Exposed

[IDUNK4HEELS]

There is no other way to describe what happened last night as Carolina's biggest fear coming into this season (post play) was put on national display all game long. Michigan State defenders were in Mayes and Berry's grills all night giving them very little room to work in and with nobody coming close to hitting a three the inside blocks would prove to be the major difference in the contest.

UNC got very few 2nd shots and the interior players on defense gave up numerous 2nd and 3rd shots. The bigs gave the Heels nothing inside offensively putting the pressure on the perimeter players yet again and the tremendous in your face defense played by the Spartans had UNC wavering the white flag all night.

The Carolina coaching staff cannot cover up the green freshmen in the middle and unless Sean May can dress again the area in the paint will be the Achilles heel for Carolina all season.

 

[bax4444]

Can see why they all three were ranked where they were. If our upperclassmen backcourt have bad games we will be In trouble. I venture to guess at some point this season Roy will resign himself to a small ball lineup.

The one who I thought would be the most ready actually looks the worst-that's Brooks. I watch him out there and he looks like he literally has no clue.

 

[Steat]

The Heels had their worst shooting night ever and experienced players missed several easy lay-ups. Very few teams in the NCAA are as good as Michigan State who is picked by many to win it all. If the Heels would have shot better they would could have won the game despite the inexperienced bigs. The Heels had many open looks they just missed the shots. We have gotten more out the the bigs than anyone ever expected, so it is ironic that some expect them to be a big part of the Heels success this year. The Heels will go as far as the the backcourt and small forwards take them. Bolden at Duke is a 5-star and he has done literally nothing in his 2 years. Jeter for Duke was a 5-star and he did nothing before he transferred. We have what we have in our bigs. They will get better.

 

[NCAAUCoach]

A typical UNC team owns the glass and that can make up for poor shooting, as we get offensive rebounds and score. Our points per possession typically are offset by that and FG% can be misleading a bit. When you don't have that traditional UNC post play, poor shooting only makes it worse. MSU owned the paint and glass and it started there. They also were physical with our guards. Berry's inability to get a clean look shows why he's not adored at the NBA level and won't likely be an NBA player. That's not a knock on him....I love him as a UNC PG.

This year, when we don't score in transition and from the perimeter we may struggle.

 

[Spacegrass]

I would of expected something score wise like the FSU game in 2012 with as bad as the team shot the ball.

 

[Hark_The_Sound_2010]

The bigs getting exposed wasn't all that alarming to me, as I (along with most of us) expected that coming into the year.

What was alarming to me was how Berry just disappeared on the big stage, very unlike him. Hopefully he gets as fired up about this loss as he does losing video games and comes out ready to rock next time out. We're gonna need him.

 

[pln2013]

The problems we saw last night were visible all year. Hell, they were predictable before the season.

We have a very good roster, but not a great one. And its weaknesses will show bigtime against top teams, as was evident from before the season.

1) We don't have a way to reliably create good shots in the half court.

We're a team of complementary players who need a star to complement. Nobody on the team right now shows the ability to be the focus of the defense but score anyway. Berry and Maye can score when other guys draw attention, but when great defenses focus on them they struggle. The physical tools just aren't there. Little and White both show star potential (which is not a guarantee), but they're playing HS games.​

2) We have basically no interior presence on either end.

Maye's physical limitations prevent him from scoring on the block. His arms are too short, so he double-clutches to avoid getting blocked. We saw the same thing happen last year in the FF - when long, athletic defenses focused on him, he couldn't do anything inside. He can find space, but he can't create it. On the other end, he's just easy to shoot over. He has the standing reach of a guard, and that's not gonna change.

The low-ranked freshman are playing like low-ranked freshman, which shouldn't be a surprise. Manley has nice tools, but he struggled to use those tools against weak HS competition - he's always been a project. Huffman has zero offensive game or understanding of how to use his body, but that was true in HS, too - again, he's always been a project. I expected more from Brooks, but it's not shocking that a low 4-star freshman is struggling a bit. We're asking too much of him by feeding him in the post against more talented players (though it's not unreasonable to expect him to rebound better).​

Those issues are gonna appear again. Probably against Duke, I'm afraid. They're built into our roster - it's a matter of personnel, not leadership or coaching.

We'll win a good number of games. We play outstanding perimeter defense (particularly Kenny and Seventh), and we can shoot the ball well when we get good looks (which we generally didn't do last night). But we're not really built to beat great teams or make a deep tournament run (not that we can't - it's just not likely). We just don't have the pieces.

 

[GoNtheDistance]

What he said above. Spot on.

 

[truetarheelraider0806]

We gonna have a fun yr. We all knew before it started the team was pretty young and green let's just have fun. From what I have seen so far we are elite 8 good but not final four good. Elite 8 is still top 90% of all of college b-ball

 

[TPFKAPFS]

I don't think anything was exposed. To expose something it must be hidden in the first place. We all knew our bigs were green and needed development both physically and in their skills. Last night they got bullied and did not know how to respond to it. The perimeter looked tired to me. When peeps are that physical with you and you have tired legs; shots are short, touch disappears, and you start to even make mental errors. How could anyone watch the last 2 Natty games and even begin to question JB's heart? He was giving maximum effort till he was taken out, but he just wasn't effective. There are three peeps on this team that I will NEVER worry about: JB, TP, and Bird!

I am impressed by the amazing effort Izzo got out of his boys and I applaud their skill. They had a shooter go ballistic and their bigs played like men!

Our true mettle will be determined by how we bounce back and how we finish this season, not how we played in ONE game!

I still see a FF team with the right breaks!

 

[gunslingerdick]

We got exposed as a team that will struggle unless we hit shots. That's it. And all of us knew that already.

 

[keysersosay#1]

Agree with all of the above

However I will add that Cam is still out and I believe he will add some needed firepower. Still, the youngsters inside need to toughen up and gain that valuable game experience, which as in last nights game can be PAINFUL

 

[Steat]

I don't think anything was exposed. To expose something it must be hidden in the first place. We all knew our bigs were green and needed development both physically and in their skills. Last night they got bullied and did not know how to respond to it. The perimeter looked tired to me. When peeps are that physical with you and you have tired legs; shots are short, touch disappears, and you start to even make mental errors. How could anyone watch the last 2 Natty games and even begin to question JB's heart? He was giving maximum effort till he was taken out, but he just wasn't effective. There are three peeps on this team that I will NEVER worry about: JB, TP, and Bird!

I am impressed by the amazing effort Izzo got out of his boys and I applaud their skill. They had a shooter go ballistic and their bigs played like men!

Our true mettle will be determined by how we bounce back and how we finish this season, not how we played in ONE game!

I still see a FF team with the right breaks!

Agree, I think the Heels are still a Final Four team. Heck, Arizona was ranked #2 and loss 3 games this past weekend and fell out of the Top 20. If the Heels shoot 15% better they would have won the game. There was sequence in the first half where the Heels missed 3 consecutive lay-ups (Berry 2, Williams 1) and Michigan State follow with 3 pointers. That was swing of 15 points!.

 

[Steat]

Another thing.

Berry is not completely healthy yet with the hand. He hit those little running bank shots all last year.

 

[MCPO_Tarheel]

That was a rough game... I guess the only positive is that coach Roy has plenty of lessons to teach the team and regain their focus. I fully believe the upper classmen will take this loss very personally.

For the freshmen: Welcome to the NCAA's.

 

[ClarktonHeel]

It was a terrible game but it is just one game against one of the best teams in the nation . Lot of bad passes , missed a lot of shots that on most nights may fall, and missed lay ups and free throws. It is early in the season and Roy will coach them up and Cam will be ready hopefully Jan. 1st.

 

[gunslingerdick]

It was a terrible game but it is just one game against one of the best teams in the nation . .

Meh. Honestly, I wasn't impressed with MSU. Like others have said, if we convert on just a handful of bunnies, that game is much closer with us playing atrocious ball. MSU is big and deep but Bridges and Izzo are both overrated IMO. And they simply don't value possessions. They had over 20 TOs against us and many of them were just them being careless and lazy.

 

[al would]

LOL .. just one really bad game in November that didn't mean a lot. To put this in perspective let me offer up this little tid bit.
http://www.sportingnews.com/ncaa-ba...inia-florida-state/1b9xv4b5uls0j1xed86ftr9uks

 

[Archer2]

There is no other way to describe what happened last night as Carolina's biggest fear coming into this season (post play) was put on national display all game long. Michigan State defenders were in Mayes and Berry's grills all night giving them very little room to work in and with nobody coming close to hitting a three the inside blocks would prove to be the major difference in the contest.

UNC got very few 2nd shots and the interior players on defense gave up numerous 2nd and 3rd shots. The bigs gave the Heels nothing inside offensively putting the pressure on the perimeter players yet again and the tremendous in your face defense played by the Spartans had UNC wavering the white flag all night.

The Carolina coaching staff cannot cover up the green freshmen in the middle and unless Sean May can dress again the area in the paint will be the Achilles heel for Carolina all season.

A little bit of an overreaction, IMO. And it was imminently predictable that it would occur when we got our butts whipped for the first time this season, which was also very predictable and won't be the last time by a long shot.

As for your last paragraph, I think our bigs will make very significant jumps in their improvement, if for no other reason than they're going to get major minutes because we have to play them. And Roy is one of the best developers of talent in the college game.

The Heels had their worst shooting night ever and experienced players missed several easy lay-ups. Very few teams in the NCAA are as good as Michigan State who is picked by many to win it all. If the Heels would have shot better they would could have won the game despite the inexperienced bigs. The Heels had many open looks they just missed the shots. We have gotten more out the the bigs than anyone ever expected, so it is ironic that some expect them to be a big part of the Heels success this year. The Heels will go as far as the the backcourt and small forwards take them. Bolden at Duke is a 5-star and he has done literally nothing in his 2 years. Jeter for Duke was a 5-star and he did nothing before he transferred. We have what we have in our bigs. They will get better.

Preach on.

If our fans can't have patience after the last two years we've been treated to and the huge attrition we suffered after last year's championship, I just don't know what to say. This years team is very much a work in progress, and will be all year. I hope our fans will realize that and not expect a finished product in November. Roy's a great coach, but he doesn't walk on water.

I don't think anything was exposed. To expose something it must be hidden in the first place. We all knew our bigs were green and needed development both physically and in their skills. Last night they got bullied and did not know how to respond to it. The perimeter looked tired to me. When peeps are that physical with you and you have tired legs; shots are short, touch disappears, and you start to even make mental errors. How could anyone watch the last 2 Natty games and even begin to question JB's heart? He was giving maximum effort till he was taken out, but he just wasn't effective. There are three peeps on this team that I will NEVER worry about: JB, TP, and Bird!

I am impressed by the amazing effort Izzo got out of his boys and I applaud their skill. They had a shooter go ballistic and their bigs played like men!

Our true mettle will be determined by how we bounce back and how we finish this season, not how we played in ONE game!

I still see a FF team with the right breaks!

Don't know about your last sentence but I agree with the rest.

 

[al would]

We got exposed as a team that will struggle unless we hit shots. That's it. And all of us knew that already.

Almost any team in D1 (or any other level) that struggles to hit shots .. especially in the 20% from the field range, will struggle and probably lose every game that it happens. Step back from that ledge my friend .

 

[jeans15]

This was the preseason number 2 team, only loss was to the number one team and we were missing one of our better players...relax.

This was great experience for our Bigs.

Disappointing leadership from the vets. Can't expect the young guys to play well if the vets play like they did.

 

[IDUNK4HEELS]

Coach William's during the Monday night show also mentioned the post defense has been a work in progress and the last three opponents have had big games against his Heels...

 

[pln2013]

Coach William's during the Monday night show also mentioned the post defense has been a work in progress and the last three opponents have had big games against his Heels...

One unfortunate thing for our bigs is that they don't get to practice against dominant bigs - they practice against each other.

I'd imagine Hicks, Meeks, and Bradley (and Brice the year before) had some awesome practice battles last year. They weren't going to run into opposing bigs much better than what they saw in practice every day.

The current crop doesn't have that advantage. They don't know what's like to play against dominant bigs until they play them in games.

 

[Archer2]

Love this post from “blue dot” on TOB. It should be pinned.


bluedot 1882 posts
8 hours ago
If you really, REALLY like hoops, then sit back and enjoy watching what happens with our basketball team over the next three months. It's going to be fun IF your attitude is right, and it's going to be instructive about how to coach for the long run, rather than the most wins right now.

I don't think there is anybody better in college basketball at bringing a team along to where they need to be in March than Roy Williams. We are going to play MTM, which is what championship teams do. We are going to run players in and out and develop depth, which is what championship teams do. We are going to live and die with some young post players who have a LOT of growing to do. But the growth potential for a bunch of kids with maybe a little bit of a chip on their shoulder about their recruiting rankings is huge, and Coach Williams is a master of that.

We probably aren't a realistic bet for a final four berth this year, but we are going to be an incredibly tough out in March. Save a tape of last night's Michigan State game; it'll be a fun comparison to what we are at the end. It's what college basketball used to be about, and what Carolina basketball still is about. And I love it!

 

[Spaceytoyz]

A 6'8 Cameron Johnson can't solve the problems but he can help them some

 

[mikeirbyusa]

The bigs getting exposed wasn't all that alarming to me, as I (along with most of us) expected that coming into the year.

What was alarming to me was how Berry just disappeared on the big stage, very unlike him. Hopefully he gets as fired up about this loss as he does losing video games and comes out ready to rock next time out. We're gonna need him.

Berry gets a pass from me for that fool brace.

 

[truetarheelraider0806]

Saw an interview with berry trust me he is plenty up we have nothing to worry about he won't disappear like that again

 

[jeans15]

A 6'8 Cameron Johnson can't solve the problems but he can help them some

Another scorer and shooter would really set this team off.

Especially with his length.

 

[Ozheelfan]

Love this post from “blue dot” on TOB. It should be pinned.


bluedot 1882 posts
8 hours ago
If you really, REALLY like hoops, then sit back and enjoy watching what happens with our basketball team over the next three months. It's going to be fun IF your attitude is right, and it's going to be instructive about how to coach for the long run, rather than the most wins right now.

I don't think there is anybody better in college basketball at bringing a team along to where they need to be in March than Roy Williams. We are going to play MTM, which is what championship teams do. We are going to run players in and out and develop depth, which is what championship teams do. We are going to live and die with some young post players who have a LOT of growing to do. But the growth potential for a bunch of kids with maybe a little bit of a chip on their shoulder about their recruiting rankings is huge, and Coach Williams is a master of that.

We probably aren't a realistic bet for a final four berth this year, but we are going to be an incredibly tough out in March. Save a tape of last night's Michigan State game; it'll be a fun comparison to what we are at the end. It's what college basketball used to be about, and what Carolina basketball still is about. And I love it!

Nice one... thanks for the share Arch.

 

[DSouthr]

Love this post from “blue dot” on TOB. It should be pinned.


bluedot 1882 posts
8 hours ago
If you really, REALLY like hoops, then sit back and enjoy watching what happens with our basketball team over the next three months. It's going to be fun IF your attitude is right, and it's going to be instructive about how to coach for the long run, rather than the most wins right now.

I don't think there is anybody better in college basketball at bringing a team along to where they need to be in March than Roy Williams. We are going to play MTM, which is what championship teams do. We are going to run players in and out and develop depth, which is what championship teams do. We are going to live and die with some young post players who have a LOT of growing to do. But the growth potential for a bunch of kids with maybe a little bit of a chip on their shoulder about their recruiting rankings is huge, and Coach Williams is a master of that.

We probably aren't a realistic bet for a final four berth this year, but we are going to be an incredibly tough out in March. Save a tape of last night's Michigan State game; it'll be a fun comparison to what we are at the end. It's what college basketball used to be about, and what Carolina basketball still is about. And I love it!

Yeah coach, you hit on something I tried to talk about last season with Joel. Love what he has brought to us as our PG but as with all players there are strengths to his game just as there are weaker points. His inability to shake MSU defenders reflects a bit of quickness we have had in other PGs that Joel doesn't have. He makes up for a lot of that in his jump shooting but it does at times force him to take higher degree of difficulty shots than you would typically like to see. When he does drive most times he will take that high off the back board kinda semi floater and he has a knack for hitting those but they are harder looks. I mentioned last season that I would like to see him drive and create more for his mates, cause the defense to collapse and look to kick out to a spot up or dish to a cutting big, doesn't do a lot of that. Frankly the guy that does more of that is Theo but Theo is not a jump shooter that you have to respect, you play him for the drive and block him out on his shot, Joel's jump shot has to be respected so it should allow him to sell the pump and drive by.

This isn't me dumping on Joel, this is nothing but sharing what I see, it is IMO fair critique. Some may not agree but you should ask yourself why the NBA has not been all over Joel, if you ask a scout you will hear much of what I am saying here. IT is going to help a lot to get Cam back because he is that extra pure jump shooter that has to be respected for the shot, not going to be as easy to stick like glue to Joel, similar to what we had with Justin. But Cam has not shown to be the driving threat Justin was, so far he has been a spot up jump shooter, you play him to shoot and not drive, I think we need someone to drive and set up the spot up shooters like Cam and Kenny when the defense collapses and I think that should be our PG if he can and if he struggles then we have to set screens to rub off the defender so he can drive by. Just my opinion.

 

[Archer2]

It was a perfect storm event, just about everything that could go wrong for us, did. Can’t remember a UNC team shooting 25%/5%/58% before.
But it was against a likely FF team at the end of a West Coast swing.

We still haven’t had our top 8 players all healthy at the same time. And our young bigs will get better more quickly than they might have otherwise due to being forced into action right away. It’s trial by fire and they got a little singed Sunday night. Nothing that wasn’t expected by most of us.

 

[TPFKAPFS]

Izzo and MSU deserve credit for the incredible energy and physicality they displayed! They bullied our team and we didn't respond. Hats off!

They better hope they don't see us in the tourney though. Sometimes bullies don't fare so well the second time!

Bring on Michigan!

 

[MCPO_Tarheel]

This why it is smart to schedule some tough opponents early in the season. I am 100% confident the team will learn from this and be stronger for it. If the response like we anticipate (as previously mentioned by a poster or 2) it will be one heck of a season.

 

[DSouthr]

This why it is smart to schedule some tough opponents early in the season. I am 100% confident the team will learn from this and be stronger for it. If the response like we anticipate (as previously mentioned by a poster or 2) it will be one heck of a season.

That is what Roy's teams do, if not totally wrecked by injury, they get better and better and figure out how the combinations work together to produce a tuff team to take down by later season and post season. What we are now isn't near what we will be, we will be really solid by season end.