There were many millions of people who couldn't afford insurance due to pre-existing conditions and other BS, like plans forcing lifetime maximums. It hasn't helped much on the "affordability" front since costs just continue to skyrocket no matter what is done (Biden's Admin HAS lowered drug prices though). I'm still hoping for single-payer for all.

Some MAGA think status quo sucks, so why not change and go single-payer? Free market ain't gonna end-well when it comes to public health. You can call single-payer socialistic, but private insurance is essentially socialized too since they're giant and you're all paying into the same pot.

And whatever happened to Sarah Palin's Death Panels?

 

[blazers]

A two time loser is different, though.

People paying attention will see Trump as a two-time loser. Will "lost" people ever see Trump as a loser? Like ->

For the record, Biden was a 3 time loser.

 

[bluetoe]

"Trump mentioned in a 2015 statement that he wanted “a total and complete shutdown of Muslims entering the United States"

do you honestly not have sense enough to cite your source, maybe even provide a link...assuming your source is on the internet. Your quote means nothing without it.

 

[gunslingerdick]

Yet somehow she is kicking Trump's ass? How can that be?

 

[prlyles]

No, it wasn't suppose to fix ALL those healthcare problems. The main intention was to make insurance more accessible to make affordable coverage attainable. There were many millions of people who couldn't afford insurance due to pre-existing conditions and other BS, like plans forcing lifetime maximums. It hasn't helped much on the "affordability" front since costs just continue to skyrocket no matter what is done (Biden's Admin HAS lowered drug prices though). I'm still hoping for single-payer for all.

Some MAGA think status quo sucks, so why not change and go single-payer? Free market ain't gonna end-well when it comes to public health. You can call single-payer socialistic, but private insurance is essentially socialized too since they're giant and you're all paying into the same pot.

And whatever happened to Sarah Palin's Death Panels?

I think it would be a great idea for Trump to run on a platform of getting rid of ACA and abortion.