Quick stuff (Citadel game)...

[gary-7]

...and I guess transition makes everyone "smarter", huh?...

Let's start where it ends --- TRANSITION.
Happily, the rediscovery of Carolina basketball continued. Once again, ignore the misleading box score numbers --- on a night that netted biscuits, we scored MORE THAN HALF of those points in transition. Of those, 46 -- count em, 46 --- came off SECONDARY BREAK action!!!
so...

- The next numbers I'm about to give you point up the exact antidote this team needed:
9 - Fast Break (primary w/ numerical advantage)
46 - Secondary Break (note that some of these get counted as FB points in box scores)
31 - Set Plays (half-court and out-of-bounds)
and that leaves only...
14 - Half-court (Freelance/Motion)

Folks, this reflects almost EXACTLY this roster's formula for success. Please embrace this:
The more possessions we spend in that last category, the less our chances are for success.
It's really that simple. Why?
Again, embrace this reality --- WE DO NOT HAVE A LEGIT PG... someone who can wrangle an offense from a stand-still, create space, move the defense --- y'know, all the things that Berry/Butter/Ray/Ed/Jet/Phil......... all our PGU guys could do.

- Ah, but y'see, TRANSITION compensates for that.
It opens up passing lanes, obviating the need for a PG to create them.
It endemically moves the defense, which is recovering, obviating the need for a PG to do that.
It can be drilled to the point that everyone is a potential play-maker.

- On that note, think about it --- after slogging thru games with single-digit Assists, tonight we had 24 on 32 made FGs (!!!). And y'all, IT COULD HAVE BEEN MORE (see below).

Now, some individual notes:

- There were some frankly counterproductive discussions of "basketball IQ" today that largely missed the mark. OK, it's true that none of our guys are basketball geniuses (like our aforementioned PGU guys), but they're not basketball idiots either. Their skill-sets just fit TRANSITION better.
RJ is our worst decision-maker (sorry, that's just a fact) because he sees the court narrowly with what coaches call "blinders", BUT he's a dynamic scorer who thrives at that in a broken floor.
Caleb has a tendency to get out-of-control, but when he keeps that in check, he actually has decent vision. BTW, tonight Caleb was credited with 6 dimes, BUT he had at least 3 blown on really sweet looks. so again, stop scapegoating.
And of course, Seth is an athlete who excels in motion, makes some nice looks in transition, but has no sense of spacing in half-court, non-scripted environments. Unsurprisingly, he did well in this transition-loaded game.

Some more notes:

- Gratifying for sure to see an extended bench (but we should've been doing that earlier). The mysterious missing man, Styles played REALLY well. And speaking of good looks, Dontrez had at least 4 potential dimes on the Secondary that weren't converted.

- I absolutely LOVE Nickel's lack of conscience and "short memory" as a shooter.

- And of course, our man Washington just keeps flashing the future for us.

- DEFENSIVELY though (sigh), I was generally disappointed in three things:
1. slow/late rotations
2. not recognizing what I call "up-down switches"
3. not multiple enough
Speaking of personnel fits, this bunch is NOT suited for straight 21.5 over extended periods, BUT... we are suited for SCRAMBLING. Guess we're gonna hafta wait though --- we ran exacltly one possession of 32 and caused one TO --- hmmm... I think that works out to batting a thousand, huh?...

Anyway, the best news is we didn't backslide from our rediscovery of Carolina basketball, and that's the best news I could've seen...

 

[FlaTarHeel]

All good points Gary but as 'ol Roy likes to say, when the ball goes in the basket.....
And I'm soooo happy for Dontrez tonight. 👏

 

[gary-7]

All good points Gary but as 'ol Roy likes to say, when the ball goes in the basket.....
And I'm soooo happy for Dontrez tonight. 👏

Dontrez can play, contrary to what has become popular belief.

 

[gobblercalls]

Fresh legs make a difference!! RJ walked the ball up a couple of times in the second half, and there was no reason for that. If he needs to walk it's time for a substitute because he must be tired! Given a chance to get into the flow of the game the reserves showed out!!

 

[dtodd4475]

Good ball movement and shooting can become contagious, hopefully that is the case. We will see once we meet teams capable of ball pressure and with bigs capable of rebounding.

Our bigs were simply men against boys, and they had very little ability to harass our ball handlers from their guards, which allowed for a multitude of clean catch and shoot 3's. Good habits grow though and hopefully we see those applied when the rubber hits the road against teams that will try to harass on ball, in the post, and on the glass. Plenty to build on from this one. Looking forward to Ohio State next.

 

[39 Feet Above Sea Level]

Spot on, Gary. Our “transition“ back into a team that can be reckoned with is packed with
what we need to do offensively: rebound, run the floor, distribute the rock. All of this
keeps the total team attentive and focused. The positive emotion that this brings
to the guys is obvious and palpable.
NOW, translate this energy to the defensive end of the floor by using multiple defensive looks,
rotate fresh players to keep playing a high tempo and you see a helluva different team on the floor.
Certainly, our opponents become more challenging, but our recipe for success remains the
same: Play Carolina Basketball for forty minutes one game at a time. That ought
to do it!!

 

[Archer2]

...and I guess transition makes everyone "smarter", huh?...

Let's start where it ends --- TRANSITION.
Happily, the rediscovery of Carolina basketball continued. Once again, ignore the misleading box score numbers --- on a night that netted biscuits, we scored MORE THAN HALF of those points in transition. Of those, 46 -- count em, 46 --- came off SECONDARY BREAK action!!!
so...

- The next numbers I'm about to give you point up the exact antidote this team needed:
9 - Fast Break (primary w/ numerical advantage)
46 - Secondary Break (note that some of these get counted as FB points in box scores)
31 - Set Plays (half-court and out-of-bounds)
and that leaves only...
14 - Half-court (Freelance/Motion)

Folks, this reflects almost EXACTLY this roster's formula for success. Please embrace this:
The more possessions we spend in that last category, the less our chances are for success.
It's really that simple. Why?
Again, embrace this reality --- WE DO NOT HAVE A LEGIT PG... someone who can wrangle an offense from a stand-still, create space, move the defense --- y'know, all the things that Berry/Butter/Ray/Ed/Jet/Phil......... all our PGU guys could do.

- Ah, but y'see, TRANSITION compensates for that.
It opens up passing lanes, obviating the need for a PG to create them.
It endemically moves the defense, which is recovering, obviating the need for a PG to do that.
It can be drilled to the point that everyone is a potential play-maker.

- On that note, think about it --- after slogging thru games with single-digit Assists, tonight we had 24 on 32 made FGs (!!!). And y'all, IT COULD HAVE BEEN MORE (see below).

Now, some individual notes:

- There were some frankly counterproductive discussions of "basketball IQ" today that largely missed the mark. OK, it's true that none of our guys are basketball geniuses (like our aforementioned PGU guys), but they're not basketball idiots either. Their skill-sets just fit TRANSITION better.
RJ is our worst decision-maker (sorry, that's just a fact) because he sees the court narrowly with what coaches call "blinders", BUT he's a dynamic scorer who thrives at that in a broken floor.
Caleb has a tendency to get out-of-control, but when he keeps that in check, he actually has decent vision. BTW, tonight Caleb was credited with 6 dimes, BUT he had at least 3 blown on really sweet looks. so again, stop scapegoating.
And of course, Seth is an athlelte who excels in motion, makes some nice looks in transition, but has no sense of spacing in half-court, non-scripted environments. Unsurprisingly, he did well in this transition-loaded game.

Some more notes:

- Gratifying for sure to see an extended bench (but we should've been doing that earlier). The mysterious missing man, Styles played REALLY well. And speaking of good looks, Dontrez had at least 4 potential dimes on the Secondary that weren't converted.

- I absolutely LOVE Nickel's lack of conscience and "short memory" as a shooter.

- And of course, our man Washington just keeps flashing the future for us.

- DEFENSIVELY though (sigh), I was generally disappointed in three things:
1. slow/late rotations
2. not recognizing what I call "up-down switches"
3. not multiple enough
Speaking of personnel fits, this bunch is NOT suited for straight 21.5 over extended periods, BUT... we are suited for SCRAMBLING. Guess we're gonna hafta wait though --- we ran exacltly one possession of 32 and caused one TO --- hmmm... I think that works out to batting a thousand, huh?...

Anyway, the best news is we didn't backslide from our rediscovery of Carolina basketball, and that's the best news I could've seen...

I agree with the majority of this, as usual. But basketball IQ isn’t just related to being “suited for a position”. It’s also learning and retaining information. If you’re a guard, it’s things like keeping your head up and your hands ready, not dribbling into a corner where the lines act as another defender, realizing defense is as important as offense, knowing that a quick three isn’t generally a good shot, knowing that when the bigs get touches in the paint good things happen, making the easy pass versus the hot dog pass, knowing your job is to facilitate getting good shots for others, etc… Those are all things that Caleb and RJ should know by now, regardless of their skills. Those are common sense knowledge that both should possess after playing basketball for years. So either they’ve failed to grasp some of the most fundamental concepts of a very simple game(which I don’t believe because a ten year old can grasp them), or they ignore them in pursuit of their own goals versus the team’s goals. While most D1 basketball/football players aren‘t the sharpest tacks in the box, they are perfectly capable of mastering the basics of the game, if they will. That’s my idea of basketball IQ.

 

[Tarheel75]

Some very good observations Gary, I enjoyed that summary and I echo most all of it.

The guys I go to the games with take turns chauffeuring to the Smith Center and our ride last night had a blowout in a tire, and it caused us to be late getting into the Smith Center last night. We settled in around the 15-minute mark, so we all missed the 1st 5-6 minutes of the game.

Gary has covered the high points of this game so no need for me to be redundant. I will say this, that reverting back to our older offense with just a few twists was the right call by Hubert & Staff.

I have nothing against a female referee, but that young lady that worked the game last night made some really bad calls, and they were obviously wrong. Two that were really bad were the block call against RJ and the one on Pete Nance on a rebound where the opposition had him in an armlock. On 2 others, she made calls out of position and there was no way that she could see what she called. I hate when officials make anticipatory calls. Get this: Raymie Styons pulled her aside for a conference in the 2nd half and I don't remember that she made a call from that point on, but I could be wrong.

We are getting our offensive groove back and increasing slowly the bench players into the games and giving them more court time. Washington had 6 minutes tonight. He has to build up acclimation to game speed and get into game shape physically so that he can go for longer stretches. Last night he was breathing fairly hard after a few trips up and down the court. Trimble played fair but found himself in no-man's land on several occasions wildly driving into the lane. I think he'll get better with that over time. That has to be a lonely feeling when you look around and are surrounded on all sides by your opponent. Kinda like running into the lion's den as Coach Smith used to say.

ETA: I thought I was through but hey I have a few more thoughts I want to share.

A lot of you will think and some will voice it out that the competition was inferior and that we should have skull drug those guys. Well, your right and we did. Many folks just don't get it with games such as these. Why do most all coaches schedule and play teams of this caliber? Where's the benefits? What are the purposes for playing these types of opponents?

1. To build confidences of all players, but particularly new additions to the team.
2. To build chemistry among those who will be playing the major minutes on the court and to let new players distinguish themselves for playing time.
3. To test new offensive & defensive designs or work on current O/D design.
4. To build and maintain game conditioning (all the practice time in the world cannot replicate game conditioning because you are playing against different athletes who may just be more talented than the ones you practice against).
5. To increase players comfort levels with each individual player.
6. In a game like this one, with the game in hand, allows players to relax more and
not feel under pressure and are able to make plays and shots that they have missed due to their sphincter muscle choking the air out them due to nerves. Once they learn how to relax their games start resembling their talent levels.

So, don't pooh pooh these games as they are critical in all the areas mentioned above. As Roy was quick to say, "everything looks better when the ball goes in the basket". It went in the basket because of what Gary mentions in his observations.
We passed the ball effectively and took better shots due to sharing the ball unselfishly.


Well, we got OSU on Saturday, let's see just how much this team has improved. Should be a good test in NY.

 

[heels05champs]

I still haven’t seen the scrambling half court press that HD promised two games ago. It would be nice to work on that now by mixing it in each game.

Also, a staff full of Carolina alum really need to enforce the thanking the passer. A couple guys do it occasionally but it needs to be engrained in them.

 

[tcb22]

Like all of you, our defense continues to worry me. Too many open threes and too many backdoors for layups/dunks. However, a real positive--we did not let up when we had them down by 20 in the second half! We often let teams claw back to within single digits but tonight that didn't happen. Part of the credit goes to the enthusiasm of the subs. Fun game to watch and much needed. I hope the good things from the past two games carry over to Ohio State and Michigan.

 

[DaveChapelle]

All good points Gary but as 'ol Roy likes to say, when the ball goes in the basket.....
And I'm soooo happy for Dontrez tonight. 👏

Tonight Dontrez made his first jumpshot since the Baylor game in the 2nd round of March Madness. I don't think it's a coincidence it came against The Citadel, who is ranked 281 in the Net rankings.

Transition/Fast breaking will allow Styles to play more. That's where he excelled in high school. He is still very much a raw athlete. Operating in the halfcourt against Power 5 conference teams is difficult for him. But if we keep playing tough defense and looking to fast break, we can find playing time for him and he can do some positive stuff.

 

[Archer2]

I still haven’t seen the scrambling half court press that HD promised two games ago. It would be nice to work on that now by mixing it in each game.

Also, a staff full of Carolina alum really need to enforce the thanking the passer. A couple guys do it occasionally but it needs to be engrained in them.

Trez even pointed to the passer when he missed what should have been an assist. I always loved that and you’re right, it should be enforced. It builds 🧪 chemistry.

 

[Tom79]

And Beau Maye brought down two defensive rebounds

 

[DSouthr]

First, want to say playing the Citadel was a bit like watching a inter squad scrimmage, their uniforms (the Blues) got me a bit confused at times LOL. Really enjoyed that this was and should have been a mismatch going in and they won in the way we expect them to when faced with a team they should drill.

From the UNC perspective I came away with 3 points that rose above the rest in a game filled with positives for us.

1) Caleb Love, kid played really really well ! 10 total shots he hit 6 of them, very nice shooting efficiency and maybe I can't recall it right now but I do not recall any heat checks (bad shots), that in itself was HUGE but it wasn't all. 6 count em, 6 assists, that is a big time number but that goes with ZERO turn overs, in fact our starting back court had 9 assists to 1 TO, that my friends is winning basketball, that is UNC like. What I didn't see was Caleb appear to lose focus, I don't recall another game from him where his focus stayed as sharp for the entire game. So to say I was happy to see that is an understatement, I felt a bit Grover like watching Caleb last night! LOL

2) Our emerging freshmen, Trimble and Nickel ! It was really nice to see Nickel have a break out night, I got a bit lost in the game and not thinking box score and was a bit surprised to see Nickel with 16 and know what, he can actually shoot much better than we saw last night, he missed some really clean looks.

Trimble, there is and has been a noticeable difference when that kid checks in to a game, it doesn't show up as much on a box score, it is more how he resets the tenor of the game how he finds ways to effect the game in a positive way. I guess when one is so entrenched in saying that Trimble is not a PG that when the kid plays they have a need to look for any way to throw shade at the kid but I think everyone watched that game realizes that kid played really well, the agenda of Trimble not being a PG was sure not helped AGAIN last night.

3) We completely abused Citadel because they had no answer to our size, but give their 2 players, Clark and Price credit for battling among those trees. But a word of caution, this was another one of those 4 out small teams that just do not have the beef to compete with us inside the paint, I want to see us against a bigger front court that does have the inside beef. They are coming our way and Bacot's shoulder is still causing him problem, he was grabbing at it again last night.


It looks like we built on that GT game and the result was last night, can we now build on this game to be even better in the next game and yeah we do have things that we do need to work on. After that tuff road trip they needed to get back on the practice court and work out some things, now we can see some reflection of that ability to practice translate in to games and not the back sliding that has marked this early season for us. We went from a team that played way to much 1 on 1 to last night's 24 assists on 32 made baskets and team that has not only actively looked to make the extra pass and seemed to really enjoy making the extra pass, HUGE change up.

Trigger warning loading up! While we started this season on the sketchy side, have ya noticed that the assist to TO numbers are trending strong in the right direction for BOTH RJ and Caleb? While tossing it to a shooter that drops the shot does help those assist numbers there is a sense of actively looking for that extra pass that does many times lead to an assist, it is that willingness to share the ball that strikes me in a very positive light.

So why now, why is our starting back court now realizing the value of making the extra pass, actively looking for assists, sharing the ball, why, what has changed? One MAJOR change has been Seth Trimble, notice how this team has begun to play now and how it matches up to a strong increase in minutes from Seth. Seth comes in the game and he sets a different tone, that tone is heard loud and clear by the guy he subbed in for and wouldn't ya know it, that guy comes back in and he begins working with in that new tone, the heat of Seth playing well is now felt by our starters. Now all the sudden in correlation to Seth's increased PT, our assists for the whole team are up, TOs down, and they finally look like they are having fun out there. All the sudden UNC is out running in the open court, breaks (primary and secondary) are rolling, guys are sharing the ball, and we do not need a hero to save the game in the last minute. The difference is Trimble is cutting in to our starters PT so they have to step their game up, that is what happens when you have a guy you can bring in that competes hard. Losing Ant last season took that guy away from them last season, he was beginning to be that guard that came in and reset the tone but he had to go away and that set the table for to much one on one play for to much of that season. We now have Seth and frankly he is a solid upgrade to Ant as a tone changer. So now those that persist in that mantra that Seth is not a PG are fully engaged maybe at some point they may actually be able to fairly credit the kid's play?

 

[DSouthr]

And Beau Maye brought down two defensive rebounds

I REALLY wanted Beau to get a clean look at a trey before that final horn.

 

[TarHeelMark]

For the most part, last night looked like Tar Heel basketball... ball movement, rebounding, transition offense!

Great to see Dontrez get in some meaningful minutes. His hops and reach are impressive when fighting for rebounds.

Hopefully, Hubert is holding back the scramble for the next few games. Don't want to show too much if not necessary, right?

 

[2DDIMOND]

And Beau Maye brought down two defensive rebounds

A rebound per minute, runs in the family.

 

[DSouthr]

A rebound per minute, runs in the family.

Don't ask Beau, why do ya shoot (to score points),
Why do ya work (to get time)
Why do you risk that knee getting hurt (cause I'm a Maye)

Over and over, I am in this unique position
When I play I am trying to carry on my FAMILY TRADITION!

 

[gary-7]

Some very good observations Gary, I enjoyed that summary and I echo most all of it.

The guys I go to the games with take turns chauffeuring to the Smith Center and our ride last night had a blowout in a tire, and it caused us to be late getting into the Smith Center last night. We settled in around the 15-minute mark, so we all missed the 1st 5-6 minutes of the game.

Gary has covered the high points of this game so no need for me to be redundant. I will say this, that reverting back to our older offense with just a few twists was the right call by Hubert & Staff.

I have nothing against a female referee, but that young lady that worked the game last night made some really bad calls, and they were obviously wrong. Two that were really bad were the block call against RJ and the one on Pete Nance on a rebound where the opposition had him in an armlock. On 2 others, she made calls out of position and there was no way that she could see what she called. I hate when officials make anticipatory calls. Get this: Ramey Styons pulled her aside for a conference in the 2nd half and I don't remember that she made a call from that point on, but I could be wrong.

We are getting our offensive groove back and increasing slowly the bench players into the games and giving them more court time. Washington had 6 minutes tonight. He has to build up acclimation to game speed and get into game shape physically so that he can go for longer stretches. Last night he was breathing fairly hard after a few trips up and down the court. Trimble played fair but found himself in no-mans land on several occasions wildly driving into the lane. I think he'll get better with that over time. That has to be a lonely feeling when you look around and are surrounded on all sides by your opponent. Kinda like running into the lion's den as Coach Smith used to say.

ETA: I thought I was through but hey I have a few more thoughts I want to share.

A lot of you will think and some will voice it out that the competition was inferior and that we should have skull drug those guys. Well, your right and we did. Many folks just don't get it with games such as these. Why do most all coaches schedule and play teams of this caliber? Where's the benefits? What are the purposes for playing these types of opponents?

1. To build confidences of all players, but particularly new additions to the team.
2. To build chemistry among those who will be playing the major minutes on the court and to let new players distinguish themselves for playing time.
3. To test new offensive & defensive designs or work on current O/D design.
4. To build and maintain game conditioning (all the practice time in the world cannot replicate game conditioning because you are playing against different athletes who may just be more talented than the ones you practice against).
5. To increase players comfort levels with each individual player.
6. In a game like this one, with the game in hand, allows players to relax more and
not feel under pressure and are able to make plays and shots that they have missed due to their sphincter muscle choking the air out them due to nerves. Once they learn how to relax their games start resembling their talent levels.

So, don't pooh pooh these games as they are critical in all the areas mentioned above. As Roy was quick to say "everything looks better when the ball goes in the basket". It went in the basket because of what Gary mentions in his observations.
We passed the ball effectively and took better shots due to sharing the ball unselfishly.


Well, we got OSU on Saturday, let's see just how much this team has improved. Should be a good test in NY.

Great points on the value of these tune-up games -- it's not winning but how you play doing it that counts. As I've mentioned previously, I think the staff was playing it too close to the vest earlier in the season, but as you said, we're recovering from an unfortunate offensive experiment, so this one was much like a November game, and probably came at a good time.

And yeah, I didn't address it in the OP, but the female zebra stood out for being bad. Maybe she was just havig a bad night, but phew!...

 

[Tarheel75]

Great points on the value of these tune-up games -- it's not winning but how you play doing it that counts. As I've mentioned previously, I think the staff was playing it too close to the vest earlier in the season, but as you said, we're recovering from an unfortunate offensive experiment, so this one was much like a November game, and probably came at a good time.

And yea, hI didn't address it in the OP, but the female zebra stood out for being bad. Maybe she was just havig a bad night, but phew!...

The unfortunate offensive experiment has been shelved, but I would be remiss if I did not mention that our team's playing schedule had a negative effect on the team's play.
I know that most don't think about scheduling and travel times and the lack of practice time availability during road trips, but it is a real thing, and we have to be able to understand that part and make some small allowances for the poor play. Since we have been back home and able to practice it has had very positive affect on team play.

Just a nuance that most don't either realize or understand.

Personally, I would have a serious chat with the schedule makers of which, includes Hubert and others, so as not to repeat this kind of scheduling that requires cross country travel, time zone changes, lack of practice time due to rest requirements mandated by the NCAA and also increased chances of getting sicknesses introduced to the team.

 

[Heels5150]

With the overall talent that this Team possesses I would love for them to be more aggressive on the defensive side of the ball. To Gary’s point it would really benefit the offense. It was nice to see 3 point attempts shot from a pass instead of dribble, dribble, dribble launch. It was great to see the bench play but this should have been happening since game one. Tyler’s hustle on the offensive rebound attempt to keep the ball alive was great to see. Plays like that can become infectious to a Team. He ends up hitting that corner three on that extra offensive possession. Style’s hustle and rebounds was great to see. His athleticism is amazing. I also liked his shot selections in last nights game. He is not a shooter and he has in the past come into the game and started launching jump shots. Justin did at the end of the game when he got in but to Style’s credit he did not. It was good to get a look at Shaver. He had a very nice pass to Tyler for an open 3. Will needs to be a lot more aggressive. His layup shot attempt that got blocked was very weak but I know he will improve in time. He has the body to be more physical. Jalen Washington looks promising. I’m really rooting for this young man. I love his demeanor and smile. He does look like a huge walking band aid with the long white tights, headband and t shirt. Lol. I wish our guys would not wear headbands. Thanking the passer to me is a staple of Carolina Basketball and it does bother me when guys don’t do that. I think it helps with moral and it shows complementary Basketball that can help build and sustain chemistry. To a lot of people they think that it’s trivial and it isn’t important. I love to see our bench excited and being supportive while guys on the court are playing. Run to the bench during timeouts. Huddle at the free throw line before free throw attempts are shot. A lot of that has been missing this season thus far. Why didn’t Puff play in the second half? Injury? Coaches decision?

 

[TPFKAPFS]

Caleb is to Grover as Seth is to DSouth!

Man love at its finest!

To be clear: I think Seth makes a real difference in D, energy and effort as soon as he steps on the floor! I think he is learning very quickly to run a team and can really do well in transition. I maintain he is third behind Caleb and RJ in running a team,especially in half-court sets, however. (Good Caleb might even be better than RJ, but his average is second!)

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

Sorry for the dumb question but I notice that we had 17 guys with minutes in the Citadel game. Has there been a rule change to allow that many players, or has it always been OK to play that many?

 

[Tarheel75]

Sorry for the dumb question but I notice that we had 17 guys with minutes in the Citadel game. Has there been a rule change to allow that many players, or has it always been OK to play that many?

No rule changes-Hubert can have as many walk-ons as he wants, but only 13 scholarships allowed. Most walk-ons practice with the team but do not travel with the team.

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

No rule changes-Hubert can have as many walk-ons as he wants, but only 13 scholarships allowed. Most walk-ons practice with the team but do not travel with the team.

Thanks. For some reason I was thinking there was a limit of 15 who could play in any given game.

 

[DSouthr]

Caleb is to Grover as Seth is to DSouth!

Man love at its finest!

To be clear: I think Seth makes a real difference in D, energy and effort as soon as he steps on the floor! I think he is learning very quickly to run a team and can really do well in transition. I maintain he is third behind Caleb and RJ in running a team,especially in half-court sets, however. (Good Caleb might even be better than RJ, but his average is second!)

LOL, if I ever get as bad as Grover was just shoot me, no warning, just Fire away! LOL

Have you noticed how this team plays when Seth gets extended PT, not just while he is in the game but over all? Have ya noticed how all the sudden BOTH RJ and Caleb are now doing the other aspects of what a PG does better than before, referring to all things that do not include shooting. Things like RJ grabbing a ton of rebounds, hustle stat, Caleb getting big time assist numbers, the reduced TOs, the much better shot selection in the last couple games? Seth is having a positive effect even sitting on the bench because his extended minutes is putting heat on our starters to clean it up. But as well look at the games this season where Seth did not get extended minutes, lot of reverting back to one on one ball.

I felt Caleb and RJ played really well vs GT and Citadel but I will maintain that high volume shot takers that hit for a low % just in my mind can not be considered good at running a team, a shoot first player may be a great player but he isn't great at running a team, he is great at running himself. To be great at running a team (my opinion) your focus has to be on getting all your teammates game rolling because 5 is greater than 1. Both RJ and Caleb are great players, especially when their fire is lite but that tends to have everyone else just standing around waiting on them to do something and that is not good basketball and it isn't running a team well.

Funny thing, fans tend to look at a player and determine how good he is based on that players scoring ability and the total points in the box score. But that can be and has at times for us been fools gold. Meaning, great you scored 20, problem is you had 4 TOs and the guy you guarded all night scored 25? That means yeah you scored 20 but you put your team in a 5pt hole and we now need a last minute dramatic shot to save the game, the game that would not likely have needed to be saved had you not put us in a 5pt hole? LOL The 10 shots you hit were great but what about the 20 you missed? 5-26 in the natty game that we were in a very tight game at the end, 5-26 was Caleb's night shooting it, that is 21 missed ops to score in a nail biter game? Look at the box score from the Bama game this season and total the shots taken vs shots made by RJ and Caleb, that was not a class on how to really run a team well.

Notice the last 2 games, Seth gets extended minutes and all the sudden fans, Hubert as well, are commentating on how we are finally beginning to look like a UNC team. Well I have noticed that in the last couple games finally Seth is the PG more. Ya see, he is not a great jump shooter, he shoots better than he has shown so far but a great jump shooter he isn't right now, that needs to be a big focus for him next off season. They call it the shooting guard spot (the 2) for a reason, he was being used more as a 2 and a 3 but very rarely as the PG, that changed in the last couple games, still not being used as a PG all of his minutes but he got more PG minutes last couple games, we see the results.

And now back to Grover, I am not just tossing some dumb fan boy praise that has nothing to do with how the guy played, I am talking about how a kid played and what those results look like. I share my opinion and I give you examples of what you have already seen so that it is clear, I am not making it up out of nothing. And yeah, I know TP, you were joshing with me and gave me a good laugh, appreciate it my friend!

 

[alabamaheel]

LOL, if I ever get as bad as Grover was just shoot me, no warning, just Fire away! LOL

Have you noticed how this team plays when Seth gets extended PT, not just while he is in the game but over all? Have ya noticed how all the sudden BOTH RJ and Caleb are now doing the other aspects of what a PG does better than before, referring to all things that do not include shooting. Things like RJ grabbing a ton of rebounds, hustle stat, Caleb getting big time assist numbers, the reduced TOs, the much better shot selection in the last couple games? Seth is having a positive effect even sitting on the bench because his extended minutes is putting heat on our starters to clean it up. But as well look at the games this season where Seth did not get extended minutes, lot of reverting back to one on one ball.

I felt Caleb and RJ played really well vs GT and Citadel but I will maintain that high volume shot takers that hit for a low % just in my mind can not be considered good at running a team, a shoot first player may be a great player but he isn't great at running a team, he is great at running himself. To be great at running a team (my opinion) your focus has to be on getting all your teammates game rolling because 5 is greater than 1. Both RJ and Caleb are great players, especially when their fire is lite but that tends to have everyone else just standing around waiting on them to do something and that is not good basketball and it isn't running a team well.

Funny thing, fans tend to look at a player and determine how good he is based on that players scoring ability and the total points in the box score. But that can be and has at times for us been fools gold. Meaning, great you scored 20, problem is you had 4 TOs and the guy you guarded all night scored 25? That means yeah you scored 20 but you put your team in a 5pt hole and we now need a last minute dramatic shot to save the game, the game that would not likely have needed to be saved had you not put us in a 5pt hole? LOL The 10 shots you hit were great but what about the 20 you missed? 5-26 in the natty game that we were in a very tight game at the end, 5-26 was Caleb's night shooting it, that is 21 missed ops to score in a nail biter game? Look at the box score from the Bama game this season and total the shots taken vs shots made by RJ and Caleb, that was not a class on how to really run a team well.

Notice the last 2 games, Seth gets extended minutes and all the sudden fans, Hubert as well, are commentating on how we are finally beginning to look like a UNC team. Well I have noticed that in the last couple games finally Seth is the PG more. Ya see, he is not a great jump shooter, he shoots better than he has shown so far but a great jump shooter he isn't right now, that needs to be a big focus for him next off season. They call it the shooting guard spot (the 2) for a reason, he was being used more as a 2 and a 3 but very rarely as the PG, that changed in the last couple games, still not being used as a PG all of his minutes but he got more PG minutes last couple games, we see the results.

And now back to Grover, I am not just tossing some dumb fan boy praise that has nothing to do with how the guy played, I am talking about how a kid played and what those results look like. I share my opinion and I give you examples of what you have already seen so that it is clear, I am not making it up out of nothing. And yeah, I know TP, you were joshing with me and gave me a good laugh, appreciate it my friend!

While I do think Seth may put some playing time pressure on our two starters, RJ has always rebounded well. I do agree with you that people overlook Seth as a pg. Heck he can have a good night and peeps just mention everything but him. It’s funny really, but all to prove he isn’t a true pg. lol.
The game before last was his coming out party and it was obvious to most that his play resembled our closest thing to a pg. passes, defense, and spreading the floor. But as usual he was harped on for dribbling into no man’s land. He’s a freshman. He’ll be ok. Off my soapbox for now

 

[DSouthr]

While I do think Seth may put some playing time pressure on our two starters, RJ has always rebounded well. I do agree with you that people overlook Seth as a pg. Heck he can have a good night and peeps just mention everything but him. It’s funny really, but all to prove he isn’t a true pg. lol.
The game before last was his coming out party and it was obvious to most that his play resembled our closest thing to a pg. passes, defense, and spreading the floor. But as usual he was harped on for dribbling into no man’s land. He’s a freshman. He’ll be ok. Off my soapbox for now

Yeah Bama, that is the part that gets me, the need to try to prove Seth isn't a PG, the need to marginalize him, it makes no sense considering we are all watching what the kid is doing. It is one thing to say it before a season begins because there is no body of work in the college game to prove a freshman is or isn't a PG. But we have now watched games, watched the kid play for UNC and yet the effort to reduce him remains?

1,000% agree bama with every word! It is really nice to see others stepping up to this, in time everyone will see, one way or the other. Sorry but have to say this and know it will NOT be well received by some folks but the fact that we already have RJ for 2 more and Seth for 3 more seasons is a concern for both Cadeau and Boogie because it means we already have 2 PGs (RJ and Seth) that are big time and that is not prime for what they are looking for. Qualified to say, thou I may not believe RJ is really a PG (he is a 2, as is Caleb in my eyes) he will start at that position as long as he stays at UNC. Caleb will start at the 2 until he leaves UNC and when he does Wilcher steps in to that role. That is not to say that Hubert will not sit a guy like Caleb and bring him off the bench for a game, like he did with Leaky for a game last season but I do not expect to see that.

 

[imajericho]

LOL, if I ever get as bad as Grover was just shoot me, no warning, just Fire away! LOL

Have you noticed how this team plays when Seth gets extended PT, not just while he is in the game but over all? Have ya noticed how all the sudden BOTH RJ and Caleb are now doing the other aspects of what a PG does better than before, referring to all things that do not include shooting. Things like RJ grabbing a ton of rebounds, hustle stat, Caleb getting big time assist numbers, the reduced TOs, the much better shot selection in the last couple games? Seth is having a positive effect even sitting on the bench because his extended minutes is putting heat on our starters to clean it up. But as well look at the games this season where Seth did not get extended minutes, lot of reverting back to one on one ball.

I felt Caleb and RJ played really well vs GT and Citadel but I will maintain that high volume shot takers that hit for a low % just in my mind can not be considered good at running a team, a shoot first player may be a great player but he isn't great at running a team, he is great at running himself. To be great at running a team (my opinion) your focus has to be on getting all your teammates game rolling because 5 is greater than 1. Both RJ and Caleb are great players, especially when their fire is lite but that tends to have everyone else just standing around waiting on them to do something and that is not good basketball and it isn't running a team well.

Funny thing, fans tend to look at a player and determine how good he is based on that players scoring ability and the total points in the box score. But that can be and has at times for us been fools gold. Meaning, great you scored 20, problem is you had 4 TOs and the guy you guarded all night scored 25? That means yeah you scored 20 but you put your team in a 5pt hole and we now need a last minute dramatic shot to save the game, the game that would not likely have needed to be saved had you not put us in a 5pt hole? LOL The 10 shots you hit were great but what about the 20 you missed? 5-26 in the natty game that we were in a very tight game at the end, 5-26 was Caleb's night shooting it, that is 21 missed ops to score in a nail biter game? Look at the box score from the Bama game this season and total the shots taken vs shots made by RJ and Caleb, that was not a class on how to really run a team well.

Notice the last 2 games, Seth gets extended minutes and all the sudden fans, Hubert as well, are commentating on how we are finally beginning to look like a UNC team. Well I have noticed that in the last couple games finally Seth is the PG more. Ya see, he is not a great jump shooter, he shoots better than he has shown so far but a great jump shooter he isn't right now, that needs to be a big focus for him next off season. They call it the shooting guard spot (the 2) for a reason, he was being used more as a 2 and a 3 but very rarely as the PG, that changed in the last couple games, still not being used as a PG all of his minutes but he got more PG minutes last couple games, we see the results.

And now back to Grover, I am not just tossing some dumb fan boy praise that has nothing to do with how the guy played, I am talking about how a kid played and what those results look like. I share my opinion and I give you examples of what you have already seen so that it is clear, I am not making it up out of nothing. And yeah, I know TP, you were joshing with me and gave me a good laugh, appreciate it my friend!

He plays extended time when the team is winning handedly. The team isn't winning handedly from him playing. You are mixing up correlation with causation.

 

[imajericho]

People are saying we are playing like Carolina basketball the last 2 games because we won in blowouts against very undersized teams. My question for you is... can you say we are playing like Carolina basketball even if we lose? Because for some, Carolina basketball is winning.

 

[gary-7]

People are saying we are playing like Carolina basketball the last 2 games because we won in blowouts against very undersized teams. My question for you is... can you say we are playing like Carolina basketball even if we lose? Because for some, Carolina basketball is winning.

We played Carolina basketball for the last 2 games --- win or lose.
For the first 9 games we did NOT --- win or lose.

Carolina basketball is what it is, and we're far more LIKELY to win when we play it, regardless of opponent.

Speaking if which, had we NOT returned to Carolina basketball, we could have EASILY lost to GaTech.

 

[gary-7]

Yeah Bama, that is the part that gets me, the need to try to prove Seth isn't a PG, the need to marginalize him, it makes no sense considering we are all watching what the kid is doing. It is one thing to say it before a season begins because there is no body of work in the college game to prove a freshman is or isn't a PG. But we have now watched games, watched the kid play for UNC and yet the effort to reduce him remains?

I was gonna step away from this, but c'mon D, that's just jumping the shark. Neither myself, @Tarheel75 , nor anyone else I'm seeing here is trying to "prove" anything. It just is what it is. And making the (honestly, fairly obvious in this case) observation that a player isn't a natural PG is not meant to "reduce" him. He is a talented, athletic Combo, and as part of that we can also hope he gets better at the aspect of the game that doesn't come naturally.

Oh, and BTW... IF (please, sweet baby Jesus) Cadeau comes here, he will EASILY be the best PG in the program the minute he walks on campus, and I think he knows that. And if the staff is all-in with recruiting him (and I'm told that they are), they'll make sure Cadeau knows that THEY know that, as well.

 

[alabamaheel]

We played Carolina basketball for the last 2 games --- win or lose.
For the first 9 games we did NOT --- win or lose.

Carolina basketball is what it is, and we're far more LIKELY to win when we play it, regardless of opponent.

Speaking if which, had we NOT returned to Carolina basketball, we could have EASILY lost to GaTech.

Gary I agree. The bama and Iowa st game could have easily been won if we had done anything close to what we’re doing at this point.

 

[dtodd4475]

Seth looks very good, love him. RJ & Caleb are the backcourt they are going to get 30 plus minutes as I thought preseason. Seth is going to spell them and play along side as Hubert likes the 3 together. He will get plenty of time, which he has earned.

 

[dtodd4475]

Gary I agree. The bama and Iowa st game could have easily been won if we had done anything close to what we’re doing at this point.

The Bama quadruple OT game would of been a great non conference win, as they have been VERY impressive since.

 

[TPFKAPFS]

It is refreshing to see someone still has a sense of humor! The only thing I even slightly disagree with that D said, was that I would ever seek to lessen any Tar Heel! I talked at length on several threads about the obvious and incredible impact that Seth has on the game. It is a fact that he needs to get better at ball handling, spacing, driving into trouble, and shooting. It is also a fact that he is an amazing defender; a real problem in transition; a natural scorer; a powerful encouragement for RJ and Caleb; a great team mate; who deserves starter level minutes! BUT what is best for the team's long term success is for RJ to run the team and for Caleb and Seth to be secondary ball handlers who can light it up on O when needed! When all 3 are playing together, they will learn to complement each other's strengths and pick up the slack for each other's weaknesses. RJ, Caleb, Seth, Washington, and Bacot or Nance looks like a pretty powerful lineup to me!

 

[TarHeelFanWV]

The Bama quadruple OT game would have been a great non conference win, as they have been VERY impressive since.

Yeah. We lost to Bama when we wasn’t even playing good. We are playing much better now, granted our opponents have been easy. We had plenty of opportunities to beat Bama and still barely lost. If we play like we have been the last 2 games, we can beat anybody.

 

[Grayhead]

Don't ask Beau, why do ya shoot (to score points),
Why do ya work (to get time)
Why do you risk that knee getting hurt (cause I'm a Maye)

Over and over, I am in this unique position
When I play I am trying to carry on my FAMILY TRADITION!

Now all I hear is hank Williams Jr

 

[What Would Jesus Do?]

LOL, if I ever get as bad as Grover was just shoot me, no warning, just Fire away! LOL

Have you noticed how this team plays when Seth gets extended PT, not just while he is in the game but over all? Have ya noticed how all the sudden BOTH RJ and Caleb are now doing the other aspects of what a PG does better than before, referring to all things that do not include shooting. Things like RJ grabbing a ton of rebounds, hustle stat, Caleb getting big time assist numbers, the reduced TOs, the much better shot selection in the last couple games? Seth is having a positive effect even sitting on the bench because his extended minutes is putting heat on our starters to clean it up. But as well look at the games this season where Seth did not get extended minutes, lot of reverting back to one on one ball.

I felt Caleb and RJ played really well vs GT and Citadel but I will maintain that high volume shot takers that hit for a low % just in my mind can not be considered good at running a team, a shoot first player may be a great player but he isn't great at running a team, he is great at running himself. To be great at running a team (my opinion) your focus has to be on getting all your teammates game rolling because 5 is greater than 1. Both RJ and Caleb are great players, especially when their fire is lite but that tends to have everyone else just standing around waiting on them to do something and that is not good basketball and it isn't running a team well.

Funny thing, fans tend to look at a player and determine how good he is based on that players scoring ability and the total points in the box score. But that can be and has at times for us been fools gold. Meaning, great you scored 20, problem is you had 4 TOs and the guy you guarded all night scored 25? That means yeah you scored 20 but you put your team in a 5pt hole and we now need a last minute dramatic shot to save the game, the game that would not likely have needed to be saved had you not put us in a 5pt hole? LOL The 10 shots you hit were great but what about the 20 you missed? 5-26 in the natty game that we were in a very tight game at the end, 5-26 was Caleb's night shooting it, that is 21 missed ops to score in a nail biter game? Look at the box score from the Bama game this season and total the shots taken vs shots made by RJ and Caleb, that was not a class on how to really run a team well.

Notice the last 2 games, Seth gets extended minutes and all the sudden fans, Hubert as well, are commentating on how we are finally beginning to look like a UNC team. Well I have noticed that in the last couple games finally Seth is the PG more. Ya see, he is not a great jump shooter, he shoots better than he has shown so far but a great jump shooter he isn't right now, that needs to be a big focus for him next off season. They call it the shooting guard spot (the 2) for a reason, he was being used more as a 2 and a 3 but very rarely as the PG, that changed in the last couple games, still not being used as a PG all of his minutes but he got more PG minutes last couple games, we see the results.

And now back to Grover, I am not just tossing some dumb fan boy praise that has nothing to do with how the guy played, I am talking about how a kid played and what those results look like. I share my opinion and I give you examples of what you have already seen so that it is clear, I am not making it up out of nothing. And yeah, I know TP, you were joshing with me and gave me a good laugh, appreciate it my friend!

The other thing that Seth gives us is rest.

Toward the end of last season I often thought RJ was running on empty by the end of the game. It didn't stop him from giving 100% of what he had left but, in particular, his scoring seemed to diminish late in the second half of tough games. Sometime Caleb would step up, but not always. Sometimes, in fact, it seemed like RJ would get us going with scoring in the first half, then it was Caleb's turn in the 2nd half. Not sure if a close inspection of the stats would support that impression, but that's how it seemed to me.

Point being, that even if Seth doesn't score much, if his PT means fresher legs for RJ and Caleb late in games, that could translate into extra wins.

 

[Grayhead]

Seth seems to be a pesky guard. He may still be finding his way, and may not be clutch at this time, but his time on the court takes up some of the load for Rj and Love. It could be by late season we may have a 3 headed guard situation that will constantly be in your face if Seth keeps improving. I'm so happy to see the bench gets some burn. It's building confidence for those tough games when they may only be needed for 5-8 minutes. This weekend will be a good tell as to the strides this team is making. If they have turned the corner, watch out ACC!!!